Question & answer session (GM:Raman Uncle)
- Hare Krishna Friends,Sharing very relevant queries of Raman Uncle, answered below little in length but this was needed. Hope this benefits all.=========================================================================================================Dear Prateek,I have some queries: What is Jivatma,& life?Are they same?As per Radha Gopinath ,all living bodies have Souls- and once it leaves ,the body isjust body discarded by Soul.( Don't animate objects have Soul,we are born as animate objects too) The Soul migrates to another body & occupies it, till it's destined time.Scientifically, when life leaves the body, it is lifeless,& action less,motionless,useless & we have to dispose it as it fit. You have instances to show re-birth of s person-out of body experience etc to show,prove that soul(life) migrates.Is life and Soul are one & the same?If Jivatma & Paramathma are one & the same (Aham Brhamasmi), why they split in the first place to unite again (after realization they are one & the same), Kindly enlighten-Raman uncle=========================================================================================================By mercy of Srila Prabhupada:q1:What is Jivatma or soul ?a1:In BG Chapter 8, TEXT 3, it is mentioned that the living entity is called jivatma and Brahman,but he is never called Parabrahman. The living entity (jivatma) takes different positions--sometimes he merges into the dark material nature and identifies himself with matter, and sometimes he identifies himself with the superior spiritual nature. Therefore he is called the Supreme Lord's marginal energy. According to his identification with material
or spiritual nature, he receives a material or spiritual body. In material nature he may take a body from any of the 8,400,000 species of life, but in spiritual nature he has only one body. In material nature he is sometimes manifested as a man, demigod, animal, beast, bird, etc., according to his karma. To attain material heavenly planets and enjoy their facilities, he sometimes performs sacrifices (yajna), but when his merit is exhausted, he returns to earth again in the form of a man. Also as per BG 15 chapter Text 7, Lord Krishna says the living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind.q2: What is life?As per BG Chapter 4 TEXT 27, Life in the human (material) body is generally refered to prana--the life air. When the soul exists in the material body it is functioning the body through help of five airs:
prana-vayu-The senses interact with the sense objects, like the ear for hearing, eyes for seeing, nose for smelling, tongue for tasting, hand for touching, and all of them are thus engaged in activities outside the self. They are the functions of the prana-vayu.
The apana-vayu goes downwards, vyana-vayu acts to shrink and expand, samana-vayu adjusts equilibrium, udana-vayu goes upwards--and when one is enlightened, one engages all these in searching for self-realization.
In other words, when the Jivatma or soul leaves body the equilibrium of these five airs is also dismantelled and hence the body is rendered lifeless.q3: Are Jivatma and life are same?Jivatma or soul and life are related to each other in a way that as long as Jivatma (soul) stays in the body, it is said that body is having life or life airs and can not be considered as dead. It is seen that once this life air leave the body (on soul's exit), the dead body becomes little heavier, rendering body to be dead matter.q4: Don't animate objects have Soul,we are born as animate objects too?Please note, especially in human beings, soul enters the womb of mother through father's sperms during conception and then there in the womb of mother, material body starts growing around the soul, which after nine months comes out in world as a baby body. More intricately to add to this point, there is also a subtle body which is inbetween soul and material body.q5: What is soul?As confirmed in BG Chapter 2 TEXT 12, the fragmental portions of the Supreme exist eternally (sanatana)and are called ksara, that is, they have a tendency to fall down into material nature. These fragmental portions are eternally so, and even after liberation, the individual soul remains the same--fragmental. This framgmental portion of Lord which is also unborn like Lord and has eternally seperated existence from Lord is called as soul.q5: What is Paramatma?As per BG Chapter 2 TEXT 12, Supersoul, is present in each and every individual body and is known as the Paramatma, who is different from the individual living entity.As per BG Chapter 5 Text 15, the Lord is the constant companion of the living entity as Paramatma. As per BG Chapter 5 Text 18, the Supreme Lord, by His plenary portion as Paramatma, is present in every living entity's heart.q6:If Jivatma & Paramathma are one & the same (Aham Brhamasmi), why they split in the first place to unite again (after realization they are one & the same)?As it is clear from explanation above, Jivatma is fragmental portion of Lord is qualitatively same as Lord but not in magnitude, as Lord is Supreme is vibhu (inconcievably mighty/big in all respects ) and Jivatma is anu (small in all respects)Jivatma is Supreme Lord's marginal energy, but is actually present there etrnally. As per BG, Chapter 13-TEXT 13 and also explained in the Second Chapter, the living entity is eternal. This is also confirmed here. There is no specific date at which the jiva was born.
Nor can anyone trace out the history of the jivatma's manifestation from the Supreme Lord. Therefore it is beginningless. The Vedic literature confirms this: na jayate mriyate va vipascit (Katha Upanisad 1.2.18). The knower of the body is never born and never dies, and he is full of knowledge.So no question of any split at the first place.Regarding question of Union:
As per the teachings of BG, union of Jivatma with the Lord refers clearly to the fact that after full realization, the soul enters Goluka Vrindavana, the eternal spiritual sky, where it associates with the lord in his past times and there it is fully purified ie in krsna concious state. In BG Chapter 2 Text 13, It is stated "But once liberated, he lives an eternal life in bliss and knowledge with the Personality of Godhead." BG Chapter 2 TEXT 12, it is mentioned and i quote "Mayavadi theory which states that after liberation the individual soul, separated by the covering of maya or illusion, will merge into the impersonal Brahman and lose its individual existence is not supported herein by Lord Krsna, the supreme authority. Nor is the theory that we only think of individuality in the conditioned state supported herein. Krsna clearly says herein that in the future also the individuality of the Lord and others, as it is confirmed in the Upanisads, will continue eternally.As per BG Chapter 2 TEXT 12, it is confirmed, the fragmental portions of the Supreme exist eternally (sanatana)and are called ksara; that is, they have a tendency to fall down into material nature. These fragmental portions are eternally so, and even after liberation, the individual soul remains the same--fragmentalPlease note: Mayawadi's are refered to those people who consider Supreme Lord to be formless in the end and infact consider brahman (effulgence of Lord to be full and final truth) which is actually the third level of realization.Related to (Aham Brhamasmi)This means that Lord is fully supreme spirited and so we jivatmas also spirited. If any Jivatma realises this he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is his real ego.Ego is there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic literature (Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad 1.4.10) it is said, aham brahmasmi: I am Brahman, I am spirit.This "I am," the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage of self-realization. This sense of "I am" is ego, but when the sense of "I am" is applied to this false body it is false ego. When the sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.Raman Uncle, hope this suits your requirement and so helps all other group members.I really thank you for asking such questions which are beneficial for all the group members.Please reply back for any clarification.YoursPrateek (Moderator)