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1186RE: [beemonitoring] RE: use of new Squash Bee Trap?

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  • Vincent Tepedino
    Sep 3, 2010



      From: beemonitoring@yahoogroups.com [mailto: beemonitoring@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of John S. Ascher
      Sent: Friday, September 03, 2010 3:03 PM
      To: Sharon Muczynski
      Cc: beemonitoring@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [beemonitoring] RE: use of new Squash Bee Trap?



      >>>John, you didn’t direct this to me but I’m going to respond anyway.

      Certain bee species and a very few bee faunas are well known and can be
      repeatedly sampled, so that adequate information can be obtained using
      observation or inefficient, highly selective collecting methods. In these
      limited circumstances large-scale collecting ("killing") may be

      >>>And that’s all that is being said here, at least by me.  It depends on what your objectives are and how scientifically worthy they are and if there are alternative ways to gather the data.  If the objective is simply to use some pins and fill a bunch of drawers, then your objectives are, in my opinion, unworthy (I could go further but won’t).  

      However, most bee species are poorly known and most bee faunas are
      inadequately characterized if not entirely unknown. The only efficient way
      to remedy this is to collect bees on a large scale using highly effective
      methods. Alternatively, we can remain ignorant or waste carbon on repeat
      visits (spewing pollutants and smashing bees against our windshield en
      route) that may not have been required had more effective techniques been

      >>>So you mean to suggest that manic collectors, those who buy t-shirts that say “I collect, therefore I am”, don’t repeat their collecting expeditions, or “spew pollutants” or “waste carbon” (angels are they?).  I suppose they do their collecting while hovering or from skateboards.  Again, I don’t know anyone, least of all me, who reasonably objects to collecting for the purposes you outline (lord knows I’ve done much of it myself) but that is hardly what we’re talking about.  Don’t erect straw men.  We’re talking about collecting simply for the sake of collecting, or collecting that cannot justify its purported purpose, or collecting that puts bee populations in local areas at risk for no good purpose.

      Those who oppose "unnecessary killing" on principal have done immense harm
      to bee populations by preventing control of the deer that eat their host
      plants. They have a lot more hemolymph on their hands then do insect

      >>>I too have remarked upon the high correlation between opponents of bee killing and opponents of deer control.  Tell me again: who did that work? 

      "I did my whole insect collection for Entomology last year with only found
      dead insects"

      I'm sure it was amusing but had little scientific value.

      >>>I doubt the purpose was for the immediate advancement of science or for amusement; it was for a class.

      Jim, I'm afraid that many people cannot distinguish Peponapis from the
      smaller Xenoglossa (see Bugguide), and until they learn to do so they will
      need to document their identifications with vouchers (photo or specimen).
      Consubgeneric Xenoglossa can be quite tricky to separate (as are Peponapis
      where multiple species occur), so if these are to be separated even more
      problematic to rely on observation or sparse vouchers. Thus, squash bee
      identification remains a challenge even though these are among the better
      known bees.

      I’ll let Jim respond if he wishes.


      Vince T.


      > Bee Group,
      > I too, have been concerned about unnecessary killing of bees. As a matter
      > of fact I did my whole insect collection for Entomology last year with
      > only found dead insects. Everyone in my class thought I was odd and
      > eccentric to care so much about a handful of bugs. I think all life is
      > precious and not to be wasted. It is nice to hear some similar sentiments.
      > I do realize, however, that it is difficult- if not impossible- to
      > identify many species by sight.
      > Best,
      > Sharon Muczynski LEED® AP
      > Graduate Student in Conservation Ecology
      > On Sep 3, 2010, at 1:17 PM, Cane, Jim wrote:
      >> Folks- I am curious (trying not to be appalled) as to why someone
      >> want to kill Peponapis bees en masse with pan trapping? What
      can’t be
      >> learned
      >> from surveying for them at the very flowers that are being used to
      >> them to pan traps? Certainly there is a lot that can’t be
      >> from merely killing the bees through passive sampling. Voucher
      >> specimens I can understand. I could say more, but will
      >> reserve judgment, knowing that I often don’t see all the angles
      to an
      >> issue and would like to learn the justification in this case.
      >> Yours,
      >> Jim Cane

      John S. Ascher, Ph.D.
      Bee Database Project Manager
      Division of Invertebrate Zoology
      American Museum of Natural History
      Central Park West @ 79th St .
      New York , NY 10024-5192
      work phone: 212-496-3447
      mobile phone: 917-407-0378

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