Re: [!! SPAM] [bbshop] Re: Youth Enrichment Program---Pt 3----Let's Roll
- You misread a lot of what I said. Please reread my points.
I think we agree on more than you realize, but I offer some cautions,
as well. See below.
On Dec 1, 2009, at 7:53 PM, Montana Jack Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Wonderful stuff Paul. I appreciate the help.
> As for your comments. Unfortunately, you have obscured the whole
> idea of the Harmonet program with FWD achievements that have nothing
> to do with getting into the high schools and remaining there to
> bring some barbershop to our high school kids on a regular basis.
My point exactly.
I was just pointing out that indeed something HAD come of it (COTS
class in YIH and the YIH program itself), at least in FWD and other
I too pointed out that we need to have continuity between the clinics
and camps by getting into classrooms. The youth chorus thrust you
include in Pt 3-1/2 is another contributor to continuity.
So how does the "Harmonet" program differ from the YIH Program
described in the YIH Resource Manual? Our FWD achievements are in line
with the latter and I hope the former.
> Although the college quartet champs may well evolve from a high
> school program, the high school is what we are pointing towards---
> not the college quartet contest.
I was just pointing out that college quartets are indeed the youth
that are among the millennials we are talking about - you dismissed
them as not being "youth". They are the millennials that are the
leading edge of the convolution with the Fourth Turning, a Crisis
And the college contest (and high school quartet contests) provide a
role model and in some cases a goal for the high school participants.
Students love the challenge of a contest. So the contests are an
ancillary part of our in-school program.
> Only approx 15 percent of the millennials are over 25 but that was
> not the thrust of the concept either. The idea is that this age
> group is most likely to mirror the WWII generation---and probably
> our best bet for new members---not particularly to compete in any
> contest. Age only matters as far as recognizing that a particular
> age group is part of particular generational group. You may want to
> have another look at the Neil Howe interviewed posted to the H-net
> last week.
I am quite familiar with it. Read all the literature and have
communicated with Mr. Howe about some ideas. We are talking about a
contemporary age group that is part of this millennial group, so in
this case they are synonymous.
> The plan is to get into the schools not run Harmony camps. We
> really want to see these kids every week, if possible.
Exactly what I said, except every week is rare because of other
curricular demands. The Resource Manual points this out and it
includes harmony camps as part of the plan.
> Sounds like FWD really has their act together in this regard.
> However, some others may not be as blessed or successful.
Exactly what I said. No time like the present to get started. A
journey of a thousand miles,...
> We are working to mobilize the Harmonet folks throughout the
> country. That the FWD is one step ahead of everyone else is a
> marvelous achievement. What we need to concentrate on is, not what
> you have accomplished but, what all of us working together and
> supporting one another can accomplish in our own areas.
Good idea, but don't dismiss others' opinions and the value of what
has been accomplished and is available to build on.
> In four short years, our high schoolers will have grown to full
> size, matured mentally and moving into adulthood. In the meantime,
> they are developing ideas, concepts and opinions that they probably
> will carry with them for a lifetime. Three years is far too long to
> develop a viable program.
Don't expect to do it any quicker, or you may be disappointed. But it
depends on what you mean by viable. If you mean attain a relationship
with a teacher, that's doable. If you mean getting to work on a
regular basis, three years is not an unreasonable goal or time frame.
Trying to rush can do more harm than good. Be willing to be patient.
> We need to be there every week (at least) and working to develop a
> real love and respect for our artform. By the time they are
> seniors, they will be the role models and running their own
> program. So we are aiming at getting in the door in three months
> and having a warm, respectful and mutually beneficial working
> relationship with the music teacher in a year.
Exactly what I said at the end of my paragraph 6 and above.
I applaud your enthusiasm, but patience is a necessary part of this
Having a relationship is not the same as the teacher having time for
barbershop. They have their lesson plans and are pretty set in their
ways. Some have stereotypical aversions to barbershop; some just don't
know what to do with it since it is not taught in college. We need
more education programs for the vocal teachers. And we need to get
colleges to include barbershop in their curricula.
Convincing teachers that barbershop can be a help to them takes more
than a comfortable relationship. They need to know how including
barbershop in their curriculum is going to help them achieve their
objectives. What carrots do we offer to help them meet those objectives?
Do you know their objectives? One of them that I was told is to have
more men in choir. That is what we are aiming for in our program. That
will be our primary measure of success, not how many quartets we form
or students who join BHS. Those are good secondary measures.
> As a former school teacher, that appears reasonable to me.
Exactly, except they can't devote every week to barbershop. "For every
purpose, there is a season", and we need to be available when there
are openings in their schedule (and their minds).
> "Teaching the teachers....." is precisely what we want to avoid like
> the plague.
Except at HEP schools (reread my paragraph 4). There we want to teach
them, because they would be coming to us as students.
> We are going into the schools to help in any way we can and to
> follow the teacher's direction, helping only when and if asked.
> Try it any other way, or display any hint of superiority or
> arrogance, and they will rightfully show you the door. The teachers
> are the professionals and have credentials to prove it. We are
> merely their guests.
Exactly what I said in my 6th paragraph (cf, paragraph 4).
> This reinforces our suggestion to download and read the society's
> wonderfully comprehensive and free "Youth in Harmony Resource
> Manual" It provides all the information and helpful hints you will
> need to be successful in getting barbershop into the schools.
> Please take the time to read it carefully.
I have read it several times, but I see it was updated in October.
Essentially the same information as before, but with expanded
explanations and suggestions. I view the Manual as the plan and my
bible. The point is that the YIH program is multi-faceted, but you
make the point that we need to focus on the in-school program. I
agree, but I am glad we have the other facets in place. Clinics and
camps help accelerate the in-school programs. I am finding that our
first clinic has cemented our relationship with the teachers whose
students attended, and they are strategizing with us about coaching
> Just a couple of comments that need addressing. I'll bet our Sweet
> Adeline sisters are displaying a bit of umbrage at your statement
> that barbershop is "a recognized MALE artform". I'm with you ladies.
But it is RECOGNIZED as a male art form; the stereotype is a MALE
quartet. There are plenty of women in choir; we need men.
> Also we better not show the teachers your comment that they "aren't
> particularly well organized and conscientious". I'll bet that
> attitude opens a lot of doors.
It's the students that may not be organized and conscientious.
Apparently my indeterminate pronoun "they" was not clearly linked to
the students. I was referring to after-school programs not involving
> Hope this helps a bit,
> Blessings, keep on rollin',
I recognize your focus is on the in-school program and youth chorus
for continuity. Bravo! I also find it useful to understand how they
fit into the overall plan. With all the hard work that went into the
college contest, harmony camps, etc., the hardest part is the in-
school facet. It's the guys in the trenches. Keep on diggin'.
> Montana Jack, keeping the faith and keeping it barbershop
Youth In Harmony Chairman
Pacific Coast Harmony
La Jolla Chapter
Barbershop Harmony Society
O[\\ \\ \\ \\]
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