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nine of 32

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  • Gary Davis
    The Illinois District has 32 chapters and only nine (28%) sent choruses to sing at its fall convention? What happened to the other 23? Just wondering. Gary
    Message 1 of 21 , Sep 29, 2012
      The Illinois District has 32 chapters and only nine (28%) sent choruses to
      sing at its fall convention?



      What happened to the other 23?



      Just wondering.



      Gary Davis

      Land of Lincoln Chorus



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Dick Johnson
      Gary Davis asked The Illinois District has 32 chapters and only nine (28%) sent choruses to sing at its fall convention? What happened to the other 23? - - -
      Message 2 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
        Gary Davis asked


        "The Illinois District has 32 chapters and only nine (28%) sent choruses to
        sing at its fall convention? What happened to the other 23?"
        - - - - - - - - - - - - -
        I think 25% to 30% is a pretty common figure Gary. High travel costs,
        housing, registration and transportation fees, etc. seem to be having
        an increasing affect on widespread participation. Not only BBShop
        Chapters. It even has shown to influence many other organizations
        that have Regional and/or National member gatherings. It's hard to
        fault our rather small (in comparison) membership when costs that
        may include Arrangements, Coaching, extra rehearsal schedules and
        the like, add to the drain on individual purse-strings.


        Dick Johnson
        Great Falls, MT




        -----Original Message-----
        From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
        To: bbshop <bbshop@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 12:49 am
        Subject: [bbshop] nine of 32







        Just wondering.

        Gary Davis

        Land of Lincoln Chorus

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]









        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Gary Davis
        I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend. Well, the answer is that most choruses don t think competition is worth the candle.
        Message 3 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
          I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

          Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
          candle.

          In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
          aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
          on.

          Is that smart?

          Gary Davis
        • Dave Jacobs
          I would guess that the 23 choruses in your district who did not compete probably *didn t *spend 90% of their time working on competition. If they did, then,
          Message 4 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
            I would guess that the 23 choruses in your district who did not compete
            probably *didn't *spend 90% of their time working on competition. If they
            did, then, no, it isn't smart.
            I would hope that they were working on the stuff that they feel **is**
            "worth the candle". (My chapter, which has opted out of competition this
            fall, is working on our first Christmas show, for example.)
            --
            Dave Jacobs
            Musical Director - Barbergator Chorus http://www.barbergators.com/
            https://www.facebook.com/Barbergators
            Sunshine District - VP of Chorus Director Development
            http://sunshinedistrict.org/
            Advancement Coordinator - BSA Troop 454

            On Sun, Sep 30, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...> wrote:

            > **
            >
            >
            > I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.
            >
            > Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
            > candle.
            >
            > In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
            > aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
            > on.
            >
            > Is that smart?
            >
            > Gary Davis
            >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Gary Davis
            Correction. I was wrong. Sorry. Only eight of our choruses decided to complete. We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%. Pretty
            Message 5 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
              Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.



              Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.



              We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.



              Pretty sad.



              Gary Davis



              From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              Gary Davis
              Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:19 PM
              To: 'Odyssey Quartet'
              Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32





              I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

              Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
              candle.

              In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
              aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
              on.

              Is that smart?

              Gary Davis





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • sct060@aol.com
              Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the
              Message 6 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall
                has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the
                "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring.
                The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters
                still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                -----Original message-----
                From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet'
                <odyssey4tet@...>
                Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on
                Saturday

                Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.



                Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.



                We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.



                Pretty sad.



                Gary Davis



                From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                Gary Davis
                Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:19 PM
                To: 'Odyssey Quartet'
                Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32





                I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

                Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
                candle.

                In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
                aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
                on.

                Is that smart?

                Gary Davis





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Gary Davis
                So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?
                Message 7 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                  So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?



                  Gary



                  From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                  Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:05 PM
                  To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                  Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring. The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                  Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless



                  -----Original message-----

                  From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                  To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet' <odyssey4tet@...>
                  Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                  Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                  Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.

                  Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.

                  We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.

                  Pretty sad.

                  Gary Davis

                  From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
                  Gary Davis
                  Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:19 PM
                  To: 'Odyssey Quartet'
                  Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com>
                  Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32

                  I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

                  Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
                  candle.

                  In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
                  aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
                  on.

                  Is that smart?

                  Gary Davis

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • sct060@aol.com
                  Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two chapters in Illinois, one of which competed this weekend, one which didn t. I ve sung in
                  Message 8 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                    Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two chapters in Illinois, one of which competed this weekend, one which didn't. I've sung in last place choruses, first place, and everywhere in between. I was never on the District board, but attended numerous House of Delegates meetings. At the chapter level, maybe 10% of our energy was devoted to competition preparation; district level, possibly 40%. This doesn't have to be a matter of speculation for you: House of Delegates meetings are open, the agenda is pre-published, and the contact information for every district board member, most of whom I consider as personal friends, is available on the district website. You can complain, or you can get involved.

                    Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                    -----Original message-----
                    From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                    To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 00:38:34 GMT+00:00
                    Subject: bang for the buck has always intrigued me

                    So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?



                    Gary



                    From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                    Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:05 PM
                    To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                    Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring. The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                    Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless



                    -----Original message-----

                    From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                    To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet' <odyssey4tet@...>
                    Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                    Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                    Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.

                    Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.

                    We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.

                    Pretty sad.

                    Gary Davis

                    From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • sct060@aol.com
                    Sorry, forgot to sign last two messages, phone truncates my normal contact info. John Gronski Fort Worth Former president, Aurora Lamplighters Co-founder and
                    Message 9 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                      Sorry, forgot to sign last two messages, phone truncates my normal contact info.

                      John Gronski
                      Fort Worth
                      Former president, Aurora Lamplighters
                      Co-founder and initial president of the latest version of the Kankakee chapter

                      Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                      -----Original message-----
                      From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                      To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 00:38:34 GMT+00:00
                      Subject: bang for the buck has always intrigued me

                      So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?



                      Gary



                      From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                      Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:05 PM
                      To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                      Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring. The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                      Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless



                      -----Original message-----

                      From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                      To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet' <odyssey4tet@...>
                      Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                      Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                      Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.

                      Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.

                      We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.

                      Pretty sad.

                      Gary Davis

                      From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Gary Davis
                      Dear SCT60 1. I did not know that House of Delegates meetings were open. Each time I’ve checked, the door to the meeting was closed. Nor did I ever
                      Message 10 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                        Dear SCT60



                        1. I did not know that House of Delegates meetings were open. Each time I’ve checked, the door to the meeting was closed. Nor did I ever receive an invitation to sit in. In fact, I’ve been told that only our president or his designee could attend. At least that’s what I think I was told.

                        2. I don’t believe that the HOD agenda is posted for the general membership to see. Somebody from the Illinois District can correct me if I’m wrong.

                        3. In our chapter, a full 90% of our effort has been devoted all summer to contest preparation. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

                        4. Thanks for your estimate that 40% of district resources go into the convention. We know that 25% of chapters send choruses to compete. If about half of our energy is going into X, shouldn’t half of our members be taking advantage of X? The 40% - 25% ratio seems a little off.

                        5. You’ll be glad to know that I AM involved. I was the staging chair for our recent convention and have the bad back to prove it. (I also provided contest programs when the District ran out.)



                        Gary Davis, Land of Lincoln Chorus



                        From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                        Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 7:50 PM
                        To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: bang for the buck has always intrigued me



                        Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two chapters in Illinois, one of which competed this weekend, one which didn't. I've sung in last place choruses, first place, and everywhere in between. I was never on the District board, but attended numerous House of Delegates meetings. At the chapter level, maybe 10% of our energy was devoted to competition preparation; district level, possibly 40%. This doesn't have to be a matter of speculation for you: House of Delegates meetings are open, the agenda is pre-published, and the contact information for every district board member, most of whom I consider as personal friends, is available on the district website. You can complain, or you can get involved.

                        Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless



                        -----Original message-----

                        From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                        To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 00:38:34 GMT+00:00
                        Subject: bang for the buck has always intrigued me

                        So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?



                        Gary



                        From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                        Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:05 PM
                        To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                        Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring. The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                        Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless



                        -----Original message-----

                        From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                        To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet' <odyssey4tet@...>
                        Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                        Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday



                        Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.

                        Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.

                        We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.

                        Pretty sad.

                        Gary Davis

                        From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
                        Gary Davis
                        Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:19 PM
                        To: 'Odyssey Quartet'
                        Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com>
                        Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32

                        I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

                        Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
                        candle.

                        In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
                        aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
                        on.

                        Is that smart?

                        Gary Davis

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Bill Byrd
                        There is a reason that districts devote much of their time to convention/contest. It s money, the majority of the district operating funds come from monies
                        Message 11 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                          There is a reason that districts devote much of their time to
                          convention/contest. It's money, the majority of the
                          district operating funds come from monies raised at convention. If our
                          districts did not make money from conventions we would have to find another
                          place to get those funds. I cannot speak to any particular district, I
                          have been here in Mid Atlantic for my entire time in barbershop (36+
                          years). If we get more participation at conventions districts can do more
                          things be cause they make money running conventions, Or at least they used
                          to. It has been one of the major sources of funds for some time. Please
                          even if you don't compete go to convention, root for your favorites, sing
                          in the lobby, stay in convention hotels, and connect with your fellow
                          barbershoppers. It is a good thing, I try to go every year whether I am
                          competing or not.
                          Bill Byrd
                          Norfolk VA
                          Suffolk VA


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Robert Farnham
                          Why are you spending 90% of your time preparing for competition?  Our director gave us 6 new songs to learn before summer began, we are competing on Oct 28th
                          Message 12 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                            Why are you spending 90% of your time preparing for competition?  Our director gave us 6 new songs to learn before summer began, we are competing on Oct 28th in NE District.  He may know which ones we are doing in competition, but no one else does.  We are doing our best to learn all 6 songs as our Annual Show is one week after competition.  Too much emphasis placed on winning, not enough on singing well and having fun in most choruses, I would guess.  Just my humble opinion,  Much prefer our directors approach!
                            Bob Farnham
                            Bass - REWIND!
                            Bass - Concord Coachmen Chorus
                            Bass - Lakes Region Chorus
                            Bass - Kytchyn Sync!

                            --- On Sun, 9/30/12, Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...> wrote:

                            From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                            Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32
                            To: "'Odyssey Quartet'" <odyssey4tet@...>
                            Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Sunday, September 30, 2012, 6:19 PM
















                             









                            I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.



                            Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the

                            candle.



                            In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)

                            aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working

                            on.



                            Is that smart?



                            Gary Davis



























                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • sct060@aol.com
                            Consider this a public apology to Gary for my earlier snappish tone-I broke my own rule of not reading twice before hitting and sent a message much
                            Message 13 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                              Consider this a public apology to Gary for my earlier snappish tone-I broke my own rule of not reading twice before hitting <send> and sent a message much harsher than I should have. I sent him a more detailed private apology.

                              John

                              Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                              -----Original message-----
                              From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                              To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 01:06:33 GMT+00:00
                              Subject: I am involved

                              Dear SCT60



                              1. I did not know that House of Delegates meetings were open. Each time I’ve checked, the door to the meeting was closed. Nor did I ever receive an invitation to sit in. In fact, I’ve been told that only our president or his designee could attend. At least that’s what I think I was told.

                              2. I don’t believe that the HOD agenda is posted for the general membership to see. Somebody from the Illinois District can correct me if I’m wrong.

                              3. In our chapter, a full 90% of our effort has been devoted all summer to contest preparation. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

                              4. Thanks for your estimate that 40% of district resources go into the convention. We know that 25% of chapters send choruses to compete. If about half of our energy is going into X, shouldn’t half of our members be taking advantage of X? The 40% - 25% ratio seems a little off.

                              5. You’ll be glad to know that I AM involved. I was the staging chair for our recent convention and have the bad back to prove it. (I also provided contest programs when the District ran out.)



                              Gary Davis, Land of Lincoln Chorus



                              From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                              Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 7:50 PM
                              To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: bang for the buck has always intrigued me



                              Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two cha


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • John Witmer
                              Hey Gary, You, or your chapter, may have confused attending HOD meetings and voting at HOD meetings. Each chapter has one vote, but that doesn t mean that
                              Message 14 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                                Hey Gary,
                                You, or your chapter, may have confused "attending" HOD meetings and "voting" at HOD meetings. Each chapter has one vote, but that doesn't mean that lots of people from your chapter can't attend.
                                I've attended many HOD meetings and noticed several non-delegates in attendence. The doors are closed because some foursome is usually woodshedding in the hall. (You wouldn't want official barbershop business disrupted by singing. <grin>)

                                I too have belonged to 1st place choruses as well as last place choruses. The primary difference is not which songs they are working on, but how they work on them. The 1st place choruses tend to spend just a much time and effort on non-competition songs as they do on the songs they plan to sing in contest. The effort, for them, is to produce top-notch singing. In other words the better choruses tend to work a lot harder than the others on all their music. But just as in most facets of life, it isn't how hard you work that produces results but how effectively you work.

                                Chordially, John Witmer
                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: Gary Davis
                                To: sct060@... ; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 9:06 PM
                                Subject: [bbshop] I am involved



                                Dear SCT60

                                1. I did not know that House of Delegates meetings were open. Each time I’ve checked, the door to the meeting was closed. Nor did I ever receive an invitation to sit in. In fact, I’ve been told that only our president or his designee could attend. At least that’s what I think I was told.

                                2. I don’t believe that the HOD agenda is posted for the general membership to see. Somebody from the Illinois District can correct me if I’m wrong.

                                3. In our chapter, a full 90% of our effort has been devoted all summer to contest preparation. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

                                4. Thanks for your estimate that 40% of district resources go into the convention. We know that 25% of chapters send choruses to compete. If about half of our energy is going into X, shouldn’t half of our members be taking advantage of X? The 40% - 25% ratio seems a little off.

                                5. You’ll be glad to know that I AM involved. I was the staging chair for our recent convention and have the bad back to prove it. (I also provided contest programs when the District ran out.)

                                Gary Davis, Land of Lincoln Chorus

                                From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                                Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 7:50 PM
                                To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: bang for the buck has always intrigued me

                                Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two chapters in Illinois, one of which competed this weekend, one which didn't. I've sung in last place choruses, first place, and everywhere in between. I was never on the District board, but attended numerous House of Delegates meetings. At the chapter level, maybe 10% of our energy was devoted to competition preparation; district level, possibly 40%. This doesn't have to be a matter of speculation for you: House of Delegates meetings are open, the agenda is pre-published, and the contact information for every district board member, most of whom I consider as personal friends, is available on the district website. You can complain, or you can get involved.

                                Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                                -----Original message-----

                                From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                                To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 00:38:34 GMT+00:00
                                Subject: bang for the buck has always intrigued me

                                So you know more than I do about district efforts. Would it be fair to say that 90% of the district officers’ time and energy goes to plan the conventions?

                                Gary

                                From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                                Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:05 PM
                                To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday

                                Gary, it has been a while since I was active in the district, but the fall has historically been the smaller of the two annual chorus competitions; the "invitational", if you will, with the "open" competition held in the spring. The rules may have changed, but I suspect that many of the small chapters still hold the belief that the spring is their time to compete.

                                Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

                                -----Original message-----

                                From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                                To: 'Gary Davis' <gwdavis44@...>, 'Odyssey Quartet' <odyssey4tet@...>
                                Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Sun, Sep 30, 2012 22:46:09 GMT+00:00
                                Subject: [bbshop] one of every four district choruses decided to compete on Saturday

                                Correction. I was wrong. Sorry.

                                Only eight of our choruses decided to complete.

                                We have 32 chapters in our district. That works out to an even 25%.

                                Pretty sad.

                                Gary Davis

                                From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
                                Gary Davis
                                Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:19 PM
                                To: 'Odyssey Quartet'
                                Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com>
                                Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32

                                I asked why only nine of our 32 choruses showed up to compete last weekend.

                                Well, the answer is that most choruses don't think competition is worth the
                                candle.

                                In other words, about 3/4 of our choruses (and probably 70% of our members)
                                aren't all that interested in something that we spend 90% of time working
                                on.

                                Is that smart?

                                Gary Davis

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • jburri62
                                Good on ya , John. Gary, very respectfully, if you don t feel 90% of your chapter s summer efforts being devoted to fall contest preparation is appropriate,
                                Message 15 of 21 , Sep 30, 2012
                                  Good on ya', John.

                                  Gary, very respectfully, if you don't feel 90% of your chapter's summer efforts being devoted to fall contest preparation is appropriate, have you taken up your concern with your chapter leadership?

                                  What do you propose can be done to bring back the balance you seek?

                                  John Burri
                                  Portland, OR

                                  --- In bbshop@yahoogroups.com, "sct060@..."<sct060@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Consider this a public apology to Gary for my earlier snappish tone-I broke my own rule of not reading twice before hitting <send> and sent a message much harsher than I should have. I sent him a more detailed private apology.
                                  >
                                  > John
                                  >
                                  > Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless
                                  >
                                  > -----Original message-----
                                  > From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                                  > To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 01:06:33 GMT+00:00
                                  > Subject: I am involved
                                  >
                                  > Dear SCT60
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > 1. I did not know that House of Delegates meetings were open. Each time I’ve checked, the door to the meeting was closed. Nor did I ever receive an invitation to sit in. In fact, I’ve been told that only our president or his designee could attend. At least that’s what I think I was told.
                                  >
                                  > 2. I don’t believe that the HOD agenda is posted for the general membership to see. Somebody from the Illinois District can correct me if I’m wrong.
                                  >
                                  > 3. In our chapter, a full 90% of our effort has been devoted all summer to contest preparation. I’m not sure it’s worth it.
                                  >
                                  > 4. Thanks for your estimate that 40% of district resources go into the convention. We know that 25% of chapters send choruses to compete. If about half of our energy is going into X, shouldn’t half of our members be taking advantage of X? The 40% - 25% ratio seems a little off.
                                  >
                                  > 5. You’ll be glad to know that I AM involved. I was the staging chair for our recent convention and have the bad back to prove it. (I also provided contest programs when the District ran out.)
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Gary Davis, Land of Lincoln Chorus
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                                  > Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 7:50 PM
                                  > To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: Re: bang for the buck has always intrigued me
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Based on what I have seen, not even close. I was president of two cha
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                • Mike Scott
                                  Understand the need to focus on competition but never forget each member cuts a check annually to belong to a barbershop chapter. If we re not the Greatest
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Oct 1, 2012
                                    Understand the need to focus on "competition" but never forget each member cuts a check annually to belong to a barbershop chapter.

                                    If we're not "the Greatest Show On Earth" on the chapter meeting night, we lose. They find something more interesting.

                                    Beating two songs to death for that long a period of time would force me to re-evaluate "my night out". Not saying I'm not interested in personally becoming a better singer = allowing the chorus to become a higher quality singing force…but stop and think for a minute.

                                    Is there a better way to be more effective, offer a little bit for everyone to enjoy and still get the job done. Answer is yes.

                                    President's leadership of the chapter is key.

                                    Director (Associate Directors) and Music Team need to realize not everyone is wired the same so variety in planning is key.

                                    About 10 years ago, we beat two songs to death over 2 1/2 months during the summer. We came in 7th in the fall.

                                    Our Director asked us at our next Board meeting what WE thought.

                                    I told him: "The next time we beat two songs again over the course of the summer, I will find something else to do."

                                    He got the message.

                                    Since then, we've recruited, hired a high quality 30 year old HS Vocal Music Director, collegiate quartet experience at International, strong, effective Music Team who are all in sync,

                                    Driven by chapter Admin leadership - who all agree on the following:

                                    - Making sure our chapter meetings / rehearsals a not predicative.

                                    - Inject many things the late Chuck Greene taught us in his CACM workshop. (VARIETY!) Something for everyone.

                                    - Prepare a quality "script" letting chapter members know ahead of time what to expect, what songs to prepare for so some poor guy isn't hammering out notes on a piano for an ill-equipped section of the chapter. (That drives me nuts anyway). J

                                    Must be working.

                                    As a 24 year member of this Iowa chapter, we've had north of 65% ~ 70% consistent summer attendance for the first time since I joined.

                                    First 23 years, barely enough to form a VLQ and wasted 50 mile R/T drive for myself.

                                    Chapter needs to sit down and determine what kind a chapter they want to be.

                                    Social or Competitive. Most line up somewhere between those goal posts.

                                    Important to allow everyone to provide their input.

                                    Makes for a healthy chapter and they feel ownership.

                                    If we fail to offer a quality night out for the boys, their TV remote control will be our biggest competitor.

                                    Starts with strong, effective leadership at the top.

                                    + common sense.

                                    Regards,

                                    Mike Scott
                                    CSD Membership Development VP
                                    Algona, IA. Chapter Prez



                                    From: bbshop@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bbshop@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jburri62
                                    Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 1:05 AM
                                    To: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: [bbshop] Re: I am involved

                                    Good on ya', John.

                                    Gary, very respectfully, if you don't feel 90% of your chapter's summer efforts being devoted to fall contest preparation is appropriate, have you taken up your concern with your chapter leadership?

                                    What do you propose can be done to bring back the balance you seek?

                                    John Burri
                                    Portland, OR

                                    --- In bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com> , "sct060@..."<sct060@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    ...
                                    >
                                    > -----Original message-----
                                    > From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                                    > To: sct060@..., bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 01:06:33 GMT+00:00
                                    > Subject: I am involved
                                    >
                                    ...
                                    >
                                    > From: sct060@... [mailto:sct060@...]
                                    > Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 7:50 PM
                                    > To: Gary Davis; bbshop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bbshop%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > Subject: Re: bang for the buck has always intrigued me
                                    >
                                    ...
                                    >
                                  • Andren Moyer
                                    Hey all! I am wondering if any of you know if there is a female arrangement of “Rockin’ With the Rythm of the Rain” ala the Judds? Thanks! Andren Moyer
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Oct 1, 2012
                                      Hey all!



                                      I am wondering if any of you know if there is a female arrangement of “Rockin’ With the Rythm of the Rain” ala the Judds?



                                      Thanks!



                                      Andren Moyer

                                      andren@...







                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • David
                                      Treating all the songs as if they were contest songs -- what a great idea! Some years back, I attended a chapter show out of my usual stomping grounds. The
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Oct 2, 2012
                                        Treating all the songs as if they were contest songs -- what a great idea!

                                        Some years back, I attended a chapter show out of my usual stomping grounds. The songs were good enough, and the audience was enjoying the show and getting their money's worth.

                                        But then, suddenly, the chorus's attitude shifted. For two songs, the men were focused and radiated excitement. For two songs, the moves were crisp and energetic, the singing was clean, and the dynamics were -- well -- dynamic. For two songs, they brought me to the edge of my seat.

                                        And then it was over. Back to being a "pretty good" chorus.

                                        Afterwards, talking to the director, I named the two songs and asked if those were their contest package. He proudly confirmed my guess. I didn't share with him that I was, in fact, disappointed. Knowing what his chorus was capable of, I felt cheated that they only gave me that excitement and energy for two of their songs.

                                        Please note: I love "pretty good" choruses, and think that we under-rate how enjoyable and entertaining "average" barbershop really is. But if you're going to put in the effort to improve the chorus's performance on two songs, why not do it for *all* of your songs? It's really not that much more difficult.

                                        Dave Garstang

                                        --- In bbshop@yahoogroups.com, Robert Farnham <robertfarnham@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Why are you spending 90% of your time preparing for competition?  Our director gave us 6 new songs to learn before summer began, we are competing on Oct 28th in NE District.  He may know which ones we are doing in competition, but no one else does.  We are doing our best to learn all 6 songs as our Annual Show is one week after competition.  Too much emphasis placed on winning, not enough on singing well and having fun in most choruses, I would guess.  Just my humble opinion,  Much prefer our directors approach!
                                        > Bob Farnham
                                        > Bass - REWIND!
                                        > Bass - Concord Coachmen Chorus
                                        > Bass - Lakes Region Chorus
                                        > Bass - Kytchyn Sync!
                                        >
                                        > --- On Sun, 9/30/12, Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > From: Gary Davis <gwdavis44@...>
                                        > Subject: [bbshop] RE: nine of 32
                                        > To: "'Odyssey Quartet'" <odyssey4tet@...>
                                        > Cc: bbshop@yahoogroups.com
                                        > Date: Sunday, September 30, 2012, 6:19 PM
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        <SNIP>
                                      • Jordan Truesdell
                                        Imagine if we required a 12 song repertoire, from which the director is notified 72 hours before contest by the district of the 2 contest songs, so that proper
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Oct 3, 2012
                                          Imagine if we required a 12 song repertoire, from which the director is
                                          notified 72 hours before contest by the district of the 2 contest songs, so
                                          that proper costume/props are brought to the competition.

                                          The dichotomy happens in my chorus, too. We have two songs we sing in the
                                          high 60s, a handful in the low 60s, and the rest in the 50s (imho, I'm not
                                          a judge). But many members feel we are an "almost 70" chorus and that
                                          number somehow magically applies to all of our songs. I get some menacing
                                          looks when I (as Music VP) claim we've got show songs that barely make the
                                          50s. We skipped District this fall, in part because I didn't have time to
                                          prep the show given the rigor with which we rehearse contest music.

                                          On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 1:52 PM, David <garsinger@...> wrote:

                                          >
                                          > But then, suddenly, the chorus's attitude shifted. For two songs, the men
                                          > were focused and radiated excitement. For two songs, the moves were crisp
                                          > and energetic, the singing was clean, and the dynamics were -- well --
                                          > dynamic. For two songs, they brought me to the edge of my seat.
                                          >
                                          > And then it was over. Back to being a "pretty good" chorus.
                                          >


                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • tpblead
                                          A few years ago in MAD district, one of our choruses brought six songs to contest. After the men were on stage and set on the risers, the director approached
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Oct 3, 2012
                                            A few years ago in MAD district, one of our choruses brought six songs to contest. After the men were on stage and set on the risers, the director approached the judges and asked them to pick two of six cards that had been prepared. That was how they picked the two songs that the chorus would sing for the contest. They just couldn't decide which songs they preferred, so they came prepared to sing any of them. After the cards were drawn, he turned to the chorus, told them which song they were singing and had the pitch blown. They did not win the contest by any means, but they scored pretty well, as I recall.

                                            Tim Buell
                                            Alexandria Harmonizers

                                            --- In bbshop@yahoogroups.com, Jordan Truesdell <jordan@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > Imagine if we required a 12 song repertoire, from which the director is
                                            > notified 72 hours before contest by the district of the 2 contest songs, so
                                            > that proper costume/props are brought to the competition.
                                            >
                                            > The dichotomy happens in my chorus, too. We have two songs we sing in the
                                            > high 60s, a handful in the low 60s, and the rest in the 50s (imho, I'm not
                                            > a judge). But many members feel we are an "almost 70" chorus and that
                                            > number somehow magically applies to all of our songs. I get some menacing
                                            > looks when I (as Music VP) claim we've got show songs that barely make the
                                            > 50s. We skipped District this fall, in part because I didn't have time to
                                            > prep the show given the rigor with which we rehearse contest music.
                                            >
                                            > On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 1:52 PM, David <garsinger@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > But then, suddenly, the chorus's attitude shifted. For two songs, the men
                                            > > were focused and radiated excitement. For two songs, the moves were crisp
                                            > > and energetic, the singing was clean, and the dynamics were -- well --
                                            > > dynamic. For two songs, they brought me to the edge of my seat.
                                            > >
                                            > > And then it was over. Back to being a "pretty good" chorus.
                                            > >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            >
                                          • John Elving
                                            Having been in three different districts and several different chapters, and having visited many chapters, I think that this may be the norm. We always think
                                            Message 21 of 21 , Oct 4, 2012
                                              Having been in three different districts and several different chapters, and
                                              having visited many chapters, I think that this may be the norm. We always
                                              think that we are better than we are. And if someone tells us different,
                                              they don't really know what they are talking about.

                                              I think that most choruses have moments of brilliance. The real difference
                                              between most choruses and the really great choruses is consistency. The
                                              great choruses, and I'm not rally talking about top competition choruses,
                                              work hard at being consistently great. The rest of us (my chapter included)
                                              are satisfied with "good enough" most of the time and expect great to come
                                              about without putting in the effort needed to be consistently great.

                                              It's the consistency that makes choruses great, not that they are any better
                                              to start with than the "good enough" choruses who don't strive for great
                                              consistency.

                                              --
                                              Sing-cerely & Humm-bly,

                                              John Elving
                                              VP Mus. & Perf. (2012)
                                              Editor-in-Cheap
                                              Shrine of Democracy Chorus
                                              RMD VP - M&PR (2011-2012)
                                              RMD Executive VP (2013-2014)
                                              PROBE President (2011-2013)
                                              Email: leaderman@...
                                              Skype: john.elving



                                              On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Jordan Truesdell <jordan@...>
                                              wrote:



                                              The dichotomy happens in my chorus, too. We have two songs we sing in the
                                              high 60s, a handful in the low 60s, and the rest in the 50s (imho, I'm not
                                              a judge). But many members feel we are an "almost 70" chorus and that
                                              number somehow magically applies to all of our songs. I get some menacing
                                              looks when I (as Music VP) claim we've got show songs that barely make the
                                              50s. We skipped District this fall, in part because I didn't have time to
                                              prep the show given the rigor with which we rehearse contest music.
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