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Re: [baseball-databank] Digest Number 1321

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  • Tom Ruane
    I looked at Frank Linzy s 1973 total and, assuming that we are talking about SH allowed, I think this is simply a discrepancy between Retrosheet s data (we
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 12, 2013
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      I looked at Frank Linzy's 1973 total and, assuming that we are talking about SH allowed, I think this is simply a discrepancy between Retrosheet's data (we have 2) and the official (or least Pete Palmer's) data (which has 1). We show Pete's data on the team and player pages. If you want the data derived from our data, you can go to the splits pages and look at the total line there. Once we finish creating discrepancy files for all of our years (right now they cover only 1915-49), you will also usually be able to identify the specific game causing the discrepancy.
      I didn't look at any of the others, but I suspect they are all the same.
      Tom Ruane



      On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 6:29 AM, <baseball-databank@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

      2 New Messages

      Digest #1321
      1a
      SH and SF errata by "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5
      1b
      Re: SH and SF errata by "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh

      Messages

      Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:08 am (PST) . Posted by:

      "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5

      I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
      posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
      and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
      checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
      probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
      discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from Mike's
      SH-SF-GDP.xls.

      Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
      1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
      1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
      1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
      2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
      http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm

      Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
      added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.

      I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but because
      it started here I have posted here.

      Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:10 am (PST) . Posted by:

      "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh


      On 12/11/2013 8:42 AM, Shane McCarthy wrote:
      > I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
      > posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
      > and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
      > checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
      > probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
      > discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from
      > Mike's
      > SH-SF-GDP.xls.
      >
      > Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
      > 1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
      > 1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      > 1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      > 1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
      > 1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
      > 1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
      > 2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
      > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm
      >
      > Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
      > added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.
      >
      > I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but
      > because it started here I have posted here.

      From what I can tell, all of these are incorrect on the Retrosheet
      totals page. I checked all but Smith's, and (1) the latest version of
      the event files, and the daily charts on the Retrosheet page match what
      I posted earlier, (2) where I could check box scores in the Sporting
      News, the numbers matched to what I posted earlier, and (3) the
      corresponding batter totals for batters that might have been affected
      match what appears in the dailies and on the Retrosheet totals page for
      those batters (in cases where I reported more SH than appear on the
      Retrosheet totals page for the pitchers).

      --
      Mike Emeigh
      MWE55inNC@gmail.com
      919-389-1013
      mike.emeigh on Skype
      http://www.linkedin.com/in/mwemeigh

      GROUP FOOTER MESSAGE

    • Clem Comly
      One of 2 SHs against Linzy was Sharp 6/2/1973 when Brewers hosted White Sox. Sharp’s split page (4) has 1 more SH than his player page (3). Does anyone
      Message 2 of 4 , Dec 12, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        One of 2 SHs against Linzy was Sharp  6/2/1973 when Brewers hosted White Sox.  Sharp’s split page (4) has 1 more SH than his player page (3). 
        Does anyone have the TSN box or access to a Chicago newspaper?
         
         
        WHITE SOX 13TH: Kelly singled to center;
        Sharp out on asacrifice bunt (third to second) [Kelly to second];
        D. Allen waswalked intentionally;
        Melton popped to third;
        May grounded out(first to pitcher);
        0 R, 1 H, 0 E, 2 LOB. White Sox 2, Brewers2.
         
        Clem Comly
         
        From: Tom Ruane
        Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 7:53 AM
        Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] Digest Number 1321
         
         

        I looked at Frank Linzy's 1973 total and, assuming that we are talking about SH allowed, I think this is simply a discrepancy between Retrosheet's data (we have 2) and the official (or least Pete Palmer's) data (which has 1). We show Pete's data on the team and player pages. If you want the data derived from our data, you can go to the splits pages and look at the total line there. Once we finish creating discrepancy files for all of our years (right now they cover only 1915-49), you will also usually be able to identify the specific game causing the discrepancy.
        I didn't look at any of the others, but I suspect they are all the same.
        Tom Ruane



        On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 6:29 AM, <baseball-databank@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

        2 New Messages

        Digest #1321
        1a
        SH and SF errata by "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5
        1b
        Re: SH and SF errata by "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh

        Messages

        Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:08 am (PST) . Posted by:

        "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5

        I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
        posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
        and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
        checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
        probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
        discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from Mike's
        SH-SF-GDP.xls.

        Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
        1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
        1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
        1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
        2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
        http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm

        Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
        added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.

        I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but because
        it started here I have posted here.

        Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:10 am (PST) . Posted by:

        "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh


        On 12/11/2013 8:42 AM, Shane McCarthy wrote:
        > I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
        > posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
        > and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
        > checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
        > probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
        > discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from
        > Mike's
        > SH-SF-GDP.xls.
        >
        > Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
        > 1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
        > 1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        > 1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        > 1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
        > 1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
        > 1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
        > 2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
        > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm
        >
        > Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
        > added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.
        >
        > I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but
        > because it started here I have posted here.

        From what I can tell, all of these are incorrect on the Retrosheet
        totals page. I checked all but Smith's, and (1) the latest version of
        the event files, and the daily charts on the Retrosheet page match what
        I posted earlier, (2) where I could check box scores in the Sporting
        News, the numbers matched to what I posted earlier, and (3) the
        corresponding batter totals for batters that might have been affected
        match what appears in the dailies and on the Retrosheet totals page for
        those batters (in cases where I reported more SH than appear on the
        Retrosheet totals page for the pitchers).

        --
        Mike Emeigh
        MWE55inNC@gmail.com
        919-389-1013
        mike.emeigh on Skype
        http://www.linkedin.com/in/mwemeigh

        We are making changes based on your feedback, Thank you !
        The Yahoo! Groups Product Blog
         
      • Shane McCarthy
        Thank you for the explanation Tom. My posts were a response to Clem s asking if I could find the game responsible for the discrepancy I was seeing between
        Message 3 of 4 , Dec 12, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          Thank you for the explanation Tom.   My posts were a response to Clem's asking if I could find the game responsible for the discrepancy I was seeing between batting and pitching yearly totals.  So knowing Retrosheet is aware of the discrepancy and has an explanation for it is marvellous.  I shall sleep well tonight!

          Also, I wish to thank everyone responsible for what I am finding to be a very interesting resource.


          On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Clem Comly <ccomly@...> wrote:
           

          One of 2 SHs against Linzy was Sharp  6/2/1973 when Brewers hosted White Sox.  Sharp’s split page (4) has 1 more SH than his player page (3). 
          Does anyone have the TSN box or access to a Chicago newspaper?
           
           
          WHITE SOX 13TH: Kelly singled to center;
          Sharp out on asacrifice bunt (third to second) [Kelly to second];
          D. Allen waswalked intentionally;
          Melton popped to third;
          May grounded out(first to pitcher);
          0 R, 1 H, 0 E, 2 LOB. White Sox 2, Brewers2.
           
          Clem Comly
           
          From: Tom Ruane
          Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 7:53 AM
          Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] Digest Number 1321
           
           

          I looked at Frank Linzy's 1973 total and, assuming that we are talking about SH allowed, I think this is simply a discrepancy between Retrosheet's data (we have 2) and the official (or least Pete Palmer's) data (which has 1). We show Pete's data on the team and player pages. If you want the data derived from our data, you can go to the splits pages and look at the total line there. Once we finish creating discrepancy files for all of our years (right now they cover only 1915-49), you will also usually be able to identify the specific game causing the discrepancy.
          I didn't look at any of the others, but I suspect they are all the same.
          Tom Ruane



          On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 6:29 AM, <baseball-databank@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

          2 New Messages

          Digest #1321
          1a
          SH and SF errata by "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5
          1b
          Re: SH and SF errata by "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh

          Messages

          Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:08 am (PST) . Posted by:

          "Shane McCarthy" 8c94a593bdc4ec42695b5a88005274c5

          I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
          posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
          and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
          checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
          probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
          discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from Mike's
          SH-SF-GDP.xls.

          Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
          1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
          1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
          1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
          2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
          http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm

          Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
          added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.

          I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but because
          it started here I have posted here.

          Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:10 am (PST) . Posted by:

          "Mike Emeigh" mwemeigh


          On 12/11/2013 8:42 AM, Shane McCarthy wrote:
          > I must begin by apologizing to anyone whose time was wasted by my previous
          > posting which was rife with errors. I checked the web pages I had listed
          > and saw that none reflected the values in Mike's SH-SF-GDP table. I
          > checked what I had posted and realized the errors in my reporting were
          > probably the culprit. Below is a more accurate report of the
          > discrepancies. The SH and SF values in the following table are from
          > Mike's
          > SH-SF-GDP.xls.
          >
          > Year retroID TEAM SH SF web address showing different value
          > 1973 linzf101 MIL 2 3
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1973/UPMIL01973.htm
          > 1985 barkl001 ATL 3 2
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          > 1985 campr001 ATL 5 3
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          > 1985 smitz001 ATL 17 1
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1985/UPATL01985.htm
          > 1991 castt001 NYN 2 1
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1991/UPNYN01991.htm
          > 1995 grosk001 TEX 6 7
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1995/UPTEX01995.htm
          > 2010 petta001 NYA 7 5
          > http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/2010/UNYA02010.htm
          >
          > Previously the final two rows had the incorrect counts for SH. I have
          > added the team because in 1991 castt001 played for both ATL and NYN.
          >
          > I suspect this is a topic to be posted on RetroList or RetroSQL but
          > because it started here I have posted here.

          From what I can tell, all of these are incorrect on the Retrosheet
          totals page. I checked all but Smith's, and (1) the latest version of
          the event files, and the daily charts on the Retrosheet page match what
          I posted earlier, (2) where I could check box scores in the Sporting
          News, the numbers matched to what I posted earlier, and (3) the
          corresponding batter totals for batters that might have been affected
          match what appears in the dailies and on the Retrosheet totals page for
          those batters (in cases where I reported more SH than appear on the
          Retrosheet totals page for the pitchers).

          --
          Mike Emeigh
          MWE55inNC@gmail.com
          919-389-1013
          mike.emeigh on Skype
          http://www.linkedin.com/in/mwemeigh

          We are making changes based on your feedback, Thank you !
          The Yahoo! Groups Product Blog
           


        • Mike Emeigh
          TSN box showed Sharp with a SH. Unfortunately, there s no online access to either Milwaukee paper for that date (usually the Journal and Sentinel are
          Message 4 of 4 , Dec 12, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            TSN box showed Sharp with a SH. Unfortunately, there's no online access
            to either Milwaukee paper for that date (usually the Journal and
            Sentinel are accessible at Google), nor can I find one in a different paper.

            --
            Mike Emeigh
            MWE55inNC@...
            919-389-1013
            mike.emeigh on Skype
            http://www.linkedin.com/in/mwemeigh
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