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Re: 1975 ALCS

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  • dsreyn
    Just reviving an old thread here, but this error still hasn t been fixed... Since this was first discussed, Retrosheet s PBP data has been revised for the play
    Message 1 of 4 , Mar 23, 2009
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      Just reviving an old thread here, but this error still hasn't been fixed...

      Since this was first discussed, Retrosheet's PBP data has been revised for the play in question (this is from game 1 of the 1975 ALCS):

      RED SOX 7TH: Evans doubled to center; Cooper out on a sacrifice
      bunt (third to first) [Evans to third]

      And of course, Retrosheet has also corrected Cooper's statistics, so he is now listed there as 4 for 10 in the series, with a sacrifice. Baseball-databank still shows Cooper as 4 for 11, with no sacrifice; I believe this should be changed, as it appears that all published sources also have him as 4 for 10 with a sacrifice.

      Doug

      --- In baseball-databank@yahoogroups.com, KJOK <kjokbaseball@...> wrote:
      >
      > Sporting News, NY Times, Washington Post, etc. all show Cooper with a sacrifice in the following day boxscore, so I would say that the official scorer gave him a sacrifice, which probably means Retrosheet, BBDB and baseball-reference.com are all incorrect.
      >
      > THANKS,
      > Kevin
      >
      > dsreyn <dreynolds@...> wrote:
      > While spot-checking some things, I noticed a discrepancy in the 1975
      > Red Sox ALCS batting statistics. According to BDB (and Retrosheet),
      > Cecil Cooper had 4 hits in 11 at-bats in the series. The Stats Inc.
      > All-Time Baseball Sourcebook lists Cooper as 4 for 10 in the series.
      > The Macmillan Baseball Encyclopedia (7th) and the 1976 TSN Baseball
      > Guide both also list Cooper as 4 for 10.
      >
      > Comparing the box scores at Retrosheet with those in the Stats Inc
      > book and the TSN Guide, the difference appears to come in the first
      > game of the series. Stats and TSN both list Cooper as going 1 for 3
      > with a sacrifice; Retrosheet lists Cooper as 1 for 4 with no
      > sacrifice. Looking through Retrosheet's play by play, I suspect that
      > the difference arises in the 7th inning:
      >
      > RED SOX 7TH: Evans doubled to center; Cooper grounded out (third
      > to first); ...
      >
      > Maybe this is really a Retrosheet question, but is there any good
      > reason to believe that all of the published sources have this wrong?
      >
      > Doug
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > http://www.baseball-databank.org/
      >
      >
      >
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    • Sean Forman
      I should probably try to revise these using retrosheet s latest postseason pbp. sean 2009/3/23 dsreyn ... -- Sean Forman President,
      Message 2 of 4 , Mar 26, 2009
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        I should probably try to revise these using retrosheet's latest postseason pbp.

        sean

        2009/3/23 dsreyn <dreynolds@...>

        Just reviving an old thread here, but this error still hasn't been fixed...

        Since this was first discussed, Retrosheet's PBP data has been revised for the play in question (this is from game 1 of the 1975 ALCS):

        RED SOX 7TH: Evans doubled to center; Cooper out on a sacrifice
        bunt (third to first) [Evans to third]

        And of course, Retrosheet has also corrected Cooper's statistics, so he is now listed there as 4 for 10 in the series, with a sacrifice. Baseball-databank still shows Cooper as 4 for 11, with no sacrifice; I believe this should be changed, as it appears that all published sources also have him as 4 for 10 with a sacrifice.

        Doug

        --- In baseball-databank@yahoogroups.com, KJOK <kjokbaseball@...> wrote:
        >
        > Sporting News, NY Times, Washington Post, etc. all show Cooper with a sacrifice in the following day boxscore, so I would say that the official scorer gave him a sacrifice, which probably means Retrosheet, BBDB and baseball-reference.com are all incorrect.
        >
        > THANKS,
        > Kevin
        >
        > dsreyn <dreynolds@...> wrote:
        > While spot-checking some things, I noticed a discrepancy in the 1975
        > Red Sox ALCS batting statistics. According to BDB (and Retrosheet),
        > Cecil Cooper had 4 hits in 11 at-bats in the series. The Stats Inc.
        > All-Time Baseball Sourcebook lists Cooper as 4 for 10 in the series.
        > The Macmillan Baseball Encyclopedia (7th) and the 1976 TSN Baseball
        > Guide both also list Cooper as 4 for 10.
        >
        > Comparing the box scores at Retrosheet with those in the Stats Inc
        > book and the TSN Guide, the difference appears to come in the first
        > game of the series. Stats and TSN both list Cooper as going 1 for 3
        > with a sacrifice; Retrosheet lists Cooper as 1 for 4 with no
        > sacrifice. Looking through Retrosheet's play by play, I suspect that
        > the difference arises in the 7th inning:
        >
        > RED SOX 7TH: Evans doubled to center; Cooper grounded out (third
        > to first); ...
        >
        > Maybe this is really a Retrosheet question, but is there any good
        > reason to believe that all of the published sources have this wrong?
        >
        > Doug
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > http://www.baseball-databank.org/
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
        >
        >
        > Visit your group "baseball-databank" on the web.
        >
        > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > baseball-databank-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        >
        >
        >
        > __________________________________________________
        > Do You Yahoo!?
        > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
        > http://mail.yahoo.com
        >




        --
        Sean Forman
        President, Sports Reference LLC
        http://www.sports-reference.com/
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