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  • Dereck L. Dietz
    Hi, I m new to this list and was just curious as to what software people use to store their baseball data and how extensive of systems are used. I m personally
    Message 1 of 11 , May 14, 2006
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      Hi,
       
      I'm new to this list and was just curious as to what software people use to store their baseball data and how extensive of systems are used.
       
      I'm personally keeping basball stats for a baseball game I've been playing since 1994 - at least for now.  Up to where my league starts I had no historical data until just about a month ago.  After 1994 I use the data from my game though I could easily extend my database to include all real data.
    • Paul Wendt
      ... used. ... Software and format must depend on the nature of the data, of course. You generate, en masse, alternative values for records and fields in the
      Message 2 of 11 , May 15, 2006
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        --- "Dereck L. Dietz" <dietzdl@...> wrote:
        > I'm new to this list and was just curious as to what software people
        > use to store their baseball data and how extensive of systems are
        used.
        >
        > I'm personally keeping basball stats for a baseball game I've been
        > playing since 1994 - at least for now.

        Software and format must depend on the nature of the data, of course.
        You generate, en masse, alternative values for records and fields in
        the baseball-databank tables. Others will have natural data for
        alternative leagues such as Japanese majors and local softball.
        Consider also supplementary fields of mlb playing data (Chuck Rosciam
        of catchers encyclopedia mentioned here or to SABR-L this year) and
        supplementary records for new mlb persons such as general managers.

        For correcting, extending, and annotating the data in current bb-db
        records, I use a private copy of the bb-db table itself; recently, from
        the MS Access release by Sean Lahman. I add at least an 'edit' field
        to each table first time I modify it and if the edit field is null that
        means I have not modified the record.
        The meaning of the edit field is sometimes false because of maintainer
        error, but you probably get the idea.

        Using MS Access, the edit field can be dragged (in the display) to a
        convenient location. Eg, this weekend I displayed the edit field
        beside the debut field while correcting some debut dates (eleven from
        1871-1875, reported to Sean Forman merely numerous hours ago).

        Paul Wendt

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      • Dereck L. Dietz
        I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally being used. For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something more robust was
        Message 3 of 11 , May 15, 2006
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          I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally being used.  For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something more robust was used.
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 10:01 AM
          Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] data format (to List Newbie)

          Software and format must depend on the nature of the data, of course. 
          You generate, en masse, alternative values for records and fields in
          the baseball-databank tables.  Others will have natural data for
          alternative leagues such as Japanese majors and local softball.
          Consider also supplementary fields of mlb playing data (Chuck Rosciam
          of catchers encyclopedia mentioned here or to SABR-L this year) and
          supplementary records for new mlb persons such as general managers.

          For correcting, extending, and annotating the data in current bb-db
          records, I use a private copy of the bb-db table itself; recently, from
          the MS Access release by Sean Lahman.  I add at least an 'edit' field
          to each table first time I modify it and if the edit field is null that
          means I have not modified the record. 
          The meaning of the edit field is sometimes false because of maintainer
          error, but you probably get the idea.

          Using MS Access, the edit field can be dragged (in the display) to a
          convenient location.  Eg, this weekend I displayed the edit field
          beside the debut field while correcting some debut dates (eleven from
          1871-1875, reported to Sean Forman merely numerous hours ago).

          Paul Wendt
           
        • KJOK
          I ve always used MS Access to work with this database, but I believe there are others who use, as you put it, something more robust , although I m not sure
          Message 4 of 11 , May 15, 2006
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            I've always used MS Access to work with this database, but I believe there are others who use, as you put it, 'something more robust', although I'm not sure what those somethings are exactly.
             
            THANKS,
            Kevin

            "Dereck L. Dietz" <dietzdl@...> wrote:
            I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally being used.  For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something more robust was used.
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 10:01 AM
            Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] data format (to List Newbie)

            Software and format must depend on the nature of the data, of course. 
            You generate, en masse, alternative values for records and fields in
            the baseball-databank tables.  Others will have natural data for
            alternative leagues such as Japanese majors and local softball.
            Consider also supplementary fields of mlb playing data (Chuck Rosciam
            of catchers encyclopedia mentioned here or to SABR-L this year) and
            supplementary records for new mlb persons such as general managers.

            For correcting, extending, and annotating the data in current bb-db
            records, I use a private copy of the bb-db table itself; recently, from
            the MS Access release by Sean Lahman.  I add at least an 'edit' field
            to each table first time I modify it and if the edit field is null that
            means I have not modified the record. 
            The meaning of the edit field is sometimes false because of maintainer
            error, but you probably get the idea.

            Using MS Access, the edit field can be dragged (in the display) to a
            convenient location.  Eg, this weekend I displayed the edit field
            beside the debut field while correcting some debut dates (eleven from
            1871-1875, reported to Sean Forman merely numerous hours ago).

            Paul Wendt
             


            Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

          • John Walsh
            I use mysql. I ve got little experience with MS Access, so I can t make a comparison, but I ve never had any problems with mysql. -John ... I use mysql. I ve
            Message 5 of 11 , May 15, 2006
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              I use mysql. I've got little experience with MS Access, so I can't make a comparison, but I've never had any problems with mysql.

               -John


              On 5/16/06, KJOK <kjokbaseball@...> wrote:
              I've always used MS Access to work with this database, but I believe there are others who use, as you put it, 'something more robust', although I'm not sure what those somethings are exactly.
               
              THANKS,
              Kevin


              "Dereck L. Dietz" <dietzdl@... > wrote:
              I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally being used.  For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something more robust was used.
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Paul Wendt
              Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 10:01 AM
              Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] data format (to List Newbie)

              Software and format must depend on the nature of the data, of course. 
              You generate, en masse, alternative values for records and fields in
              the baseball-databank tables.  Others will have natural data for
              alternative leagues such as Japanese majors and local softball.
              Consider also supplementary fields of mlb playing data (Chuck Rosciam
              of catchers encyclopedia mentioned here or to SABR-L this year) and
              supplementary records for new mlb persons such as general managers.

              For correcting, extending, and annotating the data in current bb-db
              records, I use a private copy of the bb-db table itself; recently, from
              the MS Access release by Sean Lahman.  I add at least an 'edit' field
              to each table first time I modify it and if the edit field is null that
              means I have not modified the record. 
              The meaning of the edit field is sometimes false because of maintainer
              error, but you probably get the idea.

              Using MS Access, the edit field can be dragged (in the display) to a
              convenient location.  Eg, this weekend I displayed the edit field
              beside the debut field while correcting some debut dates (eleven from
              1871-1875, reported to Sean Forman merely numerous hours ago).

              Paul Wendt
               


              Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


              http://www.baseball-databank.org/



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            • Steve Grant
              ... I use Paradox 9. Steve
              Message 6 of 11 , May 16, 2006
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                > Message 3
                > From: "KJOK" kjokbaseball@...
                > Date: Mon May 15, 2006 3:02pm(PDT)
                > Subject: Re: data format (to List Newbie)
                >
                > I've always used MS Access to work with this database, but I believe there are others who use, as you put it, 'something more robust', although I'm not sure what those somethings are exactly.
                >

                I use Paradox 9.

                Steve
              • Michael Westbay
                ... I use MySQL. It lets work on FreeBSD, Linux, Mac OS X, and even carry my database around on my Sharp Zaurus (PDA). One sub-project I m working on is
                Message 7 of 11 , May 16, 2006
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                  Dereck L. Dietz wrote:

                  > I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally
                  > being used. For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something
                  > more robust was used.

                  I use MySQL. It lets work on FreeBSD, Linux, Mac OS X, and even carry
                  my database around on my Sharp Zaurus (PDA).

                  One sub-project I'm working on is converting the BDB to SportsML (an XML
                  dialect). It's just pieces of the BDB in flat files right now (I
                  haven't had much free time the past couple of months), but I plan to
                  load it into a native XML database soon (eXist and/or the new DB2).

                  MS Access was a good introduction to databases. And for a single user,
                  will probably do everything you want it to. When you want to connect it
                  to other services (like serving web pages) is when you'll want something
                  "more robust." (MS Access 2.0 - the 16 bit version for Windows 3.1 -
                  was the product's pinnacle. Its usability has suffered from feature
                  bloat ever since.)

                  --
                  Michael Westbay
                  Writer/System Administrator
                  http://JapaneseBaseball.com
                  Public Key: http://www.japanesebaseball.com/keys/westbaystars.gpgkey
                • Dereck L. Dietz
                  Actually I was just curious what other people used and how extensive any systems they built are. I m personally using an Oracle 9i database with Oracle Forms
                  Message 8 of 11 , May 16, 2006
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                    Actually I was just curious what other people used and how extensive any systems they built are.  I'm personally using an Oracle 9i database with Oracle Forms to keep track of my data.
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:51 PM
                    Subject: Re: [baseball-databank] data format (to List Newbie)

                    Dereck L. Dietz wrote:

                    > I was actually wondering what type of database software was generally
                    > being used.  For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something
                    > more robust was used.

                    I use MySQL.  It lets work on FreeBSD, Linux, Mac OS X, and even carry
                    my database around on my Sharp Zaurus (PDA).

                    One sub-project I'm working on is converting the BDB to SportsML (an XML
                    dialect).  It's just pieces of the BDB in flat files right now (I
                    haven't had much free time the past couple of months), but I plan to
                    load it into a native XML database soon (eXist and/or the new DB2).

                    MS Access was a good introduction to databases.  And for a single user,
                    will probably do everything you want it to.  When you want to connect it
                    to other services (like serving web pages) is when you'll want something
                    "more robust."  (MS Access 2.0 - the 16 bit version for Windows 3.1 -
                    was the product's pinnacle.  Its usability has suffered from feature
                    bloat ever since.)

                    --
                    Michael Westbay
                    Writer/System Administrator
                    http://JapaneseBaseball.com
                    Public Key:  http://www.japanesebaseball.com/keys/westbaystars.gpgkey
                  • Michael Westbay
                    ... As for systems, I just have the stock BDB right now, but am not really making use of it. I have my own Japanese baseball database that runs my web site.
                    Message 9 of 11 , May 16, 2006
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                      Dereck L. Dietz wrote:

                      > Actually I was just curious what other people used and how extensive
                      > any systems they built are.

                      As for systems, I just have the stock BDB right now, but am not really
                      making use of it. I have my own Japanese baseball database that runs my
                      web site. The "Teams" rosters and schedules are all taken from the
                      database, as are the "Players" pages.

                      My goal with converting the Baseball Databank to XML is to merge it with
                      my Japanese data (without losing anything like localized names) for
                      generating player pages for players who have played in both Japan and
                      MLB, with Korean and Taiwanese leagues inclusion in the future.

                      I believe that the Baseball-Reference.com site is powered by the
                      Baseball Databank in MySQL. Sean Forman runs it and has been the lead
                      caretaker of the BDB. (Please let me know if I'm wrong about that
                      assumption, Sean.)

                      --
                      Michael Westbay
                      Writer/System Administrator
                      http://JapaneseBaseball.com
                      Public Key: http://www.japanesebaseball.com/keys/westbaystars.gpgkey
                    • Paul Wendt
                      1 . . . 2 ... generally being used. For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if something more robust was used.
                      Message 10 of 11 , May 19, 2006
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                        1
                        . . .
                        2
                        >>I was actually wondering what type of database software was
                        generally being used. For instance if MS Access was prevalent or if
                        something more robust was used.
                        <<
                        3
                        >>Actually I was just curious what other people used and how extensive
                        any systems they built are. I'm personally using an Oracle 9i
                        database with Oracle Forms to keep track of my data.
                        <<

                        So you need two short "actually" corrections in two days and you start
                        a flame war to boot.
                        (It's very civil, I know, but it's the baseball-databank equivalent of
                        a flame war.)

                        I'm not a pro but I'm smart enough and daring enough to suggest that
                        you put a lot of time into thinking seriously about the design of your
                        database, instead of the brand name of your software.

                        You have 15 years of fictional history in there now and you "can" add
                        historical statistics any time but then you'll probably want to toggle
                        from faux to real with dexterity, and combine them in clever ways.

                        People who do simulation for analytical purposes (monte carlo methods
                        of analysis) aren't particularly fond of any one simulated reality so
                        they throw them all out, or save only a few summary statistics, after
                        completing a study. But if you're emotionally or historically tied to
                        one particular fiction, you can only go so far on the technical advice
                        of other people, because they are experts at the wrong things.

                        Paul Wendt

                        P.S. The world is full of experts who are expert at the wrong things
                        but they still charge a pretty penny.
                      • Dereck L. Dietz
                        I m not a pro but I m smart enough and daring enough to suggest that you put a lot of time into thinking seriously about the design of your database, instead
                        Message 11 of 11 , May 19, 2006
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                          I'm not a pro but I'm smart enough and daring enough to suggest that
                          you put a lot of time into thinking seriously about the design of your
                          database, instead of the brand name of your software. 
                           
                          Believe me, my database is normalized and properly designed.  That was the least of my worries.

                          People who do simulation for analytical purposes (monte carlo methods
                          of analysis) aren't particularly fond of any one simulated reality so
                          they throw them all out, or save only a few summary statistics, after
                          completing a study.  But if you're emotionally or historically tied to
                          one particular fiction, you can only go so far on the technical advice
                          of other people, because they are experts at the wrong things.

                          Data is data.  It doesn't matter that part of my data is from my game and other historical.  How I have the data stored and what I can do with it doesn't care if it is real or not.  If I want to create a list of individuals with the most doubles for each year of the American League I could use the same query logic in my system against whatever data is in the database.
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