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R.eastmanii

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  • Yeatts, Steve
    After closely reviewing plants we have found in Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike Creel s house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the conclusion
    Message 1 of 8 , May 17, 2004
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      After closely reviewing plants we have found in Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the conclusion that they are the same plant. In Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about R.eastmanii.
      Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have located in Alabama, were previously identified as R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
      I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it probably is it.
       
      Steve Yeatts
      Athens, GA 
       
       
    • Buddy Lee
      When I first saw these South Alabama plants in the mid 1980 s, I had a difficult time placing them in a group. I first concluded that they were a hybrid swarm
      Message 2 of 8 , May 17, 2004
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        When I first saw these South Alabama plants in the mid 1980's, I had a difficult time placing them in a group.  I first concluded that they were a hybrid swarm of early viscosum and alabamense with some canescens (pink) background. Everyone that knew anything about these plants told me that they were R. alabamense.  But for me, they just did not fit easy under the pure R. alabamense label. The plants that I and Dr. John Thornton observed numerous times during the mid 1980's have been lost to road construction and logging. Other colonies have been located.  John named a pink form called 'Fountain'. I have a white blooming form with a yellow/gold bloch that is blooming now (May 17).
         
        I have grown seeds from these plants and also from R. eastmanii.  I find that the R. eastmanii plants are more difficult to grow.  But Steves and Bobs conclusion is probably correct.
         
        Buddy


        "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
        After closely reviewing plants we have found in Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the conclusion that they are the same plant. In Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about R.eastmanii.
        Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have located in Alabama, were previously identified as R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
        I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it probably is it.
         
        Steve Yeatts
        Athens, GA 
         
         


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      • Yeatts, Steve
        Buddy, I have also found R.eastmanii from SC more difficult to grow than the Alabama plants. I would suspect that this may be the case because the Alabama
        Message 3 of 8 , May 18, 2004
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          Buddy,
          I have also found R.eastmanii from SC more difficult to grow than the Alabama plants. I would suspect that this may be the case because the Alabama plants have adapted themselves to grow at a little lower pH (6.0 - 6.5), while the SC plants are on the high side of the range (6.5 - 7.0). A plant from a pH of 6.5 - 7.0 just doesn't thrive well in my pH 5.2 soil without ammending it first. I am installing a limestone bed for R.eastmanii and limestone loving perennials on my property. Hopefully I will be able to report some success with these plants in the future.
           
          Steve Yeatts
          Athens, GA 
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Buddy Lee [mailto:robert03asa@...]
          Sent: Monday, May 17, 2004 10:10 PM
          To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com
          Cc: John Migas
          Subject: Re: [AZ] R.eastmanii

          When I first saw these South Alabama plants in the mid 1980's, I had a difficult time placing them in a group.  I first concluded that they were a hybrid swarm of early viscosum and alabamense with some canescens (pink) background. Everyone that knew anything about these plants told me that they were R. alabamense.  But for me, they just did not fit easy under the pure R. alabamense label. The plants that I and Dr. John Thornton observed numerous times during the mid 1980's have been lost to road construction and logging. Other colonies have been located.  John named a pink form called 'Fountain'. I have a white blooming form with a yellow/gold bloch that is blooming now (May 17).
           
          I have grown seeds from these plants and also from R. eastmanii.  I find that the R. eastmanii plants are more difficult to grow.  But Steves and Bobs conclusion is probably correct.
           
          Buddy


          "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
          After closely reviewing plants we have found in Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the conclusion that they are the same plant. In Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about R.eastmanii.
          Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have located in Alabama, were previously identified as R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
          I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it probably is it.
           
          Steve Yeatts
          Athens, GA 
           
           


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        • ray head
          Steve, When I looked at eastmanii at Santee a few years ago I was puzzled at how acid loving plants were growing on top of the limestone. I took a soil sample
          Message 4 of 8 , May 18, 2004
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            Steve, When I looked at eastmanii at Santee a few
            years ago I was puzzled at how acid loving plants were
            growing on top of the limestone. I took a soil sample
            about 6 in. deep near one of the large plants of
            eastmanii. I sent the sample to Raleigh's agriculture
            lab for testing. It came back that the ph was 4.7.
            There may be some of their roots get down to the
            neutral rock base but most of them are growing in very
            acis conditions. This is the ph of native azaleas
            growing on my own property here in western NC and is
            pretty close to what I find from other locations that
            I have checked. I have also found eastmanii slow to
            get started. Ray




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          • Yeatts, Steve
            Ray, Thanks for the heads up. Soil samples taken from soil around plants in Alabama and tested by the University of Georgia Cooperative Extension Agency proved
            Message 5 of 8 , May 18, 2004
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              Ray,
              Thanks for the heads up. Soil samples taken from soil around plants in Alabama and tested by the University of Georgia Cooperative Extension Agency proved to be 6.2 - 6.5. These plants were also growing on top of limestone outcrops. I believe Mike Creel has stated that the R.eastmanii he has seen in SC grow in circumneutral soil (6.0 - 7.0). Perhaps, Mike will weigh in on this subject.
               
              Steve
              -----Original Message-----
              From: ray head [mailto:jrhead_1@...]
              Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 10:50 AM
              To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [AZ] R.eastmanii

              Steve, When I looked at eastmanii at Santee a few
              years ago I was puzzled at how acid loving plants were
              growing on top of the limestone. I took a soil sample
              about 6 in. deep near one of the large plants of
              eastmanii. I sent the sample to Raleigh's agriculture
              lab for testing. It came back that the ph was 4.7.
              There may be some of their roots get down to the
              neutral rock base but most of them are growing in very
              acis conditions. This is the ph of native azaleas
              growing on my own property here in western NC and is
              pretty close to what I find from other locations that
              I have checked. I have also found eastmanii slow to
              get started. Ray


                    
                         

            • Mike Creel
              My most vigorous plants of eastmanii seem to be the seedlings from a pure stand or hand-crossed planted in a half-filled fast-draining media and pot where some
              Message 6 of 8 , May 18, 2004
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                My most vigorous plants of eastmanii seem to be the
                seedlings from a pure stand or hand-crossed planted in
                a half-filled fast-draining media and pot where some
                local azalea humus has been sprinkled on the surface
                BEFORE the seed are sprinkled, planted in fall or
                winter, overwintered outside with a hardware cloth
                "pot cap" to keep pests out.

                Also, I have planted rooted layers or divisions of
                eastmanii in four completely different soil and sun
                situations on my 7 acres of longleaf pine,
                sparkleberries and sand. A plant at the north end of
                my house seems to benefit from the cooler shade and
                possibly from the leaching of the nearby brick mortar
                and cement. I placed slabs of waste mortar and
                concrete around the base of a plant in a much sunnier
                area beside my septic tank drain field, which seemed
                to help that plant, also benefitting from a nearby
                large deciduous holly. Seedlings planted in two other
                pinewoods beds are doing well, but I did sprinkle a
                little slow-release pelletted dolomitic lime around
                the plants.

                I grow a wide variety of azaleas from pretty much
                everywhere and believe (and have observed) that they
                will thrive IF I can get them to adapt to the native
                soil bacteria of my immediate location. This can be a
                slower process than some folks want to experience, but
                it is well worth the wait. I think there is nothing -
                azalea-wise - that cannot be grown (from a small plant
                or seeds) or rooted if the plant adapts to the biology
                of the new location. I don't attempt to recreate the
                conditions of the original site, though I did in the
                past. You are better off starting with small plants,
                cuttings or seed instead of large "instant
                landscaping" sized plants.
                I treat them like I don't care about them (after I add
                my local soil humus) and let them surprise me.
                --- "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
                > Buddy,
                > I have also found R.eastmanii from SC more difficult
                > to grow than the Alabama plants. I would suspect
                > that this may be the case because the Alabama plants
                > have adapted themselves to grow at a little lower pH
                > (6.0 - 6.5), while the SC plants are on the high
                > side of the range (6.5 - 7.0). A plant from a pH of
                > 6.5 - 7.0 just doesn't thrive well in my pH 5.2 soil
                > without ammending it first. I am installing a
                > limestone bed for R.eastmanii and limestone loving
                > perennials on my property. Hopefully I will be able
                > to report some success with these plants in the
                > future.
                >
                > Steve Yeatts
                > Athens, GA
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: Buddy Lee [mailto:robert03asa@...]
                > Sent: Monday, May 17, 2004 10:10 PM
                > To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com
                > Cc: John Migas
                > Subject: Re: [AZ] R.eastmanii
                >
                >
                > When I first saw these South Alabama plants in the
                > mid 1980's, I had a difficult time placing them in a
                > group. I first concluded that they were a hybrid
                > swarm of early viscosum and alabamense with some
                > canescens (pink) background. Everyone that knew
                > anything about these plants told me that they were
                > R. alabamense. But for me, they just did not fit
                > easy under the pure R. alabamense label. The plants
                > that I and Dr. John Thornton observed numerous times
                > during the mid 1980's have been lost to road
                > construction and logging. Other colonies have been
                > located. John named a pink form called 'Fountain'.
                > I have a white blooming form with a yellow/gold
                > bloch that is blooming now (May 17).
                >
                > I have grown seeds from these plants and also from
                > R. eastmanii. I find that the R. eastmanii plants
                > are more difficult to grow. But Steves and Bobs
                > conclusion is probably correct.
                >
                > Buddy
                >
                >
                > "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
                >
                > After closely reviewing plants we have found in
                > Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike
                > Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the
                > conclusion that they are the same plant. In
                > Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE
                > Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not
                > fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or
                > R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about
                > R.eastmanii.
                > Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have
                > located in Alabama, were previously identified as
                > R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in
                > circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
                > I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks
                > like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it
                > probably is it.
                >
                > Steve Yeatts
                > Athens, GA
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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                >
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              • ray head
                In Skinner s travels he reports on finding alabamense in Cullman and Winston counties on May 12th. On June 20th., while looking for bakeri, he notes of finding
                Message 7 of 8 , May 19, 2004
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                  In Skinner's travels he reports on finding alabamense
                  in Cullman and Winston counties on May 12th. On June
                  20th., while looking for bakeri, he notes of finding
                  only late forms of alabamense in those counties. Could
                  it be possible that what he was seeing was eastmanii.
                  My experience is that it blooms about a month later
                  than bakeri. Bob, do you have any idea on this? Ray
                  --- "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
                  > After closely reviewing plants we have found in
                  > Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike
                  > Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the
                  > conclusion that they are the same plant. In
                  > Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE
                  > Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not
                  > fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or
                  > R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about
                  > R.eastmanii.
                  > Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have
                  > located in Alabama, were previously identified as
                  > R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in
                  > circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
                  > I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks
                  > like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it
                  > probably is it.
                  >
                  > Steve Yeatts
                  > Athens, GA
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >





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                • Yeatts, Steve
                  Ray, I have forwarded your message to Bob. I have found the bloom time of R.cumberlandense (bakeri) to be highly variable. I have some plants that have already
                  Message 8 of 8 , May 19, 2004
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                    Ray,
                    I have forwarded your message to Bob. I have found the bloom time of R.cumberlandense (bakeri) to be highly variable. I have some plants that have already bloomed out at my house while others are still in bud. The R.eastmanii, at my house, just finished blooming. The plants at Mike Creel's house were in full bloom this past weekend.
                    It would be interesting to track down the plants Skinner mentions that were blooming on June 20th, no matter what they were. We'll have to put Bob on the trail!
                     
                    Steve Yeatts
                    Athens, GA  
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: ray head [mailto:jrhead_1@...]
                    Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 7:58 AM
                    To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [AZ] R.eastmanii

                    In Skinner's travels he reports on finding alabamense
                    in Cullman and Winston counties on May 12th. On June
                    20th., while looking for bakeri, he notes of finding
                    only late forms of alabamense in those counties. Could
                    it be possible that what he was seeing was eastmanii.
                    My experience is that it blooms about a month later
                    than bakeri. Bob, do you have any idea on this? Ray
                    --- "Yeatts, Steve" <syeatts@...> wrote:
                    > After closely reviewing plants we have found in
                    > Alabama and comparing them to R.eastmanii at Mike
                    > Creel's house, Bob Stevens and I have come to the
                    > conclusion that they are the same plant. In
                    > Skinner's travels, he points out plants in SE
                    > Georgia, SW Georgia and South Alabama that do not
                    > fit the criteria for R.alabamense, R.arborescens or
                    > R.viscosum. I believe he was talking about
                    > R.eastmanii.
                    > Like the plants in S.Carolina, the plants we have
                    > located in Alabama, were previously identified as
                    > R.alabamense. Plants in both states are found in
                    > circumneutral soil ( 6.5 to 7.0).
                    > I'm a firm believer in the old adage; If it looks
                    > like it, smells like it, and grows like it, it
                    > probably is it.

                    > Steve Yeatts
                    > Athens, GA

                    >

                    >
                    >



                         
                               
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