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Re: [AZ] Otakumii?

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  • kawikasc
    Bob, Thanks for the confirmation and for educating me on the wording used in Galle s book. My Otakumii are also upright growers, the tallest being a sheared 4
    Message 1 of 17 , Aug 7, 2005
      Bob,

      Thanks for the confirmation and for educating me on the wording used
      in Galle's book. My Otakumii are also upright growers, the tallest
      being a sheared 4 footer. I'll have to ask the owner of the nursery
      if she is familiar with any of the names in your reply.
      David Groff
      Columbia, SC zone 8


      > At 3:24 PM +0000 on 8/6/05, kawikasc wrote
      > >I recently added an image to the photo section.
      >
      > Although that works, consider just attaching your image to your
      > email, as I have done here. That lets the reader see your picture
      > without having to go to our email website. In either case I will
      > probably eventually snag it, and put it on our picture website and
      > link it to our index of azalea names.
      >
      > >I ran across this
      > >unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
      > >identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki. The
      > >specifics match Galles' description(page 134). The leaves are
      quite
      > >small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch. The
      flowers
      > >resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate
      any
      > >web sources for comparision.
      >
      > This spring I got an R. otakumii with impeccable provenance. It was
      a
      > gift from Mal Clark, a past-president of the ASA. He got it as a
      gift
      > from Polly Hill about 35 years ago, and it was a gift to her from
      Dr.
      > Tsuneshige Rokujo of Japan, who worked with her on her North
      Tisbury
      > hybrids. Mal thought it was one of the very few, and possibly the
      > oldest, such plants in the US.
      >
      > The plant, which lived in a pot all its life, is strongly upright,
      > about 5' x 3', with very few flowers this spring. I recently
      planted
      > it out, and we will see what it does in the landscape.
      >
      > The attached closeups of the flower and foliage appear similar to
      > your picture, and also appear to match the Galle description.
      >
      > As shown in Galle on p 134, "Yamazaki" is the name of the person
      who
      > originally gave R. otakumii its name -- the "author" of the name R.
      > otakumii. By convention, the name of the author follows the name of
      > the plant in formal descriptions, and is usually ignored in
      informal
      > usage.
      >
      > Regards,
      > Bob Stelloh Hendersonville NC USDA Zone 7
    • William C. Miller III
      David, After reviewing the two images that Bob Stelloh posted, I m satisfied that what you have is not Seigai . Most noteworthy...the foliage on Seigai is
      Message 2 of 17 , Aug 7, 2005
        David,

        After reviewing the two images that Bob Stelloh posted, I'm satisfied that what you have is not 'Seigai'.  Most noteworthy...the foliage on 'Seigai' is not shiny and the 'Seigai' petals are more narrow. It is curious however that the 'Otakumi' photo on page 132 of the Satsuki dictionary has very narrow petals compared to Bob's image which shows petals that flair.

        According to Galle, we have Dr. Rokujo, by way of Polly Hill, to thank for 'Seigai' as well.

        The International Rhododendron Register and Checklist (IRRC) lists the cultivar as 'Otakumi' with only one i.   The hiragana (the Japanese writing) on page 132 of the Satsuki dictionary reads Otakumi. 

        Bob confirmed my suspicion about Yamazaki.  It turns out that there are two Yamazaki.

        Points to ponder?

        1. The binomial nomenclature is a problem.   How can it be a newly identified species if it is a "form" of R. indicum?  The previously mentioned 2004 abstract (much more current than Galle) characterizes it as a form of indicum and not a distinct species.

        2.  According to Don Voss, the Otakumi River (one i) is found on the island of Yakushima.  I did a little investigating with Google and Yakushima is about 40 minutes by air from Kagoshima.  The river did not appear as a physical feature on the map provided by the Japan National Tourist Organization.. 

        It isn't clear where the extra "i" came from.  Undoubtedly it has something to do with Yamazaki.

        Bill




        kawikasc wrote:
        Hi Bill,
             I found what little information I have on the azalea in Galle's 
        book, 2nd printing page 134.  It states that "it is a relatively 
        newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.." I've 
        had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and this is 
        unlike any of them.  Galle describes the "spring foliage as being 
        narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves 
        generally smaller to 1/2 inch.  "Winter coloration is reddish" 
        Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with the 
        exception of the serrated edging to the leaves.  I've searched all of 
        my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they mostly 
        display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
           I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of 
        Columbia, SC.  I've lived here for thirty years and only found out 
        about it last year.  It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on 
        their sign.  No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone book.  
        As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with 
        plants sent to them from a family member at either the National 
        Arboretum or one in PA.  I have been fortunate in that owner/wife has 
        taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old 
        stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness.  We 
        both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and me 
        with my late mother.  As far as I am concerened it's the Holy Grail 
        of azalea nurseries.  Many of the names are missing, tags faded or 
        simply crumble when touched.  At one time well over 500 varieties, 
        many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?.  If I 
        wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay mostly 
        fat.  I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May of 
        last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean of 
        flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up.  Viagra couldn't 
        have worked as well as my excitement was that day.  I plan to ask if 
        she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the 
        Society.  These azaleas need to be shared and distributed.  Her son 
        will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique 
        varieties will be destroyed.  
           David Groff
        Columbia SC zone 8 
           
                   
        
          
        Hi "kawikasc",
        
        'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to 
        indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in one 
            
        of 
          
        the Satsuki books.  Based on the photo, it bears a strong 
            
        similarity to 
          
        'Seigai'.
        
        I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea and 
            
        saw 
          
        no reference to it in Galle (first edition).  Yamazaki was the site 
            
        of a 
          
        famous battle in Japan.  However, given the format...."Rhododendron 
        Otakumii Yamazaki",  the Yamazaki could be a reference to a 
            
        Japanese 
          
        botanist.
        
        As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on where 
            
        you 
          
        obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best source 
            
        for 
          
        additional information.
        
        I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form 
            
        name  and 
          
        thus appears in italics.  It also mentions the term "rheophyte" 
            
        which 
          
        was new to me.....  plants that are found along streams and river 
        banks.   Take a look at the URL:
        
        wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
        
        Bill Miller
        Bethesda, Maryland
        
        
        
        kawikasc wrote:
        
            
        I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across this 
        unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its 
        identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki.  The 
        specifics match Galles' description(page 134).  The leaves are 
              
        quite 
          
        small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch.  The 
              
        flowers 
          
        resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate 
              
        any 
          
        web sources for comparision.  
        Thanks,
        kawikasc zone 8 
        
         
        
              
        
        
        
        
        When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only, as context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo lines.  And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
        
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      • Bob Stelloh
        At 6:03 PM +0000 on 8/7/05, kawikasc wrote ... You ve posed two questions: - 1) How you attach a photo to an email depends on the email program you use. If
        Message 3 of 17 , Aug 7, 2005
          At 6:03 PM +0000 on 8/7/05, kawikasc wrote
          >Bob,
          > How'd you do that. I couldn't figure out how to attach a photo to
          >this group message board. Are you folks hiding the attach file button
          >from me as some sort of joke for the new member? Do I do my postings
          >and replies through the mail center or the message board? Mike
          >responded to my previous question about attaching a photo. Didn't
          >understand it at all...zoom over my head. Ratio this, compress that,
          >pixel my what? Will it require a special lubricant?
          >David Groff
          >Columbia, SC zone 8

          You've posed two questions:
          - 1) How you attach a photo to an email depends on the email program
          you use. If your email program has a "help" facility that will tell
          you how. I use Eudora for the Macintosh, with an "Attach Document"
          button to click, which presents me with a file selection dialog box
          to navigate to the document to be attached, and success is shown by
          an icon and the file name at the top of the email.

          -2) In general, before attaching a picture file, you take the picture
          from your camera and scrunch it down to size, so you don't bog all
          the subcribers down by sending them huge files to download. The three
          main factors are
          - resizing it down to 640x480 pixels or so (so people with small
          monitors can see it all without having to scroll up/down/left/right)
          - resampling it to 72 pixels per inch, down from whatever your camera
          uses, which is probably at least several hundred pixels per inch
          (because monitors can't display more than 72 pixels per inch, there's
          no point in sending them more than 72 pixels per inch)
          - JPEG compressing it a lot -- see
          http://www.pbase.com/azaleasociety/compression (this saves a lot of
          file space by describing and deleting repetitive pixels, in such a
          way that the viewing software can put most of those pixels back when
          you open the file)

          How you do that depends on what image processing software you use --
          I use GraphicConverter for the Macintosh, and how it works is pretty
          well documented at http://www.azaleas.org/graphicconverter.html -- I
          read that IrfanView is similar for the PC. Expect to spend a while to
          learn the lingo and figure it all out, but after that it is fast and
          simple.

          Regards,
          Bob Stelloh Hendersonville NC USDA Zone 7

          >
          >--- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com, Bob Stelloh <bstelloh@M...> wrote:
          >> At 3:24 PM +0000 on 8/6/05, kawikasc wrote
          >> >I recently added an image to the photo section.
          >>
          >> Although that works, consider just attaching your image to your
          >> email, as I have done here. That lets the reader see your picture
          >> without having to go to our email website. In either case I will
          >> probably eventually snag it, and put it on our picture website and
          > > link it to our index of azalea names.
          >>
        • Bob Stelloh
          At 3:41 PM -0400 on 8/7/05, William C. Miller III wrote ... The scope of the IRRC excludes species. It is probable that the species R. otakumii and the
          Message 4 of 17 , Aug 7, 2005
            At 3:41 PM -0400 on 8/7/05, William C. Miller III wrote
            >David,
            >
            >After reviewing the two images that Bob Stelloh posted, I'm
            >satisfied that what you have is not 'Seigai'. Most noteworthy...the
            >foliage on 'Seigai' is not shiny and the 'Seigai' petals are more
            >narrow. It is curious however that the 'Otakumi' photo on page 132
            >of the Satsuki dictionary has very narrow petals compared to Bob's
            >image which shows petals that flair.
            >
            >According to Galle, we have Dr. Rokujo, by way of Polly Hill, to
            >thank for 'Seigai' as well.
            >
            >The International Rhododendron Register and Checklist (IRRC) lists
            >the cultivar as 'Otakumi' with only one i. The hiragana (the
            >Japanese writing) on page 132 of the Satsuki dictionary reads
            >Otakumi.

            The scope of the IRRC excludes species. It is probable that the
            species R. otakumii and the cultivar R. indicum 'Otakumi' are
            different plants, which would explain the different leaves and petal
            shapes.

            >
            >Bob confirmed my suspicion about Yamazaki. It turns out that there
            >are two Yamazaki.
            >
            >Points to ponder?
            >
            >1. The binomial nomenclature is a problem. How can it be a newly
            >identified species if it is a "form" of R. indicum? The previously
            >mentioned 2004 abstract (much more current than Galle) characterizes
            >it as a form of indicum and not a distinct species.

            See the above.

            >
            >2. According to Don Voss, the Otakumi River (one i) is found on the
            >island of Yakushima. I did a little investigating with Google and
            >Yakushima is about 40 minutes by air from Kagoshima. The river did
            >not appear as a physical feature on the map provided by the Japan
            >National Tourist Organization..
            >
            >It isn't clear where the extra "i" came from. Undoubtedly it has
            >something to do with Yamazaki.

            According to "Botanical Latin" by Stearns, p 287, the International
            Code for Botanical Nomenclature recommends that when a specific
            epithet is taken from the name of a man and that name ends in a
            vowel, the letter "i" is added. Although we're dealing here with a
            river rather than a man, applying that rule to "Otakumi" would
            explain "otakumii".

            Regards,
            Bob Stelloh Hendersonville NC USDA Zone 7

            >
            >Bill
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >kawikasc wrote:
            >
            >>Hi Bill,
            >> I found what little information I have on the azalea in Galle's
            >>book, 2nd printing page 134. It states that "it is a relatively
            >>newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.." I've
            >>had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and this is
            >>unlike any of them. Galle describes the "spring foliage as being
            >>narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves
            >>generally smaller to 1/2 inch. "Winter coloration is reddish"
            >>Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with the
            >>exception of the serrated edging to the leaves. I've searched all of
            >>my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they mostly
            >>display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
            >> I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of
            >>Columbia, SC. I've lived here for thirty years and only found out
            >>about it last year. It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on
            >>their sign. No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone book.
            >>As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with
            >>plants sent to them from a family member at either the National
            >>Arboretum or one in PA. I have been fortunate in that owner/wife has
            >>taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old
            >>stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness. We
            >>both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and me
            >>with my late mother. As far as I am concerened it's the Holy Grail
            >>of azalea nurseries. Many of the names are missing, tags faded or
            >>simply crumble when touched. At one time well over 500 varieties,
            >>many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?. If I
            >>wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay mostly
            >>fat. I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May of
            >>last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean of
            >>flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up. Viagra couldn't
            >>have worked as well as my excitement was that day. I plan to ask if
            >>she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the
            >>Society. These azaleas need to be shared and distributed. Her son
            >>will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique
            >>varieties will be destroyed.
            >> David Groff
            >>Columbia SC zone 8
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>>Hi "kawikasc",
            >>>
            >>>'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to
            >>>indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in one
            >>>
            >>>
            >>of
            >>
            >>
            >>>the Satsuki books. Based on the photo, it bears a strong
            >>>
            >>>
            >>similarity to
            >>
            >>
            >>>'Seigai'.
            >>>
            >>>I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea and
            >>>
            >>>
            >>saw
            >>
            >>
            >>>no reference to it in Galle (first edition). Yamazaki was the site
            >>>
            >>>
            >>of a
            >>
            >>
            >>>famous battle in Japan. However, given the format...."Rhododendron
            >>>Otakumii Yamazaki", the Yamazaki could be a reference to a
            >>>
            >>>
            >>Japanese
            >>
            >>
            >>>botanist.
            >>>
            >>>As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on where
            >>>
            >>>
            >>you
            >>
            >>
            >>>obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best source
            >>>
            >>>
            >>for
            >>
            >>
            >>>additional information.
            >>>
            >>>I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form
            >>>
            >>>
            >>name and
            >>
            >>
            >>>thus appears in italics. It also mentions the term "rheophyte"
            >>>
            >>>
            >>which
            >>
            >>
            >>>was new to me..... plants that are found along streams and river
            >>>banks. Take a look at the URL:
            >>>
            >>>wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
            >>>
            >>>Bill Miller
            >>>Bethesda, Maryland
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>kawikasc wrote:
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>>I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across this
            >>>>unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
            >>>>identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki. The
            >>>>specifics match Galles' description(page 134). The leaves are
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>quite
            >>
            >>
            >>>>small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch. The
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>flowers
            >>
            >>
            >>>>resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>any
            >>
            >>
            >>>>web sources for comparision.
            >>>>Thanks,
            >>>>kawikasc zone 8
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only,
            >>as context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the
            >>Yahoo lines. And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
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            >>We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size - 640
            >>x 480 pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By
            >>attaching them you agree that, without giving up your rights to
            >>them, they may be shown on Azalea Society websites.
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            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >
            >
            >When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only,
            >as context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo
            >lines. And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
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            >We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size - 640 x
            >480 pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By
            >attaching them you agree that, without giving up your rights to
            >them, they may be shown on Azalea Society websites.
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          • Mary & Bill McDavit
            David, Could these folks be named Margie & Judd Wingard? There s is a Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out of Columbia very near a huge lake. We
            Message 5 of 17 , Aug 8, 2005
              David,

              Could these folks be named Margie & Judd Wingard? There's is a
              Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out of Columbia very near a huge
              lake. We got our four plants from them around about 1989. They have done
              fantastically well, even though a huge pine tree fell in their midst. I'll
              attach a photo or two of what we have. My guess is that the plant is a
              cross between 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum', although I've got no proof of
              that.

              Warm Regards,

              Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>; "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>
              To: <osprey1@...>
              Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 1:09 PM
              Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?


              >
              > Hi Bill,
              > I found what little information I have on the azalea in Galle's
              > book, 2nd printing page 134. It states that "it is a relatively
              > newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.." I've
              > had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and this is
              > unlike any of them. Galle describes the "spring foliage as being
              > narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves
              > generally smaller to 1/2 inch. "Winter coloration is reddish"
              > Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with the
              > exception of the serrated edging to the leaves. I've searched all of
              > my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they mostly
              > display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
              > I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of
              > Columbia, SC. I've lived here for thirty years and only found out
              > about it last year. It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on
              > their sign. No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone book.
              > As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with
              > plants sent to them from a family member at either the National
              > Arboretum or one in PA. I have been fortunate in that owner/wife has
              > taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old
              > stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness. We
              > both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and me
              > with my late mother. As far as I am concerened it's the Holy Grail
              > of azalea nurseries. Many of the names are missing, tags faded or
              > simply crumble when touched. At one time well over 500 varieties,
              > many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?. If I
              > wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay mostly
              > fat. I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May of
              > last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean of
              > flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up. Viagra couldn't
              > have worked as well as my excitement was that day. I plan to ask if
              > she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the
              > Society. These azaleas need to be shared and distributed. Her son
              > will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique
              > varieties will be destroyed.
              > David Groff
              > Columbia SC zone 8
              >
              >
              >
              >> Hi "kawikasc",
              >>
              >> 'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to
              >> indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in one
              > of
              >> the Satsuki books. Based on the photo, it bears a strong
              > similarity to
              >> 'Seigai'.
              >>
              >> I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea and
              > saw
              >> no reference to it in Galle (first edition). Yamazaki was the site
              > of a
              >> famous battle in Japan. However, given the format...."Rhododendron
              >> Otakumii Yamazaki", the Yamazaki could be a reference to a
              > Japanese
              >> botanist.
              >>
              >> As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on where
              > you
              >> obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best source
              > for
              >> additional information.
              >>
              >> I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form
              > name and
              >> thus appears in italics. It also mentions the term "rheophyte"
              > which
              >> was new to me..... plants that are found along streams and river
              >> banks. Take a look at the URL:
              >>
              >> wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
              >>
              >> Bill Miller
              >> Bethesda, Maryland
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> kawikasc wrote:
              >>
              >> >I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across this
              >> >unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
              >> >identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki. The
              >> >specifics match Galles' description(page 134). The leaves are
              > quite
              >> >small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch. The
              > flowers
              >> >resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate
              > any
              >> >web sources for comparision.
              >> >Thanks,
              >> >kawikasc zone 8
              >> >
              >> >
              >> >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only, as
              > context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo lines.
              > And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
              >
              > We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size - 640 x 480
              > pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By attaching them
              > you agree that, without giving up your rights to them, they may be shown
              > on Azalea Society websites.
              >
              > To unsubscribe, send an email to: azaleas-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
            • David Groff
              Mary and Bill, I ve bought from the Wingard s for years and that was my original source for the Noozminikari . A couple of other area nurseries also have
              Message 6 of 17 , Aug 8, 2005
                Mary and Bill,
                     I've bought from the Wingard's for years and that was my original source for the "Noozminikari".  A couple of other area nurseries also have carried it.  I was never able to find out anything about the azalea either on the web or azalea books(English or Japanese) until I found a single flip flop named photo in a recently acquired Japanese book or magazine.  I've looked through a dozen or so of the books today and haven't relocated it yet.  The only english in the books is by the picture so I have to search them page by page.  As soon as I find the info I'll post it.  I have another 40 Japanese Satsuki magazines being shipped by sea that I should receive shortly maybe they will have more examples. 
                David Groff
                Columbia SC zone 8     
                 
                 
                 
                 
                Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:
                David,

                    Could these folks be named Margie & Judd Wingard?  There's is a
                Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out of Columbia very near a huge
                lake.  We got our four plants from them around about 1989.  They have done
                fantastically well, even though a huge pine tree fell in their midst.  I'll
                attach a photo or two of what we have.  My guess is that the plant is a
                cross between 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum', although I've got no proof of
                that.

                Warm Regards,

                Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>; "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>
                To: <osprey1@...>
                Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 1:09 PM
                Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?


                >
                > Hi Bill,
                >     I found what little information I have on the azalea in Galle's
                > book, 2nd printing page 134.  It states that "it is a relatively
                > newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.." I've
                > had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and this is
                > unlike any of them.  Galle describes the "spring foliage as being
                > narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves
                > generally smaller to 1/2 inch.  "Winter coloration is reddish"
                > Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with the
                > exception of the serrated edging to the leaves.  I've searched all of
                > my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they mostly
                > display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
                >   I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of
                > Columbia, SC.  I've lived here for thirty years and only found out
                > about it last year.  It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on
                > their sign.  No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone book.
                > As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with
                > plants sent to them from a family member at either the National
                > Arboretum or one in PA.  I have been fortunate in that owner/wife has
                > taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old
                > stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness.  We
                > both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and me
                > with my late mother.  As far as I am concerened it's the Holy Grail
                > of azalea nurseries.  Many of the names are missing, tags faded or
                > simply crumble when touched.  At one time well over 500 varieties,
                > many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?.  If I
                > wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay mostly
                > fat.  I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May of
                > last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean of
                > flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up.  Viagra couldn't
                > have worked as well as my excitement was that day.  I plan to ask if
                > she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the
                > Society.  These azaleas need to be shared and distributed.  Her son
                > will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique
                > varieties will be destroyed.
                >   David Groff
                > Columbia SC zone 8
                >
                >
                >
                >> Hi "kawikasc",
                >>
                >> 'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to
                >> indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in one
                > of
                >> the Satsuki books.  Based on the photo, it bears a strong
                > similarity to
                >> 'Seigai'.
                >>
                >> I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea and
                > saw
                >> no reference to it in Galle (first edition).  Yamazaki was the site
                > of a
                >> famous battle in Japan.  However, given the format...."Rhododendron
                >> Otakumii Yamazaki",  the Yamazaki could be a reference to a
                > Japanese
                >> botanist.
                >>
                >> As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on where
                > you
                >> obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best source
                > for
                >> additional information.
                >>
                >> I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form
                > name  and
                >> thus appears in italics.  It also mentions the term "rheophyte"
                > which
                >> was new to me.....  plants that are found along streams and river
                >> banks.   Take a look at the URL:
                >>
                >> wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
                >>
                >> Bill Miller
                >> Bethesda, Maryland
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> kawikasc wrote:
                >>
                >> >I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across this
                >> >unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
                >> >identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki.  The
                >> >specifics match Galles' description(page 134).  The leaves are
                > quite
                >> >small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch.  The
                > flowers
                >> >resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate
                > any
                >> >web sources for comparision.
                >> >Thanks,
                >> >kawikasc zone 8
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only, as
                > context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo lines.
                > And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
                >
                > We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size - 640 x 480
                > pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By attaching them
                > you agree that, without giving up your rights to them, they may be shown
                > on Azalea Society websites.
                >
                > To unsubscribe, send an email to: azaleas-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >


                Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

              • David Groff
                Mary and Bill, One last thing. Did you also get their Myuki satsuki....the ve had a couple of different spellings over the years? If so add an i to the
                Message 7 of 17 , Aug 8, 2005
                  Mary and Bill,
                  One last thing. Did you also get their "Myuki" satsuki....the've
                  had a couple of different spellings over the years? If so add an "i"
                  to the name for the correct spelling Miyuki. I have the named picture
                  in my hands from a Japanese magazine so I'm positive on this one. I
                  only hope I wasn't on a gin induced binge and imagined the
                  Noozminikari/Mininoozkari.
                  David Groff
                  Columbia SC zone 8
                  >
                  > Could these folks be named Margie & Judd Wingard? There's is a
                  > Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out of Columbia very
                  near a huge
                  > lake. We got our four plants from them around about 1989. They
                  have done
                  > fantastically well, even though a huge pine tree fell in their
                  midst. I'll
                  > attach a photo or two of what we have. My guess is that the plant
                  is a
                  > cross between 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum', although I've got no
                  proof of
                  > that.
                  >
                  > Warm Regards,
                  >
                  > Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: "kawikasc" <kawikasc@y...>; "kawikasc" <kawikasc@y...>
                  > To: <osprey1@a...>
                  > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 1:09 PM
                  > Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?
                  >
                  >
                  > >
                  > > Hi Bill,
                  > > I found what little information I have on the azalea in
                  Galle's
                  > > book, 2nd printing page 134. It states that "it is a relatively
                  > > newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.."
                  I've
                  > > had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and
                  this is
                  > > unlike any of them. Galle describes the "spring foliage as being
                  > > narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves
                  > > generally smaller to 1/2 inch. "Winter coloration is reddish"
                  > > Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with
                  the
                  > > exception of the serrated edging to the leaves. I've searched
                  all of
                  > > my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they
                  mostly
                  > > display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
                  > > I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of
                  > > Columbia, SC. I've lived here for thirty years and only found out
                  > > about it last year. It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on
                  > > their sign. No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone
                  book.
                  > > As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with
                  > > plants sent to them from a family member at either the National
                  > > Arboretum or one in PA. I have been fortunate in that owner/wife
                  has
                  > > taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old
                  > > stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness.
                  We
                  > > both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and
                  me
                  > > with my late mother. As far as I am concerened it's the Holy
                  Grail
                  > > of azalea nurseries. Many of the names are missing, tags faded or
                  > > simply crumble when touched. At one time well over 500 varieties,
                  > > many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?. If I
                  > > wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay
                  mostly
                  > > fat. I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May
                  of
                  > > last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean
                  of
                  > > flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up. Viagra
                  couldn't
                  > > have worked as well as my excitement was that day. I plan to ask
                  if
                  > > she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the
                  > > Society. These azaleas need to be shared and distributed. Her
                  son
                  > > will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique
                  > > varieties will be destroyed.
                  > > David Groff
                  > > Columbia SC zone 8
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >> Hi "kawikasc",
                  > >>
                  > >> 'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to
                  > >> indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in
                  one
                  > > of
                  > >> the Satsuki books. Based on the photo, it bears a strong
                  > > similarity to
                  > >> 'Seigai'.
                  > >>
                  > >> I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea
                  and
                  > > saw
                  > >> no reference to it in Galle (first edition). Yamazaki was the
                  site
                  > > of a
                  > >> famous battle in Japan. However, given the
                  format...."Rhododendron
                  > >> Otakumii Yamazaki", the Yamazaki could be a reference to a
                  > > Japanese
                  > >> botanist.
                  > >>
                  > >> As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on
                  where
                  > > you
                  > >> obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best
                  source
                  > > for
                  > >> additional information.
                  > >>
                  > >> I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form
                  > > name and
                  > >> thus appears in italics. It also mentions the term "rheophyte"
                  > > which
                  > >> was new to me..... plants that are found along streams and river
                  > >> banks. Take a look at the URL:
                  > >>
                  > >> wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
                  > >>
                  > >> Bill Miller
                  > >> Bethesda, Maryland
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> kawikasc wrote:
                  > >>
                  > >> >I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across
                  this
                  > >> >unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
                  > >> >identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki.
                  The
                  > >> >specifics match Galles' description(page 134). The leaves are
                  > > quite
                  > >> >small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch. The
                  > > flowers
                  > >> >resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to
                  locate
                  > > any
                  > >> >web sources for comparision.
                  > >> >Thanks,
                  > >> >kawikasc zone 8
                  > >> >
                  > >> >
                  > >> >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s)
                  only, as
                  > > context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo
                  lines.
                  > > And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
                  > >
                  > > We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size -
                  640 x 480
                  > > pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By
                  attaching them
                  > > you agree that, without giving up your rights to them, they may
                  be shown
                  > > on Azalea Society websites.
                  > >
                  > > To unsubscribe, send an email to: azaleas-
                  unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                • Mary & Bill McDavit
                  David, Early on, Margie Wingard told me that the azalea had come from a Japanese hybridizer in your area, but he had since died. She had no other news than
                  Message 8 of 17 , Aug 8, 2005
                    David,
                     
                        Early on, Margie Wingard told me that the azalea had come from a Japanese hybridizer in your area, but he had since died.  She had no other news than that, so perhaps the azalea had originated in this country by that gentleman.  Too bad we can't afford DNA testing!!  Then again, perhaps the subject gentleman brought the azalea in from Japan.
                        I'm still of the opinion that 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum' blood is in 'Noozminikari'.  All three bloom at the same time, and the commonality is striking.
                     
                        Good Luck,
                     
                    Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 7:12 PM
                    Subject: Re: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?

                    Mary and Bill,
                         I've bought from the Wingard's for years and that was my original source for the "Noozminikari".  A couple of other area nurseries also have carried it.  I was never able to find out anything about the azalea either on the web or azalea books(English or Japanese) until I found a single flip flop named photo in a recently acquired Japanese book or magazine.  I've looked through a dozen or so of the books today and haven't relocated it yet.  The only english in the books is by the picture so I have to search them page by page.  As soon as I find the info I'll post it.  I have another 40 Japanese Satsuki magazines being shipped by sea that I should receive shortly maybe they will have more examples. 
                    David Groff
                    Columbia SC zone 8     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                    Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:
                    David,

                        Could these folks be named Margie & Judd Wingard?  There's is a
                    Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out of Columbia very near a huge
                    lake.  We got our four plants from them around about 1989.  They have done
                    fantastically well, even though a huge pine tree fell in their midst.  I'll
                    attach a photo or two of what we have.  My guess is that the plant is a
                    cross between 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum', although I've got no proof of
                    that.

                    Warm Regards,

                    Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>; "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>
                    To: <osprey1@...>
                    Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 1:09 PM
                    Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?


                    >
                    > Hi Bill,
                    >    ! I found what little information I have on the azalea in Galle's
                    > book, 2nd printing page 134.  It states that "it is a relatively
                    > newly identified species from the banks of the Otakumii River.." I've
                    > had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf azaleas before and this is
                    > unlike any of them.  Galle describes the "spring foliage as being
                    > narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4 wide"..with summer leaves
                    > generally smaller to 1/2 inch.  "Winter coloration is reddish"
                    > Everything in Galle's description seems to match what I have with the
                    > exception of the serrated edging to the leaves.  I've searched all of
                    > my Japanese Azalea books and have found nothing similiar, they mostly
                    > display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
                    >   I bought the azalea from a mom and pop nursery outside of
                    > Columbia, SC.  I've lived here for thirty years and only found out
                    > about it last year.&! nbsp; It is simply known as "Azaleas For Sale" on
                    > their sign.  No advertising, no name, no listing in the phone book.
                    > As best I can recall the nursery started over 30 years ago with
                    > plants sent to them from a family member at either the National
                    > Arboretum or one in PA.  I have been fortunate in that owner/wife has
                    > taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any of her original old
                    > stock plants, something not done before, due to family illness.  We
                    > both were going throught the same thing, her with her husband and me
                    > with my late mother.  As far as I am concerened it's the Holy Grail
                    > of azalea nurseries.  Many of the names are missing, tags faded or
                    > simply crumble when touched.  At one time well over 500 varieties,
                    > many known only by number or hybridizer...is that a word?.  If I
                    > wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up today...okay okay mostly
                    > f! at.  I nearly dropped to my knees upon finding this place in May of
                    > last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared azaleas under an ocean of
                    > flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared up.  Viagra couldn't
                    > have worked as well as my excitement was that day.  I plan to ask if
                    > she is willing to share/sell her old stock with members of the
                    > Society.  These azaleas need to be shared and distributed.  Her son
                    > will soon be taking over the nursery and I fear many of the unique
                    > varieties will be destroyed.
                    >   David Groff
                    > Columbia SC zone 8
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >> Hi "kawikasc",
                    >>
                    >> 'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and in single quotes to
                    >> indicate a cultivar name as listed in the IRRC), is pictured in one
                    > of
                    >> the Satsuki books.  Based on the photo, it bears a strong
                    > similarity to
                    >> 'Seigai'.
                    >>
                    >> I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as related to the azalea and
                    > saw
                    >> no reference to it in Galle (first edition).  Yamazaki was the site
                    > of a
                    >> famous battle in Japan.  However, given the format...."Rhododendron
                    >> Otakumii Yamazaki",  the Yamazaki could be a reference to a
                    > Japanese
                    >> botanist.
                    >>
                    >> As a general rule, it is desirable to include information on where
                    > you
                    >> obtained your azalea. The original source often is the best source
                    > for
                    >> additional information.
                    >>
                    >> I located an abstract where the name otakumi is used as a form
                    > name  and
                    >> thus appears in italics.  It also mentions the term "rheophyte"
                    > which
                    >> was new to me.....  plants that are found along streams and river
                    >> banks.   Take a look at the URL:
                    >>
                    >> wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
                    >>
                    >> Bill Miller
                    >> Bethesda, Maryland
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> kawikasc wrote:
                    >>
                    >> >I recently added an image to the photo section. I ran across this
                    >> >unusual azalea last year and am hoping someone will confirm its
                    >> >identity. I believe it to be Rhododendron Otakumii Yamazaki.  The
                    >> >specifics match Galles' description(page 134).  The leaves are
                    > quite
                    >> >small 3/16-1/4 inch wide, serrated, length up to 1 inch.  The
                    > flowers
                    >> >resemble Polypetalum but are a pale orange. I was unable to locate
                    > any
                    >> >web sources for comparision.
                    >> >Thanks,
                    >> >kawikasc zone 8
                    >> >
                    >> >
                    >> >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > When you reply t! o an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only, as
                    > context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the Yahoo lines.
                    > And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
                    >
                    > We welcome attached images RESIZED to be under 100KB in size - 640 x 480
                    > pixel JPEG images at 50% or 1:40 compression are ideal. By attaching them
                    > you agree that, without giving up your rights to them, they may be shown
                    > on Azalea Society websites.
                    >
                    > To unsubscribe, send an email to: azaleas-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    >
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >


                    Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

                  • Mike Creel
                    Very recently Mrs. Margie told me that the source of the Nooz-Minikari was a gentleman from Chapin, SC who specialized in bonsai and obtained his first plant,
                    Message 9 of 17 , Aug 8, 2005
                      Very recently Mrs. Margie told me that the source of
                      the Nooz-Minikari was a gentleman from Chapin, SC who
                      specialized in bonsai and obtained his first plant,
                      among other azaleas, directly from Japan. He has
                      since died.
                      Mike Creel, Lexington, SC

                      --- Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:

                      > David,
                      >
                      > Early on, Margie Wingard told me that the azalea
                      > had come from a Japanese hybridizer in your area,
                      > but he had since died. She had no other news than
                      > that, so perhaps the azalea had originated in this
                      > country by that gentleman. Too bad we can't afford
                      > DNA testing!! Then again, perhaps the subject
                      > gentleman brought the azalea in from Japan.
                      > I'm still of the opinion that 'Chinzan' and
                      > 'Polypetalum' blood is in 'Noozminikari'. All three
                      > bloom at the same time, and the commonality is
                      > striking.
                      >
                      > Good Luck,
                      >
                      > Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: David Groff
                      > To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 7:12 PM
                      > Subject: Re: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?
                      >
                      >
                      > Mary and Bill,
                      > I've bought from the Wingard's for years and
                      > that was my original source for the "Noozminikari".
                      > A couple of other area nurseries also have carried
                      > it. I was never able to find out anything about the
                      > azalea either on the web or azalea books(English or
                      > Japanese) until I found a single flip flop named
                      > photo in a recently acquired Japanese book or
                      > magazine. I've looked through a dozen or so of the
                      > books today and haven't relocated it yet. The only
                      > english in the books is by the picture so I have to
                      > search them page by page. As soon as I find the
                      > info I'll post it. I have another 40 Japanese
                      > Satsuki magazines being shipped by sea that I should
                      > receive shortly maybe they will have more examples.
                      > David Groff
                      > Columbia SC zone 8
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:
                      > David,
                      >
                      > Could these folks be named Margie & Judd
                      > Wingard? There's is a
                      > Mom-and-Pop nursery in Lexington, SC, just out
                      > of Columbia very near a huge
                      > lake. We got our four plants from them around
                      > about 1989. They have done
                      > fantastically well, even though a huge pine tree
                      > fell in their midst. I'll
                      > attach a photo or two of what we have. My guess
                      > is that the plant is a
                      > cross between 'Chinzan' and 'Polypetalum',
                      > although I've got no proof of
                      > that.
                      >
                      > Warm Regards,
                      >
                      > Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>;
                      > "kawikasc" <kawikasc@...>
                      > To: <osprey1@...>
                      > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 1:09 PM
                      > Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?
                      >
                      >
                      > >
                      > > Hi Bill,
                      > > ! I found what little information I have on
                      > the azalea in Galle's
                      > > book, 2nd printing page 134. It states that
                      > "it is a relatively
                      > > newly identified species from the banks of the
                      > Otakumii River.." I've
                      > > had a few of the small twisted/curled leaf
                      > azaleas before and this is
                      > > unlike any of them. Galle describes the
                      > "spring foliage as being
                      > > narrow linear 1/2-1 inch long, 3/16-1/4
                      > wide"..with summer leaves
                      > > generally smaller to 1/2 inch. "Winter
                      > coloration is reddish"
                      > > Everything in Galle's description seems to
                      > match what I have with the
                      > > exception of the serrated edging to the
                      > leaves. I've searched all of
                      > > my Japanese Azalea books and have found
                      > nothing similiar, they mostly
                      > > display Satsuki and Kurume azaleas.
                      > > I bought the azalea from a mom and pop
                      > nursery outside of
                      > > Columbia, SC. I've lived here for thirty
                      > years and only found out
                      > > about it last year.&! nbsp; It is simply known
                      > as "Azaleas For Sale" on
                      > > their sign. No advertising, no name, no
                      > listing in the phone book.
                      > > As best I can recall the nursery started over
                      > 30 years ago with
                      > > plants sent to them from a family member at
                      > either the National
                      > > Arboretum or one in PA. I have been fortunate
                      > in that owner/wife has
                      > > taken a liking to me and allowed me to buy any
                      > of her original old
                      > > stock plants, something not done before, due
                      > to family illness. We
                      > > both were going throught the same thing, her
                      > with her husband and me
                      > > with my late mother. As far as I am
                      > concerened it's the Holy Grail
                      > > of azalea nurseries. Many of the names are
                      > missing, tags faded or
                      > > simply crumble when touched. At one time well
                      > over 500 varieties,
                      > > many known only by number or hybridizer...is
                      > that a word?. If I
                      > > wasn't so old and fat I'd be digging more up
                      > today...okay okay mostly
                      > > f! at. I nearly dropped to my knees upon
                      > finding this place in May of
                      > > last year with thousands of 4 foot sheared
                      > azaleas under an ocean of
                      > > flowers...row upon row of beauty, yup I teared
                      > up. Viagra couldn't
                      > > have worked as well as my excitement was that
                      > day. I plan to ask if
                      > > she is willing to share/sell her old stock
                      > with members of the
                      > > Society. These azaleas need to be shared and
                      > distributed. Her son
                      > > will soon be taking over the nursery and I
                      > fear many of the unique
                      > > varieties will be destroyed.
                      > > David Groff
                      > > Columbia SC zone 8
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >> Hi "kawikasc",
                      > >>
                      > >> 'Otakumi', listed as a Wada hybrid (one i and
                      > in single quotes to
                      > >> indicate a cultivar name as listed in the
                      > IRRC), is pictured in one
                      > > of
                      > >> the Satsuki books. Based on the photo, it
                      > bears a strong
                      > > similarity to
                      > >> 'Seigai'.
                      > >>
                      > >> I don't recognize the name "Yamazaki" as
                      > related to the azalea and
                      > > saw
                      > >> no reference to it in Galle (first edition).
                      > Yamazaki was the site
                      > > of a
                      > >> famous battle in Japan. However, given the
                      > format...."Rhododendron
                      > >> Otakumii Yamazaki", the Yamazaki could be a
                      > reference to a
                      > > Japanese
                      > >> botanist.
                      > >>
                      > >> As a general rule, it is desirable to include
                      > information on where
                      > > you
                      > >> obtained your azalea. The original source
                      > often is the best source
                      > > for
                      > >> additional information.
                      > >>
                      > >> I located an abstract where the name otakumi
                      > is used as a form
                      > > name and
                      > >> thus appears in italics. It also mentions
                      > the term "rheophyte"
                      > > which
                      > >> was new to me..... plants that are found
                      > along streams and river
                      > >> banks. Take a look at the URL:
                      > >>
                      > >>
                      >
                      wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jsps/APG/abstracts/APG55-1_abstracts.html
                      > >>
                      > >> Bill Miller
                      > >> Bethesda, Maryland
                      > >>
                      > >>
                      > >>
                      > >> kawikasc wrote:
                      > >>
                      > >> >I recently added an image to the photo
                      > section. I ran across this
                      >
                      === message truncated ===


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                    • Mary & Bill McDavit
                      David, Thank you. I ll change our data base asap. The LFSB had the correct spelling.......... naturally!! Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8 ... From:
                      Message 10 of 17 , Aug 9, 2005
                        David,

                        Thank you. I'll change our data base asap. The LFSB had the correct
                        spelling.......... naturally!!

                        Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8



                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "David Groff" <kawikasc@...>
                        To: <azaleas@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 7:37 PM
                        Subject: [AZ] Re: Otakumii?


                        > Mary and Bill,
                        > One last thing. Did you also get their "Myuki" satsuki....the've
                        > had a couple of different spellings over the years? If so add an "i"
                        > to the name for the correct spelling Miyuki. I have the named picture
                        > in my hands from a Japanese magazine so I'm positive on this one. I
                        > only hope I wasn't on a gin induced binge and imagined the
                        > Noozminikari/Mininoozkari.
                        > David Groff
                        > Columbia SC zone 8
                      • Mary & Bill McDavit
                        Mike, Wow, thanks for the info!! I ll log all this for future reference. If Margie ever told me that, I d forgotten. At my age CRS is a common disease, you
                        Message 11 of 17 , Aug 9, 2005
                          Mike,

                          Wow, thanks for the info!! I'll log all this for future reference. If
                          Margie ever told me that, I'd forgotten. At my age CRS is a common disease,
                          you know.

                          Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8





                          > Very recently Mrs. Margie told me that the source of
                          > the Nooz-Minikari was a gentleman from Chapin, SC who
                          > specialized in bonsai and obtained his first plant,
                          > among other azaleas, directly from Japan. He has
                          > since died.
                          > Mike Creel, Lexington, SC
                          >
                          > --- Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >> David,
                          >>
                          >> Early on, Margie Wingard told me that the azalea
                          >> had come from a Japanese hybridizer in your area,
                          >> but he had since died. She had no other news than
                          >> that, so perhaps the azalea had originated in this
                          >> country by that gentleman. Too bad we can't afford
                          >> DNA testing!! Then again, perhaps the subject
                          >> gentleman brought the azalea in from Japan.
                          >> I'm still of the opinion that 'Chinzan' and
                          >> 'Polypetalum' blood is in 'Noozminikari'. All three
                          >> bloom at the same time, and the commonality is
                          >> striking.
                          >>
                          >> Good Luck,
                        • Mike Creel
                          On June 17, 2005 I visited Wingards Nurwry just outside of Lexington, SC on SC 6 (road to Lake Murray dam) and compared their azaleas with ones blooming in my
                          Message 12 of 17 , Aug 9, 2005
                            On June 17, 2005 I visited Wingards Nurwry just
                            outside of Lexington, SC on SC 6 (road to Lake Murray
                            dam) and compared their azaleas with ones blooming in
                            my yard. The small-leaved, small-flowered pink we
                            have been discussing was labelled exactly
                            "Nooz-Minikari." I have been unable to find a
                            cultivar anywhere with a description or name close to
                            this. We often "interpret" Japanese names too freely.

                            I did find a cultivar listed named Nikuna No Hikari,
                            Light of Japan, white with few flakes of light pink
                            andyellow-green blotch with overlapping lobes, 2 1/2
                            inches. This description matches my UnkEver azalea.

                            Just fiqured out the CRS syndrome. I usally encounter
                            it after opening the refrigerator or going to the
                            grocery store. Maybe it's the cold air.
                            Mike Creel, SC, Zone 8a

                            --- Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:

                            > Mike,
                            >
                            > Wow, thanks for the info!! I'll log all this
                            > for future reference. If
                            > Margie ever told me that, I'd forgotten. At my age
                            > CRS is a common disease,
                            > you know.
                            >
                            > Bill McDavit - Sunset Lakes, NC - Zone 8
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > > Very recently Mrs. Margie told me that the source
                            > of
                            > > the Nooz-Minikari was a gentleman from Chapin, SC
                            > who
                            > > specialized in bonsai and obtained his first
                            > plant,
                            > > among other azaleas, directly from Japan. He has
                            > > since died.
                            > > Mike Creel, Lexington, SC
                            > >
                            > > --- Mary & Bill McDavit <osprey1@...> wrote:
                            > >
                            > >> David,
                            > >>
                            > >> Early on, Margie Wingard told me that the
                            > azalea
                            > >> had come from a Japanese hybridizer in your area,
                            > >> but he had since died. She had no other news
                            > than
                            > >> that, so perhaps the azalea had originated in
                            > this
                            > >> country by that gentleman. Too bad we can't
                            > afford
                            > >> DNA testing!! Then again, perhaps the subject
                            > >> gentleman brought the azalea in from Japan.
                            > >> I'm still of the opinion that 'Chinzan' and
                            > >> 'Polypetalum' blood is in 'Noozminikari'. All
                            > three
                            > >> bloom at the same time, and the commonality is
                            > >> striking.
                            > >>
                            > >> Good Luck,
                            >
                            >
                            >


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