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14128Re: [AZ] Deer Fence

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  • sjperk5
    Apr 5, 2010
      Bob

      Now late Joe Parks once stated the more information you have on the hardiness of rhododendrons the less you can conclude about the hardiness of rhododendrons.

      My guess is the same is true for deer controls such as fencing.

      John Perkins
      Salem, NH

      --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com, Bob Stelloh <bstelloh@...> wrote:
      >
      > Steve nailed it. I had researched deer and wrote an article on
      > deterrents many years ago for the Azalean, and it all revolved around
      > "deer pressure" -- how many and how hungry. Almost anything works
      > for a few deer who are not very hungry, and almost nothing works for
      > a lot of very hungry deer.
      >
      > Bob Stelloh Hendersonville NC USDA Zone 7
      >
      >
      > On Apr 5, 2010, at 9:41 AM, Steve Henning wrote:
      >
      > > Hi Jim,
      > >
      > > Unfortunately, lots of things are effective until the deer get
      > > hungry. First soap and hair were effective for me until the winter
      > > of '96. Then deer netting and a 5' fence were effective were
      > > effective for me until the winter of '10. Now I am looking for
      > > complete effectiveness with an 8' black steel deer fence.
      > >
      > > Steve
      > >
      > > --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com, Jim Willhite <jwillhite@> wrote:
      > >>
      > >> A single 6' fence was effective for me.
      > >> jim willhite
      > >> west chester, pa
      > >>
      > >>
      > >> On Sunday, April 4, 2010, at 12:41 PM, Barry Sperling wrote:
      > >>
      > >>> My county (Fairfax, VA) limits fence heights to 6 ft. Could 2 6'
      > >>> fences,
      > >>> say 3' or 4' apart, be effective?
      > >>> Barry
      > >>>
      > >>> Whipple, Andy wrote:
      > >>>>
      > >>>> This is an intriguing discussion as it suggests there may
      > >>>> actually be
      > >>>> a fairly simple way to deter deer from eating all our precious
      > >>>> plants.
      > >>>> Can anyone provide some actual experience beyond the previous
      > >>>> emails?
      > >>>> That is, how low can two fences be (and how far apart) to be
      > >>>> effective? Does the outward slant reduce the necessary height? I'm
      > >>>> seeking (as we all are!) the greatest effect for the least
      > >>>> expenditure
      > >>>> of time and money. My situation is out in the woods, with no
      > >>>> grass to
      > >>>> tend to, so the slant idea may be just fine if it's effective.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> Who has some actual experience beyond what Steve and George have
      > >>>> reported?
      > >>>>
      > >>>> Thanks to all.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> Andy Whipple
      > >>>>
      > >>>> in Indiana but may be in the mountains in a bit.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> -----Original Message-----
      > >>>> From: azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> on
      > >>>> behalf of Steve Henning
      > >>>> Sent: Sat 4/3/2010 10:50 PM
      > >>>> To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>
      > >>>> Subject: Re: [AZ] Deer Fence
      > >>>>
      > >>>> We use a similar concept in the East with our white-tail deer,
      > >>>> except
      > >>>> the fences are closer together and the reason is not that they
      > >>>> can't
      > >>>> but that they won't. I have seem them jump a 6' fence effortlessly
      > >>>> just standing next to the fence. They don't run, they just
      > >>>> spring over
      > >>>> like a standing high jump. But if they don't see a clear place to
      > >>>> land, they won't try the jump. The most effective fences are
      > >>>> slanted
      > >>>> at a 45 degree angle up and out toward the deer. The deer don't do
      > >>>> running broad jumps, just simple up and overs unless the are
      > >>>> frightened. The lateral distance of the slant fences stops them
      > >>>> cold.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> I personally don't want a slant fence because I don't want to
      > >>>> have to
      > >>>> take care of the area under such a fence. Typically they use
      > >>>> something
      > >>>> like roundup or stronger.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> White-tail deer will try to go under first. Jumping is their last
      > >>>> resort. They are much better jumpers than they realize,
      > >>>> fortunately.
      > >>>> Most deer fences are black because deer won't jump a fence
      > >>>> unless they
      > >>>> can see the top. With the black fence it is much harder to see the
      > >>>> top, especially at night when they do the most damage.
      > >>>>
      > >>>> steve
      > >>>>
      > >>>> --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>,
      > >>>> George Klump <mixturev@> wrote:
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>> 3 April 2010
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>> I didn't really want to get into this discussion about deer
      > >>>>> fences.
      > >>>>> However, experience here has given at least one possible
      > >>>>> solution and
      > >>>>> the forestry boys evidently back it up.
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>> Deer need some take-off room to jump any fence. Many people
      > >>>>> here are
      > >>>>> losing azaleas, roses and anything deer love to eat, since
      > >>>>> we're all
      > >>>>> close to the mountains where the deer roam freely. The only real
      > >>>>> solution which for most people is not really practical is to build
      > >>>>> two
      > >>>>> fences within, say, 8 feet of each other, e.g. concentric
      > >>>>> style. If
      > >>>>> the
      > >>>>> distance between the two fences is 8 feet or less and the
      > >>>>> fences are
      > >>>>> equally high, the deer will not jump them. Why? Because
      > >>>>> according to
      > >>>>> some of the forestry boys who have apparently done this, the deer
      > >>>> cannot
      > >>>>> jump over two fences spread apart like this. They will land in
      > >>>>> between
      > >>>>> the two fences which traps them, since they cannot jump over two
      > >>>>> fences
      > >>>>> spread out in this manner and they do not have enough take-off
      > >>>>> room
      > >>>>> to
      > >>>>> make it over the second fence, if they did jump the first one.
      > >>>>> Being
      > >>>>> trapped between two fences with no way out panics the be-junior
      > >>>>> out
      > >>>>> of
      > >>>>> deer, since their basic theme song is the old popular classic
      > >>>>> "Don't
      > >>>>> Fence Me In". I suspect this works with any fence, chain-link,
      > >>>>> wood,
      > >>>>> log, etc. It is in any event humane, so the government can do
      > >>>>> nothing
      > >>>>> about it. Anyway, it was an idea which I got from the forestry
      > >>>>> boys.
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>> George Klump
      > >>>>> Southern California Chapter, ARS/ASA
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>> On 4/3/2010 12:23 PM, sjperk5 wrote:
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> Steve
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> I would be willing to fight the deer but I would not be
      > >>>>>> willing to
      > >>>>>> go
      > >>>>>> to the effort of fighting our multiple levels of nanny state
      > >>>>>> government to do so.
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> Being an Indiana farmboy at heart my position is animals that
      > >>>>>> destroy
      > >>>>>> your property have to be taken care of no questions asked.
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> You put up fences to keep your animals in not to keep other
      > >>>> animals out.
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> John Perkins
      > >>>>>> Salem, NH
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>> --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>
      > >>>> <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>,
      > >>>>>> "sjperk5" <sjperk5@> wrote:
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>> Steve
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>> Put in simple terms if we had deer we would stop gardening
      > >>>>>>> and work
      > >>>>>> at removing their food supply.
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>> Then I would see a lawyer and start a class action suit against
      > >>>> Disney.
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>> John Perkins
      > >>>>>>> Salem,NH
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>> --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com
      > >>>> <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:azaleas%
      > >>>> 40yahoogroups.com>,
      > >>>>>> "Steve Henning" <rhodyman@> wrote:
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> Hi John,
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> It is not only woody plants, it is annuals, perennials, and
      > >>>>>>>> grass
      > >>>>>> also. Deer only have biting teeth on their lower jaw, so they
      > >>>>>> don't
      > >>>>>> bite, they rip plants apart. I don't think anyone would want
      > >>>>>> to take
      > >>>>>> the effort to dig up our leafless twigs.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> The fence man came out yesterday to give me an estimate. He
      > >>>>>>>> uses
      > >>>>>> an 8-foot hi-tensile black wire mesh fencing stretched between
      > >>>>>> wood
      > >>>>>> posts that are 24' apart except adjacent to corners and gates
      > >>>>>> where
      > >>>>>> they are typically 12' apart. We don't want the fence in front of
      > >>>>>> our
      > >>>>>> house, so we will run the fence from the sides of the house
      > >>>>>> and then
      > >>>>>> out around our 1.5 acre landscaped area. The 70' front of our
      > >>>>>> house
      > >>>>>> will be exposed. If necessary we can use netting or sprays there.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> Along the short side in front we will use a split rail
      > >>>>>>>> facade and
      > >>>>>> on the long side paint the wood posts black.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> A neighbor has this type of fence around a 2 acre organic
      > >>>>>>>> produce
      > >>>>>> farm.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> Some people here are putting deer fencing around small plots to
      > >>>>>> see what native plants have disappeared from the landscape.
      > >>>> Amazingly,
      > >>>>>> many native plants that are no longer seen in the wild do come
      > >>>>>> back.
      > >>>>>> There must be seeds still coming from areas that the deer
      > >>>>>> don't take
      > >>>>>> the effort to get to.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> Hopefully, in 2 weeks we will be able to sit back and enjoy our
      > >>>>>> rhododendrons as they try to grow back a leaf or 2. Who knows, we
      > >>>>>> may
      > >>>>>> even get a truss or two.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> In college we had a freezer locker and kept it full of
      > >>>> venison. We
      > >>>>>> lived on venison. I don't relish going back to those days. The
      > >>>>>> best
      > >>>>>> venison tastes just like beef. The worst doesn't. Brush fed
      > >>>>>> venison
      > >>>>>> doesn't. That is why they have books of recipes on how to kill
      > >>>>>> the
      > >>>> taste.
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> Steve in Southeastern PA
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>> --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com
      > >>>> <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:azaleas%
      > >>>> 40yahoogroups.com>,
      > >>>>>> "sjperk5" <sjperk5@> wrote:
      > >>>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>>> My plan for deer control in the event we ever have this
      > >>>>>>>>> problem
      > >>>>>> is pretty simple. The spring after the damage I will put out a
      > >>>>>> call
      > >>>>>> saying that every woody plant in the yard is available free to
      > >>>> whoever
      > >>>>>> wishes to dig them.
      > >>>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>>> My yard is simply not shaped right to justify fencing it.
      > >>>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>>> Take a way the food and there will be no deer.
      > >>>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>>> John Perkins
      > >>>>>>>>> Salem, NH
      > >>>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>>
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>>
      > >>>>>
      > >>>>
      > >>>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> ------------------------------------
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      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >> Jim Willhite
      > >> West Chester, PA
      > >>
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > When you reply to an email, PLEASE quote its relevant part(s) only,
      > > as context, and DELETE the rest - especially this line and the
      > > Yahoo lines. And PLEASE tell us your city, state and/or USDA zone.
      > >
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