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14118Re: [AZ] Deer Fence

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  • George Klump
    Apr 4, 2010
      I would think so, Andy.  But Steve has a good idea, too, about slanting the second fence.  Why not slant the second fence at about 45 degrees?  I would slant it so that the top edge is at your 6-ft. limit and probably a few feet back from the vertical fence.  And, again, as Steve suggested, paint the fences black to confuse the deer, especially at night.  The only problem with all of this, as I suggested earlier, is that it takes some room to pull this off.  Not everyone wishes to spare that much property.  However, I would think, too, that sloping the second fence away from the first one may make it more confusing for the deer, since it would be a wider area and it would prevent the deer from seeing landing lights.  They do not like to jump blind in the dark!

      George Klump
      Southern California Chapter, ARS/ASA

      On 4/4/2010 9:41 AM, Barry Sperling wrote:
      My county (Fairfax, VA) limits fence heights to 6 ft. Could 2 6' fences, 
      say 3' or 4' apart, be effective?
      Whipple, Andy wrote:
      This is an intriguing discussion as it suggests there may actually be 
      a fairly simple way to deter deer from eating all our precious plants. 
      Can anyone provide some actual experience beyond the previous emails? 
      That is, how low can two fences be (and how far apart) to be 
      effective? Does the outward slant reduce the necessary height? I'm 
      seeking (as we all are!) the greatest effect for the least expenditure 
      of time and money. My situation is out in the woods, with no grass to 
      tend to, so the slant idea may be just fine if it's effective.
      Who has some actual experience beyond what Steve and George have reported?
      Thanks to all.
      Andy Whipple
      in Indiana but may be in the mountains in a bit.
      -----Original Message-----
      From: azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> on 
      behalf of Steve Henning
      Sent: Sat 4/3/2010 10:50 PM
      To: azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: Re: [AZ] Deer Fence
      We use a similar concept in the East with our white-tail deer, except 
      the fences are closer together and the reason is not that they can't 
      but that they won't. I have seem them jump a 6' fence effortlessly 
      just standing next to the fence. They don't run, they just spring over 
      like a standing high jump. But if they don't see a clear place to 
      land, they won't try the jump. The most effective fences are slanted 
      at a 45 degree angle up and out toward the deer. The deer don't do 
      running broad jumps, just simple up and overs unless the are 
      frightened. The lateral distance of the slant fences stops them cold.
      I personally don't want a slant fence because I don't want to have to 
      take care of the area under such a fence. Typically they use something 
      like roundup or stronger.
      White-tail deer will try to go under first. Jumping is their last 
      resort. They are much better jumpers than they realize, fortunately. 
      Most deer fences are black because deer won't jump a fence unless they 
      can see the top. With the black fence it is much harder to see the 
      top, especially at night when they do the most damage.
      --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>, 
      George Klump <mixturev@...> wrote:
      3 April 2010
      I didn't really want to get into this discussion about deer fences.
      However, experience here has given at least one possible solution and
      the forestry boys evidently back it up.
      Deer need some take-off room to jump any fence. Many people here are
      losing azaleas, roses and anything deer love to eat, since we're all
      close to the mountains where the deer roam freely. The only real
      solution which for most people is not really practical is to build two
      fences within, say, 8 feet of each other, e.g. concentric style. If the
      distance between the two fences is 8 feet or less and the fences are
      equally high, the deer will not jump them. Why? Because according to
      some of the forestry boys who have apparently done this, the deer 
      jump over two fences spread apart like this. They will land in between
      the two fences which traps them, since they cannot jump over two fences
      spread out in this manner and they do not have enough take-off room to
      make it over the second fence, if they did jump the first one. Being
      trapped between two fences with no way out panics the be-junior out of
      deer, since their basic theme song is the old popular classic "Don't
      Fence Me In". I suspect this works with any fence, chain-link, wood,
      log, etc. It is in any event humane, so the government can do nothing
      about it. Anyway, it was an idea which I got from the forestry boys.
      George Klump
      Southern California Chapter, ARS/ASA
      On 4/3/2010 12:23 PM, sjperk5 wrote:
      I would be willing to fight the deer but I would not be willing to go
      to the effort of fighting our multiple levels of nanny state
      government to do so.
      Being an Indiana farmboy at heart my position is animals that destroy
      your property have to be taken care of no questions asked.
      You put up fences to keep your animals in not to keep other 
      animals out.
      John Perkins
      Salem, NH
      --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> 
      "sjperk5" <sjperk5@> wrote:
      Put in simple terms if we had deer we would stop gardening and work
      at removing their food supply.
      Then I would see a lawyer and start a class action suit against 
      John Perkins
      --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com 
      <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>,
      "Steve Henning" <rhodyman@> wrote:
      Hi John,
      It is not only woody plants, it is annuals, perennials, and grass
      also. Deer only have biting teeth on their lower jaw, so they don't
      bite, they rip plants apart. I don't think anyone would want to take
      the effort to dig up our leafless twigs.
      The fence man came out yesterday to give me an estimate. He uses
      an 8-foot hi-tensile black wire mesh fencing stretched between wood
      posts that are 24' apart except adjacent to corners and gates where
      they are typically 12' apart. We don't want the fence in front of our
      house, so we will run the fence from the sides of the house and then
      out around our 1.5 acre landscaped area. The 70' front of our house
      will be exposed. If necessary we can use netting or sprays there.
      Along the short side in front we will use a split rail facade and
      on the long side paint the wood posts black.
      A neighbor has this type of fence around a 2 acre organic produce
      Some people here are putting deer fencing around small plots to
      see what native plants have disappeared from the landscape. 
      many native plants that are no longer seen in the wild do come back.
      There must be seeds still coming from areas that the deer don't take
      the effort to get to.
      Hopefully, in 2 weeks we will be able to sit back and enjoy our
      rhododendrons as they try to grow back a leaf or 2. Who knows, we may
      even get a truss or two.
      In college we had a freezer locker and kept it full of 
      venison. We
      lived on venison. I don't relish going back to those days. The best
      venison tastes just like beef. The worst doesn't. Brush fed venison
      doesn't. That is why they have books of recipes on how to kill the 
      Steve in Southeastern PA
      --- In azaleas@yahoogroups.com 
      <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:azaleas%40yahoogroups.com>,
      "sjperk5" <sjperk5@> wrote:
      My plan for deer control in the event we ever have this problem
      is pretty simple. The spring after the damage I will put out a call
      saying that every woody plant in the yard is available free to 
      wishes to dig them.
      My yard is simply not shaped right to justify fencing it.
      Take a way the food and there will be no deer.
      John Perkins
      Salem, NH
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