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Re: [atlas_craftsman] RE: This should be easy: Fair value guestimate on 101....

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  • Charles
    I have bought four Atlas 10 inch lathes and never paid more than $300.   The $300 came with change gears, center rest, steady rest, 3 and 4 jaw chucks (both
    Message 1 of 9 , Aug 29, 2013
      I have bought four Atlas 10 inch lathes and never paid more than $300.   The $300 came with change gears, center rest, steady rest, 3 and 4 jaw chucks (both worn)  A bunch of morse taper tools for the tailstock including jacobs chucks and a well made home made taper attachment.   I bought that one twice for $300 (only counting it once though).  Once when I then sold it to a good friend and then again when I bought it from his heirs.  If you are patient and scan the various sales venues everyday, whatever it is that you want can be found cheaply.   Babbit bearings are replaceable as well, though since we are getting to the point that many machinists cannot read a vernier, or even spin a crank  (they work the keyboard) it probably doesn't matter. 

      Charles


      From: "wa5cab@..." <wa5cab@...>


      WRT the prices, they might be taken as what someone posting for sale on this or similar lists might ask.  Amongst ourselves, at least most of us would probably take less than if we went to the not insignificant trouble of listing them on CL or eBay.

      WRT the babbit versus Timken question, short answer is yes.  But not because in equivalent (tight) condition one wouldn't perform as well as the other.  You can today buy and replace the Timken bearings.  But not the babbit ones.  You can remove shims and tighten up the babbits.  But compensating for the increased wear that will occur at the chuck end of the spindle is another matter.  However, at least half of my price reduction was due to no power cross feed.

      Robert D
    • wa5cab
      The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them. In a message dated 8/30/2013 1:33:25 PM Central Daylight Time, ...
      Message 2 of 9 , Aug 30, 2013
        The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them.

        In a message dated 8/30/2013 1:33:25 PM Central Daylight Time, smith975@... writes:
        Thoughts on Babbitt. I just joined the group this month and have been watching with interest the different posts. I purchased an Atlas 10" TH54 with an assorted amount of tooling at auction for $400.00 it has the Timken bearing head and seems to be in very good shape. I can see several new bearings and everything seems to be tight. It is replacing an older lathe that had a Babbitt head. I had no problems with the Babbitt head except a little heat buildup if running at higher speeds. I have a friend who for years was an active member of an old engine club. Many old engines have Babbitt bearing that need replacing. If you need new Babbitt bearing look for an old engine club in your area and most likely someone will pour you new bearings for the price of the Babbitt. Depending on the Babbitt type (compound of metals) it can be spendy.

        JS


        Robert & Susan Downs - Houston
        wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
        MVPA 9480
      • Scott Henion
        ... Why? They should be the right size when poured and aligned as long as the spindle is set up properly when poured. -- ... Scott G. Henion Craftsman 12x36
        Message 3 of 9 , Aug 30, 2013
          On 8/31/2013 12:56 AM, wa5cab@... wrote:
          The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them.

          Why? They should be the right size when poured and aligned as long as the spindle is set up properly when poured.

          --
          ------------------------------------------------------------
          	Scott G. Henion
          Craftsman 12x36 lathe: http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36
          Welding pages and homemade welder: http://shdesigns.org/Welding
          -----------------------------------------------------------------
        • Charles
          I have not done a lathe yet, but I never bored them, just scraped to get the proper clearance. Charles Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android
          Message 4 of 9 , Aug 30, 2013

            I have not done a lathe yet, but I never bored them, just scraped to get the proper clearance.

            Charles

            Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android



            From: wa5cab@... <wa5cab@...>;
            To: <atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com>;
            Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy: Fair value guestimate on 101....
            Sent: Sat, Aug 31, 2013 4:56:43 AM



            The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them.

            In a message dated 8/30/2013 1:33:25 PM Central Daylight Time, smith975@... writes:
            Thoughts on Babbitt. I just joined the group this month and have been watching with interest the different posts. I purchased an Atlas 10" TH54 with an assorted amount of tooling at auction for $400.00 it has the Timken bearing head and seems to be in very good shape. I can see several new bearings and everything seems to be tight. It is replacing an older lathe that had a Babbitt head. I had no problems with the Babbitt head except a little heat buildup if running at higher speeds. I have a friend who for years was an active member of an old engine club. Many old engines have Babbitt bearing that need replacing. If you need new Babbitt bearing look for an old engine club in your area and most likely someone will pour you new bearings for the price of the Babbitt. Depending on the Babbitt type (compound of metals) it can be spendy.

            JS


            Robert & Susan Downs - Houston
            wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
            MVPA 9480


          • James Irwin
            You obviously have no clue about how babbitt bearings are poured in place and NOT disturbed once poured. That¹s one of the things we had do do and learn in
            Message 5 of 9 , Aug 31, 2013
              Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy:  Fair value guestimate on 101.... You obviously have no clue about how babbitt bearings are poured in place and NOT disturbed once poured.
              That’s one of the things we had do do and learn in machining class as we were making a machine tool from pattern making thru final assembly and test.


              On 8/30/13 11:56 PM, "wa5cab@..." wrote:


               
               
                 

              The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them.

              In a message dated 8/30/2013 1:33:25 PM Central Daylight Time, smith975@... writes:
              Thoughts on Babbitt. I just joined the group this month and have been watching with interest the different posts. I purchased an Atlas 10" TH54 with an assorted amount of tooling at auction for $400.00 it has the Timken bearing head and seems to be in very good shape. I can see several new bearings and everything seems to be tight. It is replacing an older lathe that had a Babbitt head. I had no problems with the Babbitt head except a little heat buildup if running at higher speeds. I have a friend who for years was an active member of an old engine club. Many old engines have Babbitt bearing that need replacing. If you need new Babbitt bearing look for an old engine club in your area and most likely someone will pour you new bearings for the price of the Babbitt. Depending on the Babbitt type (compound of metals) it can be spendy.

              JS


              Robert & Susan Downs - Houston
              wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
              MVPA 9480

                 


            • jtiers
              Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy: Fair value guestimate on 101....Hmmmm.... If poured in place and left, there is a tight clearance... usually
              Message 6 of 9 , Aug 31, 2013
                Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy:  Fair value guestimate on 101....
                Hmmmm....
                 
                If poured in place and left, there is a tight clearance... usually there is some work to scrape them to fit, if you use a "model shaft"  . If you pour around the actual shaft, you still have a tight clearance, but it may wear out to be OK, will be hot for a while.  Probably it will be too close for good oiling, though, depending on the shrinkage.
                 
                Do you count scraping oil grooves as "disturbing" the babbit?
                 
                JT
                ----- Original Message -----
                To: Atlas
                Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2013 5:39 PM
                Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy: Fair value guestimate on 101....

                You obviously have no clue about how babbitt bearings are poured in place and NOT disturbed once poured.
                That’s one of the things we had do do and learn in machining class as we were making a machine tool from pattern making thru final assembly and test.

              • James Smith
                For anyone interested check out Keith Fenner s videos on YouTube. Very good videos of babbit pours and scraping to size. From: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
                Message 7 of 9 , Aug 31, 2013

                  For anyone interested check out Keith Fenner's videos on YouTube. Very good videos of babbit pours and scraping to size.

                   

                  From: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com [mailto:atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of James Irwin
                  Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2013 3:40 PM
                  To: Atlas
                  Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: This should be easy: Fair value guestimate on 101....

                   

                   

                  You obviously have no clue about how babbitt bearings are poured in place and NOT disturbed once poured.
                  That’s one of the things we had do do and learn in machining class as we were making a machine tool from pattern making thru final assembly and test.


                  On 8/30/13 11:56 PM, "wa5cab@..." wrote:


                   
                   
                     

                  The problem is that after you have new bearings poured, you still have to line bore them.

                  In a message dated 8/30/2013 1:33:25 PM Central Daylight Time, smith975@... writes:

                  Thoughts on Babbitt. I just joined the group this month and have been watching with interest the different posts. I purchased an Atlas 10" TH54 with an assorted amount of tooling at auction for $400.00 it has the Timken bearing head and seems to be in very good shape. I can see several new bearings and everything seems to be tight. It is replacing an older lathe that had a Babbitt head. I had no problems with the Babbitt head except a little heat buildup if running at higher speeds. I have a friend who for years was an active member of an old engine club. Many old engines have Babbitt bearing that need replacing. If you need new Babbitt bearing look for an old engine club in your area and most likely someone will pour you new bearings for the price of the Babbitt. Depending on the Babbitt type (compound of metals) it can be spendy.

                  JS



                  Robert & Susan Downs - Houston
                  wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
                  MVPA 9480

                     

                • wa5cab
                  The practical problem with pouring new babbit bearings using the existing spindle as part of the mold is that you have to be able to place and hold the spindle
                  Message 8 of 9 , Aug 31, 2013
                    The practical problem with pouring new babbit bearings using the existing spindle as part of the mold is that you have to be able to place and hold the spindle in the correct location.  You need to be able to locate and hold the spindle within probably +/- .005" front to back, +/- .001" up and down, and at a guess .0005" in 12" in both pitch and yaw.  In other words, you need to be able to pour bearings as accurately as the factory originally line bored them.

                    Robert D.

                    In a message dated 8/31/2013 6:27:26 PM Central Daylight Time, jerdal@... writes:
                    Hmmmm....

                     
                    If poured in place and left, there is a tight clearance... usually there is some work to scrape them to fit, if you use a "model shaft"  . If you pour around the actual shaft, you still have a tight clearance, but it may wear out to be OK, will be hot for a while.  Probably it will be too close for good oiling, though, depending on the shrinkage.
                     
                    Do you count scraping oil grooves as "disturbing" the babbit?
                     
                    JT


                    Robert & Susan Downs - Houston
                    wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
                    MVPA 9480
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