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Re: motor issues

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  • woweniii
    The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for discussion and LEARNING.
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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      The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as
      the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
      discussion and LEARNING.

      William


      --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@... wrote:
      >
      > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
      scrapped a
      > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
      capacitor.
      > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
      check out.
      > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
      > Regards
      > Tom
      >
      >
      >
      > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video
      on AOL
      > Home.
      > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?
      video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • jo barden
      I am sorry I agree, it is a bit like saying rake angle on drill bits and turning tools are nothing to do with lathes! Jon To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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        I am sorry I agree, it is a bit like saying rake angle on drill bits and turning tools are nothing to do with lathes!

        Jon

        To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
        From: wowen@...
        Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2008 15:46:30 +0000
        Subject: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues




















        The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as

        the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for

        discussion and LEARNING.



        William



        --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@... wrote:

        >

        > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just

        scrapped a

        > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no

        capacitor.

        > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to

        check out.

        > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.

        > Regards

        > Tom

        >

        >

        >

        > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

        on AOL

        > Home.

        > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?

        video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

        >

        >

        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        >
























        _________________________________________________________________
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      • indianfourrider
        I had motor issues as well, before I found this group. I can recommend www.allexperts.com for electric motor questions. (no connection/no financial interest)
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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          I had motor 'issues' as well, before I found this group. I can
          recommend www.allexperts.com for electric motor questions. (no
          connection/no financial interest) The 'industry' section is where I
          found a very helpful motor person.

          I know that there are 4000+ folks in our group and we have members with
          amazing expertise. Chances are there is an equally qualified person in
          our midst.

          And I must agree with Willaim. All you experienced Jack's-of-many-
          trades need to be patient with us amatuers! Huge amounts of stuff you
          take for granted is new to us.

          Thanks again,

          Jim
        • mlane3867@aol.com
          I agree. I have spend a lot of time on the motor for my Atlas 10 lathe. It has a DC motor with variable speed control. Mike In a message dated 4/1/2008
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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            I agree. I have spend a lot of time on the motor for my Atlas 10 lathe.
            It has a DC motor with variable speed control.

            Mike


            In a message dated 4/1/2008 11:47:08 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
            wowen@... writes:




            The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as
            the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
            discussion and LEARNING.

            William

            --- In _atlas_craftsman@atlas_craftsatl_
            (mailto:atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com) , TCHare@... wrote:
            >
            > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
            scrapped a
            > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
            capacitor.
            > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
            check out.
            > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
            > Regards
            > Tom
            >
            >
            >
            > ************ ************<WBR>**Create a Home Theater Like the Pros.
            on AOL
            > Home.
            > (_http://home.http://home.http://home.<WBRhttp://home.<W_
            (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?)
            video=15&ncid=ncid=<WBR>aolhomncid=
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >







            **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
            Home.
            (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • gixxer5869
            ... as ... video ... Thanks for what you said William. Don t want to step on any toes Tom, just trying to make a choice beneficial to me in the long run. And
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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              --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, "woweniii" <wowen@...> wrote:
              >
              > The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool
              as
              > the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
              > discussion and LEARNING.
              >
              > William
              >
              >
              > --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@ wrote:
              > >
              > > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
              > scrapped a
              > > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
              > capacitor.
              > > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
              > check out.
              > > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
              > > Regards
              > > Tom
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the
              video
              > on AOL
              > > Home.
              > > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?
              > video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              >
              Thanks for what you said William. Don't want to step on any toes Tom,
              just trying to make a choice beneficial to me in the long run. And
              thanks to all that responded. Gonna go with a enclosed, fan-cooled
              dayton.
            • TCHare@aol.com
              I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long gone.
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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                I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor
                for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long
                gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old motor, and that has
                been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch assembly for a
                motor anymore because they were made by the motor manufacturers who are out of
                business. You certainly can't get a fractional HP motor rewound and dipped in
                varnish for less than replacement cost.
                The last time we went down this path two guys were copying all four thousand
                of us about the various frequencies of current supplied to people in
                different parts of the LA basin by Southern California Edison in the 1930's!
                Tom



                **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
                Home.
                (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Jon Elson
                ... There are electronic switches that can replace almost any centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor. Now, what the heck do they call
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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                  TCHare@... wrote:
                  > I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor
                  > for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long
                  > gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old motor, and that has
                  > been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch assembly for a
                  > motor anymore because they were made by the motor manufacturers who are out of
                  > business.
                  There are electronic switches that can replace almost any
                  centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor.
                  Now, what the heck do they call those? Universal Motor
                  Starting Relays is one. I replaced one from Rexroth, I think,
                  it was called a <something>switch, a trade name, but I can't
                  remember the exact name.

                  Jon
                • catboat15@aol.com
                  Maybe those good old days are gone forever, but I have powered my tools with dumpster diving motors. One of those old fashioned washing machines may wear
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 3, 2008
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                    Maybe those "good old days" are gone forever, but I have powered my tools
                    with dumpster diving motors. One of those old fashioned washing machines may
                    wear out, but the motor was still good. (Those motors were used where water may
                    spill, so were pretty well shielded) Still running my lathe and other
                    projects with salvaged motors from "junked appliances".

                    (Don't look to vacuum cleaners, they run far too fast for lathes etc, but
                    might be good for a blower for your home made forge or melting furnace)





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                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • TCHare@aol.com
                    Now we are finally getting somewhere. Yes, the washing machines from the 1950 s had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that outlasted their machines. They were built by
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 3, 2008
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                      Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                      Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                      outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                      among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                      standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                      agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                      anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                      Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                      even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I think the
                      motors are integral to the transmissions and un-usable to hobbyists.
                      OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a database of appliances
                      with motors that can be scrounged and put to use including make and model and
                      approximate date of manufacture. little DC and stepper motors pulled out of
                      printers don't count.
                      Regards
                      Tom



                      **************Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Joe R
                      Tom Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the cage but people don t replace new furnaces they
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                        Tom

                        Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the cage but people don't replace new furnaces they replace old ones. I have gotten several 1/4th and 1/3rd hp motors off the "curb". Some had been recently replaced and were almost new. They are mostly all 120 volts, 1725 rpm's and reversible.

                        Joe R.
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: TCHare@...
                        To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 12:31 AM
                        Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues


                        Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                        Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                        outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                        among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                        standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                        agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                        anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                        Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                        even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I think the
                        motors are integral to the transmissions and un-usable to hobbyists.
                        OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a database of appliances
                        with motors that can be scrounged and put to use including make and model and
                        approximate date of manufacture. little DC and stepper motors pulled out of
                        printers don't count.
                        Regards
                        Tom

                        **************Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
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                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Mrs Leon Robinson
                        Joe, The thing to watch out for on furnace blower motors that are mounted inside of the blower is that they are designed to be cooled by the blower, without
                        Message 11 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                          Joe,

                          The thing to watch out for on furnace blower motors
                          that are mounted inside of the blower is that they are
                          designed to be cooled by the blower, without the
                          blower they may overheat if used in other
                          applications.

                          Leon

                          --- Joe R <jromas@...> wrote:

                          > Tom
                          >
                          > Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most
                          > if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the
                          > cage but people don't replace new furnaces they
                          > replace old ones. I have gotten several 1/4th and
                          > 1/3rd hp motors off the "curb". Some had been
                          > recently replaced and were almost new. They are
                          > mostly all 120 volts, 1725 rpm's and reversible.
                          >
                          > Joe R.
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: TCHare@...
                          > To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
                          > Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 12:31 AM
                          > Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues
                          >
                          >
                          > Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                          > Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3
                          > HP 1750 rpm motors that
                          > outlasted their machines. They were built by
                          > Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                          > among others. They had a standard base and a
                          > standard output shaft with a
                          > standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and
                          > when the motor hummed and the
                          > agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt
                          > had failed and nearly
                          > anybody could replace the belt and every local
                          > hardware store carried the belts.
                          > Who makes a washing machine with one of those
                          > motors now? Who made one
                          > even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor
                          > off of today? I think the
                          > motors are integral to the transmissions and
                          > un-usable to hobbyists.
                          > OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a
                          > database of appliances
                          > with motors that can be scrounged and put to use
                          > including make and model and
                          > approximate date of manufacture. little DC and
                          > stepper motors pulled out of
                          > printers don't count.
                          > Regards
                          > Tom
                          >
                          > **************Planning your summer road trip?
                          > Check out AOL Travel Guides.
                          >
                          >
                          (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv00030000000016)
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                          > removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                          > removed]
                          >
                          >


                          Political Correctness is a Political Disease
                        • Pasek, Dennis Civ USAF AFMC 520 SMXS/MXDE
                          There are two types, called potential relays and current relays . They are commonly used for starting single phase hermetic refrigeration compressors which,
                          Message 12 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                            There are two types, called 'potential relays' and 'current relays'.

                            They are commonly used for starting single phase hermetic refrigeration
                            compressors which, of course, cannot have a centrifugal switch on the
                            motor shaft.
                            They are available inexpensively from refrigeration suppliers and many
                            other industrial supply companies.

                            They can also be found bundled with a start capacitor and called
                            something like 'hard start relays'.
                            The 'static' Phase-a-Matic units are overpriced versions of this scheme.

                            You will have to bring out the connection for the start winding, and it
                            may already be available on the motor terminal board. These relays
                            should also work with motors that do not use a capacitor on their start
                            windings.


                            If the contacts are burned but the switch mechanism is otherwise
                            servicable and you are so inclined, you might try refacing the contact
                            surfaces by silver soldering on small pieces of Elkonite or some contact
                            face material salvaged from other components. But, that sounds like
                            more trouble than it is worth given the availability of the relays.

                            Regards,
                            Dennis


                            > 1a. Re: motor issues
                            > Posted by: "Jon Elson" elson@... jmelson2
                            > Date: Tue Apr 1, 2008 10:26 pm ((PDT))
                            >
                            > TCHare@... wrote:
                            > > I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or
                            > could, repair a motor
                            > > for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those
                            > days are long
                            > > gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old
                            > motor, and that has
                            > > been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch
                            > assembly for a
                            > > motor anymore because they were made by the motor
                            > manufacturers who are out of
                            > > business.

                            > There are electronic switches that can replace almost any
                            > centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor.
                            > Now, what the heck do they call those? Universal Motor
                            > Starting Relays is one. I replaced one from Rexroth, I think,
                            > it was called a <something>switch, a trade name, but I can't
                            > remember the exact name.
                            >
                            > Jon
                            >
                          • Jon Elson
                            ... White-Westinghouse for almost all the major brands. It had the typical very-open frame motor, with all the windings hanging out in the open, and belt
                            Message 13 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                              TCHare@... wrote:
                              > Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                              > Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                              > outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                              > among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                              > standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                              > agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                              > anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                              > Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                              > even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I have a ~30 year old "GE" washer, but they were all made by
                              White-Westinghouse for almost all the major brands. It had the
                              typical very-open frame motor, with all the windings hanging out
                              in the open, and belt drive. One problem with these are they
                              are often dual-speed reversing motors, and without the wiring
                              diagram off the back of the machine, you would be stymied by a
                              forest of wires. And, no, sorry, you can't have my motor, it is
                              still washing clothes for us. The transmission is leaking lube
                              like crazy, I've put several pumps on it, but it is still going.

                              Jon
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