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Re: [atlas_craftsman] motor issues

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  • TCHare@aol.com
    They don t all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just scrapped a Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no capacitor. Please,
    Message 1 of 19 , Mar 31, 2008
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      They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just scrapped a
      Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no capacitor.
      Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to check out.
      Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
      Regards
      Tom



      **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
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    • woweniii
      The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for discussion and LEARNING.
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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        The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as
        the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
        discussion and LEARNING.

        William


        --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@... wrote:
        >
        > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
        scrapped a
        > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
        capacitor.
        > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
        check out.
        > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
        > Regards
        > Tom
        >
        >
        >
        > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video
        on AOL
        > Home.
        > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?
        video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • jo barden
        I am sorry I agree, it is a bit like saying rake angle on drill bits and turning tools are nothing to do with lathes! Jon To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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          I am sorry I agree, it is a bit like saying rake angle on drill bits and turning tools are nothing to do with lathes!

          Jon

          To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
          From: wowen@...
          Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2008 15:46:30 +0000
          Subject: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues




















          The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as

          the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for

          discussion and LEARNING.



          William



          --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@... wrote:

          >

          > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just

          scrapped a

          > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no

          capacitor.

          > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to

          check out.

          > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.

          > Regards

          > Tom

          >

          >

          >

          > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

          on AOL

          > Home.

          > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?

          video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

          >

          >

          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          >
























          _________________________________________________________________
          Win 100�s of Virgin Experience days with BigSnapSearch.com
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        • indianfourrider
          I had motor issues as well, before I found this group. I can recommend www.allexperts.com for electric motor questions. (no connection/no financial interest)
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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            I had motor 'issues' as well, before I found this group. I can
            recommend www.allexperts.com for electric motor questions. (no
            connection/no financial interest) The 'industry' section is where I
            found a very helpful motor person.

            I know that there are 4000+ folks in our group and we have members with
            amazing expertise. Chances are there is an equally qualified person in
            our midst.

            And I must agree with Willaim. All you experienced Jack's-of-many-
            trades need to be patient with us amatuers! Huge amounts of stuff you
            take for granted is new to us.

            Thanks again,

            Jim
          • mlane3867@aol.com
            I agree. I have spend a lot of time on the motor for my Atlas 10 lathe. It has a DC motor with variable speed control. Mike In a message dated 4/1/2008
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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              I agree. I have spend a lot of time on the motor for my Atlas 10 lathe.
              It has a DC motor with variable speed control.

              Mike


              In a message dated 4/1/2008 11:47:08 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
              wowen@... writes:




              The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool as
              the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
              discussion and LEARNING.

              William

              --- In _atlas_craftsman@atlas_craftsatl_
              (mailto:atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com) , TCHare@... wrote:
              >
              > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
              scrapped a
              > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
              capacitor.
              > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
              check out.
              > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
              > Regards
              > Tom
              >
              >
              >
              > ************ ************<WBR>**Create a Home Theater Like the Pros.
              on AOL
              > Home.
              > (_http://home.http://home.http://home.<WBRhttp://home.<W_
              (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?)
              video=15&ncid=ncid=<WBR>aolhomncid=
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >







              **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
              Home.
              (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • gixxer5869
              ... as ... video ... Thanks for what you said William. Don t want to step on any toes Tom, just trying to make a choice beneficial to me in the long run. And
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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                --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, "woweniii" <wowen@...> wrote:
                >
                > The motor powering out lathes are as fundamental part of this tool
                as
                > the tool bits. It is a valid question and a valid topic for
                > discussion and LEARNING.
                >
                > William
                >
                >
                > --- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, TCHare@ wrote:
                > >
                > > They don't all have centrifugal switches and capacitors. I just
                > scrapped a
                > > Sears grinder that had a start relay to start windings and no
                > capacitor.
                > > Please, this is a lathe store, I think the new guy has plenty to
                > check out.
                > > Let's not turn it in to a motor store.
                > > Regards
                > > Tom
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the
                video
                > on AOL
                > > Home.
                > > (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?
                > video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                >
                Thanks for what you said William. Don't want to step on any toes Tom,
                just trying to make a choice beneficial to me in the long run. And
                thanks to all that responded. Gonna go with a enclosed, fan-cooled
                dayton.
              • TCHare@aol.com
                I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long gone.
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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                  I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor
                  for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long
                  gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old motor, and that has
                  been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch assembly for a
                  motor anymore because they were made by the motor manufacturers who are out of
                  business. You certainly can't get a fractional HP motor rewound and dipped in
                  varnish for less than replacement cost.
                  The last time we went down this path two guys were copying all four thousand
                  of us about the various frequencies of current supplied to people in
                  different parts of the LA basin by Southern California Edison in the 1930's!
                  Tom



                  **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
                  Home.
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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Jon Elson
                  ... There are electronic switches that can replace almost any centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor. Now, what the heck do they call
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
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                    TCHare@... wrote:
                    > I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or could, repair a motor
                    > for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those days are long
                    > gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old motor, and that has
                    > been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch assembly for a
                    > motor anymore because they were made by the motor manufacturers who are out of
                    > business.
                    There are electronic switches that can replace almost any
                    centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor.
                    Now, what the heck do they call those? Universal Motor
                    Starting Relays is one. I replaced one from Rexroth, I think,
                    it was called a <something>switch, a trade name, but I can't
                    remember the exact name.

                    Jon
                  • catboat15@aol.com
                    Maybe those good old days are gone forever, but I have powered my tools with dumpster diving motors. One of those old fashioned washing machines may wear
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 3, 2008
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                      Maybe those "good old days" are gone forever, but I have powered my tools
                      with dumpster diving motors. One of those old fashioned washing machines may
                      wear out, but the motor was still good. (Those motors were used where water may
                      spill, so were pretty well shielded) Still running my lathe and other
                      projects with salvaged motors from "junked appliances".

                      (Don't look to vacuum cleaners, they run far too fast for lathes etc, but
                      might be good for a blower for your home made forge or melting furnace)





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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • TCHare@aol.com
                      Now we are finally getting somewhere. Yes, the washing machines from the 1950 s had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that outlasted their machines. They were built by
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 3, 2008
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                        Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                        Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                        outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                        among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                        standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                        agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                        anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                        Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                        even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I think the
                        motors are integral to the transmissions and un-usable to hobbyists.
                        OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a database of appliances
                        with motors that can be scrounged and put to use including make and model and
                        approximate date of manufacture. little DC and stepper motors pulled out of
                        printers don't count.
                        Regards
                        Tom



                        **************Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
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                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Joe R
                        Tom Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the cage but people don t replace new furnaces they
                        Message 11 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                          Tom

                          Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the cage but people don't replace new furnaces they replace old ones. I have gotten several 1/4th and 1/3rd hp motors off the "curb". Some had been recently replaced and were almost new. They are mostly all 120 volts, 1725 rpm's and reversible.

                          Joe R.
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: TCHare@...
                          To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 12:31 AM
                          Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues


                          Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                          Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                          outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                          among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                          standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                          agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                          anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                          Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                          even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I think the
                          motors are integral to the transmissions and un-usable to hobbyists.
                          OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a database of appliances
                          with motors that can be scrounged and put to use including make and model and
                          approximate date of manufacture. little DC and stepper motors pulled out of
                          printers don't count.
                          Regards
                          Tom

                          **************Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
                          (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv00030000000016)

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Mrs Leon Robinson
                          Joe, The thing to watch out for on furnace blower motors that are mounted inside of the blower is that they are designed to be cooled by the blower, without
                          Message 12 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                            Joe,

                            The thing to watch out for on furnace blower motors
                            that are mounted inside of the blower is that they are
                            designed to be cooled by the blower, without the
                            blower they may overheat if used in other
                            applications.

                            Leon

                            --- Joe R <jromas@...> wrote:

                            > Tom
                            >
                            > Another source of motors are furnace blowers. Most
                            > if not all new blowers have the motor inside of the
                            > cage but people don't replace new furnaces they
                            > replace old ones. I have gotten several 1/4th and
                            > 1/3rd hp motors off the "curb". Some had been
                            > recently replaced and were almost new. They are
                            > mostly all 120 volts, 1725 rpm's and reversible.
                            >
                            > Joe R.
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: TCHare@...
                            > To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
                            > Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 12:31 AM
                            > Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: motor issues
                            >
                            >
                            > Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                            > Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3
                            > HP 1750 rpm motors that
                            > outlasted their machines. They were built by
                            > Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                            > among others. They had a standard base and a
                            > standard output shaft with a
                            > standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and
                            > when the motor hummed and the
                            > agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt
                            > had failed and nearly
                            > anybody could replace the belt and every local
                            > hardware store carried the belts.
                            > Who makes a washing machine with one of those
                            > motors now? Who made one
                            > even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor
                            > off of today? I think the
                            > motors are integral to the transmissions and
                            > un-usable to hobbyists.
                            > OK, there are 4000 of us out there, let's start a
                            > database of appliances
                            > with motors that can be scrounged and put to use
                            > including make and model and
                            > approximate date of manufacture. little DC and
                            > stepper motors pulled out of
                            > printers don't count.
                            > Regards
                            > Tom
                            >
                            > **************Planning your summer road trip?
                            > Check out AOL Travel Guides.
                            >
                            >
                            (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv00030000000016)
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                            > removed]
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                            > removed]
                            >
                            >


                            Political Correctness is a Political Disease
                          • Pasek, Dennis Civ USAF AFMC 520 SMXS/MXDE
                            There are two types, called potential relays and current relays . They are commonly used for starting single phase hermetic refrigeration compressors which,
                            Message 13 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                              There are two types, called 'potential relays' and 'current relays'.

                              They are commonly used for starting single phase hermetic refrigeration
                              compressors which, of course, cannot have a centrifugal switch on the
                              motor shaft.
                              They are available inexpensively from refrigeration suppliers and many
                              other industrial supply companies.

                              They can also be found bundled with a start capacitor and called
                              something like 'hard start relays'.
                              The 'static' Phase-a-Matic units are overpriced versions of this scheme.

                              You will have to bring out the connection for the start winding, and it
                              may already be available on the motor terminal board. These relays
                              should also work with motors that do not use a capacitor on their start
                              windings.


                              If the contacts are burned but the switch mechanism is otherwise
                              servicable and you are so inclined, you might try refacing the contact
                              surfaces by silver soldering on small pieces of Elkonite or some contact
                              face material salvaged from other components. But, that sounds like
                              more trouble than it is worth given the availability of the relays.

                              Regards,
                              Dennis


                              > 1a. Re: motor issues
                              > Posted by: "Jon Elson" elson@... jmelson2
                              > Date: Tue Apr 1, 2008 10:26 pm ((PDT))
                              >
                              > TCHare@... wrote:
                              > > I would agree if you could find a shop that would, or
                              > could, repair a motor
                              > > for less than the cost of a new one, then carry on. Those
                              > days are long
                              > > gone. Yes, you can get a replacement capacitor for an old
                              > motor, and that has
                              > > been addressed. You usually can't get a centrifugal switch
                              > assembly for a
                              > > motor anymore because they were made by the motor
                              > manufacturers who are out of
                              > > business.

                              > There are electronic switches that can replace almost any
                              > centrifugal switch on any capacitor-start or split-phase motor.
                              > Now, what the heck do they call those? Universal Motor
                              > Starting Relays is one. I replaced one from Rexroth, I think,
                              > it was called a <something>switch, a trade name, but I can't
                              > remember the exact name.
                              >
                              > Jon
                              >
                            • Jon Elson
                              ... White-Westinghouse for almost all the major brands. It had the typical very-open frame motor, with all the windings hanging out in the open, and belt
                              Message 14 of 19 , Apr 4, 2008
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                                TCHare@... wrote:
                                > Now we are finally getting somewhere.
                                > Yes, the washing machines from the 1950's had 1/3 HP 1750 rpm motors that
                                > outlasted their machines. They were built by Westinghouse, GE and Eclipse
                                > among others. They had a standard base and a standard output shaft with a
                                > standard key slot. They were vee belt drivers and when the motor hummed and the
                                > agitator did not agitate, everybody knew the belt had failed and nearly
                                > anybody could replace the belt and every local hardware store carried the belts.
                                > Who makes a washing machine with one of those motors now? Who made one
                                > even 25 years ago that I might scrounge a motor off of today? I have a ~30 year old "GE" washer, but they were all made by
                                White-Westinghouse for almost all the major brands. It had the
                                typical very-open frame motor, with all the windings hanging out
                                in the open, and belt drive. One problem with these are they
                                are often dual-speed reversing motors, and without the wiring
                                diagram off the back of the machine, you would be stymied by a
                                forest of wires. And, no, sorry, you can't have my motor, it is
                                still washing clothes for us. The transmission is leaking lube
                                like crazy, I've put several pumps on it, but it is still going.

                                Jon
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