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RE: [art_education] Kinko's acting like copyright agents, too?

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  • Kristi Gilleland
    I know a certain company that used to have Kinko s copy 100+ books at a time so they wouldn t have to buy extra copies, lol, but ....my friend did a patel
    Message 1 of 10 , Sep 30, 2006
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      I know a certain company that used to have Kinko's copy 100+ books at a time so they wouldn't have to buy extra copies, lol, but ....my friend did a patel drawing and brought it into a Kinko's and they told her she COULD NOT copy it due to copyright violations.  She kept saying BUT I'M THE ARTIST!  I OWN THE COPYRIGHT!
       
      But they wouldn't let her copy her own drawing!
       
      -Kristi


      From: art_education@yahoogroups.com [mailto:art_education@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rivka Kehaty
      Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 10:28 PM
      To: art_education@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [art_education] Kinko's acting like copyright agents, too?

      >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry much
      about
      the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
      librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel obliged to
      act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are not. All
      you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret about
      it. <<<
       
      I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko' s) and needed a color copy made (needed something special done to it so could not do it myself on the color copier,etc.. ..)  but they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school I teach for.
       
      Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright violations?  Are the librarians afraid of that too?  Should they be??
       
      Rivka


      Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.

    • kathieblanche
      I ve been wondering about Kinko s lately too. I want to bring in several art posters and have them copied. I de like to cut the copies apart into even sized
      Message 2 of 10 , Oct 1, 2006
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        I've been wondering about Kinko's lately too.

        I want to bring in several art posters and have them copied. I'de like to cut the
        copies apart into even sized rectangles and have each student recreate the image that
        is on their rectangle onto a larger piece of paper using a variety of different materials.
        The pieces will all be fitted together into one large image when all are done and hung
        on a wall. I am not ready to do this lesson yet, so I haven't brought them in to be
        copied, but I'm not sure that they'll even do it...

        I went to Kinko's in May to copy some scrapbook pages I'd made and the Kinko's
        guy said I could copy all but the one that was a big collage with part of a map pasted
        in the corner. He said copying the map was not allowed. I wanted to say, "But it's
        ART!!" -but then I realized that that left open the rebuttal, "No it's not!" And as I
        looked down at my photo collage of the Cabazon, CA dinasaurs attacking myself and
        my neices I thought, "Nope. Don't want to open that door..."

        So what's the best way to handle the Kinko workers? Kathie, safely back in WI.


        --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com, Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@...> wrote:
        >
        > >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry much about
        > the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
        > librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel obliged to
        > act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are not. All
        > you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret about
        > it. <<<
        >
        > I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko's) and needed a color copy made (needed
        something special done to it so could not do it myself on the color copier,etc....) but
        they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school I teach for.
        >
        > Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright violations? Are the librarians
        afraid of that too? Should they be??
        >
        > Rivka
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.
        >
      • henlaojim
        ... about ... made (needed something special done to it so could not do it myself on the color copier,etc....) but they have refused me in the past or wanted
        Message 3 of 10 , Oct 2, 2006
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          --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com, Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry much
          about
          > the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
          > librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel obliged to
          > act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are not. All
          > you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret about
          > it. <<<
          >
          > I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko's) and needed a color copy
          made (needed something special done to it so could not do it myself
          on the color copier,etc....) but they have refused me in the past or
          wanted a note for the school I teach for.
          >
          Well, Kinko'w and other copy shops are in an awkward position
          becayuse they are vulnerable as large corporatins to suits from
          multimedia conglomerates and have, thus, become very cautious about
          copyright. I once had a Kinko's copy shop in Louisville Kentucky, on
          Bardstown Road, refuse to make posters for a missing child because
          the picture on them seemed to be a school portrait for which, they
          said, I had no rights. I reciprocted by making a great scene crying
          and yelling and pounding on the counter until they copied them just
          to get rid of me. I do not recommend that strategy in your case.

          A good color printer is useful.

          Incidentally, I related that story to the company that had taken the
          pictures and they sent me within days one hudred full color 8X10
          photos free of charge and a note giving me permission to copy them
          along with an apology for the incident, with which, of course, they
          had nothing to do.
        • MaryAnn Faubion Kohl
          Make a friend with someone who has a copier in their home or office. Also, you can download images from the internet and cut those in half...and make color
          Message 4 of 10 , Oct 2, 2006
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            Re: [art_education] Re: Kinko's acting like copyright agents, too? Make a friend with someone who has a copier in their home or office.

            Also, you can download images from the internet and cut those in half...and make color prints instead of using Kinko’s.

            Once I asked them to copy some things from a book I had written and published, and even I had troulbe getting them to help me. And I was the publisher!!  It was kind of funny, in a way.

            MaryAnn


                
            .........................................
               MaryAnn F. Kohl
               educator/consultant/author
               
            maryann@...
                www.brightring.com
               .........................................




            On  10/1/06 11:39 AM,  kathieblanche  kathieblanche@...  wrote:


             
             

               I've been wondering about Kinko's lately too.

            I want to bring in several art posters and have them copied.  I'de like to cut the
            copies apart into even sized rectangles and have each student recreate the image that
            is on their rectangle onto a larger piece of paper using a variety of different materials.  
            The pieces will all be fitted together into one large image when all are done and hung
            on a wall.  I am not ready to do this lesson yet, so I haven't brought them in to be
            copied, but I'm not sure that they'll even do it...

            I went to Kinko's in May to copy some scrapbook pages I'd made and the Kinko's
            guy said I could copy all but the one that was a big collage with part of a map pasted
            in the corner.  He said copying the map was not allowed.  I wanted to say, "But it's
            ART!!"  -but then I realized that that left open the rebuttal, "No it's not!"  And as I
            looked down at my photo collage of the Cabazon, CA dinasaurs attacking myself and
            my neices I thought, "Nope.  Don't want to open that door..."

            So what's the best way to handle the Kinko workers?  Kathie, safely back in WI.

            --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com <mailto:art_education%40yahoogroups.com> , Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@...> wrote:
            >
            > >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry much about
            > the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
            > librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel obliged to
            > act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are not. All
            > you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret about
            > it. <<<
            >    
            >   I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko's) and needed a color copy made (needed
            something special done to it so could not do it myself on the color copier,etc....)  but
            they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school I teach for.
            >    
            >   Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright violations?  Are the librarians
            afraid of that too?  Should they be??
            >    
            >   Rivka
            >
            >  
            > ---------------------------------
            > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com.  Check it out.
            >

             
                

          • Act Silly 4 Art
            I ve also noticed that Kinko s has beefed up security on copying anything that they feel is infringes on copyright violation law. I drew a sketch for a
            Message 5 of 10 , Oct 2, 2006
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              I've also noticed that Kinko's has beefed up security on copying anything that "they" feel is infringes on copyright violation law.  I drew a sketch for a mural we are about to do at school and asked if they could blow it up for me.  The girl took the sketch to the back then came back with the manager who informed me that they could reproduce copyright material.  I told her that I had drawn the sketch, which was as plain as day, but she insisted that it was a reproduction.  I asked her to prove it.  She said she didn't have to because it was their right to refuse to copy anything that "she" deemed suspicious.  Frustrated, I said a few choice words and left with my sketchbook.  Then I went home called 1.800.254.6567 and filed a complaint with Kinko/Fed Ex on the Mananger and Store.  I got a nice little letter apologizing for the misunderstanding and stupid coupon good for a Free Color Copy.  I refuse to go to Kinko to copy anything.
               
              Cat in Honolulu

              Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@...> wrote:
              >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry much about
              the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
              librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel obliged to
              act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are not. All
              you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret about
              it. <<<
               
              I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko' s) and needed a color copy made (needed something special done to it so could not do it myself on the color copier,etc.. ..)  but they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school I teach for.
               
              Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright violations?  Are the librarians afraid of that too?  Should they be??
               
              Rivka

              Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.


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              Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail.

            • Susan Michael
              We has some questions from Walmart about some family pictures that my husband took. The attendant thought it was from a studio and if they had not already been
              Message 6 of 10 , Oct 2, 2006
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                We has some questions from Walmart about some family pictures that my husband took. The attendant thought it was from a studio and if they had not already been paid for would not have let us have them. =/ Susan
              • Stephen Torode
                I am sorry that you had a bad experience with Kinkos. I thought I would weigh in with my thoughts on the matter. As both an Art teacher and professional
                Message 7 of 10 , Oct 3, 2006
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                  I am sorry that you had a bad experience with Kinkos. I thought I
                  would weigh in with my thoughts on the matter.
                  As both an Art teacher and professional photographer, I provide a
                  service to clients that I hope will return income for myself and my
                  family. One of the ways I do that is by charging for my
                  professionally finished prints.
                  I had printed some proofs for one of my clients to look at for the
                  purpose of printing enlargements. Since I had my studio information
                  printed on the back of the prints along with the statement that the
                  prints are copywritten, I received a phone call from a manager at
                  Kinkos informing me that someone was making enlargements and copies
                  of my work.
                  I appreciated Kinkos efforts to thwart copywrite infringement for the
                  sake of my family's well being.
                  I can understand, however, that this power can be abused and I hope
                  that Kinkos will find a better, more efficient way of handling this
                  issue in the future.
                  Thanks for allowing me to comment.
                  Stephen Torode
                  Valley Christian High School
                  San Jose, Ca.
                  www.torodephotography.com

                  --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com, MaryAnn Faubion Kohl
                  <maryann@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Make a friend with someone who has a copier in their home or office.
                  >
                  > Also, you can download images from the internet and cut those in
                  half...and
                  > make color prints instead of using Kinko¹s.
                  >
                  > Once I asked them to copy some things from a book I had written and
                  > published, and even I had troulbe getting them to help me. And I
                  was the
                  > publisher!! It was kind of funny, in a way.
                  >
                  > MaryAnn
                  >
                  >
                  > .........................................
                  > MaryAnn F. Kohl
                  > educator/consultant/author
                  > maryann@...
                  > www.brightring.com
                  > .........................................
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > On 10/1/06 11:39 AM, kathieblanche kathieblanche@... wrote:
                  >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > I've been wondering about Kinko's lately too.
                  > >
                  > > I want to bring in several art posters and have them copied.
                  I'de like to cut
                  > > the
                  > > copies apart into even sized rectangles and have each student
                  recreate the
                  > > image that
                  > > is on their rectangle onto a larger piece of paper using a
                  variety of
                  > > different materials.
                  > > The pieces will all be fitted together into one large image when
                  all are done
                  > > and hung
                  > > on a wall. I am not ready to do this lesson yet, so I haven't
                  brought them in
                  > > to be
                  > > copied, but I'm not sure that they'll even do it...
                  > >
                  > > I went to Kinko's in May to copy some scrapbook pages I'd made
                  and the Kinko's
                  > > guy said I could copy all but the one that was a big collage with
                  part of a
                  > > map pasted
                  > > in the corner. He said copying the map was not allowed. I
                  wanted to say,
                  > > "But it's
                  > > ART!!" -but then I realized that that left open the
                  rebuttal, "No it's not!"
                  > > And as I
                  > > looked down at my photo collage of the Cabazon, CA dinasaurs
                  attacking myself
                  > > and
                  > > my neices I thought, "Nope. Don't want to open that door..."
                  > >
                  > > So what's the best way to handle the Kinko workers? Kathie,
                  safely back in
                  > > WI.
                  > >
                  > > --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com <mailto:art_education%
                  40yahoogroups.com>
                  > > , Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@> wrote:
                  > >> >
                  > >>>>> > >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry
                  much about
                  > >> > the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
                  > >> > librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel
                  obliged to
                  > >> > act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are
                  not. All
                  > >> > you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret
                  about
                  > >> > it. <<<
                  > >> >
                  > >> > I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko's) and needed a color
                  copy made
                  > >> (needed
                  > > something special done to it so could not do it myself on the
                  color
                  > > copier,etc....) but
                  > > they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school
                  I teach for.
                  > >> >
                  > >> > Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright
                  violations? Are the
                  > >> librarians
                  > > afraid of that too? Should they be??
                  > >> >
                  > >> > Rivka
                  > >> >
                  > >> >
                  > >> > ---------------------------------
                  > >> > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.
                  > >> >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                • MaryAnn Faubion Kohl
                  As a publisher and author, I appreciate Kinko¹s stand on copyright infringement. To alleviate trouble for people trying to make one copy, I print a permission
                  Message 8 of 10 , Oct 3, 2006
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                    Re: [art_education] Re: Kinko's acting like copyright agents, too? As a publisher and author, I appreciate Kinko’s stand on copyright infringement.
                    To alleviate trouble for people trying to make one copy, I print a permission in the front of my books that says something like --
                    “ok photocopying ten or less pages for single person use or classroom use for teachers”
                    Some of my older editions don’t say this, but any newer books do.
                    It’s simply to keep some control over the rampant multiple copying of entire books that is happening.

                    Can you believe the following?
                    I have been part of email sharing groups (not this one), where people scan
                    an entire book and share those jpgs with thousands of other people? The way
                    it benefits is that if each member in the group scans one entire book and
                    shares it, then everyone gets 1000 entire books for free. Yes, lots of paper
                    involved if they print them out. But not everyone prints out books. They
                    keep them on their computers for access. They share these books through AIM
                    and ICQ and iCHAT, where anyone on their member list or buddy list has
                    instant access to all their shared files. Kind of like the Napster music thing. But
                    entire BOOKS? Very disheartening for those little single person publishers
                    like myself trying to do good things for kids and parents and teachers and
                    still make a living.




                        
                    .........................................
                       MaryAnn F. Kohl
                       educator/consultant/author
                       
                    maryann@...
                        www.brightring.com
                       .........................................




                    On  10/3/06 8:14 AM,  Stephen Torode  storode@...  wrote:


                     
                     

                    I am sorry that you had a bad experience with Kinkos. I thought I
                    would weigh in with my thoughts on the matter.
                    As both an Art teacher and professional photographer, I provide a
                    service to clients that I hope will return income for myself and my
                    family. One of the ways I do that is by charging for my
                    professionally finished prints.
                    I had printed some proofs for one of my clients to look at for the
                    purpose of printing enlargements. Since I had my studio information
                    printed on the back of the prints along with the statement that the
                    prints are copywritten, I received a phone call from a manager at
                    Kinkos informing me that someone was making enlargements and copies
                    of my work.
                    I appreciated Kinkos efforts to thwart copywrite infringement for the
                    sake of my family's well being.
                    I can understand, however, that this power can be abused and I hope
                    that Kinkos will find a better, more efficient way of handling this
                    issue in the future.
                    Thanks for allowing me to comment.
                    Stephen Torode
                    Valley Christian High School
                    San Jose, Ca.
                    www.torodephotography.com

                    --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com <mailto:art_education%40yahoogroups.com> , MaryAnn Faubion Kohl
                    <maryann@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Make a friend with someone who has a copier in their home or office.
                    >
                    > Also, you can download images from the internet and cut those in
                    half...and
                    > make color prints instead of using Kinko’s.
                    >
                    > Once I asked them to copy some things from a book I had written and
                    > published, and even I had troulbe getting them to help me. And I
                    was the
                    > publisher!!  It was kind of funny, in a way.
                    >
                    > MaryAnn
                    >
                    >
                    >     .........................................
                    >     MaryAnn F. Kohl
                    >     educator/consultant/author
                    >     maryann@...
                    >     www.brightring.com
                    >     .........................................
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > On  10/1/06 11:39 AM,  kathieblanche  kathieblanche@...  wrote:
                    >
                    > >  
                    > >  
                    > >  
                    > >
                    > >    I've been wondering about Kinko's lately too.
                    > >
                    > > I want to bring in several art posters and have them copied.  
                    I'de like to cut
                    > > the
                    > > copies apart into even sized rectangles and have each student
                    recreate the
                    > > image that
                    > > is on their rectangle onto a larger piece of paper using a
                    variety of
                    > > different materials.
                    > > The pieces will all be fitted together into one large image when
                    all are done
                    > > and hung
                    > > on a wall.  I am not ready to do this lesson yet, so I haven't
                    brought them in
                    > > to be
                    > > copied, but I'm not sure that they'll even do it...
                    > >
                    > > I went to Kinko's in May to copy some scrapbook pages I'd made
                    and the Kinko's
                    > > guy said I could copy all but the one that was a big collage with
                    part of a
                    > > map pasted
                    > > in the corner.  He said copying the map was not allowed.  I
                    wanted to say,
                    > > "But it's
                    > > ART!!"  -but then I realized that that left open the
                    rebuttal, "No it's not!"
                    > > And as I
                    > > looked down at my photo collage of the Cabazon, CA dinasaurs
                    attacking myself
                    > > and
                    > > my neices I thought, "Nope.  Don't want to open that door..."
                    > >
                    > > So what's the best way to handle the Kinko workers?  Kathie,
                    safely back in
                    > > WI.
                    > >
                    > > --- In art_education@yahoogroups.com <mailto:art_education%40yahoogroups.com>  <mailto:art_education%
                    40yahoogroups.com>
                    > > , Rivka Kehaty <rivkakehaty@> wrote:
                    > >> >
                    > >>>>> > >>>. Students have a right to learn things so I don't worry
                    much about
                    > >> > the rights to individual images. Never---and I mean NEVER ask a
                    > >> > librarian if it is OK to copy something. They often feel
                    obliged to
                    > >> > act as the agents of the copyright holders, which they are
                    not. All
                    > >> > you want to do is use the images to teach kids so don't fret
                    about
                    > >> > it. <<<
                    > >> >    
                    > >> >   I have gone into Kinko's (FedEx/Kinko's) and needed a color
                    copy made
                    > >> (needed
                    > > something special done to it so could not do it myself on the
                    color
                    > > copier,etc....)  but
                    > > they have refused me in the past or wanted a note for the school
                    I teach for.
                    > >> >    
                    > >> >   Haven't Kinko's in the past been sued for copyright
                    violations?  Are the
                    > >> librarians
                    > > afraid of that too?  Should they be??
                    > >> >    
                    > >> >   Rivka
                    > >> >
                    > >> >  
                    > >> > ---------------------------------
                    > >> > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com.  Check it out.
                    > >> >
                    > >
                    > >  
                    > >
                    >

                     
                        

                  • Anne Rose-Phillips
                    Regarding Kinko s (I used to work there years ago beofre they went corporate & at that time they had recently survived losing a big lawsuit from textbook
                    Message 9 of 10 , Oct 3, 2006
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                      Regarding Kinko's (I used to work there years ago beofre they went
                      corporate & at that time they had recently survived losing a big
                      lawsuit from textbook companies, so that sent them down a very strict
                      copyright path...) but it sounds extreme now.

                      My best suggestion is to use the do-it-yourself (self-serve) machines
                      & then the employees don't have to pay attention to what you are
                      doing. Don't know if that would still work, but it's probably worth a
                      try if there aren't other printing alternatives.

                      Anne in Oregon
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