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PHANTOM 2 CONFIRMED

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  • owen brennan
    Just got confirmation that the Phantom is to be re-released,this time with colours more like the charger and it s to include the VPC2 system too.   Sizes will
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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      Just got confirmation that the Phantom is to be re-released,this time with colours more like the charger and it's to include the VPC2 system too.
       
      Sizes will be 6,8,10,13,16,20 & possibly a 30Meter low wind monster.
       
      You can look forward to it being released close to XMAS  

    • jaroskiter
      April 1?
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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        April 1?
        :)

        --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, owen brennan <owenbreflickr@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Just got confirmation that the Phantom is to be re-released,this time with colours more like the charger and it's to include the VPC2 system too.
        >  
        > Sizes will be 6,8,10,13,16,20 & possibly a 30Meter low wind monster.
        >  
        > You can look forward to it being released close to XMAS  
        >
      • Andre Krause
        got me ;-)
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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          got me ;-)

          owen brennan wrote:
          >
          >
          > Just got confirmation that the Phantom is to be re-released,this
          > time with colours more like the charger and it's to include the VPC2
          > system too.
          >
          > Sizes will be 6,8,10,13,16,20 & possibly a 30Meter low wind monster.
          >
          > You can look forward to it being released close to XMAS
          >
          >
          >
        • surfwrecker
          ... Come on, I just ordered one directly from VO for those super light days! Would fit in my quiver to replace the 24 m Charger!
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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            > April 1?

            Come on, I just ordered one directly from VO for those super light days! Would fit in my quiver to replace the 24 m Charger!
          • ced
            Yep, got a 1 inch scar on my right tricep from a a board flying back at me in the early days... and that is because I had the reflex to lift my arms before
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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              Yep, got a 1 inch scar on my right tricep from a a board flying back at me in the early days... and that is because I had the reflex to lift my arms before impact, otherwise it would have got me in the teeth....
              No joke this leash thing!

              Body drag body drag body drag!

              And kite where there are people who can retrieve your board if you get in trouble. Unless you are surrounded by idiots, which is unfortunately quite common in our sport...

              ced
              --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Chinatown" <gunnar@...> wrote:
              >
              > We have had two bad injuries from the Reel Leash, both times the Clip ripped out of the Loop on the board and hit the rider.
              >
              > I also remember a guy who got the whole leash wrapped around his lines.
              >
              > Any leash is a bad idea.
              >
              > --
              > Gunnar
              >
              >
              > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, tim grossnickle <tog0713@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Gideon,
              > >
              > > Agree with you that surfboard style board leashes attached to ankles dangerous with kiteboards. However, reel leashes attached to a harness can't snap back. I've broken the reel spring on one under an extreme load, but they never snapped back. In cold water in dark waves on Lake Michigan guys without leaches lose boards with some regularity. Even though I can body drag upwind, a reel leash saves me time in the cold water looking for my board. Plus when you lose a board it takes time and energy to body drag back to find it. With a leash your back and going in seconds. I've used a reel leash for years and have never lost a board of had one snap back close to my body...
              > >
              > > Regards,
              > > Tim
              > >
              >
            • Mark Hoeppner
              Yes Gideon,No Leash, So working on tactics for keeping board in long run:Leashes are crutches,Pre 1970,No leashes on surfers.Sure we lost our boards but we
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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                Yes Gideon,No Leash, So working on tactics for keeping board in long run:Leashes are crutches,Pre 1970,No leashes on surfers.Sure we lost our boards but we surfed way more carefully especially the bigger the gamble.Like a big day at Sunset or Hanalei which could mean a half mile of swimming!But a good clean up set could mean  you might be only one in line up if you saw it coming first.That was the bonus:your pick of the next set at world class spot!      Defense:1.Get better and while getting better just play conservatively(Saw guy yesterday doing 30 foot airs thinking he is good:Wrong!He next does one and wipes out and just barely misses shore rocks,then he spends long time trying to get board and kite is just missing trees and board is getting farther away,i run into water get his board and carefully walk risking my feet without booties to get board to him,Seems stupid doing 30 foot airs in 0-3 feet of water over infectious coral and rocks.yet there are long experienced guys 30-70 years old doing such.About as smart as doing cartwheels down center of highway.What is good rule of airs:No higher than depth of water and at least 30 feet from rocks??   2.Body drag carefully3.Spray board Neon colors 4.Put Name and phone numbers on with Large Magic markers       In general most people are honest and if given a chance want to return your stuff and if it looks hideous even if they are not honest or dont care about others dont want to be seen with not so good looking stuff or obviously stolen goods.  There goes "Danger Mark"  Bright Orange spray spots on all his gear. .             ! 

                --- On Wed, 3/31/10, Gideon L <gideonlow@...> wrote:

                From: Gideon L <gideonlow@...>
                Subject: [arcusers] Board Leashes?
                To: arcusers@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Wednesday, March 31, 2010, 6:25 PM

                 
                Mark: Give it up, ditch the board leash. The physics are what they are, and you WILL get violently yanked by the kite and the board WILL come flying at you at mach 10. Remember to think defensively.

                I remember seeing the whole thing in slow-motion like a car accident--my brain had enough time to deduce the effects of that tug I just had on my ankle, I turned to look, estimated the board's velocity at "maiming speed", cursed my stubbornness, said my prayers, closed my eyes, and heard it whiz past my ear before yanking my ankle the other way.

                Fortunately, the board missed, but I never used a leash again.

                Cheers,

                Gideon


              • ced
                Hey Mark Yes name and phone number works. Have retrieved one board like that before. As for doing big airs in shallow water.... there are a few kiters on
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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                  Hey Mark

                  Yes name and phone number works. Have retrieved one board like that before.

                  As for doing big airs in shallow water.... there are a few kiters on crutches who could tell you about it... Even if we have all done them. But then try choose sandy bottom, not sharp coral!

                  In general you should stay away from shallow sharp infectious corals with a kite... But I'm sure I don't need to tell you that. Quick launch if it takes you time to get on the board, body drag to deeper water as quickly as possible holding board by one hand...

                  How's your repair going?

                  Ced

                  --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, Mark Hoeppner <mark_hoeppner@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Yes Gideon,No Leash, So working on tactics for keeping board in long run:Leashes are crutches,Pre 1970,No leashes on surfers.Sure we lost our boards but we surfed way more carefully especially the bigger the gamble.Like a big day at Sunset or Hanalei which could mean a half mile of swimming!But a good clean up set could mean  you might be only one in line up if you saw it coming first.That was the bonus:your pick of the next set at world class spot!      Defense:1.Get better and while getting better just play conservatively(Saw guy yesterday doing 30 foot airs thinking he is good:Wrong!He next does one and wipes out and just barely misses shore rocks,then he spends long time trying to get board and kite is just missing trees and board is getting farther away,i run into water get his board and carefully walk risking my feet without booties to get board to him,Seems stupid doing 30 foot airs in 0-3 feet of water over infectious coral and rocks.yet
                  > there are long experienced guys 30-70 years old doing such.About as smart as doing cartwheels down center of highway.What is good rule of airs:No higher than depth of water and at least 30 feet from rocks??   2.Body drag carefully3.Spray board Neon colors 4.Put Name and phone numbers on with Large Magic markers       In general most people are honest and if given a chance want to return your stuff and if it looks hideous even if they are not honest or dont care about others dont want to be seen with not so good looking stuff or obviously stolen goods.  There goes "Danger Mark"  Bright Orange spray spots on all his gear. .             ! 
                  >
                  > --- On Wed, 3/31/10, Gideon L <gideonlow@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > From: Gideon L <gideonlow@...>
                  > Subject: [arcusers] Board Leashes?
                  > To: arcusers@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Wednesday, March 31, 2010, 6:25 PM
                  >
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Mark: Give it up, ditch the board leash. The physics are what they are, and you WILL get violently yanked by the kite and the board WILL come flying at you at mach 10. Remember to think defensively.
                  >
                  > I remember seeing the whole thing in slow-motion like a car accident--my brain had enough time to deduce the effects of that tug I just had on my ankle, I turned to look, estimated the board's velocity at "maiming speed", cursed my stubbornness, said my prayers, closed my eyes, and heard it whiz past my ear before yanking my ankle the other way.
                  >
                  > Fortunately, the board missed, but I never used a leash again.
                  >
                  > Cheers,
                  >
                  > Gideon
                  >
                • tim grossnickle
                  In big waves, in extreme conditions or on a directional board I can see the argument for no board leashes. I think the utility of a board leash depends on
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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                    In big waves, in extreme conditions or on a directional board I can see the argument for no board leashes.  I think the utility of a board leash depends on where you ride and the conditions when you ride.  Have ridden kites since the beginning 12 years ago using surfboard style ankle leashes which I agree endanger the rider.  Good reel leashes on the other hand in normal kiting conditions meaning rollers up to 6 feet and mellow waves in bays and lakes work fine. If you are riding in open ocean with overhead waves,  I agree with the experts and wouldn't use one. On the other hand, in the Gulf of Mexico including all of Florida and Texas plus Lake Michigan reel leashes work fine except during hurricanes.  Swimming after a board in dark waves in 40F degree water in springtime on Lake Michigan I found to be no fun.  And so Gideon, Gunnar, CED et al,  we'll have to agree to disagree.   Its said,  "There are horses for courses." and there are conditions where reel leashes attached to a harness work fine and save you swimming after a board in cold cold water and maybe not finding it...

                    Regards,
                    Tim 



                  • Chinatown
                    Sorry Tim, but you are wrong on this. I cannot accept that a leash is Safe in any conditions. I have been witness (also involved) in too many board leash
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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                      Sorry Tim, but you are wrong on this. I cannot accept that a leash is Safe in any conditions. I have been witness (also involved) in too many board leash accidents to let anyone tell a beginner that a leash is OK to use.

                      Too many people are still using them, instead of learning to body-drag upwind properly. It's just plain laziness or lack of confidence. either way it's asking for trouble.

                      --
                      Gunnar


                      --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, tim grossnickle <tog0713@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > In big waves, in extreme conditions or on a directional board I can see the argument for no board leashes. I think the utility of a board leash depends on where you ride and the conditions when you ride. Have ridden kites since the beginning 12 years ago using surfboard style ankle leashes which I agree endanger the rider. Good reel leashes on the other hand in normal kiting conditions meaning rollers up to 6 feet and mellow waves in bays and lakes work fine. If you are riding in open ocean with overhead waves, I agree with the experts and wouldn't use one. On the other hand, in the Gulf of Mexico including all of Florida and Texas plus Lake Michigan reel leashes work fine except during hurricanes. Swimming after a board in dark waves in 40F degree water in springtime on Lake Michigan I found to be no fun. And so Gideon, Gunnar, CED et al, we'll have to agree to disagree. Its said, "There are horses for courses." and there are conditions where
                      > reel leashes attached to a harness work fine and save you swimming after a board in cold cold water and maybe not finding it...
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      > Tim
                      >
                    • kevininyasu
                      That s interesting, Mark ... so surfers get smacked in the head etc or do they just not generate the yank of a kiter? Had another good day at Pranburi
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 1, 2010
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                        That's interesting, Mark ... so surfers get smacked in the head etc or do they just not generate the yank of a kiter?

                        Had another good day at Pranburi yesterday, this time on a Nobile NTX or something ... had bright red fins which made it easier to spot when I went flying. Might try painting the fins on my other boards ...

                        This thread at kiteforum.com is getting interesting ...
                        http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2363475&start=20
                      • Mark Hoeppner
                        Hi Kevin,Gonna paint my fins with Neon Orange.Guys were packing up at dark the other night.Two kites that had Neon Orange really caught your eye.Street cones
                        Message 11 of 19 , Apr 2, 2010
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                          Hi Kevin,Gonna paint my fins with Neon Orange.Guys were packing up at dark the other night.Two kites that had Neon Orange really caught your eye.Street cones etc.:Neon Orange           Leashes on surfboards are way safer in general than kitesurfing l.One,they help prevent loose boards going thru crowds,Two,In general surfers when they wipeout slow way down versus kite can accellerate you  Three,the surfer generally goes directly into water and usually board cant hit him- except when coming up. Four ,on mean  waves"rag dolling" you and holding you down you can grab leash at ankle and follow  to surface, to get that much wanted air..  Knowing surfers are carefull when we surface when we coud get hit from springback ,either we followed up leash ,we hold up hand first,wait for pull on ankle to settle down and even put hand on back of head and look out to see as usually board was pulled toward beach  and springbacks out.  In surfing in general leashes are safer than not and they advance the fun of trying rad maneuvers and not have to swim.                 If you really want to find out if leash is safe in kite boarding in severe conditions try wakesurfing at 15 knots andjump off board and hang on to ski rope for minute. If you are not on way to hospital then maybe its ok???!!!!           I am  painting  boards with some Neon Orange and forgeting the leash.Also enough equipment on me now dont need leash tangled around too!And saw guy fussing when that reel thing got locked up.    Kitesurfing and surfing are similar but NOT exactly same.    Hey ,i got to give advice instead of beg for it.   Beginner Mark on Kauai  Fri, 4/2/10, kevininyasu <kevininyasu@...> wrote:

                          From: kevininyasu <kevininyasu@...>
                          Subject: [arcusers] Re: Board Leashes?
                          To: arcusers@yahoogroups.com
                          Date: Friday, April 2, 2010, 2:29 AM

                           
                          That's interesting, Mark ... so surfers get smacked in the head etc or do they just not generate the yank of a kiter?

                          Had another good day at Pranburi yesterday, this time on a Nobile NTX or something ... had bright red fins which made it easier to spot when I went flying. Might try painting the fins on my other boards ...

                          This thread at kiteforum.com is getting interesting ...
                          http://www.kiteforu m.com/viewtopic. php?f=1&t= 2363475&start= 20


                        • ssameer wind
                          the phantom was the coolest looking kite EVER. to re-release it with the insanely boring and unoriginal charger colors/design is such disrespect to the
                          Message 12 of 19 , Apr 3, 2010
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                            the phantom was the coolest looking kite EVER. to re-release it with the insanely boring and unoriginal charger colors/design is such disrespect to the original phantom.

                            as an artist/designer and lover of PLK kites, please, i beg you, keep a simple design, make it look aggressive and recognizable from a distance, like the old phantom (go back to the size/color thing), and don't make a cheesy abstract design. keep the big bold colors.


                          • rcolborne@hotmail.com
                            I full agree, the Charger colors are pretty lame and the Phantom is a true classic.
                            Message 13 of 19 , Apr 4, 2010
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                              I full agree, the Charger colors are pretty lame and the Phantom is a true classic.
                            • Andre Krause
                              besides the design debate: what do you think: will the new phantom II also have a much improved low end? and if so, could that mean that due to the higher
                              Message 14 of 19 , Apr 4, 2010
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                                besides the design debate:

                                what do you think: will the new phantom II also have a much improved low end?
                                and if so, could that mean that due to the higher aspect ratio and thinner
                                profile the phantom2 in 19sqm will be the new true lightwind arc ? what about a
                                lighter "deluxe" fabric, this time ?
                                i am currently selling my 13 sqm scorpion, leaving me with a 7 scorp, 10 synergy
                                and 16 scorp. a 19 phantom2 would be awesome for low end power...
                                what are your predictions.. available already in the summer? or rather at the
                                end of this year ?


                                regarding design: my opinion: i would happily go without any design, if this
                                would make the kite lighter, more precise and more robust. and i think that
                                would be the case: you would need less thread and less fabric panels that needs
                                to be glued.. so - why not make a completely single-coloured (white? black?) kite ?


                                rcolborne@... wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > *I full agree, the Charger colors are pretty lame and the Phantom is a
                                > true classic.*
                                >
                              • surfwrecker
                                Hey Andre, I really like your ideas about the PL P II. Would suggest PL to release the option of a Deluxe-version - you could choose the design and fabric you
                                Message 15 of 19 , Apr 4, 2010
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                                  Hey Andre,

                                  I really like your ideas about the PL P II. Would suggest PL to release the option of a Deluxe-version - you could choose the design and fabric you like. (No more discussion about the design and stuff! Can't wait to get mine: The PL P II 19m with this fancy ultra light fabric in gold and silver. Hmmm...)

                                  Cheers

                                  Kai
                                • surfwrecker
                                  P.S.: I heard rumors spreading about a helium-based version of the PL P II. Much better low-end as the kite won t fall out of the sky during lulls. In addition
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Apr 4, 2010
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                                    P.S.: I heard rumors spreading about a helium-based version of the PL P II. Much better low-end as the kite won't fall out of the sky during lulls. In addition the float is epic! I sooo want one!
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