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Re: Why no other team riders on here?

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  • Gideon Low
    Hey Gunnar, I hope you know that most of the grief you get isn t meant for you at all, but rather for VO s management. We on ArcUsers are also a pretty
    Message 1 of 7 , Dec 1, 2007
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      Hey Gunnar,

      I hope you know that most of the "grief" you get isn't meant for you
      at all, but rather for VO's management. We on ArcUsers are also a
      pretty technical bunch and love to dissect questions and possibilities
      more than most. I also hope that you sometimes forward our comments
      made in times of frustration up the chain-of-command so they have some
      hope of making an impact. We know VO's management limits what you can
      say, but an occasional "I hear you, I'll pass it on" reply would take
      all of the heat off of you.

      I've played your role in the global Java development community for my
      company, GemStone Systems, and I have to admit that (despite having a
      very thick skin) I gave up partly because of all the BS--Google me and
      you can find some of it. In my case I made a calculated choice that
      the company's strategies for advancing our products weren't really
      suited to the typical public forum discussion (Our deal sizes are in
      the millions of $$$). In the case of PL/VO and a market of individual
      buyers, however, I think more public participation would make a big
      impact on the bottom line.

      Please understand that at the end of the day, many of the outspoken
      folks on this group do more to promote the brand than (as far as we
      can tell) some of the team riders do. Not knocking the team riders,
      just making the point that we are dedicated enthusiasts who sometimes
      aren't feeling the love come back our way.

      BTW, Stefan Cook participates in the forum and is listed as a team
      rider.

      Cheers,

      Gideon

      PS - One reason team riders should be participating more is to promote
      themselves as well as the products they represent. A few months of
      posting on Java forums got my name out more than I ever expected . . .
      getting quoted by folks like Amazon's CTO (that was out-of-the-blue!),
      and getting several unsolicited job offers. For this, you're
      definitely the smartest player on the PL Team. Respect for putting
      yourself out there, many others don't have the courage.

      --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Gunnar Biniasch" <gunnar@...> wrote:
      >
      > 1) I think it has to do with the grief they would be subjected to.
      >
      > 2) Also most of them will never be able to answer the questions put
      to them, as they are
      > not as involved as I am.
      >
      > 3) Some of them don't have internet 24/7
      >
      > 4) Some don't speak/understand english very well
      >
      >
      > --
      > Gunnar
      >
      > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Brent Helmstaedt" <brenth@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Hey Gunnar,
      > >
      > > Really glad you contribute here as its a huge step up from years past.
      > > So thanks, as you take some grief from time to time, and your the
      > > only one answering.
      > >
      > > Why is that?
      > >
      > > There are a whole slew of PL sponsored riders now and how come none of
      > > em show their "face" round here?
      > >
      > > Should be an obligation of some sort.
      > >
      > > I dont even fly em any more, but still spread the PL love.
      > >
      > > Cheers
      > >
      >
    • Wollo
      Well said Gideon. Exactly how I feel. ... past. ... none of
      Message 2 of 7 , Dec 1, 2007
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        Well said Gideon. Exactly how I feel.

        --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Gideon Low" <gideonlow@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hey Gunnar,
        >
        > I hope you know that most of the "grief" you get isn't meant for you
        > at all, but rather for VO's management. We on ArcUsers are also a
        > pretty technical bunch and love to dissect questions and possibilities
        > more than most. I also hope that you sometimes forward our comments
        > made in times of frustration up the chain-of-command so they have some
        > hope of making an impact. We know VO's management limits what you can
        > say, but an occasional "I hear you, I'll pass it on" reply would take
        > all of the heat off of you.
        >
        > I've played your role in the global Java development community for my
        > company, GemStone Systems, and I have to admit that (despite having a
        > very thick skin) I gave up partly because of all the BS--Google me and
        > you can find some of it. In my case I made a calculated choice that
        > the company's strategies for advancing our products weren't really
        > suited to the typical public forum discussion (Our deal sizes are in
        > the millions of $$$). In the case of PL/VO and a market of individual
        > buyers, however, I think more public participation would make a big
        > impact on the bottom line.
        >
        > Please understand that at the end of the day, many of the outspoken
        > folks on this group do more to promote the brand than (as far as we
        > can tell) some of the team riders do. Not knocking the team riders,
        > just making the point that we are dedicated enthusiasts who sometimes
        > aren't feeling the love come back our way.
        >
        > BTW, Stefan Cook participates in the forum and is listed as a team
        > rider.
        >
        > Cheers,
        >
        > Gideon
        >
        > PS - One reason team riders should be participating more is to promote
        > themselves as well as the products they represent. A few months of
        > posting on Java forums got my name out more than I ever expected . . .
        > getting quoted by folks like Amazon's CTO (that was out-of-the-blue!),
        > and getting several unsolicited job offers. For this, you're
        > definitely the smartest player on the PL Team. Respect for putting
        > yourself out there, many others don't have the courage.
        >
        > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Gunnar Biniasch" <gunnar@> wrote:
        > >
        > > 1) I think it has to do with the grief they would be subjected to.
        > >
        > > 2) Also most of them will never be able to answer the questions put
        > to them, as they are
        > > not as involved as I am.
        > >
        > > 3) Some of them don't have internet 24/7
        > >
        > > 4) Some don't speak/understand english very well
        > >
        > >
        > > --
        > > Gunnar
        > >
        > > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Brent Helmstaedt" <brenth@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Hey Gunnar,
        > > >
        > > > Really glad you contribute here as its a huge step up from years
        past.
        > > > So thanks, as you take some grief from time to time, and your the
        > > > only one answering.
        > > >
        > > > Why is that?
        > > >
        > > > There are a whole slew of PL sponsored riders now and how come
        none of
        > > > em show their "face" round here?
        > > >
        > > > Should be an obligation of some sort.
        > > >
        > > > I dont even fly em any more, but still spread the PL love.
        > > >
        > > > Cheers
        > > >
        > >
        >
      • mrfloat05
        ditto ... you ... possibilities ... comments ... some ... can ... take ... my ... having a ... and ... that ... in ... individual ... riders, ... sometimes ...
        Message 3 of 7 , Dec 1, 2007
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          ditto

          --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Gideon Low" <gideonlow@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hey Gunnar,
          >
          > I hope you know that most of the "grief" you get isn't meant for
          you
          > at all, but rather for VO's management. We on ArcUsers are also a
          > pretty technical bunch and love to dissect questions and
          possibilities
          > more than most. I also hope that you sometimes forward our
          comments
          > made in times of frustration up the chain-of-command so they have
          some
          > hope of making an impact. We know VO's management limits what you
          can
          > say, but an occasional "I hear you, I'll pass it on" reply would
          take
          > all of the heat off of you.
          >
          > I've played your role in the global Java development community for
          my
          > company, GemStone Systems, and I have to admit that (despite
          having a
          > very thick skin) I gave up partly because of all the BS--Google me
          and
          > you can find some of it. In my case I made a calculated choice
          that
          > the company's strategies for advancing our products weren't really
          > suited to the typical public forum discussion (Our deal sizes are
          in
          > the millions of $$$). In the case of PL/VO and a market of
          individual
          > buyers, however, I think more public participation would make a big
          > impact on the bottom line.
          >
          > Please understand that at the end of the day, many of the outspoken
          > folks on this group do more to promote the brand than (as far as we
          > can tell) some of the team riders do. Not knocking the team
          riders,
          > just making the point that we are dedicated enthusiasts who
          sometimes
          > aren't feeling the love come back our way.
          >
          > BTW, Stefan Cook participates in the forum and is listed as a team
          > rider.
          >
          > Cheers,
          >
          > Gideon
          >
          > PS - One reason team riders should be participating more is to
          promote
          > themselves as well as the products they represent. A few months of
          > posting on Java forums got my name out more than I ever
          expected . . .
          > getting quoted by folks like Amazon's CTO (that was out-of-the-
          blue!),
          > and getting several unsolicited job offers. For this, you're
          > definitely the smartest player on the PL Team. Respect for putting
          > yourself out there, many others don't have the courage.
          >
          > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Gunnar Biniasch" <gunnar@> wrote:
          > >
          > > 1) I think it has to do with the grief they would be subjected
          to.
          > >
          > > 2) Also most of them will never be able to answer the questions
          put
          > to them, as they are
          > > not as involved as I am.
          > >
          > > 3) Some of them don't have internet 24/7
          > >
          > > 4) Some don't speak/understand english very well
          > >
          > >
          > > --
          > > Gunnar
          > >
          > > --- In arcusers@yahoogroups.com, "Brent Helmstaedt" <brenth@>
          wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Hey Gunnar,
          > > >
          > > > Really glad you contribute here as its a huge step up from
          years past.
          > > > So thanks, as you take some grief from time to time, and your
          the
          > > > only one answering.
          > > >
          > > > Why is that?
          > > >
          > > > There are a whole slew of PL sponsored riders now and how come
          none of
          > > > em show their "face" round here?
          > > >
          > > > Should be an obligation of some sort.
          > > >
          > > > I dont even fly em any more, but still spread the PL love.
          > > >
          > > > Cheers
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • tim grossnickle
          Gideon, Certainly appreciated your comments on Team Riders. Thanks much, Tim ... Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. [Non-text portions of this
          Message 4 of 7 , Dec 1, 2007
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            Gideon,

            Certainly appreciated your comments on Team Riders.

            Thanks much,
            Tim




            ---------------------------------
            Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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