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Re: Delayed digipeats

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  • asbjorn.hauge
    ... I checked and reconfigured the TNC, but didn t solve any problems. Slottime set to 0 (was 300ms) Persist set to 0 (just to be sure. It was 63) PPersist set
    Message 1 of 14 , Mar 18, 2013
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      --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:

      > 3 to 15 seconds seems awfully long for slottime and persist.
      >
      > If persist were set very low, then the odds of it being hit are pretty
      > slim, and if slottime were very high you could wait a long time
      > between random checks.... I suppose it is possible.

      I checked and reconfigured the TNC, but didn't solve any problems.
      Slottime set to 0 (was 300ms)
      Persist set to 0 (just to be sure. It was 63)
      PPersist set to off
      DWait set to 0
      Ackprior is off (not sure if it matters)

      I installed a serial port sniffer to see what and when data was sent and received. APRSIS32 responds quickly and the packet is verified sent over RS232 about 600ms after it was received. So, the problem lies within the TNC.

      Does anyone have a known working init script for PK-232? Seems like mine is not quite perfect, but it's adopted from UI-View which doesn't have this problem.

      --
      Asbjoern
      LA1HSA
    • Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
      ... UI-View may send some additional timing parameters in the KISS protocol during port initialization. APRSISCE/32 assumes these have all been done by
      Message 2 of 14 , Mar 18, 2013
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        On 3/18/2013 6:09 PM, asbjorn.hauge wrote:
        > Does anyone have a known working init script for PK-232? Seems like mine is not quite perfect, but it's adopted from UI-View which doesn't have this problem.

        UI-View may send some additional timing parameters in the KISS protocol
        during port initialization. APRSISCE/32 assumes these have all been
        done by configuration commands and not via the KISS set commands.

        Does anyone know this detail about UI-View? Or can someone capture the
        actual KISS packets from an RS-232 sniffer during both UI-View and
        APRSISCE/32 KISS port startup? The packets of interest would be the
        first set of packets wrapped in <C0>...<C0> KISS delimiters, not the
        ASCII port commands just prior to commanding KISS mode to start.

        Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
      • asbjorn.hauge
        ... Thank you for the response, Lynn. I can t see any other controls before it enters KISS-mode, at least not in my captures. ... I have made captures from
        Message 3 of 14 , Mar 18, 2013
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          --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...> wrote:
          >
          > On 3/18/2013 6:09 PM, asbjorn.hauge wrote:
          > > Does anyone have a known working init script for PK-232? Seems like mine is not quite perfect, but it's adopted from UI-View which doesn't have this problem.
          >
          > UI-View may send some additional timing parameters in the KISS protocol
          > during port initialization. APRSISCE/32 assumes these have all been
          > done by configuration commands and not via the KISS set commands.

          Thank you for the response, Lynn.

          I can't see any other controls before it enters KISS-mode, at least not in my captures.

          > Does anyone know this detail about UI-View? Or can someone capture the
          > actual KISS packets from an RS-232 sniffer during both UI-View and
          > APRSISCE/32 KISS port startup? The packets of interest would be the
          > first set of packets wrapped in <C0>...<C0> KISS delimiters, not the
          > ASCII port commands just prior to commanding KISS mode to start.

          I have made captures from both UI-VIew and APRSISCE/32. Capture is running while I start the program and all inits are done. The result would be cluttered in a post here, so I'm posting links to both text files (hope those links are allowed here).

          UI-View init: http://la1hsa.com/digi/UI-View_init.txt
          APRSISCE/32 init: http://la1hsa.com/digi/APRSIS32_init.txt

          There are some overhead in those files, but removing the header would mess up the formatting.
          From what I see in the APRSISCE/32-file, I have a constant data flow, but that is "control parameters" and warnings from the capture program. The logs should be colour-coded to show TX/RX (and they are here). If you want, I can post them in RTF to make you able to see the difference.

          If there is any other way you want me to capture data, just tell me and I'll do my best.


          --
          Asbjoern
          LA1HSA
        • James Ewen
          On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 4:09 PM, asbjorn.hauge wrote: Do you have a user manual for your TNC? I only have the KPC-3 manual which
          Message 4 of 14 , Mar 18, 2013
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            On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 4:09 PM, asbjorn.hauge <asbjorn.hauge@...> wrote:

            Do you have a user manual for your TNC? I only have the KPC-3 manual
            which describes the settings as it pertains to that device, but they
            should be similar.

            > I checked and reconfigured the TNC, but didn't solve any problems.

            > Slottime set to 0 (was 300ms)

            Slottime sets how long the TNC should wait before checking to see if
            it should try to gain access to the channel.

            > Persist set to 0 (just to be sure. It was 63)

            Persist controls the "odds" of whether the channel should be checked or not.

            These two combined determine when to try sending a packet. The unit
            waits the desired slottime, then the unit picks a random number
            between 0 and 255. If that random number is less than persist, the
            radio keys up, otherwise it goes back to the top waiting for slottime
            to expire. With persist set at 0, it's pretty hard to get a random
            number less than zero.


            > PPersist set to off
            > DWait set to 0

            Dwait is the other way to hold off... check that manual.

            > Ackprior is off (not sure if it matters)

            Dunno...
            --
            James
            VE6SRV
          • Rob Giuliano
            I was reading somewhere that there is an implementation where the use is reversed. That was what prompted the thought. Robert Giuliano KB8RCO ... From: James
            Message 5 of 14 , Mar 18, 2013
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              I was reading somewhere that there is an implementation where the use is reversed.
              That was what prompted the thought.
               
              Robert Giuliano
              KB8RCO


              ---------------------------------------------
              From: James Ewen <ve6srv@...>
              To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Monday, March 18, 2013 5:12 PM
              Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Re: Delayed digipeats
               
              On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 8:52 AM, asbjorn.hauge <mailto:asbjorn.hauge%40yahoo.no> wrote:

              > --- In mailto:aprsisce%40yahoogroups.com, Rob Giuliano <kb8rco@...> wrote:
              >>
              >> Are you sure this is not related to your "SlotTime" and "Persist" settings?
              >
              > That may just be the answer! I will check that when I get home.

              3 to 15 seconds seems awfully long for slottime and persist.

              If persist were set very low, then the odds of it being hit are pretty
              slim, and if slottime were very high you could wait a long time
              between random checks.... I suppose it is possible.

              --
              James
              VE6SRV
            • asbjorn.hauge
              ... Yes I have the manual. I ve checked out every parameter and tried out settings for everything that is related to KISS-mode. It works, but it s slow. Just
              Message 6 of 14 , Mar 21, 2013
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                --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:

                > Do you have a user manual for your TNC? I only have the KPC-3 manual
                > which describes the settings as it pertains to that device, but they
                > should be similar.

                Yes I have the manual. I've checked out every parameter and tried out settings for everything that is related to KISS-mode. It works, but it's slow.

                Just to try out other possibilities: I have configured my TinyTrak4 to work in KISS, hooked it up and set APRSISCE/32 to use that one. It all works fairly well and all received packets are transferred to the software blazing fast (running 57600 baud). I still have a fair bit of delay using this setup (never less than three seconds from a free channel), while the same TNC config in UI-View is super-snappy (instant digipeat if channel is clear).

                From the logs I posted earlier, I see that APRSISCE/32 adds some strange traffic to the RS232-port and logs sent strings as mostly HEX data. Could it be the way the program sends data or handles the COM-port? I will try running it on another computer and different serial port just for comparison.

                --
                Asbjoern
                LA1HSA
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