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RE: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me (Messages?)

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  • Robert Bruninga
    I may not be following this correctly, but the Mic-E message bits are a misnomer. Just because a Mic-E has set his message bits to something does not mean
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 3, 2013
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      I may not be following this correctly, but the Mic-E "message" bits are a
      misnomer. Just because a Mic-E has set his "message bits" to something
      does not mean it is a "message".

      Never was intended that way. The one 10 byte word that is encoded by
      those bits was intended to fill a 10 byte window in the "STATUS" display
      of that station.

      And of course "STATUS" for a Mic-E is also a misnomer since it refers
      actually to the POSITION COMMENT field.

      This confusion resulted from Kenwood's (and mine) attempt at naming the
      outputs of the Mic-E format over 14 years ago.
      The proper handing of a Mic-E to be compatible with the fundamental APRS
      prot0ocol should be something like this:

      1) The 3 bit decodes into a "STATUS" packet. I woiuld expand it maybe as
      "STATUS: returning"
      2) The "STATUS" of the Mic-E is placed where a POSITION TEXT would go
      3) If the 3 bits imply EMERGENCY, then do something special, like sound an
      alarm and zoom the map to that location.

      But in no way were the "message" bits ever intended to be a message.
      Hope that helps? (I have not been following this thread).

      Bob, WB4aPR

      -----Original Message-----
      From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
      Of kf4lvz
      Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 11:53 PM
      To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me but not really?

      --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...>
      wrote:
      >
      > It's a message addressed to everyone by the definition of Mic-E status.

      > Since you are one particular part of "everyone", and in order to be
      > able to quickly respond to their request to be noticed, the message is
      > formatted as it is.
      >
      > See also http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt

      I'm used to Emergency, wasn't used to anything else.

      >
      > PS. When you click on the green pending message pane, you can just
      > hit Escape to clear the message that is brought up. Click - Escape -
      > Click
      > - Escape and I can clear 1000s of eavesdrops pretty quickly. You can
      > also use some of the Clear menu options to flush a bunch of eavesdrops
      > and/or ALL/CQ messages if you don't want to see any of them
      individually.

      Is there a way to jump to the middle of a list of messages? For example,
      if there's a pile of status messages then a message actually addressed to
      me and then another pile of status messages, how can I jump to the ones
      for me without a constant barrage of click-escapes?




      ------------------------------------

      Yahoo! Groups Links
    • Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
      You re right. You haven t been following the thread, but I don t think there s confusion between Mic-E status and APRS messages right now. Per your
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 3, 2013
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        You're right.  You haven't been following the thread, but I don't think there's confusion between Mic-E status and APRS messages right now.

        Per your http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt page, APRS client's are supposed to provide notifications when certain of the Mic-E (or !xxxx!) codes are observed.  Specifically:

         SPECIAL  - would CENTER the map on the symbol
         PRIORITY - would CENTER and ZOOM to 8 mile local range scale
         EMERGENCY- CENTER and ZOOM and ALARM beeps until cleared by operator.

        To provide an asynchronous notification that one of these codes has been observed, APRSISCE/32 generates an INTERNAL message appearing to come FROM the station transmitting the status and the TEXT of the message states which status was received.  For instance: 01-03 09:31:28 Mic-E:UE7JMP-7 Transmitted Status(Priority).  This allows quick access to send a message to the transmitting station confirming their intent and offering assistance if needed.

        I think we understand that the Mic-E statuses are not "messages" per se, but reception of those statuses may cause a message to be generated internal to APRSISCE/32 as part of the local notification process.

        See Configure / Mic-E Notifications for the ability to enable or disable actions to be taken on the various Mic-E (and extended) statuses.



        Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

        PS.  Configure / Beacon / Mic-E Notification is where you can configure APRSISCE/32 to include any of the !xxxxx! statuses in your own transmitted beacon.

        On 1/3/2013 10:12 AM, Robert Bruninga wrote:
        I may not be following this correctly, but the Mic-E "message" bits are a
        misnomer.  Just because a Mic-E has set his "message bits" to something
        does not mean it is a "message".
        
        Never was intended that way.  The one 10 byte word that is encoded by
        those bits was intended to fill a 10 byte window in the "STATUS" display
        of that station.
        
        And of course "STATUS" for a Mic-E is also a misnomer since it refers
        actually to the POSITION COMMENT field.
        
        This confusion resulted from Kenwood's (and mine) attempt at naming the
        outputs of the Mic-E format over 14 years ago.
        The proper handing of a Mic-E to be compatible with the fundamental APRS
        prot0ocol should be something like this:
        
        1) The 3 bit decodes into a "STATUS" packet.  I woiuld expand it maybe as
        "STATUS: returning"
        2) The "STATUS" of the Mic-E is placed where a POSITION TEXT would go
        3) If the 3 bits imply EMERGENCY, then do something special, like sound an
        alarm and zoom the map to that location.
        
        But in no way were the "message" bits ever intended to  be a message.
        Hope that helps? (I have not been following this thread).
        
        Bob, WB4aPR
        
        -----Original Message-----
        From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
        Of kf4lvz
        Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 11:53 PM
        To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me but not really?
        
        --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...>
        wrote:
        
        It's a message addressed to everyone by the definition of Mic-E status.
        
        Since you are one particular part of "everyone", and in order to be
        able to quickly respond to their request to be noticed, the message is
        formatted as it is.
        
        See also http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt
        
        I'm used to Emergency, wasn't used to anything else.
        
        
        PS.  When you click on the green pending message pane, you can just
        hit Escape to clear the message that is brought up.  Click - Escape -
        Click
        - Escape and I can clear 1000s of eavesdrops pretty quickly.  You can
        also use some of the Clear menu options to flush a bunch of eavesdrops
        and/or ALL/CQ messages if you don't want to see any of them
        
        individually.
        
        Is there a way to jump to the middle of a list of messages?  For example,
        if there's a pile of status messages then a message actually addressed to
        me and then another pile of status messages, how can I jump to the ones
        for me without a constant barrage of click-escapes?
        
        
        
        
        ------------------------------------
        
        Yahoo! Groups Links
        
        
        
        
        
        ------------------------------------
        
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      • Robert Bruninga
        Does it send these internal messages on every posit? That would seem to cause massive overload of repetitive data. Typically a SPECIAL station is special
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 3, 2013
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          Does it send these internal messages on every posit?  That would seem to cause massive overload of repetitive data.  Typically a SPECIAL station is special throughout the entire event or day’s trip…?

           

          Bob

           

           

          From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
          Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 10:52 AM
          To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me (Messages?)

           

          You're right.  You haven't been following the thread, but I don't think there's confusion between Mic-E status and APRS messages right now.

          Per your http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt page, APRS client's are supposed to provide notifications when certain of the Mic-E (or !xxxx!) codes are observed.  Specifically:


           SPECIAL  - would CENTER the map on the symbol
           PRIORITY - would CENTER and ZOOM to 8 mile local range scale
           EMERGENCY- CENTER and ZOOM and ALARM beeps until cleared by operator.


          To provide an asynchronous notification that one of these codes has been observed, APRSISCE/32 generates an INTERNAL message appearing to come FROM the station transmitting the status and the TEXT of the message states which status was received.  For instance: 01-03 09:31:28 Mic-E:UE7JMP-7 Transmitted Status(Priority).  This allows quick access to send a message to the transmitting station confirming their intent and offering assistance if needed.

          I think we understand that the Mic-E statuses are not "messages" per se, but reception of those statuses may cause a message to be generated internal to APRSISCE/32 as part of the local notification process.

          See Configure / Mic-E Notifications for the ability to enable or disable actions to be taken on the various Mic-E (and extended) statuses.



          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

          PS.  Configure / Beacon / Mic-E Notification is where you can configure APRSISCE/32 to include any of the !xxxxx! statuses in your own transmitted beacon.

          On 1/3/2013 10:12 AM, Robert Bruninga wrote:

          I may not be following this correctly, but the Mic-E "message" bits are a
          misnomer.  Just because a Mic-E has set his "message bits" to something
          does not mean it is a "message".
           
          Never was intended that way.  The one 10 byte word that is encoded by
          those bits was intended to fill a 10 byte window in the "STATUS" display
          of that station.
           
          And of course "STATUS" for a Mic-E is also a misnomer since it refers
          actually to the POSITION COMMENT field.
           
          This confusion resulted from Kenwood's (and mine) attempt at naming the
          outputs of the Mic-E format over 14 years ago.
          The proper handing of a Mic-E to be compatible with the fundamental APRS
          prot0ocol should be something like this:
           
          1) The 3 bit decodes into a "STATUS" packet.  I woiuld expand it maybe as
          "STATUS: returning"
          2) The "STATUS" of the Mic-E is placed where a POSITION TEXT would go
          3) If the 3 bits imply EMERGENCY, then do something special, like sound an
          alarm and zoom the map to that location.
           
          But in no way were the "message" bits ever intended to  be a message.
          Hope that helps? (I have not been following this thread).
           
          Bob, WB4aPR
           
          -----Original Message-----
          From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
          Of kf4lvz
          Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 11:53 PM
          To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me but not really?
           
          --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...>
          wrote:
           
          It's a message addressed to everyone by the definition of Mic-E status.
           
          Since you are one particular part of "everyone", and in order to be
          able to quickly respond to their request to be noticed, the message is
          formatted as it is.
           
          See also http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt
           
          I'm used to Emergency, wasn't used to anything else.
           
           
          PS.  When you click on the green pending message pane, you can just
          hit Escape to clear the message that is brought up.  Click - Escape -
          Click
          - Escape and I can clear 1000s of eavesdrops pretty quickly.  You can
          also use some of the Clear menu options to flush a bunch of eavesdrops
          and/or ALL/CQ messages if you don't want to see any of them
          individually.
           
          Is there a way to jump to the middle of a list of messages?  For example,
          if there's a pile of status messages then a message actually addressed to
          me and then another pile of status messages, how can I jump to the ones
          for me without a constant barrage of click-escapes?
           
           
           
           
          ------------------------------------
           
          Yahoo! Groups Links
           
           
           
           
           
          ------------------------------------
           
          Yahoo! Groups Links
           
          <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aprsisce/
           
          <*> Your email settings:
              Individual Email | Traditional
           
          <*> To change settings online go to:
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aprsisce/join
              (Yahoo! ID required)
           
          <*> To change settings via email:
              aprsisce-digest@yahoogroups.com 
              aprsisce-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
           
          <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              aprsisce-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
           
          <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
           
           

           

        • Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
          Only when the status transitions to one that is configured and enabled for notification. That would also include the FIRST time a station is heard. It will
          Message 4 of 5 , Jan 3, 2013
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            Only when the status transitions to one that is configured and enabled for notification.  That would also include the FIRST time a station is heard.  It will be repeated if the station goes inactive long enough to be forgotten and then becomes active again.

            It is also possible to disable the MultiTrack and/or Flash notifications on a per-station basis.

            Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

            On 1/3/2013 11:28 AM, Robert Bruninga wrote:

            Does it send these internal messages on every posit?  That would seem to cause massive overload of repetitive data.  Typically a SPECIAL station is special throughout the entire event or day’s trip…?

             

            Bob

             

             

            From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
            Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 10:52 AM
            To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me (Messages?)

             

            You're right.  You haven't been following the thread, but I don't think there's confusion between Mic-E status and APRS messages right now.

            Per your http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt page, APRS client's are supposed to provide notifications when certain of the Mic-E (or !xxxx!) codes are observed.  Specifically:


             SPECIAL  - would CENTER the map on the symbol
             PRIORITY - would CENTER and ZOOM to 8 mile local range scale
             EMERGENCY- CENTER and ZOOM and ALARM beeps until cleared by operator.


            To provide an asynchronous notification that one of these codes has been observed, APRSISCE/32 generates an INTERNAL message appearing to come FROM the station transmitting the status and the TEXT of the message states which status was received.  For instance: 01-03 09:31:28 Mic-E:UE7JMP-7 Transmitted Status(Priority).  This allows quick access to send a message to the transmitting station confirming their intent and offering assistance if needed.

            I think we understand that the Mic-E statuses are not "messages" per se, but reception of those statuses may cause a message to be generated internal to APRSISCE/32 as part of the local notification process.

            See Configure / Mic-E Notifications for the ability to enable or disable actions to be taken on the various Mic-E (and extended) statuses.



            Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

            PS.  Configure / Beacon / Mic-E Notification is where you can configure APRSISCE/32 to include any of the !xxxxx! statuses in your own transmitted beacon.

            On 1/3/2013 10:12 AM, Robert Bruninga wrote:

            I may not be following this correctly, but the Mic-E "message" bits are a
            misnomer.  Just because a Mic-E has set his "message bits" to something
            does not mean it is a "message".
             
            Never was intended that way.  The one 10 byte word that is encoded by
            those bits was intended to fill a 10 byte window in the "STATUS" display
            of that station.
             
            And of course "STATUS" for a Mic-E is also a misnomer since it refers
            actually to the POSITION COMMENT field.
             
            This confusion resulted from Kenwood's (and mine) attempt at naming the
            outputs of the Mic-E format over 14 years ago.
            The proper handing of a Mic-E to be compatible with the fundamental APRS
            prot0ocol should be something like this:
             
            1) The 3 bit decodes into a "STATUS" packet.  I woiuld expand it maybe as
            "STATUS: returning"
            2) The "STATUS" of the Mic-E is placed where a POSITION TEXT would go
            3) If the 3 bits imply EMERGENCY, then do something special, like sound an
            alarm and zoom the map to that location.
             
            But in no way were the "message" bits ever intended to  be a message.
            Hope that helps? (I have not been following this thread).
             
            Bob, WB4aPR
             
            -----Original Message-----
            From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
            Of kf4lvz
            Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 11:53 PM
            To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Messages to me but not really?
             
            --- In aprsisce@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...>
            wrote:
             
            It's a message addressed to everyone by the definition of Mic-E status.
             
            Since you are one particular part of "everyone", and in order to be
            able to quickly respond to their request to be noticed, the message is
            formatted as it is.
             
            See also http://aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt
             
            I'm used to Emergency, wasn't used to anything else.
             
             
            PS.  When you click on the green pending message pane, you can just
            hit Escape to clear the message that is brought up.  Click - Escape -
            Click
            - Escape and I can clear 1000s of eavesdrops pretty quickly.  You can
            also use some of the Clear menu options to flush a bunch of eavesdrops
            and/or ALL/CQ messages if you don't want to see any of them
            individually.
             
            Is there a way to jump to the middle of a list of messages?  For example,
            if there's a pile of status messages then a message actually addressed to
            me and then another pile of status messages, how can I jump to the ones
            for me without a constant barrage of click-escapes?
             
             
             
             
            ------------------------------------
             
            Yahoo! Groups Links
             
             
             
             
             
            ------------------------------------
             
            Yahoo! Groups Links
             
            <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aprsisce/
             
            <*> Your email settings:
                Individual Email | Traditional
             
            <*> To change settings online go to:
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aprsisce/join
                (Yahoo! ID required)
             
            <*> To change settings via email:
                aprsisce-digest@yahoogroups.com 
                aprsisce-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
             
            <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                aprsisce-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
             
            <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
                http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
             
             

             


          • James Ewen
            ... This is interesting... your emergency codes document does not indicate that the client application should only alert on the first receipt of an APRS
            Message 5 of 5 , Jan 3, 2013
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              On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 9:28 AM, Robert Bruninga <bruninga@...> wrote:

              > Does it send these internal messages on every posit? That would seem to
              > cause massive overload of repetitive data. Typically a SPECIAL station is
              > special throughout the entire event or day’s trip…?

              This is interesting... your emergency codes document does not indicate
              that the client application should only alert on the first receipt of
              an APRS status. Does this include alerting on EMERGENCY? If a station
              sets their mic-e status to EMERGENCY, should the receiving station
              alert once, and then ignore all further EMERGENCY alerts from that
              station?

              http://www.aprs.org/aprs12/EmergencyCode.txt

              The description of the various mic-e status settings describes
              special, priority, and emergency as causing specific actions, but not
              how often these should be acted upon.

              --
              James
              VE6SRV
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