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Re: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

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  • Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
    I believe I tried formatting an 2GB SD card one time with a smaller cluster size, but due to the FAT limitations, it needed to use the 32KB. You can see why
    Message 1 of 8 , Sep 2, 2011
      I believe I tried formatting an 2GB SD card one time with a smaller cluster size, but due to the FAT limitations, it needed to use the 32KB.

      You can see why I'm considering the container file for tiles, right?  Needed 167MB, using 868MB is a 4 TIMES waste of space!

      Anyone out there running OSMTiles on a thumb drive?  Does it do the same thing or is it better?

      Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

      On 9/2/2011 10:29 AM, Fred Hillhouse wrote:
      My desktop is 4K(HD) and my Tilt is 32K (uSD).
       
      Tilt (Original Tiles): 27660/167.07MB/868.66MB(*32) 6.16GB Free
       
      It looks like the average tile size is ~6KB. With the cluster size at 32K, the minimum is 32K for a 533% increase. Sweet!
       
      I haven't looked into it myself but can the uSD be formatted differently to shrink the cluster size?
       
      Apparently you just need a bigger uSD card, like an 8 or 16GB. ;)
       
       
      Best regards,
      Fred, N7FMH
       
       


      From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
      Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 08:05
      To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

      I've been going nuts trying to figure out why the OSM tiles are taking up so much disk space on my 2GB uSD card, so I added the cluster size to the OSM Map Tiles popup dialog (double-click an empty area of the map).  At the bottom you will now see the following stats for all configured Tile Sets:

      Name->Storage Directory
      TileCount/TotalSize/DiskSize(*Cluster) Space Free

      Name is your tile set name.
      Storage Directory is where that tile set is being stored (they better all be unique!)
      TileCount is the count of tiles found in that tree
      TotalSize is the necessary size of the tile files
      DiskSize is the on-disk allocation for the tile files
      Cluster is the disk's cluster size
      Space is the free space on that particular device

      My uSD card has a cluster size of 32KB and an average OSM tile file of 9.65K, no wonder the 77MB occupies 261MB of the card!  It's mostly cluster rounding waste.  (I was using >800MB of the card before I re-enabled the tile purger last night when my card completely filled up).

      My desktop is much nicer, but then it's not running an SD card.  The cluster size is only 4KB and 168MB only occupies 215MB on disk.

      If any of you WinMo users out there have read this far, double-click an empty space and let me know what your cluster size is.  I've got a ToDo item to (optionally) store the individual tiles in a container file of some sort to squeeze out the excess allocation space, but I need to know if it'll really be worth it.

      Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32



    • Greg Dolkas
      Hi Lynn, Confirmed. My 2 gb card is reporting a 32k cluster size, and I do believe it s a FAT limitation. Your desktop is probably using NTFS, which has a
      Message 2 of 8 , Sep 2, 2011
        Hi Lynn,

        Confirmed. My 2 gb card is reporting a 32k cluster size, and I do believe it's a FAT limitation. Your desktop is probably using NTFS, which has a different structure.

        Thumb drives are usually FAT formatted, so would have the same issue. That said, I also have an external hard drive, and it came with an HPFS file system, so it might depend on their capacity. A large enough thumb drive would probably be NTFS too.

        Greg.

        Sent from my trusty iPAQ.

        -----Original Message-----
        From: "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...>
        To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: 9/2/11 7:46 AM
        Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

        I believe I tried formatting an 2GB SD card one time with a smaller
        cluster size, but due to the FAT limitations, it needed to use the 32KB.

        You can see why I'm considering the container file for tiles, right?
        Needed 167MB, using 868MB is a 4 TIMES waste of space!

        Anyone out there running OSMTiles on a thumb drive? Does it do the same
        thing or is it better?

        Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

        On 9/2/2011 10:29 AM, Fred Hillhouse wrote:
        >
        >
        > My desktop is 4K(HD) and my Tilt is 32K (uSD).
        > Tilt (Original Tiles): 27660/167.07MB/868.66MB(*32) 6.16GB Free
        > It looks like the average tile size is ~6KB. With the cluster size at
        > 32K, the minimum is 32K for a 533% increase. Sweet!
        > I haven't looked into it myself but can the uSD be formatted
        > differently to shrink the cluster size?
        > Apparently you just need a bigger uSD card, like an 8 or 16GB. ;)
        > Best regards,
        > Fred, N7FMH
        >
        > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > *From:* aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] *On
        > Behalf Of *Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
        > *Sent:* Friday, September 02, 2011 08:05
        > *To:* aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
        > *Subject:* [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)
        >
        > I've been going nuts trying to figure out why the OSM tiles are taking
        > up so much disk space on my 2GB uSD card, so I added the cluster size
        > to the OSM Map Tiles popup dialog (double-click an empty area of the
        > map). At the bottom you will now see the following stats for all
        > configured Tile Sets:
        >
        > Name->Storage Directory
        > TileCount/TotalSize/DiskSize(*Cluster) Space Free
        >
        > Name is your tile set name.
        > Storage Directory is where that tile set is being stored (they better
        > all be unique!)
        > TileCount is the count of tiles found in that tree
        > TotalSize is the necessary size of the tile files
        > DiskSize is the on-disk allocation for the tile files
        > Cluster is the disk's cluster size
        > Space is the free space on t
      • Fred Hillhouse
        I started up a USB stick instance (N7FMH-US). The drive is a PNY 4GB FAT23 device. Best regards, Fred This is the screen capture: _____ From:
        Message 3 of 8 , Sep 2, 2011
          I started up a USB stick instance (N7FMH-US).
           
          The drive is a PNY 4GB FAT23 device.
           
          Best regards,
          Fred
           
          This is the screen capture:
           
           

          From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
          Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 10:47
          To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

           

          I believe I tried formatting an 2GB SD card one time with a smaller cluster size, but due to the FAT limitations, it needed to use the 32KB.

          You can see why I'm considering the container file for tiles, right?  Needed 167MB, using 868MB is a 4 TIMES waste of space!

          Anyone out there running OSMTiles on a thumb drive?  Does it do the same thing or is it better?

          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

          On 9/2/2011 10:29 AM, Fred Hillhouse wrote:
          My desktop is 4K(HD) and my Tilt is 32K (uSD).
           
          Tilt (Original Tiles): 27660/167.07MB/868.66MB(*32) 6.16GB Free
           
          It looks like the average tile size is ~6KB. With the cluster size at 32K, the minimum is 32K for a 533% increase. Sweet!
           
          I haven't looked into it myself but can the uSD be formatted differently to shrink the cluster size?
           
          Apparently you just need a bigger uSD card, like an 8 or 16GB. ;)
           
           
          Best regards,
          Fred, N7FMH
           
           


          From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
          Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 08:05
          To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

          I've been going nuts trying to figure out why the OSM tiles are taking up so much disk space on my 2GB uSD card, so I added the cluster size to the OSM Map Tiles popup dialog (double-click an empty area of the map).  At the bottom you will now see the following stats for all configured Tile Sets:

          Name->Storage Directory
          TileCount/TotalSize/DiskSize(*Cluster) Space Free

          Name is your tile set name.
          Storage Directory is where that tile set is being stored (they better all be unique!)
          TileCount is the count of tiles found in that tree
          TotalSize is the necessary size of the tile files
          DiskSize is the on-disk allocation for the tile files
          Cluster is the disk's cluster size
          Space is the free space on that particular device

          My uSD card has a cluster size of 32KB and an average OSM tile file of 9.65K, no wonder the 77MB occupies 261MB of the card!  It's mostly cluster rounding waste.  (I was using >800MB of the card before I re-enabled the tile purger last night when my card completely filled up).

          My desktop is much nicer, but then it's not running an SD card.  The cluster size is only 4KB and 168MB only occupies 215MB on disk.

          If any of you WinMo users out there have read this far, double-click an empty space and let me know what your cluster size is.  I've got a ToDo item to (optionally) store the individual tiles in a container file of some sort to squeeze out the excess allocation space, but I need to know if it'll really be worth it.

          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32



        • Fred Hillhouse
          Fat fingered the FAT32 into FAT23. :( _____ From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Fred Hillhouse Sent: Friday,
          Message 4 of 8 , Sep 2, 2011
            Fat fingered the FAT32 into FAT23. :(


            From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Fred Hillhouse
            Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 12:08
            To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

             

            I started up a USB stick instance (N7FMH-US).
             
            The drive is a PNY 4GB FAT23 device.
             
            Best regards,
            Fred
             
            This is the screen capture:
             
             

            From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
            Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 10:47
            To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

             

            I believe I tried formatting an 2GB SD card one time with a smaller cluster size, but due to the FAT limitations, it needed to use the 32KB.

            You can see why I'm considering the container file for tiles, right?  Needed 167MB, using 868MB is a 4 TIMES waste of space!

            Anyone out there running OSMTiles on a thumb drive?  Does it do the same thing or is it better?

            Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

            On 9/2/2011 10:29 AM, Fred Hillhouse wrote:
            My desktop is 4K(HD) and my Tilt is 32K (uSD).
             
            Tilt (Original Tiles): 27660/167.07MB/868.66MB(*32) 6.16GB Free
             
            It looks like the average tile size is ~6KB. With the cluster size at 32K, the minimum is 32K for a 533% increase. Sweet!
             
            I haven't looked into it myself but can the uSD be formatted differently to shrink the cluster size?
             
            Apparently you just need a bigger uSD card, like an 8 or 16GB. ;)
             
             
            Best regards,
            Fred, N7FMH
             
             


            From: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aprsisce@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
            Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 08:05
            To: aprsisce@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [aprsisce] Cluster Size (Dev: 2011/09/02 07:51)

            I've been going nuts trying to figure out why the OSM tiles are taking up so much disk space on my 2GB uSD card, so I added the cluster size to the OSM Map Tiles popup dialog (double-click an empty area of the map).  At the bottom you will now see the following stats for all configured Tile Sets:

            Name->Storage Directory
            TileCount/TotalSize/DiskSize(*Cluster) Space Free

            Name is your tile set name.
            Storage Directory is where that tile set is being stored (they better all be unique!)
            TileCount is the count of tiles found in that tree
            TotalSize is the necessary size of the tile files
            DiskSize is the on-disk allocation for the tile files
            Cluster is the disk's cluster size
            Space is the free space on that particular device

            My uSD card has a cluster size of 32KB and an average OSM tile file of 9.65K, no wonder the 77MB occupies 261MB of the card!  It's mostly cluster rounding waste.  (I was using >800MB of the card before I re-enabled the tile purger last night when my card completely filled up).

            My desktop is much nicer, but then it's not running an SD card.  The cluster size is only 4KB and 168MB only occupies 215MB on disk.

            If any of you WinMo users out there have read this far, double-click an empty space and let me know what your cluster size is.  I've got a ToDo item to (optionally) store the individual tiles in a container file of some sort to squeeze out the excess allocation space, but I need to know if it'll really be worth it.

            Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32



          • Colin Catlin
            Hi Lynn, My -5 instance is showing (*512Bytes) for the built-in Memory & (*1024Bytes) for the MiniSDcard. That could explain why I can very rapidly run out of
            Message 5 of 8 , Sep 2, 2011
              Hi Lynn,

              My -5 instance is showing (*512Bytes) for the built-in Memory & (*1024Bytes) for the MiniSDcard.
              That could explain why I can very rapidly run out of Storage Space.


              73,
              Colin.



              On 02/09/2011 12:05, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:
              I've been going nuts trying to figure out why the OSM tiles are taking up so much disk space on my 2GB uSD card, so I added the cluster size to the OSM Map Tiles popup dialog (double-click an empty area of the map).  At the bottom you will now see the following stats for all configured Tile Sets:

              Name->Storage Directory
              TileCount/TotalSize/DiskSize(*Cluster) Space Free

              Name is your tile set name.
              Storage Directory is where that tile set is being stored (they better all be unique!)
              TileCount is the count of tiles found in that tree
              TotalSize is the necessary size of the tile files
              DiskSize is the on-disk allocation for the tile files
              Cluster is the disk's cluster size
              Space is the free space on that particular device

              My uSD card has a cluster size of 32KB and an average OSM tile file of 9.65K, no wonder the 77MB occupies 261MB of the card!  It's mostly cluster rounding waste.  (I was using >800MB of the card before I re-enabled the tile purger last night when my card completely filled up).

              My desktop is much nicer, but then it's not running an SD card.  The cluster size is only 4KB and 168MB only occupies 215MB on disk.

              If any of you WinMo users out there have read this far, double-click an empty space and let me know what your cluster size is.  I've got a ToDo item to (optionally) store the individual tiles in a container file of some sort to squeeze out the excess allocation space, but I need to know if it'll really be worth it.

              Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32



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