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Same old, same old

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  • ted.wrinch
    Alicia s pointed to a blog response on Michael Egget s site (http://egoistenblog.blogspot.com/2012/02/ansgar-martins-praktiziert-das-leidige. html ) where
    Message 1 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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      Alicia's pointed to a blog response on Michael Egget's site (http://egoistenblog.blogspot.com/2012/02/ansgar-martins-praktiziert-das-leidige.\
      html
      ) where there's a long, frenetic exchange concerning another post she referenced, which discussed the old Steiner chestnuts of fascism/anti-Semitism/racism. It's fascinating that they are going around and around the same Steiner ground in Germany as the Two Towers here, and re-asserting and refuting the same round of Steiner quotes and Staudenmaierian stuff (he seems more influential than Zander from what I can see). The responses from the pro crowd are similar to ours; e.g. see the response to the end of this familiar Staudemaier quote:

      "….On occasion Steiner's fantasies along these lines attributed genocidal intentions Essentially to the Jews. " That's one of the scribbling modern grandson of Joseph Goebbels, who have only one intention: Manipulation!

      Some one there (Anonymous- Wolfgang) has also dug up the same reference I did recently to refute Der Staudi's claim that Steiner thought 'it was the Jews' fault' (for Christ's death). The reference is ignored and the old stuff re-asserted; Anonymous notes a response pattern very similar to that of our own Sugar Chrubs:

      "…a pity that even Hermann Fink Elsteen again for many years with the ever-same quote comes - because people find nothing more compelling - what Rudolf Steiner said in his twenties - and not at 40 or when he was 50 or 60!"

      There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course, since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.

      Final mangled quote from Anonymous before my Google translate gave up:

      "And he predicted privately that it would come to the next big war that will go from 1939/1940 to 1945. He wanted to change the attitude of the people by means of "education" about the spiritual nature of man and the world - and others - and the people were not ripe for it. That he fought against the fact that Germany, the sole responsibility for the 1.WK. to carry, is very evident that he has fought against the Versailles Treaty, is understandable. Which also laid a base for the rise of the Nazis!) But you did not listen to him. So karma has prevailed - the dark forces gained the upper hand - and it came to the next world war. People who want to make Rudolf Steiner in a Nazi corner - like light - these are for me the real art "Goebbels"."

      Does anyone know anything about this private printing?

      T.

      Ted Wrinch
    • elfuncle
      ... makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if Steiner s classification of the different races, nations and groups is supposed to be
      Message 2 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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        --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
        >
        > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course, since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.


        Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in the Lemurian jungle.

        Tarjei
      • ted.wrinch
        Tarjei, I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet! T. Ted Wrinch
        Message 3 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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          Tarjei,

          I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!

          T.

          Ted Wrinch

          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
          > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
          > >
          > > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang
          > makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if
          > Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is
          > supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of
          > 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did
          > Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are
          > being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the
          > C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese
          > too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that
          > were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in
          > Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated
          > formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining
          > races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This
          > is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation
          > is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can
          > see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der
          > Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course,
          > since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a
          > 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.
          >
          > Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on
          > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
          > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
          > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up
          > reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and
          > falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so
          > please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out
          > exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of
          > course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet
          > and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in
          > the Lemurian jungle.
          >
          > Tarjei
          >
        • ted.wrinch
          our Beloved Sister, on ... I can see that you believe in her like Elvis Presley singing psalms on Sunday and let s hope she s not come to save her soul :
          Message 4 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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            "our Beloved Sister, on
            > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
            > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
            > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard."

            I can see that you believe in her 'like Elvis Presley singing psalms on Sunday' and let's hope she's not 'come to save her soul':

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wudh_54ylhw

            T.

            Ted Wrinch

            --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
            >
            > Tarjei,
            >
            > I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!
            >
            > T.
            >
            > Ted Wrinch
            >
            > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
            > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang
            > > makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if
            > > Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is
            > > supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of
            > > 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did
            > > Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are
            > > being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the
            > > C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese
            > > too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that
            > > were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in
            > > Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated
            > > formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining
            > > races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This
            > > is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation
            > > is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can
            > > see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der
            > > Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course,
            > > since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a
            > > 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.
            > >
            > > Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on
            > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
            > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
            > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up
            > > reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and
            > > falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so
            > > please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out
            > > exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of
            > > course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet
            > > and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in
            > > the Lemurian jungle.
            > >
            > > Tarjei
            > >
            >
          • ted.wrinch
            One of my heroes, a very beautiful women. I loved this song on honeymoon with my wife (an even more beautiful woman, of course!): When the day goes down
            Message 5 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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              One of my heroes, a very beautiful women. I loved this song on honeymoon with my wife (an even more beautiful woman, of course!):

              When the day goes down

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQrLJxQ0yI

              Also, another, earlier favourite:

              The Miracle of Love

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s901V3GvELQ

              They played with the boundaries, transgressed the real, sought for the true, the good and the beautiful so well: they used to scare me when I was 'young' (quite old actually - I was such a slow developer!):

              Eurythmics - You Have Placed A Chill In My Heart

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQpJqtfCmcM&feature=related


              Hell, their whole damn career together was a miracle of love!

              T.

              Ted Wrinch

              --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
              >
              > "our Beloved Sister, on
              > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
              > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
              > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard."
              >
              > I can see that you believe in her 'like Elvis Presley singing psalms on Sunday' and let's hope she's not 'come to save her soul':
              >
              > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wudh_54ylhw
              >
              > T.
              >
              > Ted Wrinch
              >
              > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Tarjei,
              > >
              > > I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!
              > >
              > > T.
              > >
              > > Ted Wrinch
              > >
              > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
              > > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang
              > > > makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if
              > > > Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is
              > > > supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of
              > > > 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did
              > > > Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are
              > > > being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the
              > > > C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese
              > > > too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that
              > > > were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in
              > > > Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated
              > > > formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining
              > > > races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This
              > > > is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation
              > > > is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can
              > > > see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der
              > > > Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course,
              > > > since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a
              > > > 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.
              > > >
              > > > Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on
              > > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
              > > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
              > > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up
              > > > reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and
              > > > falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so
              > > > please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out
              > > > exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of
              > > > course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet
              > > > and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in
              > > > the Lemurian jungle.
              > > >
              > > > Tarjei
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • ted.wrinch
              My colleague s wife works at Hobbs, Notting Hill, London and has provided personal shopping services for Ms Lennox a few times. She confirms what you d hope: a
              Message 6 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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                My colleague's wife works at Hobbs, Notting Hill, London and has provided personal shopping services for Ms Lennox a few times. She confirms what you'd hope: a modest, genuinely nice woman. Must be that Aberdonian grit!

                T.

                Ted Wrinch

                --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
                >
                > One of my heroes, a very beautiful women. I loved this song on honeymoon with my wife (an even more beautiful woman, of course!):
                >
                > When the day goes down
                >
                > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQrLJxQ0yI
                >
                > Also, another, earlier favourite:
                >
                > The Miracle of Love
                >
                > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s901V3GvELQ
                >
                > They played with the boundaries, transgressed the real, sought for the true, the good and the beautiful so well: they used to scare me when I was 'young' (quite old actually - I was such a slow developer!):
                >
                > Eurythmics - You Have Placed A Chill In My Heart
                >
                > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQpJqtfCmcM&feature=related
                >
                >
                > Hell, their whole damn career together was a miracle of love!
                >
                > T.
                >
                > Ted Wrinch
                >
                > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                > >
                > > "our Beloved Sister, on
                > > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
                > > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
                > > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard."
                > >
                > > I can see that you believe in her 'like Elvis Presley singing psalms on Sunday' and let's hope she's not 'come to save her soul':
                > >
                > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wudh_54ylhw
                > >
                > > T.
                > >
                > > Ted Wrinch
                > >
                > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Tarjei,
                > > >
                > > > I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!
                > > >
                > > > T.
                > > >
                > > > Ted Wrinch
                > > >
                > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                > > > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang
                > > > > makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if
                > > > > Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is
                > > > > supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of
                > > > > 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did
                > > > > Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are
                > > > > being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the
                > > > > C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese
                > > > > too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that
                > > > > were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in
                > > > > Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated
                > > > > formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining
                > > > > races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This
                > > > > is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation
                > > > > is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can
                > > > > see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der
                > > > > Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course,
                > > > > since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a
                > > > > 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.
                > > > >
                > > > > Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on
                > > > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
                > > > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
                > > > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up
                > > > > reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and
                > > > > falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so
                > > > > please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out
                > > > > exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of
                > > > > course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet
                > > > > and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in
                > > > > the Lemurian jungle.
                > > > >
                > > > > Tarjei
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • ted.wrinch
                This is fun, much better than Gaga, IMHO, as she s always, patently genuine: Beethoven (I Love To Listen To)
                Message 7 of 15 , Mar 2, 2012
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                  This is fun, much better than Gaga, IMHO, as she's always, patently genuine:

                  Beethoven (I Love To Listen To)

                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=rbuMXyzouJQ

                  Love the cut glass posh Scottish (English) accent: Edinburgh: 'all fur and nae nickers'.

                  Best comment (?):

                  "I need a girlfriend with OCD, my home is a mess."

                  T.

                  Ted Wrinch

                  --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > My colleague's wife works at Hobbs, Notting Hill, London and has provided personal shopping services for Ms Lennox a few times. She confirms what you'd hope: a modest, genuinely nice woman. Must be that Aberdonian grit!
                  >
                  > T.
                  >
                  > Ted Wrinch
                  >
                  > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > One of my heroes, a very beautiful women. I loved this song on honeymoon with my wife (an even more beautiful woman, of course!):
                  > >
                  > > When the day goes down
                  > >
                  > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQrLJxQ0yI
                  > >
                  > > Also, another, earlier favourite:
                  > >
                  > > The Miracle of Love
                  > >
                  > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s901V3GvELQ
                  > >
                  > > They played with the boundaries, transgressed the real, sought for the true, the good and the beautiful so well: they used to scare me when I was 'young' (quite old actually - I was such a slow developer!):
                  > >
                  > > Eurythmics - You Have Placed A Chill In My Heart
                  > >
                  > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQpJqtfCmcM&feature=related
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Hell, their whole damn career together was a miracle of love!
                  > >
                  > > T.
                  > >
                  > > Ted Wrinch
                  > >
                  > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > "our Beloved Sister, on
                  > > > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
                  > > > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
                  > > > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard."
                  > > >
                  > > > I can see that you believe in her 'like Elvis Presley singing psalms on Sunday' and let's hope she's not 'come to save her soul':
                  > > >
                  > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wudh_54ylhw
                  > > >
                  > > > T.
                  > > >
                  > > > Ted Wrinch
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Tarjei,
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!
                  > > > >
                  > > > > T.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Ted Wrinch
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                  > > > > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > There's also an observation that is new to me. Anonymous- Wolgang
                  > > > > > makes the point in a comment of February 29, 2012 05:13 AM that if
                  > > > > > Steiner's classification of the different races, nations and groups is
                  > > > > > supposed to be discriminatory, and he supposedly held to a kind of
                  > > > > > 'spiritual racism' (as, for example, Der Staudi holds) then why did
                  > > > > > Steiner say that Native Americans, supposedly an 'inferior' race, are
                  > > > > > being re-incarnated as Europeans, supposedly the 'advanced race', in the
                  > > > > > C20? I can recall a similar Steiner statement concerning the Chinese
                  > > > > > too: he said that the result of the Opium was was that many souls that
                  > > > > > were in Chinese bodies in a previous incarnation had incarnated in
                  > > > > > Europe during the late C19. According to Staudi's oft repeated
                  > > > > > formulation, Steiner's system mandates that the souls of the 'declining
                  > > > > > races' are fixed to re-incarnate in those declining races forever. This
                  > > > > > is a contradiction; it suggests that the Staudenmaierian interpretation
                  > > > > > is wrong. Hell, it destroys the Staudenmaierian interpreataion! AFAI can
                  > > > > > see (can anyone see this differently?)! Time for another post to Der
                  > > > > > Staudi's 'ecofascism' article perhaps! This won't bother him, of course,
                  > > > > > since he has no interest in truth and will be happy to call it a
                  > > > > > 'contradiction', ignore it, and carry on as usual.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Forget Staudenmaier and Staudi and all that -- our Beloved Sister, on
                  > > > > > the other hand, is very astute and has a keen and sensitive spiritual
                  > > > > > understanding, deep deep down, and she's fighting her astral and etheric
                  > > > > > demons and studying her anthroposophy very hard. She can also sum up
                  > > > > > reincarnation and race like an A-student. Staudenmaier twists and
                  > > > > > falsifies everything because he can't utter a word without lying, so
                  > > > > > please forget him(!), but that sweet Sister of ours spells it out
                  > > > > > exactly as it is. Afterwards, she adds her poison and her nonsense, of
                  > > > > > course, like an antidote she must not forget to take; it's all so sweet
                  > > > > > and charming that I melt like .... like a strawberry ice cream cone in
                  > > > > > the Lemurian jungle.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Tarjei
                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
                • elfuncle
                  ... style. I think you two need to meet! That s a highly unlikely scenarion unless she s planning a visit to Norway and to give me a call then or something.
                  Message 8 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                    --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Tarjei,
                    >
                    > I think this is your thing. You have hope for her soul; she likes your style. I think you two need to meet!


                    That's a highly unlikely scenarion unless she's planning a visit to Norway and to give me a call then or something. You're far more likely to meet your Staudi in London. I bet that would be a memorable experience, at least for you ;)

                    What our Beloved Sister is concerned, she definitely has a reflective and original spiritual philosopher in her belly. Your Staudi has absolutely no take on anything he writes about, no opinions, no honest judgments. That's what I intended to show with that link to the dialogue between him and me in 2004 that was republished on Daniel Hindes' page: Whether or not racism is moral or immoral is something that never interests him one iota. Dan Dugan, on the other hand, constantly reiterates that racism is immoral, that anthroposophy is racist, and about "the moral bankruptcy of the Steiner cult" as he calls it, but not your Staudi. He is exclusively interested in textual analyses and digging for anthroposophical racists, Nazis and so on past and present, and to demonstrate that if some anthroposophists or esotericists don't fall into this preferred category, they're stupid, uneducated, in denial of history and scholarship and learning and so on.

                    Our Beloved Sister, on the other hand, although she absorbs and agrees with all this as a devoted member of this sweet congregation, has a mind of her own that is struggling to break through. She philosophizes and tries very hard to connect the dots independently. As a classic example, take her comment on the laws of karma and reincarnation as defined by classic theosophy and anthroposophy (Blavatsky and Steiner); she has an exceptionally good take on this, and her post (Feb 20, 2012) should be read in its entirety:

                    Theosophy of the Rosicrucian-Rudolf Steiner-Lecture V 

                    Here is an interesting excerpt:
                    "Two more details:

                    · Duration of our sojourn in the spiritual worlds betw/death and rebirth averages 1,000 to 1,300 years

                    · Sex alternates (in general, you are the same sex for three to five incarnations, then you alternate)

                    This period is correlated to the zodiac. "The period required by the sun for its passage through one zodiacal constellation is the period within which the human being is twice incarnated, once as a man and once as a woman."

                    Most of us need the long interval between incarnations because conditions on earth change and the individuality needs to experience a different set of conditions for his or her personal spiritual development, and because our "tasks" change/progress from lifetime to lifetime. Presumably if we just came back 20 years later conditions would not be different enough to be useful to us. I know that some anthroposophists dispute this or propose exceptions to the rule (often because they are, as I noted above, trying to convince themselves and others that THEY are the reincarnation of someone hip and groovy who hasn't actually been gone long enough for the formula to work).

                    In addition to individual karma, "common karma" comes into play as the individual reconfigures him/herself for the new life ahead. Common karma (of groups, races, nations) is integrated with the individual's karma. How this could possibly work, with several billion people on the planet and Steiner-only-knows how many more disincarnate at a given time, does not seem to have troubled Steiner, nor does it trouble believers in these notions today."
                    Wow, this is so sharp and astute, and in fact a tremendous contribution to progressive anthroposophical thinking. You know, an objection one sometimes hears is that Steiner has an answer for everything, and especially about things people want to assume that one can't know anything about but only speculate and believe and so on. But the fact is that Steiner doesn't reduce the number of fundamental questions by answering some of these; on the contrary, he gives rise to more mature and sophisticated riddles, and it's such riddles that our Beloved Sister is proposing to tackle here. The other Sugar Cherubs are doing no such thing, and they never have. Our Sister is the only one!

                    It's true, of course, that if one should take a very different view of reincarnation by assuming that we reincarnate very frequently, perhaps even so often that we basically jump in and out of bodies with virtually no time in the spiritual world in between -- obviously a more materialistic theory that dispenses with the spiritual world altogether -- the total number of reincarnating individuals on earth would be severely reduced, and the present-day skyrocketing world population would be much more challenging. At the present time, our Beloved Sister is probably entertaining the theory that no human being ever reincarnates. (The assumption that she still thinks there are no spiritual worlds and no higher beings is a different subject, although she has expressed a strong longing for gnomes, elves and similar nature spirits; she desires to become one. She's always had a "thing" about gnomes. She may be heavily into Tolkien for all we know but doesn't share that with her anti-Steiner congregation because it's sinful and off-topic.)

                    Notice also that our Beloved Sister has a sophisticated and fascinating comprehension of racial evolution, in spite of the apparent fact that PS is constantly hammering on how important it is to hold everything about race in disdain and contempt and to link it to Nazism and the like.

                    Also pay very close attention to our Beloved Sister's idiosyncratic expression "yada yada", which literally means "Yes, naturally" or "Yes, of course" (in Norwegian). That's her Spirit expressing itself! That's the Yes-Girl, her very own Steiner-and-Paul-inspired Christ-Self, her True Ego, deep down in her soul, fighting fiercely against that legion of demons possessing her so cruelly.

                    Some day in the not too distant future, the very Steiner-and-Paul-inspired Christ-Self of our Beloved Sister will burst into full bloom for the whole world to see. With a little help from her friends, of course, like ourselves and our Lovathons.

                    Tarjei
                  • Frank Thomas Smith
                    ... Spirit expressing itself my ass. She says that all the time because in her last incarnation she was a Norwegian yes-man. Frank
                    Message 9 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Also pay very close attention to our Beloved Sister's idiosyncratic
                      > expression "yada yada", which literally means "Yes, naturally" or "Yes,
                      > of course" (in Norwegian). That's her Spirit expressing itself! That's
                      > the Yes-Girl, her very own Steiner-and-Paul-inspired Christ-Self, her
                      > True Ego, deep down in her soul, fighting fiercely against that legion
                      > of demons possessing her so cruelly.
                      >

                      Spirit expressing itself my ass. She says that all the time because in her last incarnation she was a Norwegian yes-man.
                      Frank
                    • Kathleen Bonneau
                      ... This slang dictionary describes yada yada: yada yada yadacolloq. Used to save time in conversations by not having to actually explain things that should be
                      Message 10 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                        Tarjei said:

                        > Also pay very close attention to our Beloved Sister's idiosyncratic
                        > expression "yada yada"



                        This slang dictionary describes yada yada:

                        yada yada yada

                        colloq.

                        Used to save time in conversations by not having to actually explain things that should be apparent... yada, yada, yada...

                        First heard on the Seinfeld show 


                        http://www.odps.org/glossword/index.php?a=term&d=4&t=12939 





                        I wasn't aware of the meaning of yada yada, the use of this expression is really quite profound...  not explaining the apparent...  when silence will suffice... the ineffability of Truth.


                        Shall I flail with words, when love has made the space inside me full of light? 

                                   I know the diamond is wrapped in this cloth, so why should I open it all the time and look? 
                                   When the pan was empty it flew up; now that it’s full, why bother weighing it?

                                   The swan has flown to the mountain lake! 
                                   Why bother with ditches and holes anymore? 
                                   The Holy One lives inside you-- 
                                   why open you other eyes at all?

                                   Kabir will tell you the truth: Listen, brother! 
                                   The Guest, who makes my eyes so bright, 
                                   has made love with me.

                        Kabir




                        Perhaps someone recited Kabir on Jung's couch, who later met some friends of Steiner...   


                        Tarjei I agree DW has an interesting philosophical mind, and a bright spirit.  Although, I must say,  things are a bit Midsummer Nights Dreamish around here with Myla being so madly in love with you, and you being so in love (spiritually of course) with Dianna...   



                        Kathleen










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                      • elfuncle
                        ... If you drag your rectum into this, Frank, you ll only attract one of them Adorable Darlings again. ... Norwegian yes-man. Highly improbable. Our Sister s
                        Message 11 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Thomas Smith" <fts.trasla@...> wrote:

                          > Spirit expressing itself my ass.

                          If you drag your rectum into this, Frank, you'll only attract one of them Adorable Darlings again.

                          > She says that all the time because in her last incarnation she was a Norwegian yes-man.

                          Highly improbable. Our Sister's strong aversion to the Middle Ages -- something she emphasizes repeatedly -- indicates that she lived in a feudal system in Eastern or Southern Europe, maybe in Russia, or perhaps in England. She (or as you suggest, more probably he), may have lived through one of the plagues, perhaps the Black Death itself in 1347. Anyway, her subconscious memories of medieval life are awful and give her the shudders.

                          We're assuming, of course, the basic pattern of two incarnations during a 2160 year period, one as a male and one as a female, so we're talking about a male incarnation roughly a millennium ago. If this had been in Norway, our Beloved Sister would have been a male Viking with a very good life, at a time when Norway was approaching the height of its power. There was never any feudal system in Norway; the peasants/farmers were always fiercely independent and a strong political force capable of making or breaking kings. And Norway had no Early Middle Ages. The rest of Europe had that, but Norway only had its Viking Age prior to 1030, when it was Christianized.

                          The only thing that may support your position, Frank, is that Diana's former male self may have resented the arrival of Christianity in favor of the good old ways of the Vikings and the Nordic mythology. Her longing for gnomehood is also a good argument, and so is her antipathy to everything Christian.

                          But I don't think so. If she had been a Viking, especially a male, the world would have been at this person's feet, living the good life with adventure, trade, plunder, wild parties, excellent food and drinks, and looking forward to Valhalla. It may also be argued on your behalf that the Diana individuality came to resent spirituality because he/she didn't get to spend eternity in Valhalla afterwards, but -- nah, Valhalla is far too crude for our Beloved Holy Sister's taste and sentiments. It was the heaven promised to Vikings who died honorably in bloody battles, and there they got to gorge themselves on food and get very drunk and then slay each other, to repeat the same thing the next day over and over for eternity. If this sounds anything like a heaven preferred by our Sister, I must have misjudged her terribly.

                          Tarjei
                        • elfuncle
                          It don t matter vat that silli dikchionari sez, Kathleen, coz ever time I see yada yada from Sister, mehears her soul singin, it really do. And I hear them
                          Message 12 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                            It don't matter vat that silli dikchionari sez, Kathleen, coz ever time I see yada yada from Sister, mehears her soul singin, it really do. And I hear them harps too when Goddess Diana singin yada yada.



                            Tarjei


                            --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, Kathleen Bonneau <kahabo3@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Tarjei said:
                            >
                            > > Also pay very close attention to our Beloved Sister's idiosyncratic
                            >
                            > > expression "yada yada"
                            >
                            > This slang dictionary describes yada yada:
                            > yada yada yadacolloq.
                            > Used to save time in conversations by not having to actually explain things that should be apparent... yada, yada, yada...
                            > First heard on the Seinfeld show
                            > http://www.odps.org/glossword/index.php?a=term&d=4&t=12939
                            >
                            > I wasn't aware of the meaning of yada yada, the use of this expression is really quite profound... not explaining the apparent... when silence will suffice... the ineffability of Truth.
                            >
                            >
                            > Shall I flail with words, when love has made the space inside me full of light?
                            > I know the diamond is wrapped in this cloth, so why should I open it all the time and look?
                            > When the pan was empty it flew up; now that it's full, why bother weighing it?
                            > The swan has flown to the mountain lake!
                            > Why bother with ditches and holes anymore?
                            > The Holy One lives inside you--
                            > why open you other eyes at all? Kabir will tell you the truth: Listen, brother!
                            > The Guest, who makes my eyes so bright,
                            > has made love with me.Kabir
                            >
                            >
                            > Perhaps someone recited Kabir on Jung's couch, who later met some friends of Steiner...
                            > Tarjei I agree DW has an interesting philosophical mind, and a bright spirit. Although, I must say, things are a bit Midsummer Nights Dreamish around here with Myla being so madly in love with you, and you being so in love (spiritually of course) with Dianna...
                            >
                            > Kathleen

                          • elfuncle
                            ... Or a Sugar Cherub. Right now, one of those sweet things, Pete K, is accusing me of wanting Sune to do something unspeakable to Peter S s rectum. I ve never
                            Message 13 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                              --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <elfuncle@...> wrote:

                              > If you drag your rectum into this, Frank, you'll only attract one of
                              > them Adorable Darlings again.


                              Or a Sugar Cherub. Right now, one of those sweet things, Pete K, is accusing me of wanting Sune to do something unspeakable to Peter S's rectum. I've never mentioned his or anybody else's hindparts.

                              Tarjei
                            • Kathleen Bonneau
                              Right now, one of those sweet things, Pete K, is accusing me of wanting Sune to do something unspeakable to Peter S s rectum. I ve never mentioned his or
                              Message 14 of 15 , Mar 3, 2012
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                                " Right now, one of those sweet things, Pete K, is accusing me of wanting Sune to do something unspeakable to Peter S's rectum. I've never mentioned his or anybody else's hindparts. "

                                He's probably reading  a whole lot more into the "kicking the pricks" references than was ever intended by you, Tarjei.   It may have implanted prickly anatomical images in his mind, if like me, he had to look up what it meant!


                                Kathleen
                              • ted.wrinch
                                It also has the meaning of the male appendage on the opposite side of the body to the rectum in UK English slang, which could add to the cognitive dissonance
                                Message 15 of 15 , Mar 4, 2012
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                                  It also has the meaning of the male appendage on the opposite side of the body to the rectum in UK English slang, which could add to the cognitive dissonance of the expression!

                                  T.

                                  Ted Wrinch

                                  --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, Kathleen Bonneau <kahabo3@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > " Right now, one of those sweet things, Pete K, is accusing me of wanting Sune to do something unspeakable to Peter S's rectum. I've never mentioned his or anybody else's hindparts. "
                                  >
                                  > He's probably reading a whole lot more into the "kicking the pricks" references than was ever intended by you, Tarjei. It may have implanted prickly anatomical images in his mind, if like me, he had to look up what it meant!
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Kathleen
                                  >
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