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More trouble in the hole?

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  • ted.wrinch
    Dear all, Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don t think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun. Steiner s Truth And Science
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 19, 2010
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      Dear all,

      Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.

      Steiner's Truth And Science
      ====================
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1


      T.
    • elfuncle
      It s impossible for anyone to create trouble in that place; the sad troublespot for the universe nobody can make any sadder. And it s not to be taken too
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 19, 2010
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        It's impossible for anyone to create trouble in that place; the sad troublespot for the universe nobody can make any sadder. And it's not to be taken too seriously either, because the sad place is also an obscene joke, I'm afraid. This means that the only thing to do with it, if anything, is to troll there and to make dirty jokes and legends about it.

        Tarjei

        --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
        >
        > Dear all,
        >
        > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
        >
        > Steiner's Truth And Science
        > ====================
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
        >
        >
        > T.
        >
      • jmn36210
        Hi Ted, In your waldorf-critics message #14 424: 1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier s message # 13 424 [March 17, 2010] 2- Your pertinent question is: «He just
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 20, 2010
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          Hi Ted,

          In your waldorf-critics message #14 424:

          1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier's message # 13 424 [March 17, 2010]
          2- Your pertinent question is: «He just doesn't get it does he?»

          Perhaps you could:

          1- Check waldorf-critics message # 9271 [February 14, 2009]
          2- Take into account that the passages were first posted to waldorf-critics
               in December 2006 actually!

          Isn't the light absorbed, and apparently annihilated in no time - as if it never was?


          Best,
          Jean-Marc


          ================================================================
          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch" <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear all,
          >
          > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
          >
          > Steiner's Truth And Science
          > ====================
          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
          >
          >
          > T.
          >
        • ted.wrinch
          Hi Jean-Marc You posts do have something of a familiar look to them, right down to some references to Truth and science ! And I liked: ...books like *The
          Message 4 of 7 , Sep 22, 2010
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            Hi Jean-Marc

            You posts do have something of a familiar look to them, right down to some references to 'Truth and science'!
            And I liked:


            "...books like *The Philosophy of Freedom*, *Truth and Science*,
            which were intentionally written to train thinking and to ensure that
            it could move on the highest planes [above the physical plane]
            with absolute confidence. Someone who studied those writings and
            knew absolutely nothing about theosophy could find his bearings
            in the higher worlds."

            This was my experience on reading them in my 20s. I also liked:

            "In my works *The Philosophy of Freedom* and *Truth and Science*
            it was shown that man needs to (...) first undergo a development of
            his inner life in order to be able to know the truth about the
            phenomena of the world (...)
            The concept of Redemption must be added to the mere causal
            knowing."'

            Containing the conception, also verified for myself, that we are changed by the action of reading if we allow the experience to act deeply enough upon us.

            But darkness swallowing the light it is. PS never does change or tire, and has never been known to loose, or alter his opinion, in combat with an adversary - which in itself shows a degree of sub/super humanness. He is immune to evidence, reason or common sense, being guided instead by his opinions, formed, apparently, from a deep hatred of Steiner and things Steiner. But once he's formed that opinion, grounded in nothing but prejudice, he uses his immense talent and intelligence to marshal all the techniques of dishonest argument to bamboozle and confuse the 'fans of Steiner'.

            But the problem with your quotes, Jean-Marc, is that PS will not allow Rudi to speak for himself, regarding that an 'unscholarly' approach. Instead, PS must legislate what Rudi meant when, for instance, he said he had access to the spiritual worlds since childhood. PS knows better than this, relying on his scholarly exegesis of the texts to find out what was really the case, and to deduce that Rudi was an atheist in his 20s and lied/fooled himself about his ability to commune with the spirit worlds. So much for 'historical scholarship'.


            T.

            Ted Wrinch
            --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" <jmn36210@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > Hi Ted,
            >
            > In your waldorf-critics message #14 424:
            >
            > 1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier's message # 13 424 [March 17,
            > 2010]
            > 2- Your pertinent question is: «He just doesn't get it does he?»
            >
            > Perhaps you could:
            >
            > 1- Check waldorf-critics message # 9271 [February 14, 2009]
            > 2- Take into account that the passages were first posted to
            > waldorf-critics
            > in December 2006 actually!
            >
            > Isn't the light absorbed, and apparently annihilated in no time - as
            > if it never was?
            >
            >
            > Best,
            > Jean-Marc
            >
            >
            > ================================================================
            > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
            > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Dear all,
            > >
            > > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't
            > think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
            > >
            > > Steiner's Truth And Science
            > > ====================
            > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
            > >
            > >
            > > T.
            > >
            >
          • jmn36210
            Generally speaking, Ted --- is it not the Satanic hallmark of our decisive times that *intelligence* stunningly borders on *idiocy*? Jean-Marc ... some
            Message 5 of 7 , Sep 26, 2010
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              Generally speaking, Ted --- is it not the Satanic hallmark of our
              decisive times
              that *intelligence* stunningly borders on *idiocy*?



              Jean-Marc



              =================================================================
              --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
              <ted.wrinch@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi Jean-Marc
              >
              > You posts do have something of a familiar look to them, right down to
              some references to 'Truth and science'!
              > And I liked:
              >
              >
              > "...books like *The Philosophy of Freedom*, *Truth and Science*,
              > which were intentionally written to train thinking and to ensure that
              > it could move on the highest planes [above the physical plane]
              > with absolute confidence. Someone who studied those writings and
              > knew absolutely nothing about theosophy could find his bearings
              > in the higher worlds."
              >
              > This was my experience on reading them in my 20s. I also liked:
              >
              > "In my works *The Philosophy of Freedom* and *Truth and Science*
              > it was shown that man needs to (...) first undergo a development of
              > his inner life in order to be able to know the truth about the
              > phenomena of the world (...)
              > The concept of Redemption must be added to the mere causal
              > knowing."'
              >
              > Containing the conception, also verified for myself, that we are
              changed by the action of reading if we allow the experience to act
              deeply enough upon us.
              >
              > But darkness swallowing the light it is. PS never does change or tire,
              and has never been known to loose, or alter his opinion, in combat with
              an adversary - which in itself shows a degree of sub/super humanness. He
              is immune to evidence, reason or common sense, being guided instead by
              his opinions, formed, apparently, from a deep hatred of Steiner and
              things Steiner. But once he's formed that opinion, grounded in nothing
              but prejudice, he uses his immense talent and intelligence to marshal
              all the techniques of dishonest argument to bamboozle and confuse the
              'fans of Steiner'.
              >
              > But the problem with your quotes, Jean-Marc, is that PS will not allow
              Rudi to speak for himself, regarding that an 'unscholarly' approach.
              Instead, PS must legislate what Rudi meant when, for instance, he said
              he had access to the spiritual worlds since childhood. PS knows better
              than this, relying on his scholarly exegesis of the texts to find out
              what was really the case, and to deduce that Rudi was an atheist in his
              20s and lied/fooled himself about his ability to commune with the spirit
              worlds. So much for 'historical scholarship'.
              >
              >
              > T.
              >
              > Ted Wrinch
              > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" jmn36210@
              wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > Hi Ted,
              > >
              > > In your waldorf-critics message #14 424:
              > >
              > > 1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier's message # 13 424 [March 17,
              > > 2010]
              > > 2- Your pertinent question is: «He just doesn't get it does
              he?»
              > >
              > > Perhaps you could:
              > >
              > > 1- Check waldorf-critics message # 9271 [February 14, 2009]
              > > 2- Take into account that the passages were first posted to
              > > waldorf-critics
              > > in December 2006 actually!
              > >
              > > Isn't the light absorbed, and apparently annihilated in no time - as
              > > if it never was?
              > >
              > >
              > > Best,
              > > Jean-Marc
              > >
              > >
              > > ================================================================
              > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
              > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Dear all,
              > > >
              > > > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't
              > > think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
              > > >
              > > > Steiner's Truth And Science
              > > > ====================
              > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > T.
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • ted.wrinch
              You re right Jean-Marc, And in so many ways - I used to call it intelligent stupidity when I first came across it in the IT industry. But there people are
              Message 6 of 7 , Sep 28, 2010
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                You're right Jean-Marc,

                And in so many ways - I used to call it 'intelligent stupidity' when I first came across it in the IT industry. But there people are rarely setting out to be dishonest like PS; I would note also that scoffery is a major part of his technique (and scoffery and lying are two hallmarks of the demonic too). But PS is idiotic (or solipsistic, living on his own planet as I've taken to calling it); I think it's due to what I've called his not being able to think - though he does have a very potent *surface* intelligence and talent. He's just made the recommendation that I read "A NOTE ON WILHELM OSTWALD'S ENERGISM" by Niles R Holt, supposedly because I'm ignorant of some aspect of Ostwald's relation to materialism - he never specifies what in these situations. I had to pay £10 to get it - though perhaps I can consider this a donation to academe - and it was a terrible, superficial, poorly written account of aspects of Ostwald's life. Ostwald's own text, though it also taught me nothing, at least was thoughtfully written and well put together and a fun canter through the physics of a hundred years ago.

                But I think this idiocy is inevitable - meaning doesn't just reside in 'texts', as PS' neo-Marxist methodology would have it, rather it flames into life when the products of an author 's spirit are resuscitated in our own. We can see this anti-spiritual stupidity taking place in the hole in the current discussion touching Kafka and his work: no one there mentions the heart of Kafka's work, and the expression of his genius, seminally described by Eric Heller, mid last contrary in the 'Disinherited Mind', as 'negative transcendence'. Kafka has described a world where transcendent truth has been abolished and replaced with a positivistic logic, and in this context the meaning that has been eviscerated from reality is replenished by sucking up stuff from below, from Hell: "For where the positive values are suppressed, Evil will take over with the force and inevitability of a physical necessity".

                T.

                Ted Wrinch

                --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" <jmn36210@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                >
                > Generally speaking, Ted --- is it not the Satanic hallmark of our
                > decisive times
                > that *intelligence* stunningly borders on *idiocy*?
                >
                >
                >
                > Jean-Marc
                >
                >
                >
                > =================================================================
                > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Hi Jean-Marc
                > >
                > > You posts do have something of a familiar look to them, right down to
                > some references to 'Truth and science'!
                > > And I liked:
                > >
                > >
                > > "...books like *The Philosophy of Freedom*, *Truth and Science*,
                > > which were intentionally written to train thinking and to ensure that
                > > it could move on the highest planes [above the physical plane]
                > > with absolute confidence. Someone who studied those writings and
                > > knew absolutely nothing about theosophy could find his bearings
                > > in the higher worlds."
                > >
                > > This was my experience on reading them in my 20s. I also liked:
                > >
                > > "In my works *The Philosophy of Freedom* and *Truth and Science*
                > > it was shown that man needs to (...) first undergo a development of
                > > his inner life in order to be able to know the truth about the
                > > phenomena of the world (...)
                > > The concept of Redemption must be added to the mere causal
                > > knowing."'
                > >
                > > Containing the conception, also verified for myself, that we are
                > changed by the action of reading if we allow the experience to act
                > deeply enough upon us.
                > >
                > > But darkness swallowing the light it is. PS never does change or tire,
                > and has never been known to loose, or alter his opinion, in combat with
                > an adversary - which in itself shows a degree of sub/super humanness. He
                > is immune to evidence, reason or common sense, being guided instead by
                > his opinions, formed, apparently, from a deep hatred of Steiner and
                > things Steiner. But once he's formed that opinion, grounded in nothing
                > but prejudice, he uses his immense talent and intelligence to marshal
                > all the techniques of dishonest argument to bamboozle and confuse the
                > 'fans of Steiner'.
                > >
                > > But the problem with your quotes, Jean-Marc, is that PS will not allow
                > Rudi to speak for himself, regarding that an 'unscholarly' approach.
                > Instead, PS must legislate what Rudi meant when, for instance, he said
                > he had access to the spiritual worlds since childhood. PS knows better
                > than this, relying on his scholarly exegesis of the texts to find out
                > what was really the case, and to deduce that Rudi was an atheist in his
                > 20s and lied/fooled himself about his ability to commune with the spirit
                > worlds. So much for 'historical scholarship'.
                > >
                > >
                > > T.
                > >
                > > Ted Wrinch
                > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" jmn36210@
                > wrote:
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Hi Ted,
                > > >
                > > > In your waldorf-critics message #14 424:
                > > >
                > > > 1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier's message # 13 424 [March 17,
                > > > 2010]
                > > > 2- Your pertinent question is: «He just doesn't get it does
                > he?»
                > > >
                > > > Perhaps you could:
                > > >
                > > > 1- Check waldorf-critics message # 9271 [February 14, 2009]
                > > > 2- Take into account that the passages were first posted to
                > > > waldorf-critics
                > > > in December 2006 actually!
                > > >
                > > > Isn't the light absorbed, and apparently annihilated in no time - as
                > > > if it never was?
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Best,
                > > > Jean-Marc
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > ================================================================
                > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                > > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Dear all,
                > > > >
                > > > > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't
                > > > think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
                > > > >
                > > > > Steiner's Truth And Science
                > > > > ====================
                > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > T.
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • ted.wrinch
                Already answered: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy_tomorrow/message/45485?l=1 T. Ted Wrinch
                Message 7 of 7 , Sep 30, 2010
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                  Already answered:

                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy_tomorrow/message/45485?l=1

                  T.

                  Ted Wrinch
                  --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" <jmn36210@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Generally speaking, Ted --- is it not the Satanic hallmark of our
                  > decisive times
                  > that *intelligence* stunningly borders on *idiocy*?
                  >
                  >
                  > Jean-Marc
                  >
                  >
                  > ==================================================================
                  > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                  > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi Jean-Marc
                  > >
                  > > You posts do have something of a familiar look to them, right down to
                  > some references to 'Truth and science'!
                  > > And I liked:
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > "...books like *The Philosophy of Freedom*, *Truth and Science*,
                  > > which were intentionally written to train thinking and to ensure that
                  > > it could move on the highest planes [above the physical plane]
                  > > with absolute confidence. Someone who studied those writings and
                  > > knew absolutely nothing about theosophy could find his bearings
                  > > in the higher worlds."
                  > >
                  > > This was my experience on reading them in my 20s. I also liked:
                  > >
                  > > "In my works *The Philosophy of Freedom* and *Truth and Science*
                  > > it was shown that man needs to (...) first undergo a development of
                  > > his inner life in order to be able to know the truth about the
                  > > phenomena of the world (...)
                  > > The concept of Redemption must be added to the mere causal
                  > > knowing."'
                  > >
                  > > Containing the conception, also verified for myself, that we are
                  > changed by the action of reading if we allow the experience to act
                  > deeply enough upon us.
                  > >
                  > > But darkness swallowing the light it is. PS never does change or tire,
                  > and has never been known to loose, or alter his opinion, in combat with
                  > an adversary - which in itself shows a degree of sub/super humanness. He
                  > is immune to evidence, reason or common sense, being guided instead by
                  > his opinions, formed, apparently, from a deep hatred of Steiner and
                  > things Steiner. But once he's formed that opinion, grounded in nothing
                  > but prejudice, he uses his immense talent and intelligence to marshal
                  > all the techniques of dishonest argument to bamboozle and confuse the
                  > 'fans of Steiner'.
                  > >
                  > > But the problem with your quotes, Jean-Marc, is that PS will not allow
                  > Rudi to speak for himself, regarding that an 'unscholarly' approach.
                  > Instead, PS must legislate what Rudi meant when, for instance, he said
                  > he had access to the spiritual worlds since childhood. PS knows better
                  > than this, relying on his scholarly exegesis of the texts to find out
                  > what was really the case, and to deduce that Rudi was an atheist in his
                  > 20s and lied/fooled himself about his ability to commune with the spirit
                  > worlds. So much for 'historical scholarship'.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > T.
                  > >
                  > > Ted Wrinch
                  > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "jmn36210" jmn36210@
                  > wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Hi Ted,
                  > > >
                  > > > In your waldorf-critics message #14 424:
                  > > >
                  > > > 1- You mention Peter Staudenmaier's message # 13 424 [March 17,
                  > > > 2010]
                  > > > 2- Your pertinent question is: «He just doesn't get it does
                  > he?»
                  > > >
                  > > > Perhaps you could:
                  > > >
                  > > > 1- Check waldorf-critics message # 9271 [February 14, 2009]
                  > > > 2- Take into account that the passages were first posted to
                  > > > waldorf-critics
                  > > > in December 2006 actually!
                  > > >
                  > > > Isn't the light absorbed, and apparently annihilated in no time - as
                  > > > if it never was?
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Best,
                  > > > Jean-Marc
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ================================================================
                  > > > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "ted.wrinch"
                  > > > <ted.wrinch@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Dear all,
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Have I created more trouble for myself? I do hope not, as I don't
                  > > > think I have the stamina for anymore PS fun.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Steiner's Truth And Science
                  > > > > ====================
                  > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waldorf-critics/message/14424?l=1
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > T.
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
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