SV: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: The Hole Revisited (was: Technology, Science Fi
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Kim" <kimgm@...> wrote:
"When I were around 30 I said that I was born old and grow younger,
became more free with time."(...)
RS. :"Man's external physical body (we know this, for it is a trivial truth) grows older and older. But this is not the case with the etheric body. It may perhaps be difficult to understand this, but the etheric body does not in any way grow older; the etheric body grows younger and younger, in the same degree in which the physical body grows older, until it reaches, as it were, a certain childlike stage of etheric existence, when the human being passes through the portal of death after having reached a normal age."
THE ETHERIC BODY AS A REFLEXION OF THE UNIVERSE.
Lecture by Dr. RUDOLF STEINER, delivered at Elberfeld on the 13th of June 1915.
I have mostly read Steiners book quickly, understanding what I could, and skipped the rest as unimportant or not to find out, as most others, I think. But recently I started looking into the open questions, a snippet from an earlier post:
Steiner puts forward the question who the new Michael is, but there are many more questions than that: Who is the old Michael, who is Skythianos, Zarathustra, Gabriel, Ahriman, Lucifer, Jahve, Isis, Sophia, and other of the preferred names Steiner uses? Why is Gabriel called the messenger of God in the bible? What about the relation of the Elemental beings in relation to our development cycle, and their relation to Christ? What about the Ahrimanic Spirits? What about the Demiurge and the Æons and their relations to the hierarchies from the Thrones down to the Elemental of the third kind? Why are each new Æon lower in the hierarchy than the previous? When Steiner says that the planets from Earth and inward are within man, and the planets from Mars and out until Saturn are outside man, what does he mean by that? What is the new Cosmic Principle? What's behind Adam one and Adam two? Why does the Angels dessert man, as described in Dotties post (I don't know), and whats behind the statement that Adam one and the Nathan Soul is sistersouls. What about our stragglers in the animal, and Plant kingdom? And so forth.When you are born, you live in the mothers etherbody, and your own etherbody is build from the layout placed in your astral body, the karma which should be handled in this life. When the etherbody is build, your astral body is clear of karmic stuff, but we start quickly filling it again. When you through your life don't accumulate too much karma and manage the current life's karma in this life, your chakras in the astral body can be set running after they have been cleaned up. The astral body with your own rebuild astral organs is now used to make a new etheric body (in dreams or the bible known as a beautiful mantle, good jacket, shirt,...), without the dependence of karma, the Zodiac, as it was before.
That we impress change on the astral more quickly than the etheric I hadn't thought of in connection with this, but that's right. The three days, seven days, and forty days periods are when working on the etheric body.
I don't think it's the right to say running backwards in time. The fat man is older than his age, when he looses weight, becomes more healthy, he becomes younger, and I think it's the same for the etherbody.
Steiner says that most university people are young souls, but thats of course also the right place to learn about the physical universe before it gets practical, fulfilling the young souls curiosity ;-)
--- Den tors 3/6/10 skrev ted.wrinch <ted.wrinch@...>:
Fra: ted.wrinch <ted.wrinch@...>
Emne: SV: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: The Hole Revisited (was: Technology, Science Fi
Dato: torsdag 3. juni 2010 21.42
I recognise many of your insights, but I think you are much further along the road than I. I am finding that as I re-read or read for the first time parts of Steiner, it is a little easier for my mind, that so naturally inclines to the physical, to pick things up and put them into place. Your point about the ether body running backwards in time as it is unburdened of the need hold karmic memory seems right; as is the accumulation of new debt in the astral body. This aligns with Steiner's observation that we impress change onto the astral much more quickly than the etheric, in the manner of the relative speed of rotation of the minute and hour hands of a clock.
I remember when I first read Occult Science it took me some 6 months to get through and even then I couldn't really say I could make much of it. I found the most difficult part the incarnations of worlds, and for many years this all seemed something that only existed in Steiner's cosmology. But this is one of the things I liked in the Steiner Pherecydes reference: you can seem to see in Pherecydes account of Chronos, Cthonie and Zas (Zeus), and of Zas dressing Cthonie to become Gaia, a part of the recapitulation described in Occult Science. But it doesn't seem at all possible to be sure about this.
I guess you may think Penrose an old soul because he's a Platonist; and that would make the positivist Stephen Hawking a young soul. My wife has always thought I am more Hawking than Penrose. But I also know that Penrose is not willing to jump very far off the tracks as he refused to even acknowledge receipt of Nick Thomas' book.
Thanks for all the references and suggestions for the road ahead,
--- In email@example.com, "Kim" <kimgm@...> wrote:
> When I were around 30 I said that I was born old and grow younger,
> became more free with time. When younger there were things I didn't do
> because it was stupid, when I got older I took more chances, but I knew
> beforehand what I did, I joked with that I could put a percentage on the
> chances for problems.
> The rule about sinning is, that if you know you sin, you can manage the
> karma in this life, otherwise you have to handle it in a new
> incarnation. That's the reason to analyze the days work before you go to
> sleep, and it's also the reason for dream interpretation.
> Both cycling and vegetarianism are not only a good idea it can also be
> an important step on the road, which is a relatively new insight for me,
> as I previously have lived by: It's more important what comes out of the
> mouth than in, but it usually comes to one when important.The Essene
> Gospel of Peace
> I am also a generalist, as I don't believe in only one book. When
> younger I was relatively well versed in the main theses of
> Anthroposophy, but no expert. I became a good amateur in Astrology, as
> it was practical knowledge in interaction with other persons, but
> otherwise I had some knowledge from many sources, like Sufism, Hermes
> Trismegistus, psychoanalysis, and so forth, building a consistent
> framework. Science was my preferred area, especially within my field.
> The Kaballah Tree of Life is a relatively new tool for me, but it's a
> fantastic chart to understand the spiritual world, both historically and
> current, but I don't go deep into Kaballah as it's a life study in
> itself, with not much place for living, and the real study is done
> through living.
> By the way, Penrose is an old soul, I believe.