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Ooops -- Errata (Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond)

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  • elfuncle
    ... type ... for ... 1879 -- I did it again [:-B] T
    Message 1 of 20 , Apr 9, 2009
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      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle" <coolvibes@...> wrote:

      > Through Rudolf Steiner, we are presented with a more spiritualized type
      > of epistemology and thinking than that of Aquinas, especially suited for
      > the Consciousness Age, which began in the fifteenth century, and
      > partuicularly the Age of Michael, which began in 1979.


      1879 -- I did it again :-B

      T
    • Cheese Curve
      according to Steiner, good friday was on 3 april 33 http://stevemorse.org/jcal/easter.html a modern easter calculator Kees
      Message 2 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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         according to Steiner,
        good friday was on 3 april 33
         
        http://stevemorse.org/jcal/easter.html
         
        a modern easter calculator
         
        Kees




        Haal meer uit je Hotmail met Internet Explorer 8. Download nu
      • nadmateescu
        Hi Kees, Yes. (So?) Thanks for link. (http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/) Dan
        Message 3 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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          Hi Kees,

          Yes. (So?)
          Thanks for link. (http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/)

          Dan

          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, Cheese Curve <K_Kromme@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          > according to Steiner,
          >
          > good friday was on 3 april 33
          >
          >
          >
          > http://stevemorse.org/jcal/easter.html
          >
          >
          >
          > a modern easter calculator
          >
          >
          >
          > Kees
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > _________________________________________________________________
          > De grappigste filmpjes vind je op MSN Video!
          > http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=nl-nl
          >
        • Cheese Curve
          To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com From: nadmateescu@yahoo.com Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:37:21 +0000 Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: easter
          Message 4 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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            To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
            From: nadmateescu@...
            Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:37:21 +0000
            Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: easter calculating



            Hi Kees,

            Yes. (So?)
             
            (;-) in Steiners time there were not yet computers....
            15.00 oclock in the afternoon he mentiones too

            Thanks for link. (http://www.timeandd ate.com/calendar /)

            Dan

            --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, Cheese Curve <K_Kromme@.. .> wrote:
            >
            >
            >
            > according to Steiner,
            >
            > good friday was on 3 april 33
            >
            >
            >
            > http://stevemorse. org/jcal/ easter.html
            >
            >
            >
            > a modern easter calculator
            >
            >
            >
            > Kees
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
            > De grappigste filmpjes vind je op MSN Video!
            > http://video. msn.com/video. aspx?mkt= nl-nl
            >




            Deel je favoriete foto's online met Windows Live Photos
          • dottie zold
            Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the capacity latent within
            Message 5 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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              Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light' within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.

              In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find this:

              " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time through the forces of Christ Jesus."

              Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is of Christ becomes realized within him.

              Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the example of man in the world. So is my thinking.

              Rudolf Steiner again:

              On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."

              Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one, is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward: all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart forces forming at the back of the head.

              Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of antipathies and sympathies...and this is what I have always always appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to spiritual science.

              Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears immediately...it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.

              I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.

              All good things,
              Dottie
            • dottie zold
              Hey Friends, Good Friday to you all. I had a consideration I wanted to share and it has to do with the pineal gland looking at the back of the skull....what
              Message 6 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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                Hey Friends, Good Friday to you all.

                I had a consideration I wanted to share and it has to do with the pineal gland 'looking' at the back of the skull....what is it looking at? Why is it mentioned that the etheric heart is at the back of the head? Why is it that we see a painting of the two, Adam and Eve, back to back?

                When I was thinking on this while reading Dennis K.'s book Seeking Spirit Vision, it came to me again how it is that we can understand Jesus when he says to Peter 'get ye behind me Satan'. and when it is that the Magdalene has to 'turn around' to see the teacher...it must also have something to do with the capacity that is forming at the back of the head, the etheric heart. So she sees Him there, she sees Him in and through the spirit viewfinder. By the time Peter and John have come to the cave the moment has passed and what they are looking for can not any longer be found 'there'. It's not about what was 'outside' but what was 'inside'.

                It's funny because we can read books but until we are able to have a reason to understand it can seem to allude us. And unfortunatley if you are good at assimilating 'information' and 'facts' about Spiritual Science, this helps not one iota towards experiencing in the heart, Christ. It can lead to this if one really works to become and develop into a good human being filled with love for the other even in differences, and mostly only if your sympathies and antipathies are cleared.

                It seems to me that if we arrive at it through the manner of focusing on images that are without they don't really help us develop the latent forces living within the heart to become what is called a 'new star'...we can say that because Rudolf Steiner has given us the imagination of the heart as a new sun. And the Sun we know has moved from a planet to a Star. So too must we move in the future but if we haven't developed the heart forces according to and rightly in rythm with today's consciousness soul, they will be given to us at a future date just as it is said that eight of our petals have been given and the other eight are our responsibility. But as students of Rudolf Steiner it seems to me that there is a greater responsibility to be of service to Michael which calls us to get it before it is given. For we must return to the spiritual world what they will need to keep us on course towards this next cosmos we are building. If we cannot who can.

                Holy Thursday was yesterday and it was an interesting day. Today we have Good Friday and another interesting day. I think it would be good to consider to realize that the Christ is speaking to us throughout our day. If we could have our mind on Him it would be good.

                All good things,
                Dottie
              • Kim
                Hello Dottie, I found this text The Human Heart A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May
                Message 7 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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                  Hello Dottie,

                  I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                  yesterday, and it's really interesting.

                  Love,
                  Kim

                  --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "dottie zold" <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light' within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                  >
                  > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find this:
                  >
                  > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                  >
                  > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is of Christ becomes realized within him.
                  >
                  > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                  >
                  > Rudolf Steiner again:
                  >
                  > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                  >
                  > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one, is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward: all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart forces forming at the back of the head.
                  >
                  > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of antipathies and sympathies...and this is what I have always always appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to spiritual science.
                  >
                  > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears immediately...it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.
                  >
                  > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                  >
                  > All good things,
                  > Dottie
                  >
                • dottie zold
                  So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that lecture and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were there with Rudolf
                  Message 8 of 20 , Apr 10, 2009
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                    So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that lecture and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were there with Rudolf Steiner, like Ehrenfried Pheiffer, Emil Bock, Willhem Zeylmans van Emmichoven, Rudolf Grosse, is that they have first hand experience with Rudolf Steiner and also digested the work in such a way that helps to flesh it out even further...I appreciate that about those gentlemen.
                     
                    Pheiffer also has a good book on the Chymical Wedding that is also really enlightning as well.
                     
                    All good things,
                    Dottie


                    "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner

                    --- On Fri, 4/10/09, Kim <kimgm@...> wrote:
                    From: Kim <kimgm@...>
                    Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                    To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Friday, April 10, 2009, 2:30 PM

                    Hello Dottie,

                    I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                    yesterday, and it's really interesting.

                    Love,
                    Kim

                    --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold" <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light' within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                    >
                    > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find this:
                    >
                    > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                    >
                    > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is of Christ becomes realized within him.
                    >
                    > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                    >
                    > Rudolf Steiner again:
                    >
                    > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                    >
                    > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one, is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward: all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart forces forming at the back of the head.
                    >
                    > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of antipathies and sympathies.. .and this is what I have always always appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to spiritual science.
                    >
                    > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears immediately. ..it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.
                    >
                    > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                    >
                    > All good things,
                    > Dottie
                    >

                  • Kim
                    It s description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives. The heart is
                    Message 9 of 20 , Apr 11, 2009
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                      It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives.

                      The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ between Lucifer and Ahriman.

                      The following  puts us in relation to our sun system:
                      Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral structure — wherein the heart is floating, so to speak — contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul and spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms. Now, as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the etheric body of his heart.
                      And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers 
                      Saturn
                       
                      Instincts
                      Jupiter
                       
                      Inclinations, sympathies
                      Mars
                       
                      Moral Impulses
                       
                      Sun
                       
                      Mercury
                       
                      Sagacity, Cleverness
                      Venus
                       
                      Love
                      Moon
                       
                      Phantasy, Imagination, Memory
                      And 
                      Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the physicalelements in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom the Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism. Between the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury, Venus and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid and aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect him from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you see, the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the two groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.

                      The Sun
                      These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.

                      /Kim


                      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, dottie zold <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that lecture and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were there with Rudolf Steiner, like Ehrenfried Pheiffer, Emil Bock, Willhem Zeylmans van Emmichoven, Rudolf Grosse, is that they have first hand experience with Rudolf Steiner and also digested the work in such a way that helps to flesh it out even further...I appreciate that about those gentlemen.
                      >  
                      > Pheiffer also has a good book on the Chymical Wedding that is also really enlightning as well.
                      >  
                      > All good things,
                      > Dottie
                      >
                      >
                      > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                      >
                      > --- On Fri, 4/10/09, Kim kimgm@... wrote:
                      >
                      > From: Kim kimgm@...
                      > Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                      > To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                      > Date: Friday, April 10, 2009, 2:30 PM
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello Dottie,
                      >
                      > I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                      > yesterday, and it's really interesting.
                      >
                      > Love,
                      > Kim
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold" dottie_z@ wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light' within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                      > >
                      > > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find this:
                      > >
                      > > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                      > >
                      > > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is of Christ becomes realized within him.
                      > >
                      > > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                      > >
                      > > Rudolf Steiner again:
                      > >
                      > > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                      > >
                      > > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one, is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward: all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart forces forming at the back of the head.
                      > >
                      > > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of antipathies and sympathies.. .and this is what I have always always appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to spiritual science.
                      > >
                      > > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears immediately. ..it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.
                      > >
                      > > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                      > >
                      > > All good things,
                      > > Dottie
                      > >
                      >
                    • dottie zold
                      Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of the head? An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary work
                      Message 10 of 20 , Apr 11, 2009
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                        Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of the head?

                        An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together' as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while contemplating their relationship....well actually while reading further work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.

                        All good things,
                        Dottie



                        > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the
                        > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives.
                        >
                        > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ
                        > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                        >
                        > [fig7-3]
                        > The following <http://roohit.com/f3914> puts us in relation to our sun
                        > system:
                        > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral
                        > structure — wherein the heart is floating, so to speak —
                        > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul and
                        > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms. Now,
                        > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                        > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is
                        > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the etheric
                        > body of his heart.
                        > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                        > <http://shinyurl.com/bc3e7>
                        > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral Impulses Sun
                        > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                        > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl.com/54b2c>
                        > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the physicalelements
                        > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom the
                        > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism. Between
                        > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury, Venus
                        > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid and
                        > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect him
                        > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you see,
                        > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the two
                        > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                        >
                        > [sun]
                        > The Sun
                        > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.
                        >
                        > /Kim
                        >
                        >
                        > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, dottie zold
                        > <dottie_z@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that lecture
                        > and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were
                        > there with Rudolf Steiner, like Ehrenfried Pheiffer, Emil Bock, Willhem
                        > Zeylmans van Emmichoven, Rudolf Grosse, is that they have first hand
                        > experience with Rudolf Steiner and also digested the work in such a way
                        > that helps to flesh it out even further...I appreciate that about those
                        > gentlemen.
                        > >
                        > > Pheiffer also has a good book on the Chymical Wedding that is also
                        > really enlightning as well.
                        > >
                        > > All good things,
                        > > Dottie
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the
                        > human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                        > >
                        > > --- On Fri, 4/10/09, Kim kimgm@ wrote:
                        > >
                        > > From: Kim kimgm@
                        > > Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                        > > To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                        > > Date: Friday, April 10, 2009, 2:30 PM
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Hello Dottie,
                        > >
                        > > I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner
                        > Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                        > > yesterday, and it's really interesting.
                        > >
                        > > Love,
                        > > Kim
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold"
                        > dottie_z@ wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really
                        > important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the
                        > capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the
                        > warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the
                        > experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the
                        > Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces
                        > that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial
                        > that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to
                        > intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light'
                        > within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting
                        > through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                        > > >
                        > > > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find
                        > this:
                        > > >
                        > > > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can
                        > receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be
                        > born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time
                        > through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                        > > >
                        > > > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when
                        > our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the
                        > sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when
                        > man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is
                        > of Christ becomes realized within him.
                        > > >
                        > > > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a
                        > part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next
                        > few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center
                        > and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual
                        > 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the
                        > heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as
                        > an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and
                        > outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going
                        > through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the
                        > example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                        > > >
                        > > > Rudolf Steiner again:
                        > > >
                        > > > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the
                        > etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a
                        > man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                        > > >
                        > > > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in
                        > the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one,
                        > is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems
                        > to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to
                        > the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these
                        > glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually
                        > show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher
                        > worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward:
                        > all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart
                        > forces forming at the back of the head.
                        > > >
                        > > > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a
                        > lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of
                        > antipathies and sympathies.. .and this is what I have always always
                        > appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides
                        > like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to
                        > spiritual science.
                        > > >
                        > > > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be
                        > seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears
                        > immediately. ..it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to
                        > me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the
                        > other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a
                        > humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which
                        > was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.
                        > > >
                        > > > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in
                        > his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births
                        > forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall
                        > which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the
                        > 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in
                        > the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                        > > >
                        > > > All good things,
                        > > > Dottie
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Kim
                        I have not read what Steiner had said about the neck chakra, but I am very interested! I don t believe that it is the heart who has moved up to the head, it
                        Message 11 of 20 , Apr 11, 2009
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                          I have not read what Steiner had said about the neck chakra, but I am very interested!

                          I don't believe that it is the heart who has moved up to the head, it sounds too Ahrimanic for me.

                          There are two possibilities, either it is the backward (Ahrimanian) part of the Brow Chakra or the Throat Chakra as seen in the following picture. I thought it was the back part of the Throat Chakra (and still do), as it has with communication to do, which the third eye also have, but of a higher visual art. The Neck chakra can control the muscles in the neck which are connected to the front head, and can induce pain at the brow if the person are acting against his own good. Of cause only if this chakra is functioning relatively good. It can be rather frustrating if you don't understand the cause or remedy in a given situation.
                          kopfgegch 

                          Throat Chakra: 5. Chesed, 6. Gevurah,
                          Third Eye: 7. Chokmah, 8. Binah,
                          Crown Chakra: 9. Daat, 10. Kether

                           

                          Throat Chakra

                          /Kim

                          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "dottie zold" <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of the head?
                          >
                          > An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together' as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while contemplating their relationship....well actually while reading further work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.
                          >
                          > All good things,
                          > Dottie
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the
                          > > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives.
                          > >
                          > > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ
                          > > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                          > >
                          > > [fig7-3]
                          > > The following <http://roohit.com/f3914> puts us in relation to our sun
                          > > system:
                          > > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral
                          > > structure — wherein the heart is floating, so to speak —
                          > > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul and
                          > > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms. Now,
                          > > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                          > > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is
                          > > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the etheric
                          > > body of his heart.
                          > > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                          > > <http://shinyurl.com/bc3e7>
                          > > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral Impulses Sun
                          > > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                          > > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl.com/54b2c>
                          > > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the physicalelements
                          > > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom the
                          > > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism. Between
                          > > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury, Venus
                          > > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid and
                          > > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect him
                          > > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you see,
                          > > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the two
                          > > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                          > >
                          > > [sun]
                          > > The Sun
                          > > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.
                          > >
                          > > /Kim

                        • dottie zold
                          Hi Kim, here is the article wherein it is mentioned. It references Rudolf Steiner s GA 161 May 1, 1915. I was looking for the title but it is not available on
                          Message 12 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                            Hi Kim, here is the article wherein it is mentioned. It references Rudolf Steiner's GA 161 May 1, 1915. I was looking for the title but it is not available on elib yet. I will see if I can get it from someone.
                             

                            by Ruth Haertl,
                            Michaelmas 2000
                            Translated by Monica Gold


                            This essay concerning the etheric heart touches on the most profound mysteries of the human being. It touches on individual processes in human life as well as on evolutionary changes which affect all mankind. Knowledge of these changes are significant for us when we want to expand the ability for future Karma-cognition.

                            To begin with I will give a brief summary of the development of the etheric heart. Rudolf Steiner described the process in great detail when he discussed the formation of the etheric heart in children.

                            Before birth etheric forces are drawn together to create the individual etheric body. These ether forces harbour substances which are taken from the entire cosmos.

                            A Study of
                            The Formation of a New Etheric Heart Organ in the Light of the Present
                            Michaelic Mystery Culture as Rudolf Steiner Required it for our Age
                            in his Lectures
                            “Die Sendung Michaels und Die Offenbarung der eigentlichen
                            Geheimnisse des Menschenwesens”

                            Figure 1 
                            Figure 1
                            (from: GA 212, May 26, 1922)

                            In a drawing of the etheric heart Rudolf Steiner shows the periphery of the stars, the heart amid sun and moon, while further down the earthly is indicated. “It is important to know that when we descend into the earthly world we draw into ourselves a kind of image from the cosmos.” This first etheric heart configuration Rudolf Steiner regards as provisional or as inherited. It remains with the child only until he loses his teeth. At age seven it falls away. Rudolf Steiner even says: “it decays”. It is cast off just as the teeth are discarded at age seven. The wonderful cosmic configuration of the starry images fades more and more as the seventh birthday approaches. This happens at the time when the child's own etheric body is born.

                            Rays of ether configurations begin to form anew and strive from the periphery to the centre. Here they accumulate around the physical heart and as they grow together, the new second etheric heart is born. It is the individualized etheric heart of the growing young person who matures from age seven to fourteen.

                            It happens through a process whereby bit by bit the new etheric heart replaces whatever dies off from the inherited heart. The new heart is condensed from the entire world sphere.

                            In another of Steiner's lectures we read that at puberty the astral body is restructured in a new configuration. In the same area of the body in which the second etheric heart was formed as a reflection of the stars, sun and moon, the forces of the astral body establish an additional central organ. These two organs weave in and out of each other as one central organ and in it are inscribed all deeds, all moral motivations, human intentions and ideas.

                            In one of his lectures Rudolf Steiner speaks of a small box in which everything concerning our life is recorded. As students on the path of initiation we are meant gradually to become able to read and interpret our past karmic deeds, we are supposed to grow towards an understanding of all that which is inscribed into the etheric heart. It was the 27 of February, 1925 on his sixty-third birthday that Rudolf Steiner gave the following related meditation to Dr. Ita Wegman.

                            “Hearts interpret Karma
                            When hearts learn to read
                            The Word,
                            Which creates in
                            Human Life;
                            When hearts learn to
                            Speak the Word
                            Which


                          • dottie zold
                            Hi Kim, Good Sunday to you,   Below is the article wherein the third heart at the back of the head can be referenced. GA 161, May 1, 1915 is the lecture she
                            Message 13 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                              Hi Kim, Good Sunday to you,
                               
                              Below is the article wherein the third heart at the back of the head can be referenced. GA 161, May 1, 1915 is the lecture she uses however it is not availabe on elib. I shall see if we can get a hold of this unless Mr. Stewart can make it available.
                               
                              From: dottie zold <dottie_z@...>
                              Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                              To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                              Date: Saturday, April 11, 2009, 6:49 AM

                              Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of the head?

                              An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together' as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while contemplating their relationship. ...well actually while reading further work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.

                              All good things,
                              Dottie

                              > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the
                              > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives.
                              >
                              > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ
                              > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                              >
                              > [fig7-3]
                              > The following <http://roohit. com/f3914> puts us in relation to our sun
                              > system:
                              > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral
                              > structure — wherein the heart is floating, so to speak —
                              > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul and
                              > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms. Now,
                              > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                              > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is
                              > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the etheric
                              > body of his heart.
                              > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                              > <http://shinyurl. com/bc3e7>
                              > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral Impulses Sun
                              > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                              > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl. com/54b2c>
                              > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the physicalelements
                              > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom the
                              > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism. Between
                              > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury, Venus
                              > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid and
                              > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect him
                              > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you see,
                              > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the two
                              > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                              >
                              > [sun]
                              > The Sun
                              > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.
                              >
                              > /Kim
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, dottie zold
                              > <dottie_z@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that lecture
                              > and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were
                              > there with Rudolf Steiner, like Ehrenfried Pheiffer, Emil Bock, Willhem
                              > Zeylmans van Emmichoven, Rudolf Grosse, is that they have first hand
                              > experience with Rudolf Steiner and also digested the work in such a way
                              > that helps to flesh it out even further...I appreciate that about those
                              > gentlemen.
                              > >
                              > > Pheiffer also has a good book on the Chymical Wedding that is also
                              > really enlightning as well.
                              > >
                              > > All good things,
                              > > Dottie
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the
                              > human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                              > >
                              > > --- On Fri, 4/10/09, Kim kimgm@ wrote:
                              > >
                              > > From: Kim kimgm@
                              > > Subject: [anthroposophy_ tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                              > > To: anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com
                              > > Date: Friday, April 10, 2009, 2:30 PM
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Hello Dottie,
                              > >
                              > > I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner
                              > Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                              > > yesterday, and it's really interesting.
                              > >
                              > > Love,
                              > > Kim
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold"
                              > dottie_z@ wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are really
                              > important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the
                              > capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences the
                              > warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has the
                              > experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences the
                              > Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart forces
                              > that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial
                              > that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to
                              > intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of light'
                              > within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and righting
                              > through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                              > > >
                              > > > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we find
                              > this:
                              > > >
                              > > > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can
                              > receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be
                              > born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second time
                              > through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                              > > >
                              > > > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart when
                              > our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the
                              > sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and when
                              > man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which is
                              > of Christ becomes realized within him.
                              > > >
                              > > > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a
                              > part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the next
                              > few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to center
                              > and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual
                              > 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that the
                              > heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart as
                              > an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and
                              > outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going
                              > through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is the
                              > example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                              > > >
                              > > > Rudolf Steiner again:
                              > > >
                              > > > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from the
                              > etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in a
                              > man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                              > > >
                              > > > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this in
                              > the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third one,
                              > is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it seems
                              > to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up to
                              > the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now these
                              > glands play an important part of our ongoing development and actually
                              > show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the higher
                              > worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work upward:
                              > all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart
                              > forces forming at the back of the head.
                              > > >
                              > > > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a
                              > lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of
                              > antipathies and sympathies.. .and this is what I have always always
                              > appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play sides
                              > like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes to
                              > spiritual science.
                              > > >
                              > > > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can not be
                              > seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears
                              > immediately. ..it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems to
                              > me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that the
                              > other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as a
                              > humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that which
                              > was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and soul.
                              > > >
                              > > > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K. in
                              > his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb births
                              > forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall
                              > which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards the
                              > 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of development in
                              > the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                              > > >
                              > > > All good things,
                              > > > Dottie
                              > > >
                              > >
                              >


                            • dottie zold
                              Crown chakra Kim, related to the Crown chakra...somehow through the...well I shall just make a mess of it but it seems to me that out of my experience, it has
                              Message 14 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Crown chakra Kim, related to the Crown chakra...somehow through the...well I shall just make a mess of it but it seems to me that out of my experience, it has something to do with the pineal gland, the pituitary gland, the higher and the lower, metabolic and neurological, and then a raying up of sorts from where they meet in the middle...well, that's kinda how it feels in an imagination and also a sensation....
                                 
                                So, Kim, tell me, what does the left hand, one where the Christ Jesus had a nail go through, signify? If one was to feel that in their left hand only what would it signify?
                                d

                                "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner

                                --- On Sat, 4/11/09, Kim <kimgm@...> wrote:
                                From: Kim <kimgm@...>
                                Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                                To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                                Date: Saturday, April 11, 2009, 1:18 PM

                                I have not read what Steiner had said about the neck chakra, but I am very interested!

                                I don't believe that it is the heart who has moved up to the head, it sounds too Ahrimanic for me.

                                There are two possibilities, either it is the backward (Ahrimanian) part of the Brow Chakra or the Throat Chakra as seen in the following picture. I thought it was the back part of the Throat Chakra (and still do), as it has with communication to do, which the third eye also have, but of a higher visual art. The Neck chakra can control the muscles in the neck which are connected to the front head, and can induce pain at the brow if the person are acting against his own good. Of cause only if this chakra is functioning relatively good. It can be rather frustrating if you don't understand the cause or remedy in a given situation.
                                kopfgegch 

                                Throat Chakra: 5. Chesed, 6. Gevurah,
                                Third Eye: 7. Chokmah, 8. Binah,
                                Crown Chakra: 9. Daat, 10. Kether

                                throat-chakra 

                                Throat Chakra

                                /Kim

                                --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold" <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of the head?
                                >
                                > An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together' as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while contemplating their relationship. ...well actually while reading further work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.
                                >
                                > All good things,
                                > Dottie
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it the
                                > > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our lives.
                                > >
                                > > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ
                                > > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                                > >
                                > > [fig7-3]
                                > > The following <http://roohit. com/f3914> puts us in relation to our sun
                                > > system:
                                > > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral
                                > > structure — wherein the heart is floating, so to speak —
                                > > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul and
                                > > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms. Now,
                                > > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                                > > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is
                                > > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the etheric
                                > > body of his heart.
                                > > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                                > > <http://shinyurl. com/bc3e7>
                                > > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral Impulses Sun
                                > > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                                > > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl. com/54b2c>
                                > > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the physicalelements
                                > > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom the
                                > > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism. Between
                                > > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury, Venus
                                > > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid and
                                > > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect him
                                > > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you see,
                                > > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the two
                                > > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                                > >
                                > > [sun]
                                > > The Sun
                                > > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.
                                > >
                                > > /Kim


                              • Kim
                                That made it clearer. It s the Crown Chakra, who gets opened by grace when we have opened our other Chakras by work. It s our connection to the higher
                                Message 15 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                                  That made it clearer. It's the Crown Chakra, who gets opened by grace
                                  when we have opened our other Chakras by work. It's our connection to
                                  the higher hierarchies, to Christ, to God.
                                  /Kim


                                  --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, dottie zold
                                  <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hi Kim, Good Sunday to you,
                                  > Â
                                  > Below is the article wherein the third heart at the back of the head
                                  can be referenced. GA 161, May 1, 1915 is the lecture she uses however
                                  it is not availabe on elib. I shall see if we can get a hold of this
                                  unless Mr. Stewart can make it available.
                                  > Â
                                  >
                                  http://images.google.com.au/imgres?imgurl=http://wn.rsarchive.org/RelArt\
                                  ic/GoldM/images/eh_diagram04s.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.rsarchive.org/Rel\
                                  Artic/GoldM/etheric_heart.html&usg=__oEgSox-gWLHmf26ccpRyK_whSQE=&h=274&\
                                  w=300&sz=3&hl=en&start=8&um=1&tbnid=LyMjmg8_RyJFpM:&tbnh=106&tbnw=116&pr\
                                  ev=/images%3Fq%3Detheric%2Bheart%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG%26um%3D1
                                  >
                                  > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the
                                  human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                                  >
                                  > --- On Sat, 4/11/09, dottie zold dottie_z@... wrote:
                                  >
                                  > From: dottie zold dottie_z@...
                                  > Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                                  > To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Date: Saturday, April 11, 2009, 6:49 AM
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of
                                  the head?
                                  >
                                  > An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary
                                  work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher
                                  beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head
                                  and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together'
                                  as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while
                                  contemplating their relationship. ...well actually while reading further
                                  work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we
                                  study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those
                                  areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.
                                  >
                                  > All good things,
                                  > Dottie
                                  >
                                  > > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body it
                                  the
                                  > > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our
                                  lives.
                                  > >
                                  > > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as Christ
                                  > > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                                  > >
                                  > > [fig7-3]
                                  > > The following <http://roohit. com/f3914> puts us in relation to our
                                  sun
                                  > > system:
                                  > > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this ethereal-astral
                                  > > structure â€" wherein the heart is floating, so to speak
                                  â€"
                                  > > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul
                                  and
                                  > > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms.
                                  Now,
                                  > > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                                  > > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos is
                                  > > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the
                                  etheric
                                  > > body of his heart.
                                  > > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                                  > > <http://shinyurl. com/bc3e7>
                                  > > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral Impulses
                                  Sun
                                  > > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                                  > > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl. com/54b2c>
                                  > > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the
                                  physicalelements
                                  > > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom
                                  the
                                  > > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism.
                                  Between
                                  > > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury,
                                  Venus
                                  > > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid, fluid
                                  and
                                  > > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect
                                  him
                                  > > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you
                                  see,
                                  > > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the
                                  two
                                  > > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                                  > >
                                  > > [sun]
                                  > > The Sun
                                  > > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic view.
                                  > >
                                  > > /Kim
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, dottie zold
                                  > > <dottie_z@> wrote:
                                  > > >
                                  > > > So what did you appreciate about that lecture Kim? I have that
                                  lecture
                                  > > and what I appreciate most about the early students, those that were
                                  > > there with Rudolf Steiner, like Ehrenfried Pheiffer, Emil Bock,
                                  Willhem
                                  > > Zeylmans van Emmichoven, Rudolf Grosse, is that they have first hand
                                  > > experience with Rudolf Steiner and also digested the work in such a
                                  way
                                  > > that helps to flesh it out even further...I appreciate that about
                                  those
                                  > > gentlemen.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Pheiffer also has a good book on the Chymical Wedding that is also
                                  > > really enlightning as well.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > All good things,
                                  > > > Dottie
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be
                                  the
                                  > > human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                                  > > >
                                  > > > --- On Fri, 4/10/09, Kim kimgm@ wrote:
                                  > > >
                                  > > > From: Kim kimgm@
                                  > > > Subject: [anthroposophy_ tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and
                                  beyond
                                  > > > To: anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com
                                  > > > Date: Friday, April 10, 2009, 2:30 PM
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Hello Dottie,
                                  > > >
                                  > > > I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner
                                  > > Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                                  > > > yesterday, and it's really interesting.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Love,
                                  > > > Kim
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold"
                                  > > dottie_z@ wrote:
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Hey Taz, I wanted to say that these thoughts on the heart are
                                  really
                                  > > important, not just because of the thinking but also because of the
                                  > > capacity latent within it: the heart is an organ that experiences
                                  the
                                  > > warmth, which is light, which, when one is working lawfully, one has
                                  the
                                  > > experience of the Christ: it is in the heart that one experiences
                                  the
                                  > > Christ, not in religion, in the heart. It is through the heart
                                  forces
                                  > > that we learn to 'breathe light' versus breathing air. It is crucial
                                  > > that we can experience this in our imagination and then it rises to
                                  > > intuition and from there we begin to work with this 'breathing of
                                  light'
                                  > > within the spirit body itself, the one that we are forming and
                                  righting
                                  > > through our actions, all kinds, thinking, feeling, and willing.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > In How Can Mankind Find the Christ Again? December 22, 1918 we
                                  find
                                  > > this:
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > " The Christ is a Being, through Whom the rest of humanity can
                                  > > receive what they cannot receive through physical birth...we must be
                                  > > born twice; the first time through the forces of nature, the second
                                  time
                                  > > through the forces of Christ Jesus."
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Dottie: Now, the place where this is reconciled is in the heart
                                  when
                                  > > our blood is working towards etherization. I say etherization in the
                                  > > sense that the blood is connected to the moral element in man and
                                  when
                                  > > man rises so does the content of his blood transform and that which
                                  is
                                  > > of Christ becomes realized within him.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Frank Chester, who has found the geometry of the heart, and is a
                                  > > part of the conferences taking place on East and West coast in the
                                  next
                                  > > few weeks, speaks of the heart as n organ goes from periphery to
                                  center
                                  > > and center to periphery, there is something that serves as an actual
                                  > > 'eye' of the heart that moves in this manner. It seems to me that
                                  the
                                  > > heart shows exacly mans own development here on the earth, the heart
                                  as
                                  > > an organ, and its regulating of the blood, the balance of inner and
                                  > > outer, shows us, explains to us, what our consciousness is going
                                  > > through, is working on and developing into, the heart as an organ is
                                  the
                                  > > example of man in the world. So is my thinking.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Rudolf Steiner again:
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > On the etheric body ~ "For the chief forces working in us from
                                  the
                                  > > etheric body, out of the depths of our being, are those expressed in
                                  a
                                  > > man's capacity for loving at every moment of his existence."
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Dottie: We experience this warmth as a grace, we experience this
                                  in
                                  > > the vicincity of the heart. The etheric heart it is said, the third
                                  one,
                                  > > is at the back of the head. If we follow the Medula Oblongata it
                                  seems
                                  > > to me that we can follow how it is the forces of the blood move up
                                  to
                                  > > the head wherein we find the pineal and also pituitary glands. Now
                                  these
                                  > > glands play an important part of our ongoing development and
                                  actually
                                  > > show how and where it is that we need work: we either allow the
                                  higher
                                  > > worlds to work down into us or we allow the lower forces to work
                                  upward:
                                  > > all this is seen in the brain and then its connection to the heart
                                  > > forces forming at the back of the head.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Something has to transform when we wake up the Will in love, a
                                  > > lawful love, an objective love, one that does not play sides out of
                                  > > antipathies and sympathies.. .and this is what I have always always
                                  > > appreciated about Tarjei more than anyone I know: he doesn't play
                                  sides
                                  > > like that, he is objective and he has a pure integrity when it comes
                                  to
                                  > > spiritual science.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Frank Chester says that the fifth chamber that is forming can
                                  not be
                                  > > seen. With the beat of the heart it forms and then disappears
                                  > > immediately. ..it is an ongoing element that keeps moving...it seems
                                  to
                                  > > me that this must also be the picture imagination of how it is that
                                  the
                                  > > other four, I imagine at some point representing our attainments as
                                  a
                                  > > humanity towards the ego, were formed within the womb: off of that
                                  which
                                  > > was already attained as an ongoing evolution of body, spirit, and
                                  soul.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > I will share when I get another moment, the quote by Dennis K.
                                  in
                                  > > his book Seeking Spirit Vision. In here he speaks of how the womb
                                  births
                                  > > forth in the physical whereas the pineal or pituitary, cannot recall
                                  > > which one, births forth images....for me this is speaking towards
                                  the
                                  > > 'light and the warmth' that is creating the next level of
                                  development in
                                  > > the Sixth Epoch, the Christ birth in us.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > All good things,
                                  > > > > Dottie
                                  > > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                • Kim
                                  The Pineal Gland is related to the Brow Chakra, but all Chakras are related to the crown chakra. Left hand is the Father or Luciferic side (red), where the
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                                    The Pineal Gland is related to the Brow Chakra, but all Chakras are
                                    related to the crown chakra.

                                    Left hand is the Father or Luciferic side (red), where the right hand is
                                    the Mother or Ahrimanic side (blue).

                                    But what it means I can't say, at least yet, but I have no idea.

                                    Kim

                                    --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, dottie zold
                                    <dottie_z@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Crown chakra Kim, related to the Crown chakra...somehow through
                                    the...well I shall just make a mess of it but it seems to me that out of
                                    my experience, it has something to do with the pineal gland, the
                                    pituitary gland, the higher and the lower, metabolic and neurological,
                                    and then a raying up of sorts from where they meet in the middle...well,
                                    that's kinda how it feels in an imagination and also a sensation....
                                    > Â
                                    > So, Kim, tell me, what does the left hand, one where the Christ Jesus
                                    had a nail go through, signify? If one was to feel that in their left
                                    hand only what would it signify?
                                    > d
                                    >
                                    > "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the
                                    human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner
                                    >
                                    > --- On Sat, 4/11/09, Kim kimgm@... wrote:
                                    >
                                    > From: Kim kimgm@...
                                    > Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                                    > To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Date: Saturday, April 11, 2009, 1:18 PM
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > I have not read what Steiner had said about the neck chakra, but I am
                                    very interested!
                                    >
                                    > I don't believe that it is the heart who has moved up to the head, it
                                    sounds too Ahrimanic for me.
                                    >
                                    > There are two possibilities, either it is the backward (Ahrimanian)
                                    part of the Brow Chakra or the Throat Chakra as seen in the following
                                    picture. I thought it was the back part of the Throat Chakra (and still
                                    do), as it has with communication to do, which the third eye also have,
                                    but of a higher visual art. The Neck chakra can control the muscles in
                                    the neck which are connected to the front head, and can induce pain at
                                    the brow if the person are acting against his own good. Of cause only if
                                    this chakra is functioning relatively good. It can be rather frustrating
                                    if you don't understand the cause or remedy in a given situation.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Â
                                    > Throat Chakra: 5. Chesed, 6. Gevurah,
                                    > Third Eye: 7. Chokmah, 8. Binah,
                                    > Crown Chakra: 9. Daat, 10. Kether
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Â
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Throat Chakra
                                    > /Kim
                                    >
                                    > --- In anthroposophy_ tomorrow@ yahoogroups. com, "dottie zold"
                                    dottie_z@ wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Kim have you not heard it described by Rudolf Steiner at the back of
                                    the head?
                                    > >
                                    > > An experience I had last night was that the pineal and the pituitary
                                    work together in a way when it comes to working with the higher
                                    beings...there is a sensation that can be felt at the back of the head
                                    and at the top of the head at the same time...I say 'working together'
                                    as it was the first time I experienced them at the same time while
                                    contemplating their relationship. ...well actually while reading further
                                    work in Dennis K.s book. I realized an experience that happens when we
                                    study and the Being is working with us, we can experience it in those
                                    areas, almost like a 'lighting up' of sorts.
                                    > >
                                    > > All good things,
                                    > > Dottie
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > > It's description of the interplay between Astral and Etheric body
                                    it the
                                    > > > clearest I have seen until now, here you see how Karma enters our
                                    lives.
                                    > > >
                                    > > > The heart is described in it's right place, in the middle, as
                                    Christ
                                    > > > between Lucifer and Ahriman.
                                    > > >
                                    > > > [fig7-3]
                                    > > > The following <http://roohit. com/f3914> puts us in relation to
                                    our sun
                                    > > > system:
                                    > > > Then when man passes through the gate of death, this
                                    ethereal-astral
                                    > > > structure â€" wherein the heart is floating, so to speak
                                    â€"
                                    > > > contains all that man takes with him into his further life of soul
                                    and
                                    > > > spirit, when he has laid aside the physical and the etheric forms.
                                    Now,
                                    > > > as he expands ever more widely in the spirit, he can hand over his
                                    > > > entire karma to the cosmos, for the substance of the whole cosmos
                                    is
                                    > > > contained within him; it is drawn together in his heart, in the
                                    etheric
                                    > > > body of his heart.
                                    > > > And with this from Human Questions and Cosmic Answers
                                    > > > <http://shinyurl. com/bc3e7>
                                    > > > Saturn InstinctsJupiter Inclinations, sympathiesMars Moral
                                    Impulses Sun
                                    > > > Mercury Sagacity, ClevernessVenus LoveMoon Phantasy, Imagination,
                                    > > > MemoryAnd <http://shinyurl. com/54b2c>
                                    > > > Thus the planets near the Sun have to do more with the
                                    physicalelements
                                    > > > in man's organism: solid, fluid aeriform. The planets distantfrom
                                    the
                                    > > > Sun have to do more with the etheric elements in man sorganism.
                                    Between
                                    > > > the two groups of planets is the Sun itself. Theforces of Mercury,
                                    Venus
                                    > > > and Moon bring the human being intoconnection with the solid,
                                    fluid and
                                    > > > aeriform elements. The forces ofMars, Jupiter and Saturn. protect
                                    him
                                    > > > from Rowing away into theWarmth, Light and Chemical Ethers. As you
                                    see,
                                    > > > the effects arepolaric. And the Sun stands between, preventing the
                                    two
                                    > > > groups of planetary forces from interpenetrating.
                                    > > >
                                    > > > [sun]
                                    > > > The Sun
                                    > > > These documents give together a macro cosmic and micro cosmic
                                    view.
                                    > > >
                                    > > > /Kim
                                    >
                                  • Kim
                                    Dottie: So, Kim, tell me, what does the left hand, one where the Christ Jesus had a nail go through, signify? If one was to feel that in their left hand only
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                                      Dottie: So, Kim, tell me, what does the left hand, one where the Christ Jesus had a nail go through, signify? If one was to feel that in their left hand only what would it signify?

                                      I am still not sure, but I think the following might give a lead. Left hand is connected with the Father or Lucifer, and it's the place where the Water Ether goes over in the Fire Ether. The drawing shows the left hand as Jupiter.

                                      From the Contents of Esoteric Classes 

                                      We're always surrounded by five ether streams in the world around us on earth. They're called earth, water, fire, air and thought ethers. These etheric streams are also active in man: earth either from the head to the right foot, from there water ether to the left hand, from there fire ether to the right hand, from there air ether to the left foot, and then thought ether back to the head. This is the occultist's sacred pentagram, the symbol of man. Its point is directed upwards, which indicates that the spirit streams to man from the heights. The pentagram is present in many flowers and other things in nature. The sign of black magic is a pentagram with one point at the bottom, through which magicians attract bad forces from the earth and send them out of the two top horns into the environment by means of their bad will in order to use soul and nature forces for their own egotistical, evil purposes.

                                      The cross sections of the five etheric streams and their connections with color, taste, and body regions are as follows:

                                      Square with only corners distinct earth ether, square with only the corners distinct, yellow, sweet, bones and muscles;

                                      Crescent moon at fifth day water ether, crescent moon at fifth day, white, tart, digestion;

                                      Equilateral triangle fire ether, equilateral triangle, red, hot, blood;

                                      Circle air ether, circle, green, sour, nerves;

                                      Two intersecting spirals - one distinct thought (akasha) ether, two intersecting spirals — one is distinct, dark blue, bitter, lymph vessel system.

                                       

                                      Occult Signs and Symbols

                                      Let us consider the pentagram. You know that much abstruse thinking has been spent on it; this is not the concern of occultism. In order to understand what the occultist says about the pentagram, we must at first call to mind the seven fundamental parts of the human being, and it is, above all, the etheric body that is especially relevant in this consideration. You know that the etheric body belongs to the sphere of the occult; it is not to be seen with physical eyes. To perceive it, clairvoyant methods are necessary. Then it will become evident that the essentiality of the etheric body does not consist in its appearing as a fine nebulous formation. It is characteristic of it that it is indeed, the architect, the creator of the physical body. Just as ice forms out of water, so does the physical body fashion itself out of the etheric body, which, like the ocean, is flooded through by many currents flowing in all directions. Among them are five main currents. When you stand with feet apart and arms outstretched, you can accurately follow the direction of these five currents. They form a pentagram.

                                      Everybody has these five currents hidden in him. The healthy etheric body appears so that these currents are, as it were, his bony framework. You must not suppose however, that everything pertaining to the etheric body is only within, because when a person moves, for instance, the currents actually go through the air. This pentagram is as mobile as a man's physical bony framework. Thus, when the occultist speaks of the pentagram as the figure of man, it is not a matter of something that has been thought out, but rather he is speaking of it as the anatomist does of the skeleton. This figure is really present in the etheric body. It is a fact.

                                      /Kim
                                    • dottie zold
                                      Left hand, right brain....that is the sensation right now...so, I have wonder if we consider the wounds of Christ Jesus how they meet up....it is something
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Apr 12, 2009
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                                        Left hand, right brain....that is the sensation right now...so, I have wonder if we consider the wounds of Christ Jesus how they meet up....it is something about that, something how the wounds meet up.....d

                                        "If there is something more powerful than destiny, this must be the human being who bears destiny unshaken." Rudolf Steiner

                                        --- On Sun, 4/12/09, Kim <kimgm@...> wrote:
                                        From: Kim <kimgm@...>
                                        Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Easter thoughts -- and beyond
                                        To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
                                        Date: Sunday, April 12, 2009, 2:11 PM

                                        Dottie: So, Kim, tell me, what does the left hand, one where the Christ Jesus had a nail go through, signify? If one was to feel that in their left hand only what would it signify?

                                        I am still not sure, but I think the following might give a lead. Left hand is connected with the Father or Lucifer, and it's the place where the Water Ether goes over in the Fire Ether. The drawing shows the left hand as Jupiter.

                                        We're always surrounded by five ether streams in the world around us on earth. They're called earth, water, fire, air and thought ethers. These etheric streams are also active in man: earth either from the head to the right foot, from there water ether to the left hand, from there fire ether to the right hand, from there air ether to the left foot, and then thought ether back to the head. This is the occultist's sacred pentagram, the symbol of man. Its point is directed upwards, which indicates that the spirit streams to man from the heights. The pentagram is present in many flowers and other things in nature. The sign of black magic is a pentagram with one point at the bottom, through which magicians attract bad forces from the earth and send them out of the two top horns into the environment by means of their bad will in order to use soul and nature forces for their own egotistical, evil purposes.

                                        The cross sections of the five etheric streams and their connections with color, taste, and body regions are as follows:

                                        Square with only corners distinct earth ether, square with only the corners distinct, yellow, sweet, bones and muscles;

                                        Crescent moon at fifth day water ether, crescent moon at fifth day, white, tart, digestion;

                                        Equilateral triangle fire ether, equilateral triangle, red, hot, blood;

                                        Circle air ether, circle, green, sour, nerves; Two intersecting spirals - one distinct thought (akasha) ether, two intersecting spirals — one is distinct, dark blue, bitter, lymph vessel system.

                                         

                                        Occult Signs and Symbols
                                        Let us consider the pentagram. You know that much abstruse thinking has been spent on it; this is not the concern of occultism. In order to understand what the occultist says about the pentagram, we must at first call to mind the seven fundamental parts of the human being, and it is, above all, the etheric body that is especially relevant in this consideration. You know that the etheric body belongs to the sphere of the occult; it is not to be seen with physical eyes. To perceive it, clairvoyant methods are necessary. Then it will become evident that the essentiality of the etheric body does not consist in its appearing as a fine nebulous formation. It is characteristic of it that it is indeed, the architect, the creator of the physical body. Just as ice forms out of water, so does the physical body fashion itself out of the etheric body, which, like the ocean, is flooded through by many currents flowing in all directions. Among them are five main currents. When you stand with feet apart and arms outstretched, you can accurately follow the direction of these five currents. They form a pentagram.
                                        Everybody has these five currents hidden in him. The healthy etheric body appears so that these currents are, as it were, his bony framework. You must not suppose however, that everything pertaining to the etheric body is only within, because when a person moves, for instance, the currents actually go through the air. This pentagram is as mobile as a man's physical bony framework. Thus, when the occultist speaks of the pentagram as the figure of man, it is not a matter of something that has been thought out, but rather he is speaking of it as the anatomist does of the skeleton. This figure is really present in the etheric body. It is a fact.
                                        /Kim

                                      • holderlin66
                                        I found this text The Human Heart A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Apr 13, 2009
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                                          I found this text "The Human Heart " A Lecture By Rudolf Steiner Dornach, May 26, 1922 GA 212
                                          yesterday, and it's really interesting.

                                          " For, at death, what is gathered up and concentrated there in the human being becomes increasingly cosmic; and in our next earthly life it is incorporated in the human being once again out of the cosmos. Everything we do, accordingly, concerns not ourselves alone. Incorporated within us is something that comes from the cosmos and retains the tendency, after our death, to give over our deeds to the cosmos once more. For it is from the cosmos that the karmic laws work themselves out, fashioning our karma. So do we bear the effects of what the cosmos makes of our deeds back again into earthly life, at the beginning of our next life on earth."

                                          Bradford comments;

                                          The Human Heart lecture given in 1922 by Steiner gathers into focus many insights.  One such insight is something we have attempted to express for several years.  We bring with us a cosmic map, each person brings with them a picture of the stars, and karmic navigational tool.  Between the unfolding of the hereditary heart that links itself into the hereditary stream and the head and heart connection that tells us clearly that there are TWELVE CRANIAL NERVES, Steiner plots out clearly how the etheric and astral heart map becomes configured, and the navigational and individual birth and biography of our individual star forces are woven into the current karmic life scroll.

                                          We look upon the stars of entrance, where we entered and fixed our star configurations and we sink our karma, via the Lord of Karma into our hereditary stream, anchored in the etheric heart and gradually this first phase, like our first teeth, fall away and we gain for ourselves a more distinct field of our own heart capacities, more refined and integrated into our own karmic potentials.  It is here where in previous researches I sought this first Angelic Moon Node of approx. 19 years, where our heart and higher being and Angelic intention and soul forces have been integrated and intersect a star point where we re-transit that which inserted us into the karmic hereditary stream we chose on Earth.  At approx 19 and around 18.6 years our unique astral and star patterns and earthly personalities are form fitted, that is by the constellations we brought with us, that which has stamped our entrance into incarnation, that which we sometimes say is our first breath and we gather round a little cake and sing happy birthday, as another year of our physical incarnation is celebrated - obviously is only part of the equation of exactly how our etheric and astral bodies and finally our i am recover our thought and navigational star streaming and intentions and form our own emancipated karmic destiny.

                                          So as a preliminary research to the Karma lectures themselves, Steiner placed before us a picture of the Lord of Karmas technical activities within each human being as they mature, ripen and cast off the unneeded hereditary baggage and refine their own star intentions and karmic intentions for their incarnation.  Now certainly at age 14 approx we understand heart, love, sexuality and attractions to things that we become attracted to.  We get a taste for what our tastes and attractions will be.  By the first Moon Node at approx 19 years of age, the literal Moon returns to exactly the configuration it was in, when we first slid into incarnation and recalls, via our Angelic relation to our higher intentions, the cohesive star qualities we brought with us.

                                          This direction of research into the human heart supports what I have gathered and I am grateful to Kim and all the researchers for sweeping over the heart region.  For I had gotten to the point where I could understand the TWELVE CRANIAL NERVES as part of the mapping and star imprinting of our own unique region of thinking.  In other words we carry into incarnation via our astral nerve system and our TWELVE CRANIAL NERVES a field of potentials that reveal to us why each of us are unique insertions into Space out of Time.  Time might be spread out before us, all of those past incarnations, all of our memories in NDE or Near Death Experiences, reveal a sort of holographic death map of all our etheric and astral experiences laid out as a kind of spacial picture of Time.  A true Sun force system.

                                          But as we enter the research of the human heart that STeiner lays before us, we now grasp how etheric body forces, etheric habits, etheric temperaments and tendencies we carry with us from our previous incarnations merge into our hereditary heart and bodily etheric field like an overlay and how we outgrow and refine our parents patterns and come to the slow illumination of our own astral star configurations that were hidden in our etheric hearts.  Slowly our astral hearts and our TWELVE CRANIAL NERVES integrate and technically overlay just who we are and what we brought with us out of the stars, that now walks, talks, makes loves, finds love, works at unconditional love and thinks, acts and carries within ourselves our own unique star stamp that is monitored by the Angels every 18.6 years.

                                          Slowly we encounter our karmic Saturn forces carried through our entire biography every 29 1/2 years...These events are always specific to us and standard to all biographies and therefore the Christ weaves into all human biographies because the great I AM and the lesser i am's throb to the same Time sequence of the vernal points of the progressive Sun through the equinoxes.  But again, we are carrying the star charts of ourselves deeply imprinted and deeply laid in the foundation of our bodily, etheric and astral forces and these very star forces are linked directly to our hearts and our 12 cranial nerves.  How each human thinks and how they rid themselves of heredity domination and locate the strengths of their own star being and have their sympathies and antipathies, tastes in thought, poetry, films, relationships and etheric temperament tendencies brought under the shadow form of the Anima and Animus as well as the style we choose of Sanguine or Melancholic or phlegmatic or choleric out of the invisible elemental beings that came with us into incarnation from our starry companions where the constellations themselves tell of airy sylphs, air signs, earthy gnomes or earth signs, phlegmatic water or water undine style personality traits or fiery, salamandar and choleric traits, these appear in the style and direction of the physical and etheric sheaths.

                                          All the while our physical selves have an opposite mirrored karmic being known as our anima or animus that reveals previous incarnations where strongly feminine or strongly male forces direct our soul urges and our current political sexual games of same sex attractions.  But most importantly, are the refined constellation and thought tools, moral and ethically real forces, not phony or borrowed forces from our church or parents, all these hoops and hurdles that we as human beings accumulate as we go along our paths either obstruct or benefit our gifts.  In all the details that Steiner workds out in this heart lecture, we see the technical outline of just how the Lord of Karma harvests the forces of the stars we have alchemically transformed during our incarnations into new living courage to face the ongoing upward development of humanity.

                                          R.S.

                                          http://wn.rsarchive.org/Lectures/Places/Dornach/19220526p01.html

                                          "The etheric body, as it forms and develops itself in the human being, is a universe in itself — a universe, one might say, in picture form. At its circumference it manifests something in the nature of stars, and in its lower portion something that appears more or less as an image of the earth. It even has in it a kind of image of the sun nature and the moon nature.

                                          This is of great significance. On our descent into the earthly world, when we draw to ourselves the forces of the universal ether, we actually take with us in our etheric body a kind of image of the cosmos. If we could extract the etheric body of a man at the moment when he is uniting with the physical, we should have a sphere — far more beautiful than has ever been wrought by mechanical means — a sphere complete with stars and zodiac and sun and moon.

                                          These configurations of the etheric body remain during the embryonic time, while the human being coalesces more and more with his physical body. They begin to fade away a little, but they remain. Indeed they remain right on into the seventh year — that is, until the change of teeth. In the etheric body of the little child, this cosmic sphere is still quite recognizable. But with the seventh year — with the change of teeth — these forms that we behold in the etheric body begin to ray out, in a manner of speaking, previously they were more star-like; now they begin to be like rays. The stars dissolve away in the human ether body; but as they do so they become rays, rays with a tendency to come together inwardly.

                                          All this goes on gradually throughout the period of life between the change of teeth and puberty. At puberty the process is so far advanced that these rays, having grown together here in the center, form as it were a distinct structure — a distinct etheric structure of their own. The stars have faded out, while the structure which has gathered in the center becomes especially living. And in the midst of this central etheric structure, at the time of puberty, the physical heart, with its blood vessels, is suspended.

                                          So we have this strange phenomenon of the star-ether-body drawing inwards. As etheric body it is, of course, undifferentiated at the periphery of the organism — very little can be distinguished in there. On the other hand, during the time from the change of teeth until puberty, it is intensely radiant, raying from without inwards. Then it gathers itself together, and there, clearly suspended within it, is the physical heart."

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