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Hole Grunts

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  • Tarjei Straume
    You know how it is with sex: One thing lead to another, they always say afterwards. And so it was with the nasty sex-bomb under the label Warning: Porn Mode
    Message 1 of 35 , Jul 31 10:22 PM
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      You know how it is with sex: One thing lead to
      another, they always say afterwards. And so it
      was with the nasty sex-bomb under the label
      "Warning: Porn Mode" that I posted with such
      thundering force that I instantly knew it would
      reverberate throughout the Hole and shake it all
      the way down to the Abyss at the bottom, causing
      even the most revolting of demons to tremble. I
      should have checked it with our Basement
      Supervisor Mr. Helsher for polish and approval
      first, and a few minor test-blasts perhaps, but
      it went off completely before I got that far. Sorry, Mike.

      Anyway, the sex-ball or porn-ball began rolling
      in Mike's yard, when he was inspired by one of
      Steve's responses to Deborah, claiming to stick
      his neck out.... And from there it developed
      through the topic of circumcision and Bob Dylan
      pulling down his pants in the bank in his 115th
      Dream, and as we're in the middle of all this,
      Diana begins to pull her disgusting, dishonest,
      and infuriating stunts in the Hole, and bang, off
      it went - about the worst I've ever written, ever
      - well, on an anthro-list anyway.

      Diana has been busy dragging Linda and me into
      perdition along with Bradford, and of course she
      quotes my shock-bomb because who in the world
      could miss something like that ? But here's the
      fall-out, sooo typical of the Hole: Diana's
      fellow Hole-dwellers seem to claim I'm a Waldorf
      teacher or at least a Waldorf janitor, because
      it's so awful that Waldorf kids must be around
      folks like me who write things like that. You
      see, no anthro has any business anywhere except
      in Waldorf establishments, Waldorf schools,
      Waldorf kindergartens, or Waldorf daycare
      centers. Anthros are always working with kids,
      other people's kids, and not just neighbors
      either. Read one RS lecture, and wooops the next
      morning you wake up in a Waldorf school with Hole
      Dwellers' kids all around you. If there's an
      anthro-bum, an anthro-drunk lying in the gutter,
      smelling and attracting flies with some Steiner
      lecture-pamphlet sticking out of his pocket, he's
      always, always lying in some Waldorf school, and
      his smell will reach the nostrils of OUR
      children, yours and mine, if you don't heed the
      warnings from the Hole and learn that Waldorfs
      schools are teeming with foul-mouthed and
      foul-keyboarded anthro-bums, anthro-drunks, and anthro-junkies.

      Peter Staudenmaier, on the other hand, has other
      things in mind, like anti-Semitism. Surprise
      anyone? And here's something strange: When
      Bradford posted a quote from a nasty anti-Semitic
      article that was published on a left-wing
      anarchist website, it got me thinking about how
      the anti-Israeli agenda of the left leads to
      elements of anti-Semitism in that neck of the
      woods, in anarchist circles. Interestingly, Peter
      Staudenmaier mentions this in his latest post in the Hole.

      Staudenmaier mentions only in passing that
      anthropsophy is completely saturated with
      anti-Semitism - something that those of us who
      oppose it, are completely blind to, because we
      haven't read Steiner properly. But here is his
      interesting remark about anti-Semitism and the left:

      *****************************************************************************
      On the Americans for Waldorf Education website,
      co-created and co-sponsored by Linda, there is a
      prominently displayed quote from me that begins
      with the words "I am very critical of the
      academic realm"; Linda and her colleagues appear
      to think that this quote reflects poorly on me,
      though I may have misunderstood the point of
      their presentation. In either case, it is hard to
      square this part of their complaint about me and
      my work with Linda's new complaint. The core of
      that new complaint seem to be that I, and by
      extension other critics of anthroposophy, have
      failed to address antisemitism in my own ranks
      and have instead focused solely on antisemitism among anthroposophists.

      As it happens, just a week ago I gave a very
      public presentation in New York City on
      antisemitism in radical movements (that is, the
      movements that I am a part of, from left
      ecologist circles to critics of capitalism and
      globalization to the anti-war movement and
      opponents of Israeli policy in the Palestinian
      territories as well as the war in Lebanon). The
      last course that I offered at the Institute for
      Social Ecology was a critical examination of
      antisemitism historically and today, including
      particularly extensive attention to my own
      political and intellectual environments. I didn't
      mention anthroposophists in either instance
      (though I did remark at the NYC workshop that one
      of the longest standing antisemitic claims is
      that Jews are responsible for wars, only to find
      this confirmed a week later by a drunken Mel
      Gibson in Malibu). The critical articles that I
      have published about the anarchist movement, in
      addition, have consistently pointed out the
      antisemitic background of several prominent
      anarchists and urged my fellow anarchists to take
      this legacy seriously. I am by no means the only
      anarchist or the only leftist or the only
      anti-war activist (or certainly the only
      academic!) to make such stances public and call
      on others to reflect on their significance.

      This is indeed a relatively common aspect of
      movements that place significant value on
      critique. As anthroposophy takes the contrary
      view of critique, it seems sadly unlikey that the
      current trend of anthroposophist ignorance of the
      antisemitic elements in their own tradition will
      change soon. But we can always hope. Greetings to all,

      Peter Staudenmaier

      *****************************************************************************
      It's so strange to see that PS and I may have
      almost identical perspectives and political
      standpoints with regard to anti-Semitism on the
      left, anti-war, anarchism etc. This is why the
      world needs more anarchosophists, or
      anarcho-anthroposophists or whatever you choose
      to call them. The most prominent anarchosophist
      ever, who didn't call himself such, but simply an
      anarchist and anthroposophist, was Jens Bjørneboe
      (1920-1976). He was an extremely talented and
      effective author, and a true friend and spokesman
      of the underdog, but he's long gone.

      Bradford looked so, so promising to me for a long
      time, and then he blew it all with that
      unbelievable garbage about Jews and 9-11, his
      praise of Bondarev and so on. Threw it all out the window.

      As a matter of fact, I had a reality check with
      regard to Bradford when he of all people
      contended that the 9-11 skyjackers were Jews
      disguised as Arabs, with stolen identities. It
      was a deep shock, and my admiration for him took
      a plunge. I could have expected it from Hale, the
      anthro-nutcase, but supremely intelligent and
      knowledgeable Bradford? It forced me to
      reevaluate him completely. Dazed, I'm still
      working on it. And now he comes along with "Springtime for hitler Lyrics" - ?

      This is mind-boggling. Bradford also comes across
      as someone identifying more or less with the
      anarchist left; I'm associated with it one way or
      the other regardless of what I say, and Peter
      Staudenmaier is a self-proclaimed anarchist,
      leftist, and anti-war activist. So there are
      basically three of us standing there, sort of. PS
      opposes anti-Semitism, and in Rudolf Steiner's
      works and among anthroposophists in general, he
      purports that it's literally reeking with
      anti-Semitism, and those of us who disagree
      haven't read enough Steiner. There are right-wing
      anti-Semites and left-wing anti-Semites and
      Anthroposophy's got both. Next comes Bradford, an
      anti-war leftist and probably anarchist who says
      that anti-Semitism is not what it appears to be;
      it's spiritual-scientific truth, perhaps
      forbidden truth that should not be subjected to
      treachery, because it's a holy reality, and this
      reality may include historical revisionism with
      regard to the holocaust, because Bondarev was a
      very wise anthroposophist, and Irving was
      probably a smart man too because he questioned
      "the official story" that may be a Jewish lie. So
      so far, we have PS and Bradford standing on the
      anarchist platform arguing pro and con Jews and
      anti-Semitism and historical revisionism. (To
      this must be added the obvious hypocrisy of PS,
      who has been practicing shameful historical
      revisionism with regard to the origins of
      anthroposophy, very reminiscent of those who
      argue holocaust denial.) And then finally there's
      me, the third party in this anarchist camp,
      fighting against PS' anti-anthroposophy and
      historical revisionism as well as Bradford's
      apologetics for historical revisionism with
      regard to the holocaust and his endorsement of
      theories reminiscent of the Protocols of Zion.

      Does anyone see the problem? PS needs to be
      opposed on his own turf: Among anarchists.
      Otherwise, he is going to turn every anarchist
      who is *not* anti-Semitic (because of Israel)
      against anthroposophy by convincing them it's
      racist. With a little help from our friends.

      Tarjei
    • anarchosophia
      ... point ... 2004. ... the ... This post is meddling with list managment. You have been warned about the only off topic. You are hereby banned form
      Message 35 of 35 , Aug 5, 2006
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        --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Hale"
        <sardisian01@...> wrote:
        >
        > --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, Tarjei Straume
        > <straume@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Steve Hale wrote:
        > >
        > > >Sounds more like you smooching Tarjei's big white butt.
        > >
        > > "White" butt - ? You're weird, man. I just took a new look at how
        > you
        > > introduced yourself to this group in late January, 2004. The
        point
        > > is, you didn't sign up and introduce yourself. Instead, you wrote
        > all
        > > kinds of strange emails to members, including me. In your message
        > to
        > > me, a total stranger, you complained about a post Christine had
        > > written, which was about why some chicken crossed the road - a
        > very
        > > benign, harmless, and hilarious post btw. This complaint to me
        > from a
        > > total stranger about Christine's "chicken"-post (because I had
        > > thanked her for it) with the message, "Taz, it is getting to be
        > alot
        > > of bullshit, isn't it? " followed by a Steiner-quote was so
        > intrusive
        > > and creepy that I did a Dan Dugan on you by quoting it on the AT
        > with
        > > the title, "Do it on-list, mr. SH":

        Steve H. you wrote:

        > >
        > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy_tomorrow/message/1564
        >
        >
        > Well, I also took the opportunity to look back in the archive and
        > found a message of yours from the same time period: January 19,
        2004.
        >
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy_tomorrow/message/1349
        >
        > Now, please explain how your nemesis, Klaus Tues, makes it into the
        > ranks of a moderator on this list? Yes, folks, the sheriff from
        the
        > mountain commune that guards against the evils of the drug-crazed
        > Uncle Taz is now a moderator here since June.
        >
        > But hey, maybe you two made up for all I know. It certainly makes
        > for a headline story in the Star, or National Enquirer, though.
        >
        > Steve

        This post is meddling with list managment. You have been warned about
        the only off topic. You are hereby banned form anthroposophy tomorrow.

        Faithfully

        Sophia
        Moderator
        >
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