Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Propaganda with a twist

Expand Messages
  • isenhart7
    ... that s ... Dear Diana, This gave me pause. First of all there s that S word that always seems to get my attention. But this was a new thought for me-that
    Message 1 of 508 , Mar 31, 2006
    • 0 Attachment
      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "winters_diana"
      <diana.winters@...> wrote:
      >
      > >no responsible teacher hands a paring knife to a three year old
      > >and walks off to do something else.
      >
      > No teacher who *gives a shit* about children does this. This person
      > has a career in Waldorf because she is a fanatical anthroposophist,
      > not because she likes or knows how to work with children, and
      that's
      > the other thing the story represents. Repeat: represents. It is
      > *representative*. I tell it because it was a simple daily sort of
      > occurrence in our kindergartens.

      Dear Diana,

      This gave me pause. First of all there's that "S" word that always
      seems to get my attention. But this was a new thought for me-that
      someone would go into teaching wee ones for reasons other than
      teaching wee ones. 'Cause I know first hand what a difficult task it
      is-this never would have occured to me. But then once you spoke it I
      was reminded immediately of one kindergarten teacher that I know. Not
      the majority by any means but one for sure.

      So I started thinking about it-like what's going on there-and what I
      came up with is in the case of the K teacher I know we have a person
      who wants to be on a spiritual path without relinquishing control, I
      think. Now, this brings up for me, a lot more questions-for instance
      does anthroposophy attract more of these individuals with, let's say,
      a high need for autonomy because of its, comparatively speaking, do-
      it-yourself methodology. This was definitely an attraction for me, as
      I have "guru issues" that I am currently taking medicine for.
      >
      > It is not that every Waldorf kindergarten teacher allows the
      children
      > to use sharp knives unsupervised - but it is *representative* of
      the
      > type of lapse in safety, hygiene and general concern for children's
      > welfare that is reported in Waldorf world wide. There is no doubt
      > about this.

      So there's a question-do WSs have a more laize faire attitude than
      other independent schools? The number one reason that parents choose
      an independent school (according to the NAIS) last I looked was
      safety. Parents are concerned for their children's welfare-duhhh. So
      I'm sure that there is a lot of anecdotal evidence for lax policy and
      procedures at WSs but this is an example of what I was mentioning to
      Pete-this could be documented. What are best practices for
      independent schools? What policies and procedures has X WS school
      formally adopted?

      Tom mentioned Dee Coulter a few days ago and I just mentioned I have
      guru problems and this all ties together neatly here... A couple
      years ago Dee and a good friend of mine, a local anthroposophical
      guru, were part of a panel discussion for independent schools in
      Colorado. Afterward they reported that there were about fifty
      educators in the room and that they came with the knowledge that in
      ten years time half of their schools would no longer exist. So they
      were hungry and eager to hear what this "cutting edge" panel could
      provide in the way of curriculum guidance.

      Patrice Maynard with AWSNA just spoke a few weeks ago at the NAIS
      conference. She had a room with seventy five chairs-standing room
      only with the hall filled with people wanting to hear about WEd. Her
      presentation on storytelling was very well received.

      I went to a grant-writing course a few weeks ago and was approached
      by two University of Colorado professors and the Chair of the
      Education Department at the University of Wyoming for information on
      WEd. I mean it used to be that you mentioned WEd and people either
      had never heard of it or thought you were a kook-now they say can you
      tell me where I can get more information?

      Well, what's my point? I think it'd be highly ironic, Diana, as the
      independent school market gets increasingly competitive if the non-
      Waldorf schools adapt and thus survive at the "expense" of the
      Waldorf schools who pioneered the curriculum all these years. Because
      its not after all the smartest who survive or the most spiritual its
      the most adaptive. And Waldorf schools apparently have nothing to
      learn, the way I hear it told here, there, and everwhere at times,
      about safety, responsibility, accountability, governance, and
      leadership. Because we have arrived, we are it, the pinnacle, the
      peak. In all facets of school life? Well where can you go really from
      there?

      > And YES - this is a story about karma. The belief in karma
      justifies
      > a lack of accountability to normal measures that safeguard
      children's
      > safety and wellbeing in other schools. If your child is "drawn to"
      > the Waldorf school (karmically, that is) you are supposed to
      > understand that what happens to them, happens to them. In fact,
      they
      > were born into your family *because* you will put them in a Waldorf
      > school. The only thing that matters is that they are in a Waldorf
      > school, and incompetent, unkind teachers who can't manage a
      classroom
      > or look out for the safety of small children, like who's running
      > around with a sharp knife? are just not considered a problem, as
      long
      > as they spout Rudolf Steiner all day long and in their sleep. Hey
      > Dottie - looking for a new job?
      >
      > Those who would defend it, or lie about the story later because it
      > makes them feel all shaken up if their religion is criticized, are
      > the ones who have something to answer for.

      So this really bothers me a lot. What you're describing would be a
      really warped understanding of karma, IMO. And it personally bothers
      me because of the other statement that came up about letting children
      die if that's their karma. Because I was in that situation, as people
      here have heard numerous times, and I did give the situation over to
      a higher power-to God's will specifically. And it surprised me-I
      expected to be bargaining with God-negotiating but when it came right
      down to it I just said-well okay then. There is not one but two
      examples of this prayer in Guideposts magazine this month that
      describe what I'm talking about as well.

      In one story a young mother is in a terrible auto accident, resulting
      in a coma with head trauma, with a million to one odds for recovery.
      Good Friday arrives and her husband prays:

      "God, on this day Jesus put himself into your hands, unconditionally.
      I am doing the same, If it's your will, I know you can bring Natalie
      back to us. If it isn't...Thy will be done."

      So for me, personally this experience, saying this -if it's your will
      so be it prayer-was a real baptism and it's maybe not a coincidence
      that admitting that we are powerless, acknowledging a higher power,
      and turning our will over to a higher power are the first few steps
      on the spiritual path known as 12 steps. So back to the beginning
      here-I really am going someplace with all this. Your post brings to
      mind the question of people who are attracted to a spiritual path but
      don't want to get their feet wet-they are unwilling to give over
      their sense of their own power or control and thus wield it rather
      than yield it.-Val
    • pete_karaiskos
      ... Keep your mouth open - I ll turn around... Pete
      Message 508 of 508 , Apr 18, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "Mike T"
        <leosun_75@...> wrote:
        >
        > Pete Always Right,
        > Has that constipation gone to your head again?

        Keep your mouth open - I'll turn around...

        Pete

        > >From: "pete_karaiskos" <petekaraiskos@...>
        > >Reply-To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
        > >To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
        > >Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Steiner and Abraham
        > >Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2006 04:28:54 -0000
        > >
        > >--- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "Mike T"
        > ><leosun_75@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Gee Pete Always Right,
        > > > Your must be highly evolved to come up with that. More evolved that
        > >Steiner.
        > >
        > >That's not saying much, in my book.
        > >
        > > > That says it all.
        > >
        > >snip
        >
        > _________________________________________________________________
        > realestate.com.au: the biggest address in property
        > http://ninemsn.realestate.com.au
        >
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.