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Re: From Ignorance to Intention

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  • val2160
    ... fundamental ... has ... at ... determinism ... to the ... are, ... Agreed, you might have noticed I said I liked the guy, I like just about anyone who
    Message 1 of 12 , Sep 29, 2005
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      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, Joel Wendt
      <hermit@t...> wrote:
      > It, in my view, is not the technology, but what we don't know about
      > ourselves. For all its wonders,
      > science and technology stand mute when faced with certain
      fundamental
      > human problems. The theories given, that we are violent because it
      has
      > been hard wired into us by evolution, for example, offer no answer
      at
      > all, in a practical sense. In fact the determinism of scientific
      > materialism (accidental evolution) is equalled easily by the
      determinism
      > of religious fundamentalism (God makes us do it). Neither grants
      to the
      > human being freedom and/or responsibility.
      >
      > Fortunately, God being much smarter than Man, deals well with both
      > problems. All we need to do now is to catch up to what we really
      are,
      > in spite of those who can't seem to get it.>

      Agreed, you might have noticed I said I liked the guy, I like just
      about anyone who causes me to think-I never said I was, you know,
      swooning over him.-Val
    • Stephen Clarke
      ... OK. ... ROTFLOL!!! ... Well, I only went back to the URL you posted and it was this lady quoting Braden on the pole shifts. Now it is common knowlege
      Message 2 of 12 , Sep 30, 2005
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        Dear Val:

        --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "val2160"
        <wdenval@a...> wrote:
        > Stephen wrote:
        > > Sorry to pop your bubble for this guy, but...
        >
        > Dear Stephen,
        >
        > If I had a bubble for the guy I'd consider it a favor if you popped it,
        > so no need to be sorry for anything.

        OK.


        > All I said was that I liked his
        > work on frequency and magnetics.I still do. But to be fair I have read
        > all his later books but the first on-the zero point affair I saw a
        > friend's four hour video-maybe I'll have to borrow it again. Maybe he
        > is totally crackers and the book is full of the telltale crumbs.


        ROTFLOL!!!



        > The
        > video was of incredibly poor quality but was riveting, really.I thought
        > he was talking about a magnetic pole reversal-a magnetic shift very
        > much like the one depicted in the Nova documentary, "The Magnetic
        > Storm." There's a bunch of geologists and physicists explaining the
        > mechanics of magnetic pole reversal in this film, if you're interested.


        Well, I only went back to the URL you posted and it was this lady
        "quoting" Braden on the pole shifts. Now it is common knowlege that
        the _magnetic_ poles do wander around a lot and even flip form time to
        time. People do get the "pole shift" thing very garbled when they
        confuse the two, and maybe Braden did and/or maybe this lady did....



        > Now, what you said about people having these great intuitions and then
        > applying them to the wrong dimension-something to that effect-well I'd
        > agree with you there in the case of the Earth stopping-again what I
        > remember was specific to the inner core of the Earth-but I'll have to
        > go watch it again, I guess.


        Even if it was the inner core, my objections would still stand. The
        extent of complete devestation would still be essentially infinite.


        But even so, even if he's "gone around the
        > bend"with a conclusion that doesn't hold water in a 3-D world, I'd
        > still be interested in what he has to say in terms of magnetics and
        > frequency as they apply to CONSCIOUSNESS. Since this is my inherent
        > bais in the first place it is quite possible that I ignored his
        > conclusion as irrelevant. This sounds very sloppy, somehow-there's
        > probably even a name for it and I have probably committed it.-Val

        No, I don't think so; all these guys have good things to say and all
        of us make outstanding clankers from time to time, too. What piques
        my interest in all this is the ocassional evidence of _intentional_
        disinformation laced within the otherwise well-intentioned work of
        those who do not believe that there are those who attempt to
        preeemptively spin, distort, and corrupt what is inevitable due to
        come out. Virus memes, you might say - they really make things tough
        when you try to get to the bottom of things.....

        E.g.: just look at the involvement of the CIA with Leary's Harvard LSD
        experiments, of J.J.Hurtak's involement with the psychic craze of the
        1980's and teh New Age Nine or the Pentagon's remote-viewing projects.

        Beneath the glossy veneer of the New Age Spirituality & Science craze
        is a fetid swamp of dark forces. People who cannot Think in the way
        promoted by Steiner - its all about discrimination - are sitting ducks
        for tasty but poisonous nonsense.

        Stephen
      • holderlin66
        What is most unrefreshingly interesting about the students who have encountered Spiritual Science and that of the rest of humanity, is the vast abyss of
        Message 3 of 12 , Dec 29, 2005
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          What is most unrefreshingly interesting about the students who have
          encountered Spiritual Science and that of the rest of humanity, is
          the vast abyss of thinking that they can recognize but cannot cross
          over to. Below we find Thomas Aquinas was one of the first to argue
          with Aristotle's sharpened faculties of rational intelligence for
          such a thing as Intelligent Design. Then we find this great gap...Oh
          they can understand Thomas Aquinas but suddenly the interior of the
          personality and I AM system of Aquinas changes...after the Grail
          call, Michael brings Aristotle's Being and Intelligence into Aquinas
          and shifts it, super sizes it and lands it in the Being of Rudolf
          STeiner. Aquinas was setting the stage for what we have presented
          here as the vast, vast dishonesty and SPIN in Nominalism vs the
          solidity of what Aquinas argued against Arabism on, Realism.
          Students of Spiritual Science don't get any of this, because they
          haven't yet delved in to take Steiner historically seriously.

          Now STeiner takes up the exact battle that Thomas Aquinas battled
          over only now STeiner has data, sight, The Astral body of Jesus,
          working within Initiation Science as a Michael inspiration. Cause,
          Karma, and dynamic events in relation to human develop and the
          actual deeds of the Gods are restored via the three part patterning
          of Aristotle/Aquinas and Steiner. This leap is so astonishing it has
          left everyone in the dust. And Anthros somehow don't even recognize
          the deed that so stunningly has shaken history and caused even the
          Angels to tremble. Anthros fail to place before humanity the actual
          devastating history of events that 869 to 2005 reveal. Real, actual
          history, not phony crap history that we feed our children. Shame on
          us.

          It is this immense strange impression of following Aquinas/Aristotle
          into the being of Rudolf Steiner that halts the intelligence of
          people from shifting the paradigms that they were familiar with to
          those that are totally NEW. It is an intelligent leap that people
          like Owen Barfield could make by examining the Evolution of
          Consciousness...but our tired, failed and dogmatic dumbed down
          education, public school and science daily drone remains poisoning
          the intelligence of our children day in and day out...Day in and day
          out parents reaffirm that they are basically stupid brainwashed
          morons and they hope and expect their children to become stupid
          brainwashed morons like them.

          Here is someone who traces it to its source and updates it to 2005
          but has never heard, never had it whispeered, never encountered the
          missing part of the puzzle piece. IT IS ANTHROS FAULT that we cannot
          express these things and make them clearly common property.

          http://www.lewrockwell.com/hein/hein122.html

          "I was surprised by the furor about Intelligent Design. Decades ago
          I was introduced to Thomas Aquinas's proofs, from reason, of the
          existence of God, and Intelligent Design seems to be a rather mild
          variation on his theme of causality. The difference is that Aquinas,
          reasoning to the necessity of an ultimate uncaused cause, did not,
          over 700 years ago, hesitate to call it God. The advocates of
          Intelligent Design, however, seem to have found a door, but deny
          that there is anything beyond it; or, having filled a glass from the
          kitchen faucet, declare the liquid within to be tasteless, odorless,
          colorless, with a formula of HOH, and a specific gravity of exactly
          1.00, but shrink from admitting it's water, although everybody knows
          it is. Did they think they would fool someone by insisting that
          Intelligent Design was not a religious belief?

          Certainly they did not fool judge John Jones. Regardless of the
          unconstitutionality, even absurdity, of a federal judge deciding
          what is or isn't appropriate to a school curriculum, Jones was
          absolutely right about one thing: he called ID "creationism in
          disguise." (He also warned that ID was not science, as though truth
          could only be learned via the scientific method. Well, the law is
          not science, either!)

          Had the proponents of ID boldly asserted a belief in Creationism,
          they would hardly have been alone. Many scientists have found that
          the ultimate truth of their investigations is Theism. Kurt Gödel, a
          friend of Einstein, and author of Gödel's incompleteness theorem,
          found that the more he discovered about the physical universe, the
          greater his belief in God as its creator. Sir John Eccles, Nobel
          laureate in medicine, is resolutely Christian, and sees no
          impediment to his beliefs posed by science. The same can be said of
          Henry Schaefer III, author of Science and Christianity: Conflict or
          Coherence? His answer is unequivocal: coherence! Sir John
          Polkinghorne gave up his career as a physicist at Cambridge and took
          holy orders, working as a parish priest, declaring no conflict
          between quantum physics and Christianity. Sir Anthony Flew, one of
          England's most outspoken atheists of the 20th century, acknowledged
          a belief in God about a year ago, pointing out that the order found
          throughout the universe simply could not have arisen from chance.

          It is ironic that non-believers, not believers, were the ones who,
          by rejecting it, affirmed where ID was leading. Their rejection was
          absolutely necessary, lest they set foot on a path that would,
          inevitably, lead where they didn't want to go. Having reached a
          verdict, they could not acknowledge the worth of any contradictory
          evidence.

          It could be said of believers, as well, that, having reached their
          own verdict, they would support it with whatever evidence lent
          affirmation; but there's a difference. If I know of a place called
          Chicago, want to go there, and follow the correct route, I'll end up
          in – Chicago. If, on the other hand, I've never heard of Chicago, or
          deny its existence, and have no desire to go there at all, if I
          somehow find myself there, I'll be in – Chicago. Know of it, believe
          it, desire it – or not – Chicago IS. And you can find yourself
          there, even if by accident."

          holderlin previously brought:

          When we study star numbers, patterns in history and look at
          gestation cycles in relation to planets, numerically grasp the
          sequencing in pine cones, hand and finger bones, and plant patterns,
          heart beats and Venus in relation to human birth and reproduction,
          we begin to understand " Etheric, Astral, or I AM systems that
          place the integers we discover in relation to both the Stars and how
          Nature does her thing in exact forms before our eyes. There is no
          dispute of intelligent design when we see the Chambered Nautilus in
          relation to the unfolding spiral galaxies.

          Waldorf Instruction teaches these basic math and observational
          skills. It does not harp on trumped up Intelligent Design, it
          reveals how intelligent the universe really is in the Hexagon and
          the circle and the orbits and study of the round in relation to
          clear hexagonal structured systems. Current ahrimanic education is
          furiously struggling, again, back to square one before the kali-
          yuga, with the resurgence of evolution and the Darwinian theory, the
          newer lego building block theory of the human genome against the
          other force of Luciferic fundamentalism/Creationism..caught in a
          stupid version of Intelligent design.

          Evolution as Science with its flaws and failed insights drifts into
          Ahrimanically cutting out the reality of humanity in the cosmos
          voiced from the Newtonian Chair held by Stephen Hawkings.
          Intelligent Design is barking up the tree of rigidity of Luciferic
          dogma because it fears to think and draw its inspiration from both
          Science and Spiritual Science. These are flaws and parental damages
          are what the Waldorf Teacher encounters when a child moves into the
          Waldorf Community. Waldorf antidotes lazy, unfounded and confused
          thinking and Spiritual Science lifts the human being back into the
          ball game with the divine.

          Spiritual Science grasps Fibonacci, math,rational and irrational
          numbers, and the development of sentient beings against stone, and
          plant. In other words Steve Talbott and Dennis Klocek are working
          with real Michael Intelligence and most of the world has not been
          introduced to the REAL arguments about Intelligent Design.

          In the Anthro Leading Thoughts, you will find the dead universe, The
          Finished Work of the Gods, and the dead intellect and inside these
          leading thoughts you find how the I Am ploughs its way through from
          RENE DESCARTES (1595-1650) through the Philosophy of Freedom, enters
          the Spiritual or Consciousness Soul and comes to the stirring
          discovery of the I AM systems treasures that bring about true
          education, the elementary education that leads from hogwarts to
          Waldorf was there long before these people started forming their
          thoughts."
        • earlyfire@earthlink.net
          We ll be your Ferryman, you, our boats. And, if lucky, that is to say, if blessed, we ll steer you to places whose floorboarded thoughts never of wood were
          Message 4 of 12 , Dec 29, 2005
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            We'll be your Ferryman, you, our boats. And, if lucky, that is to say, if blessed, we'll steer you to places whose floorboarded thoughts never of wood were composed, yet strange to say, be it as imagination may, sturdy, ancient, perhaps as majestic as Sequoia, and so I smile when I suspect, make for reliable astral transportation, which is not our shot to call. And Christens his voyages thus:

            One of the vastly underacknowledged characteristics of truth, is because it's not a what, a what being a compressed, paralyzed verb, stolen signal theft in the night, but rather a flow, a wilderness process, never can truth be archived, and like the one tenth of law which is never possessed, refuses credentialization in the familiar, for which unreasonable reasons, so's ever unrehearsed. Words are but oasis, Truth the river, we, all of us, brief islands in the rush, and so hoist anchor............

            -------------------                            ----------------------                                 ---------------------------                   ----------------------------


            -----Original Message-----
            From: holderlin66
            Sent: Dec 29, 2005 9:47 AM
            To: anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: From Ignorance to Intention/Intelligent Design

            What is most unrefreshingly interesting about the students who have
            encountered Spiritual Science and that of the rest of humanity, is
            the vast abyss of thinking that they can recognize but cannot cross
            over to.

            What would be refreshingly courageous is for increasing numbers of us on AP_Tomorrow,

            to dare find ways to intervene in the world by loosing solutions to the shortcomings of a conspicuously dysfunctional educational system. I forsee soon authoring a small manual for teachers, called "Education as Adventure", which would form the basis for a four or six year journaling initiative, in which students across all of America would be asked to deal with Quest, this term, this mythic, Quixote-like blast of energy, being a will-virtue associated, even inextricably married, happily wedded to the notion of Destiny. Quest, rather than questions, ever associated with the recycle of History.

            After all, it seems fair to say, or self evident in growing intensity to many of us, that subject matter for the War of All against All is obviously fulcrumed thus: Humanity will soon be engaged in a Jihad to determine whether History shall repeat itself, or whether Destiny, which requires spiritual interventions shall be taken up in its stead and so, like Arthur's company gone before, knight those interested in reinventing the ways in which we spend our time shifting our celebrations of life energy and attitudes from pastime indulgence of recycled habit, cultural templates, and similar same old, same old, to aspiration focus.

            What this implies, is that Destiny is what happens whenever Moments of, or All of History is dissolved into the Progressive Stream, and the intent of humanity, individual by individual is not merely re-released in novelty and fashion most charmingly Luciferic, which for its spice and wonder, surely sports redeemability, and at best, immortal art, and so's valuable, but ultimately, to go beyond this, into the initiatory realm which aspires to knighthood, where intent itself is transformed from leisure to striving, and where Faust enters the Temple of Solomons erstwhile temple turned Shopping Mall, and immolates the consumer paradigm'd abasement into which a paralyzed and carbonite-frozen Christianity has become sorry imprisoned. Upgraded from TV to Spiritual Widescreen format, so that the immortality prior and the immortality future lend continuity to the center, to the now, and the now kneels in the Presence of the unfolding of the Angelic.

            Any educational initiatives which fall short of inviting children to embrace and carry this scope into their studies, actually dishonors the ascent to the perfection of conscience, virtue and the Sophianic transformation of Imagination into Manas, which makes Angelic Cuisine in the Mortal Sinai.

            So for the AP_Tomorrow forum to voice thoughts which command the attention of those in education, this is the solution. No more choir preaching. We remain villains to Michael by standing by and doing nothing in the realm, in the lion's den of risk, nothing to assist the teachers who keep perfecting their cowardice by buckling under the Vadaresque Decrees of standards-based literalism, superimposed as a totality at the expense of introducing a battery of "Leaven questions", "Lazarus-Quality Questions" which general peril and instability in thinking, rather than convenience, and by so deranging the complacence of educational infrastructures, do stand a good chance of perking the rearising of imagination, inspiration and intuition as honorable, as holy, as necessary influences to be reinjected into the bread and water of a spiritually flatline world.

            What Earlyfire is doing in this regard, is compiling a series of questions which provide for a reimagination of the vocabulary of philosophy, making it accessible as karmically-embracable pursuit in various levels of junior high and high school. We substitute teach as our day job, and so hopscotch, wandering Jew that we are, from classroom to classroom, sowing dangerous, openended thoughts which charm the growth of metaphysical responsibility.

            For those who are in education, who wish to influence students and teachers with Michael-thoughts, and annoint them knights of the Progressive Stream, one can easily start with googling quotes of Einstein and others, and asking students to spend ten minutes a day, journaling them, then using the journaling as a basis for transfiguring the study of history and literature, where intent and content can be modelled as an ongoing systole-diastole of learning. In this way, training and processing, processes industrially, (i.e., read between the lines, Ahrimanically, mechanically abased, bereft of Luciferic enchantment, Christ Love impulses) training and processing, thus reinspired, like a frog kissed turning back into a prince, turn into discovery, and adventure and the true meaning of learning, as the art of approach, the are of welcome to the unknown again comes to light.

            Princess Leia to Han Solo, over and out.

            (Remember that moment when he thaws at her

            hands, the Mary Magdelene of Science Fiction:

            Solo arising, asks something like: "Who has freed me?"

            Leia: Someone who loves you)

            And so it seems a good direction for AP_Forum members who wish to intervene in leavening the consciousness of teachers and students, to find Waldorf Schools in which to host free classes for the parents interested in the reconnection of thinking to moral intent, and using fairy tales or poetry as a medium of focus, be silver iodide to the clouds of other people's doubts, and cause sweet rain to fall on their hearts with ideas which leaven optimism from cynicism. Who can already do this, evidences the degree of initiatory focus which assists the liberation of Sophia from imprisonment in Spin and other weapons of mass distraction. If a person is inteed evolved enough, and this is an amazing litmous test in front of the mirror, the fairest mirror of them all, true self-reflection, and a person has utterly transcended all impulses to project astral blame and the ruthless sphere of sympathy and antipathy which still exerts a considerable magnetism upon many professed practicioners of AP, redeeming political controversy with spiritual solutions is the most challenging of spheres to awaken.

            But we have rambled enough. Princess Leia advises, that dissolving the sins of history into the Aqua Regia of Self-Transformation, will burn away the cosmetic veneer in which Christianity and Islam are entrapped in the Maya of Profession, rather than de-cocooned, and made flight-borne into the realm of Intent. For it is clear that in this day, Deeds have become the only Words. Be frightened of this statement, let it be an exclamation point to dagger the sentence, and end the curse of "That's the way we've always done it, therefore, that's the way we'll always have to do it". (It was good enough for Abraham, remaining dead is easy)

            This post brought to you by "Thief in the Night", specializing in subliminal Trojan Horse-Ware.

            Warm regards, and best wishes for a lifted, untroubled, vibrant new year.

            Harvey

            (Backstage, Shrouded in Turin, smirks, filled with subtle Chutzpah, ;-) and imagines this:

            It is far easier to be Baptized in water than in the Progressive Stream, as in, The real Jordan River has no latitude or longitude)

          • isenhart7
            Earlyfire wrote: We ll be your Ferryman, you, our boats. And, if lucky, that is to say, if blessed, we ll steer you to places whose floorboarded thoughts never
            Message 5 of 12 , Dec 29, 2005
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              Earlyfire wrote:

              We'll be your Ferryman, you, our boats. And, if lucky, that is to say,
              if blessed, we'll steer you to places whose floorboarded thoughts never
              of wood were composed, yet strange to say, be it as imagination may,
              sturdy, ancient, perhaps as majestic as Sequoia, and so I smile when I
              suspect, make for reliable astral transportation, which is not our shot
              to call.

              Val:
              Of course, this calls to mind a song, several actually, "Speed Bonnie
              Boat" comes to mind but here's a really beautiful kind of haunting
              melody that I think is a traditional round:

              Winter calls a clear horizon
              Like the sea calls to the shore
              Like the sky calls to the desert
              Like the Love calls to the heart
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