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Re: Fwd: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: "*we* who must hold the beam in equipoise"

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  • Griselda Andersen
    ... It s too elaborate and complex and I have no time to write about it, the 350th Simpson s episode is just starting. I have a short opinion on Atlanta,
    Message 1 of 12 , May 1, 2005
      --- > --- In ,
      > "Frank Thomas Smith"
      > wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      >On the other hand, dictatorial though it may be, you
      >opinion about Waldorf
      >education might be interesting to some around here.

      It's too elaborate and complex and I have no time to
      write about it, the 350th Simpson's episode is just
      starting. I have a short opinion on Atlanta, though:
      can a place be cooler? Now there's even a kidnapping
      turned into runaway bride soap opera going on. I love
      it, Hotlanta.

      > > > Well, what can I say? I will gladly expound on
      any
      > subject you like,
      > whether
      > I know anything about it or not -

      Frankie dear, you may not realize it, but Herr
      Holderlin has been dying to hear these same words from
      you for ages, you know. And now you say them to me.
      He'll be so upset. I even feel like asking you to talk
      about something he would like to hear you talking
      about. Just so that he won't hate me. Problem is, I
      can't think of anything. Let's see. Think think
      think...ok, how about sentient souls? Can you talk
      about them? I was told several times in this list I am
      one, so what the heck. You can start by letting me
      know if I am really one or not. Then, tell me if
      there's any prize involved if I am. Then go from there
      in more general, abstract terms. Something like that.

      Love,
      Griselda









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    • Jennifer
      A tyranny of one, you say? Nice to see you again, Gris! I m here, too, reading quietly. ;) Cheers, Jennifer P.S. Hey, you can write me offlist anytime,
      Message 2 of 12 , May 4, 2005
        A tyranny of one, you say?

        Nice to "see" you again, Gris!
        I'm here, too, reading quietly.

        ;)

        Cheers,
        Jennifer

        P.S. Hey, you can write me offlist anytime, yaknow?
        Sorry to hear "real life" is troublesome these days.

        Griselda Andersen wrote:

        > I'm not a democracy but a total dictatorship.
      • hatscaps66
        Thanks, Jennifer! :) Yeah I m mostly quiet too. This WC X WE thing is truly boring to me. But here is a quote just because: Great spirits have always
        Message 3 of 12 , May 4, 2005
          Thanks, Jennifer! :)
          Yeah I'm mostly quiet too. This WC X WE thing is truly boring to me.
          But here is a quote just because:
          "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from
          mediocre minds". Albert Einstein
          You know what I mean. :)
          Cheers,
          Griselda

          --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "Jennifer" < wrote:
          > A tyranny of one, you say?
          >
          > Nice to "see" you again, Gris!
          > I'm here, too, reading quietly.
          >
          > ;)
          >
          > Cheers,
          > Jennifer
          >
          > P.S. Hey, you can write me offlist anytime, yaknow?
          > Sorry to hear "real life" is troublesome these days.
          >
          > Griselda Andersen wrote:
          >
          > > I'm not a democracy but a total dictatorship.
        • Jennifer
          Griselda, I m speechless so will just let Bob do the talking for me. (Your reference to Einstein reminded me of this song.) See ya, Jennifer Desolation Row
          Message 4 of 12 , May 5, 2005
            Griselda, I'm speechless so will just let
            Bob do the talking for me. (Your reference
            to Einstein reminded me of this song.)

            See ya,
            Jennifer

            Desolation Row

            They're selling postcards of the hanging
            They're painting the passports brown
            The beauty parlor is filled with sailors
            The circus is in town
            Here comes the blind commissioner
            They've got him in a trance
            One hand is tied to the tight-rope walker
            The other is in his pants
            And the riot squad they're restless
            They need somewhere to go
            As Lady and I look out tonight
            From Desolation Row

            Cinderella, she seems so easy
            "It takes one to know one," she smiles
            And puts her hands in her back pockets
            Bette Davis style
            And in comes Romeo, he's moaning
            "You Belong to Me I Believe"
            And someone says," You're in the wrong place, my friend
            You better leave"
            And the only sound that's left
            After the ambulances go
            Is Cinderella sweeping up
            On Desolation Row

            Now the moon is almost hidden
            The stars are beginning to hide
            The fortunetelling lady
            Has even taken all her things inside
            All except for Cain and Abel
            And the hunchback of Notre Dame
            Everybody is making love
            Or else expecting rain
            And the Good Samaritan, he's dressing
            He's getting ready for the show
            He's going to the carnival tonight
            On Desolation Row

            Now Ophelia, she's 'neath the window
            For her I feel so afraid
            On her twenty-second birthday
            She already is an old maid

            To her, death is quite romantic
            She wears an iron vest
            Her profession's her religion
            Her sin is her lifelessness
            And though her eyes are fixed upon
            Noah's great rainbow
            She spends her time peeking
            Into Desolation Row

            Einstein, disguised as Robin Hood
            With his memories in a trunk
            Passed this way an hour ago
            With his friend, a jealous monk
            He looked so immaculately frightful
            As he bummed a cigarette
            Then he went off sniffing drainpipes
            And reciting the alphabet
            Now you would not think to look at him
            But he was famous long ago
            For playing the electric violin
            On Desolation Row

            Dr. Filth, he keeps his world
            Inside of a leather cup
            But all his sexless patients
            They're trying to blow it up
            Now his nurse, some local loser
            She's in charge of the cyanide hole
            And she also keeps the cards that read
            "Have Mercy on His Soul"
            They all play on penny whistles
            You can hear them blow
            If you lean your head out far enough
            From Desolation Row

            Across the street they've nailed the curtains
            They're getting ready for the feast
            The Phantom of the Opera
            A perfect image of a priest
            They're spoonfeeding Casanova
            To get him to feel more assured
            Then they'll kill him with self-confidence
            After poisoning him with words

            And the Phantom's shouting to skinny girls
            "Get Outa Here If You Don't Know
            Casanova is just being punished for going
            To Desolation Row"

            Now at midnight all the agents
            And the superhuman crew
            Come out and round up everyone
            That knows more than they do
            Then they bring them to the factory
            Where the heart-attack machine
            Is strapped across their shoulders
            And then the kerosene
            Is brought down from the castles
            By insurance men who go
            Check to see that nobody is escaping
            To Desolation Row

            Praise be to Nero's Neptune
            The Titanic sails at dawn
            And everybody's shouting
            "Which Side Are You On?"
            And Ezra Pound and T. S. Eliot
            Fighting in the captain's tower
            While calypso singers laugh at them
            And fishermen hold flowers
            Between the windows of the sea
            Where lovely mermaids flow
            And nobody has to think too much
            About Desolation Row

            Yes, I received your letter yesterday
            (About the time the door knob broke)
            When you asked how I was doing
            Was that some kind of joke?
            All these people that you mention
            Yes, I know them, they're quite lame
            I had to rearrange their faces
            And give them all another name
            Right now I can't read too good
            Don't send me no more letters no
            Not unless you mail them
            From Desolation Row

            Copyright © 1965; renewed 1993 Special Rider Music


            hatscaps66 wrote:

            > Thanks, Jennifer! :)
            > Yeah I'm mostly quiet too. This WC X WE thing is truly boring to
            me.
            > But here is a quote just because:
            > "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from
            > mediocre minds". Albert Einstein
            > You know what I mean. :)
            > Cheers,
            > Griselda
          • Tarjei Straume
            Jennifer, you re awesome! You re posting my absolute favorite of all Bob Dylan songs! No snipping this time! Cheers, Tarjei
            Message 5 of 12 , May 5, 2005
              Jennifer, you're awesome! You're posting my absolute favorite of all Bob
              Dylan songs! No snipping this time!

              Cheers,

              Tarjei

              At 19:34 05.05.2005, you wrote:
              >Griselda, I'm speechless so will just let
              >Bob do the talking for me. (Your reference
              >to Einstein reminded me of this song.)
              >
              >See ya,
              >Jennifer
              >
              >Desolation Row
              >
              >They're selling postcards of the hanging
              >They're painting the passports brown
              >The beauty parlor is filled with sailors
              >The circus is in town
              >Here comes the blind commissioner
              >They've got him in a trance
              >One hand is tied to the tight-rope walker
              >The other is in his pants
              >And the riot squad they're restless
              >They need somewhere to go
              >As Lady and I look out tonight
              > From Desolation Row
              >
              >Cinderella, she seems so easy
              >"It takes one to know one," she smiles
              >And puts her hands in her back pockets
              >Bette Davis style
              >And in comes Romeo, he's moaning
              >"You Belong to Me I Believe"
              >And someone says," You're in the wrong place, my friend
              >You better leave"
              >And the only sound that's left
              >After the ambulances go
              >Is Cinderella sweeping up
              >On Desolation Row
              >
              >Now the moon is almost hidden
              >The stars are beginning to hide
              >The fortunetelling lady
              >Has even taken all her things inside
              >All except for Cain and Abel
              >And the hunchback of Notre Dame
              >Everybody is making love
              >Or else expecting rain
              >And the Good Samaritan, he's dressing
              >He's getting ready for the show
              >He's going to the carnival tonight
              >On Desolation Row
              >
              >Now Ophelia, she's 'neath the window
              >For her I feel so afraid
              >On her twenty-second birthday
              >She already is an old maid
              >
              >To her, death is quite romantic
              >She wears an iron vest
              >Her profession's her religion
              >Her sin is her lifelessness
              >And though her eyes are fixed upon
              >Noah's great rainbow
              >She spends her time peeking
              >Into Desolation Row
              >
              >Einstein, disguised as Robin Hood
              >With his memories in a trunk
              >Passed this way an hour ago
              >With his friend, a jealous monk
              >He looked so immaculately frightful
              >As he bummed a cigarette
              >Then he went off sniffing drainpipes
              >And reciting the alphabet
              >Now you would not think to look at him
              >But he was famous long ago
              >For playing the electric violin
              >On Desolation Row
              >
              >Dr. Filth, he keeps his world
              >Inside of a leather cup
              >But all his sexless patients
              >They're trying to blow it up
              >Now his nurse, some local loser
              >She's in charge of the cyanide hole
              >And she also keeps the cards that read
              >"Have Mercy on His Soul"
              >They all play on penny whistles
              >You can hear them blow
              >If you lean your head out far enough
              > From Desolation Row
              >
              >Across the street they've nailed the curtains
              >They're getting ready for the feast
              >The Phantom of the Opera
              >A perfect image of a priest
              >They're spoonfeeding Casanova
              >To get him to feel more assured
              >Then they'll kill him with self-confidence
              >After poisoning him with words
              >
              >And the Phantom's shouting to skinny girls
              >"Get Outa Here If You Don't Know
              >Casanova is just being punished for going
              >To Desolation Row"
              >
              >Now at midnight all the agents
              >And the superhuman crew
              >Come out and round up everyone
              >That knows more than they do
              >Then they bring them to the factory
              >Where the heart-attack machine
              >Is strapped across their shoulders
              >And then the kerosene
              >Is brought down from the castles
              >By insurance men who go
              >Check to see that nobody is escaping
              >To Desolation Row
              >
              >Praise be to Nero's Neptune
              >The Titanic sails at dawn
              >And everybody's shouting
              >"Which Side Are You On?"
              >And Ezra Pound and T. S. Eliot
              >Fighting in the captain's tower
              >While calypso singers laugh at them
              >And fishermen hold flowers
              >Between the windows of the sea
              >Where lovely mermaids flow
              >And nobody has to think too much
              >About Desolation Row
              >
              >Yes, I received your letter yesterday
              >(About the time the door knob broke)
              >When you asked how I was doing
              >Was that some kind of joke?
              >All these people that you mention
              >Yes, I know them, they're quite lame
              >I had to rearrange their faces
              >And give them all another name
              >Right now I can't read too good
              >Don't send me no more letters no
              >Not unless you mail them
              > From Desolation Row
              >
              >Copyright © 1965; renewed 1993 Special Rider Music
            • Jennifer
              I only just recently bought his album, Highway 61 Revisited. Bob SEES things, and his humor keeps me sane. ;) I love this, from the notes he wrote for this
              Message 6 of 12 , May 6, 2005
                I only just recently bought his album, Highway 61 Revisited.
                Bob SEES things, and his humor keeps me sane. ;) I love this,
                from the notes he wrote for this album: "we are singing today
                of the WIPE-OUT GANG - the WIPE-OUT GANG buys, owns & operates
                the Insanity Factory - if you do not know where the Insanity
                Factory is located, you should hereby take two steps to the
                right, paint your teeth & go to sleep...." I LOVE BOB!!!

                Cheers,
                Jennifer

                cyberuncle wrote:

                > Jennifer, you're awesome! You're posting my absolute
                > favorite of all Bob Dylan songs! No snipping this time!
                >
                > Cheers,
                >
                > Tarjei
              • Tarjei Straume
                ... Yep, that album is packed with dynamite. It took me a long time to realize that Just Like Tom Thumb s Blues was based upon William Burrough s Naked
                Message 7 of 12 , May 6, 2005
                  At 18:08 06.05.2005, Jennifer wrote:

                  >I only just recently bought his album, Highway 61 Revisited.
                  >Bob SEES things, and his humor keeps me sane. ;) I love this,
                  >from the notes he wrote for this album: "we are singing today
                  >of the WIPE-OUT GANG - the WIPE-OUT GANG buys, owns & operates
                  >the Insanity Factory - if you do not know where the Insanity
                  >Factory is located, you should hereby take two steps to the
                  >right, paint your teeth & go to sleep...." I LOVE BOB!!!

                  Yep, that album is packed with dynamite. It took me a long time to realize
                  that "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues" was based upon William Burrough's "Naked
                  Lunch," which was floating around at that time before it was finally
                  published. My guess is that Bob got a copy from Allan Ginsburg, Burrough's
                  former lover in New York City. When Ginsburgh broke up with Burroughs, the
                  latter hit the skids in Paris and somewhere in Africa, shooting up and
                  writing, but always standing up in spite of it all and strangely reaching a
                  very ripe old age. The last verse says it all:

                  I started out on burgundy
                  But soon hit the harder stuff
                  Everybody said they'd stand behind me
                  When the game got rough
                  But the joke was on me
                  There was nobody even there to call my bluff
                  I'm going back to New York City
                  I do believe I've had enough

                  Tarjei
                • Jennifer
                  Hi, Tarjei! I didn t know that, about Naked Lunch. Cool. Well, I just happened to stumble across this: http://www.interferenza.com/bcs/interw/play78.htm
                  Message 8 of 12 , May 7, 2005
                    Hi, Tarjei!

                    I didn't know that, about "Naked Lunch." Cool.
                    Well, I just happened to stumble across this:
                    http://www.interferenza.com/bcs/interw/play78.htm
                    Don't know whether you've seen it before.

                    Cheers,
                    Jennifer

                    You wrote:

                    > Yep, that album is packed with dynamite. It took me a long time to
                    realize
                    > that "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues" was based upon William
                    Burrough's "Naked
                    > Lunch," which was floating around at that time before it was
                    finally
                    > published. My guess is that Bob got a copy from Allan Ginsburg,
                    Burrough's
                    > former lover in New York City. When Ginsburgh broke up with
                    Burroughs, the
                    > latter hit the skids in Paris and somewhere in Africa, shooting up
                    and
                    > writing, but always standing up in spite of it all and strangely
                    reaching a
                    > very ripe old age. The last verse says it all:
                    >
                    > I started out on burgundy
                    > But soon hit the harder stuff
                    > Everybody said they'd stand behind me
                    > When the game got rough
                    > But the joke was on me
                    > There was nobody even there to call my bluff
                    > I'm going back to New York City
                    > I do believe I've had enough
                    >
                    > Tarjei
                  • Tarjei Straume
                    ... No I havent, although I was reading Playboy occasionally back then, in the seventies. No wait, this interview is from 1978, and I didn t read much Playboy
                    Message 9 of 12 , May 8, 2005
                      At 05:12 08.05.2005, Jennifer wrote:

                      >Hi, Tarjei!
                      >
                      >I didn't know that, about "Naked Lunch." Cool.
                      >Well, I just happened to stumble across this:
                      >http://www.interferenza.com/bcs/interw/play78.htm
                      >Don't know whether you've seen it before.

                      No I havent, although I was reading Playboy occasionally back then, in the
                      seventies. No wait, this interview is from 1978, and I didn't read much
                      Playboy between 1976 and December 1980, with the John and Yoko interview
                      came out, when the news of John's violent death flashed on the screen while
                      I was in the middle of reading it. I remember 1976 because of the Jimmy
                      Carter interview. I feel nostalgic about those PIayboy Interviews, the
                      best! - the "candid conversations" with three photos on the first page and
                      an intro running a page and a half. Never forget the interview with Abbie
                      Hoffman on the run from the FBI and underground - I think that was in 1976
                      too - and he'd had plastic surgery and wore a bandit scarf across his face
                      on those three photos. And John Lennon was so funny - every time he said
                      something wise, he added, "Print that between tits and asses on page 138."

                      I began reading Playboy in the early seventies in London, wow about Phillip
                      Agee, the ex-CIA agent who created a world-wide scandal by blowing the
                      whistle on the agency and its ugly dark secrets, and he had those deadly
                      feds stalking him and breathing down his neck while being interviewed for
                      Playboy in Spain I think it was. Say what you like about Hugh Hefner, but
                      he sure knew how to pick interesting people to be interviewed in the good
                      old days!! Well, a moratorium on my Playboy reading was brought on by my
                      girlfriend from Miami who said, "I don't want you looking at those naked
                      girls!" Oh my, she was the one who introduced me to the magazine and had
                      been reading it for years, and now she didn't want me to look at it! Henry
                      Higgins: "Women are irrational, that's all there is to that...."

                      Anyway, I read through the 1978 Playboy Interview with Bob Dylan, and I
                      thank you for posting the link to it. I can tell it's been scanned
                      privately, because there are a lot of periods missing. You have to put most
                      of them back in when you edit.

                      I didn't know BD was involved in so many movie projects in the early days,
                      and I had forgotten that he painted. The only movie I've seen with him was
                      one that took me by surprise a year or two ago, on the TCM channel. All of
                      a sudden, there was Billy the Kid from 1970, with Kris Kristoffersen as
                      Billy, James Coburn as the sheriff chasing him (another favorite movie star
                      of mine who also passed away not too long ago), and Bob Dylan as Billy's
                      nameless sidekick. I really chuckled when they were in this saloon and
                      coburn looks at Dylan's character and asks, "Who are you?" and Dylan
                      replies with a mysterious smile, "Well, that's a good question!"

                      Here are some interesting tidbits:


                      About belief and knowledge (quoted and discussed in a previous post):

                      "I'd say people will always believe in something if they feel it to be
                      true. Just knowing it's true is not enough. If you feel in your gut that
                      it's true, well, then, you can be pretty much assured that it's true."

                      Here is something that kind of stunned me because there was a piece in it
                      that hit right home on a personal level:

                      ****************************************************************************

                      DYLAN: Well, certain truths I know. Not necessarily myself but a certain
                      accumulation of experience that has become real to me and a knowledge that
                      I acquired on the road.

                      PLAYBOY: And what are those truths?

                      DYLAN: One is that if you try to be anyone but yourself, you will fail; if
                      you are not true to your own heart, you will fail. Then again, there's no
                      success like failure

                      PLAYBOY: And failure's no success at all.

                      DYLAN: Oh, well, we're not looking to succeed. Just by our being and acting
                      alive, we succeed. You fail only when you let death creep in and take over
                      a part of your life that should be alive.

                      PLAYBOY: How does death creep in?

                      DYLAN: Death don't come knocking at the door. It's there in the morning
                      when you wake up.

                      PLAYBOY: How is it there?

                      DYLAN: Did you ever clip your fingernails, cut your hair? Then you
                      experience death.

                      ****************************************************************************

                      About keys:

                      ****************************************************************************
                      PLAYBOY: What does a major key generally conjure up for you?

                      DYLAN: I think any major key deals with romance.

                      PLAYBOY: And the minor keys?

                      DYLAN: The supernatural.

                      PLAYBOY: What about other specific keys?

                      DYLAN: I find C major to be the key of strength, but also the key of
                      regret. E major is the key of confidence. A-flat major is the key of
                      renunciation.
                      ****************************************************************************

                      About Death and the Devil:

                      ****************************************************************************
                      PLAYBOY: When you're onstage, do you feel the illusion that death can't get
                      you?

                      DYLAN: Death can't get you at all. Death's not here to get anybody. It's
                      the appearance of the Devil, and the Devil is a coward, so knowledge will
                      overcome that.

                      PLAYBOY: What do you mean?

                      DYLAN: The Devil is everything false, the Devil will go as deep as you let
                      the Devil go. You can leave yourself open to that. If you understand what
                      that whole scene is about, you can easily step aside. But if you want the
                      confrontation to begin with, well, there's plenty of it. But then again, if
                      you believe you have a purpose and a mission, and not much time to carry it
                      out, you don't bother about those things.

                      PLAYBOY: Do you think you have a purpose and a mission?

                      DYLAN: Obviously.

                      PLAYBOY: What is it?

                      DYLAN: Henry Miller said it: The role of an artist is to inoculate the
                      world with disillusionment.
                      ****************************************************************************
                      About belief:

                      "But, getting back to that again, you have to have belief. You must have a
                      purpose. You must believe that you-can disappear through walls. Without
                      that belief, you're not going to become a very good rock singer, or pop
                      singer, or folk-rock singer, or you're not going to become a very good
                      lawyer. Or a doctor. You must know why you're doing what you're doing."

                      (Tarjei:)
                      There you go. Even a scientist needs to have belief.

                      About Jimmy Carter (who was president at the time of the interview):

                      ****************************************************************************
                      PLAYBOY: Jimmy Carter has said that listening to your songs, he learned to
                      see in a new way the relationship between landlord and tenant, farmer and
                      sharecropper and things like that. He also said that you were his friend.
                      What do you think of all that?

                      DYLAN: I am his friend.

                      PLAYBOY: A personal friend?

                      DYLAN: I know him personally.

                      PLAYBOY: Do you like him?

                      DYLAN: Yeah, I think his heart's in the right place.

                      PLAYBOY: How would you describe that place?

                      DYLAN: The place of destiny. You know, I hope the magazine won't take all
                      this stuff and edit-like, Carter's heart's in the right place of destiny,
                      because it's going to really sound

                      PLAYBOY: No, it would lose the sense of conversation. The magazine's pretty
                      good about that.

                      DYLAN: Carter has his heart in the right place. He has a sense of who he
                      is. That's what I felt, anyway, when I met him.

                      PLAYBOY: Have you met him many times?

                      DYLAN: Only once.

                      PLAYBOY: Stayed at his house?

                      DYLAN: No. But anybody who's a governor or a Senate leader or in a position
                      of authority who finds time to invite a folkrock singer and his band out to
                      his place has got to have . . . a sense of humor . . . and a feeling of the
                      pulse of the people. Why does he have to do it? Most people in those kinds
                      of positions can't relate at all to people in the music field unless it's
                      for some selfish purpose.

                      PLAYBOY: Did you talk about music or politics?

                      DYLAN: Music. Very little politics. The conversation was kept in pretty
                      general areas.

                      PLAYBOY: Does he have any favorite Dylan songs?

                      DYLAN: I didn't ask him if he had any favorite Dylan songs. He didn't say
                      that he did. I think he liked Ballad of a Thin Man, really.

                      PLAYBOY: Did you think that Carter might have been using you by inviting
                      you there?

                      DYLAN: No, I believe that he was a decent, untainted man and he just wanted
                      to check me out.
                      ****************************************************************************

                      Cheers,


                      Tarjei
                      under the auspices of
                      His Holiness Uncle Taz
                      http://uncletaz.com/

                      "At least two thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human
                      malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity,
                      idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religious or
                      political idols."
                      - Aldous Huxley
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