Re: The President a Liar and Murderer
- Tarjei wrote:
Bush doesn't have the brains to lie. He believes everything he's
> to believe, just like Ronald Reagan did. So the question is,obviously,
> who's lying to Bush?Dear Tarjei,
It is a lie and he does have a brain to lie just like all other men
and women do. We can not make excuses for his lies and his
misinformation. He has a job to do and just like the Scientologists
who think it is okay to lie to do something you believe is right so
does Bush. Reagan lied as well. These are not stupid men. They may
not be intellectuals but indeed they have bought Lucifers lie hook
line and sinker. Therefore they lie. Unless one wants to blame it on
Lucifer which would of course be the easy thing to do. It is still
Bush who has bought this lie from Lucifer and he calls it Gods will.
At this point I do not expect the politicians to tell me the truth
however i do not think them to be so bold as to lie right to my face
and smile thinking I have not seen it. Lucifer is becoming
transparent. I have seen the lie as have many others. And no, this
does not mean that other politicians have not lied, they have.
Why not just say the truth that I am out to save the world and God is
on my side. Are you with me or are you not? I believe he can not and
dare not say it as then lord Lucifers game would be up unbeknownst to
him. And Lucifer loves to play games. Lord Lucifer loves to excite
righteousness and hate in people. He loves for one group to think it
better than another. He loves disiveness. That is how his energy
continues through the quickness of misplaced emotions. Let us choose
not to give into this game and continue to argue for a higher
understanding led by Lord Michael.
- At 20:21 04.01.2004, Dottie wrote:
>They may not be intellectuals but indeed they have bought Lucifers lieLucifer, the god of primeval wisdom, does not lie; that's fundy talk.
>hook line and sinker.
Ahriman, however, is the liar and father of lies.
> >They may not be intellectuals but indeed they have bought Luciferslie
> >hook line and sinker.Tarjei
> Lucifer, the god of primeval wisdom, does not lie; that's fundytalk.
> Ahriman, however, is the liar and father of lies.Dottie
There are two aspects to Lucifer that I understand. One above and one
below. The one below has begun a lie that this world is the true
world and he is the true God. And in that Lucifer lies.
Nuthin fundy about it.
- At 20:36 04.01.2004, Dottie wrote:
>There are two aspects to Lucifer that I understand. One above and oneAhriman is the World Prince:
>below. The one below has begun a lie that this world is the true world and
>he is the true God. And in that Lucifer lies.
"Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be
cast out." - Joh 12:31
"Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world
cometh, and hath nothing in me." - Joh 14:30
"Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged." - Joh 16:11
Ahriman is also the father of lies:
"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because
there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it." - Joh 8:44
Lucifer is the bringer of wisdom and liberty. His work is fulfilled by Christ.
>Nuthin fundy about it.No, not necessarily, when we take into consideration that Milton also
blended Ahriman and Lucifer into one in "Paradise Lost", and that even
Goethe blended them in Faust's Mephistopheles, who, although basically
Ahriman, became a sort of Lucifer-Ahriman. But the fundies are the
forerunners of insisting upon this blend, declaring everything else to be
heresy and devil-worship. You should see the fire-and-brimstone angry mails
I have received from fundies because of my article "Children of Lucifer"
- Tarjei wrote:
> Lucifer is the bringer of wisdom and liberty. His work is fulfilledby Christ.
Where is Sophia in all of this in your mind? I can't see how it is
said that Lucifer is the bringer of wisdom and liberty here in the
physical realm. Don't we bring it unto ourselves through our work
which is affected by that which we encounter of Lucifer and Christ in
the physical realm?
I have absolutely no feeling for this Ahriman. Can you point me to
where he rises in the Bible according to Steiner? Also I am wondering
where it is differentiated by Lucifer as well if you know off hand?
I am wondering of your quotes if Ahriman is noted as such because it
is said 'he is coming' and that Lucifer is already here.
And I know this is strange to say but can it be that Ahriman is the
fallen Lucifer that exists in our physical world. Pardon my ignorance.
- At 02:50 05.01.2004, Dottie wrote:
>Tarjei wrote:Sophia is the purified soul, the Virgin Soul bestowed by Christ through the
> > Lucifer is the bringer of wisdom and liberty. His work is fulfilled
>Where is Sophia in all of this in your mind?
Holy Spirit. Lucifer Redeemed has something to do with the Holy Spirit too,
coming up in the next post.
>I can't see how it is said that Lucifer is the bringer of wisdom andThe physical realm is the result of the Fall, which was Lucifer's original
>liberty here in the physical realm.
>Don't we bring it unto ourselves through our work which is affected bySounds about right to me.
>that which we encounter of Lucifer and Christ in the physical realm?
>I have absolutely no feeling for this Ahriman.Ahriman doesn't want you to feel him, Dottie. That's what makes him so
subtle and elusive.
>Can you point me to where he rises in the Bible according to Steiner?That's best described in "Occult Science". In the New Testament, Ahriman
(or Satan) is spoken of as the Prince of the World. And there are some very
interesting reference to Ahriman in the Old Testament. Here is one:
"And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the
LORD, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him." - Zec 3:1
According to Steiner, the power of Ahriman is felt from the right, Lucifer
from the left. And the name "Satan" leaves no doubt about who is being
talked about here.
>Also I am wondering where it is differentiated by Lucifer as well if youI don't understand your question.
>know off hand?
>I am wondering of your quotes if Ahriman is noted as such because it isYou're referring to Joh 14:30 where Christ says: "Hereafter I will not talk
>said 'he is coming' and that Lucifer is already here.
much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in
me." Yes, that's a fascinating NT quote that corroborates very strongly,
the way I see it, Steiner's description of spiritual evolution and the role
of cosmice Beings like Ahriman. As you probably know, Ahriman's power came
into play for real in the 14th, 15th, and 16th centuries as the universe
changed from Ptolemy to Galileo. Shakespeare describes this wonderfully in
some of his tragedies, especially in King Lear, where the world of the Earl
of Gloucester, who tries to arrange his life astrologically according to
the stars, while his bastard son Edmund, whose philosopophy reads "Gods,
stand up for bastards!" has the following to say about his father's
old-fashioned astrological world-view: "I am rough and lecherous. - Fut, I
should have been that I am, had the maidenliest star in the firmament
twinkled on my bastardizing."
Further down the road, Ahriman makes his power felt for full music in the
1840's and onwards, during the scientific Enlightenment. The economists
have long ago taken over political leadership, pushing aside the monarchs
and the clergy, and the men of finance are calling the shots. Ahriman is in
the driver seat; he is the World Priince.
That, i think, is what Christ meant when he said that He Himself was
leaving, but Ahriman was on his way. The path of Ahriman into the driver
seat as world prince had to be intercepted by the Golgotha Mystery before
Ahriman's plan was accomplished. Humanity needed time to absorb some of the
Christ Impulse before Ahriman's hour arrived. The greatest challenge is yet
to come, because Ahriman will incarnate physically during the third
millennium; probably during the first third of this millennium, and most
likely on the Western hemisphere.
>And I know this is strange to say but can it be that Ahriman is the fallenAhriman is Lucifer's karma. Ahriman came into the world as a result of
>Lucifer that exists in our physical world. Pardon my ignorance.
Lucifer's Deed. Check this out:
"The higher hierarchies contain in their being the forces that have formed
Saturn, the Sun, the Moon and finally the Earth. If the higher hierarchies
had expressed their teachings amongst themselves, as it were, up to the
Mystery of Golgotha, they would have said: We can form the Earth out of
Saturn, Sun and Moon. But if the Earth were to contain only what we have
placed into Saturn, Sun and Moon it would never have been able to develop
beings who know something about death, and can therefore develop the
intellect within them. We, the higher hierarchies, are able to let an Earth
proceed out of the Moon, on which there are men who know nothing of death,
and on which they cannot develop the intellect. It is not possible for us,
higher hierarchies, to form the Earth in such a way that it is able to
supply the forces which lead man towards the intellect. We must rely, for
this, on an entirely different being, on a being who comes from another
direction than our own - The Ahrimanic Being. Ahriman is a being who does
not belong to our hierarchy. Ahriman comes into the stream of evolution
from another direction. If we tolerate Ahriman in the evolution of the
Earth, if we allow him a share in it, he brings us death, and with it, the
intellect, and we can take up in the human being death and intellect.
Ahriman knows death, because he is at one with the Earth and has trodden
paths which have brought him into connection with the evolution of the
Earth. He is an initiate, a sage of death, and for this reason he is the
ruler of the intellect. The gods had to reckon with Ahriman - if I may
express it in this way. They had to say: the evolution cannot proceed
without Ahriman. It is only a question of admitting Ahriman into the
evolution. But if Ahriman is admitted and becomes the lord of death and,
consequently, of the intellect too, we forfeit the Earth, and Ahriman,
whose sole interest lies in permeating the Earth with intellect, will claim
the Earth for himself. The gods faced the great problem of losing to a
certain extent their rule over the Earth in favour of Ahriman. There was
only one possibility - that the gods themselves should learn to know
something which they could not learn in their godly abodes which were not
permeated by Ahriman - namely, that the gods should learn to know death
itself, on the Earth, through one of their emissaries - the Christ. A god
had to die on earth, and he had to die in such a way that this was not
grounded in the wisdom of the gods, but in the human error which would hold
sway if Ahriman alone were to rule. A god had to pass through death and he
had to overcome death."
- "Exoteric and Esoteric Christianity" Dornach, 2 April, 1922. (GA 211) -
- I wrote:
>Shakespeare describes this wonderfully in some of his tragedies,I'm sorry about that awful, awful sentence with dangling pieces that don't
>especially in King Lear, where the world of the Earl of Gloucester, who
>tries to arrange his life astrologically according to the stars, while his
>bastard son Edmund, whose philosopophy reads "Gods, stand up for
>bastards!" has the following to say about his father's old-fashioned
fit together. It's some of the worst I've ever written, I think.