43403RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: The Real, True *I* or Ego
- Mar 3, 2010Juan:
"At this point I don't see the absolute or dogmatic necessity of karma. Instead of karma being indispensable today I would say that "a heightened consciousness" is what is indispensable, and this is not achieved by rationalization based on abstract principles or "laws" but by a re-education and intensification or liberation of thinking (I thinkFederico was saying something very similar)."Dottie: Liberation or no liberation there is karma it is part of the cosmic worlds lawfulness....Do ....okay so someone who might know their past lives or one or two can begin to see the threads of the past and what is being or trying to be changed today. I can tell you I have seen exactly the karma of the past meeting me today, in the last two years and I mean exact people and although not the same circumstances I can see that it was I who had to change in what was being presented in this lifetime. And I could see where I was being gifted by how it was that I responded to certain things that caused Love to be in the room regardless of what it looked like to anyone else.Karma is, it is what we do in the moment that speaks to karma and how it is played out. d
"Hence only by means of love can we give real help for karma to work out in the right way." Rudolf Steiner
--- On Wed, 3/3/10, Kim Graae Munch <kimgm@...> wrote:
From: Kim Graae Munch <kimgm@...>
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: The Real, True *I* or Ego
Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 9:14 AMWithout karma you have an OT religion with a Father god which is telling you what is good and bad and which punishes you when you are bad. With karma you are creating your own future based on your actions and with a loving god who bears your burden with you, and who will help you when you are ready to be helped.Kim-----Original Message-----
From: firstname.lastname@example.org [mailto:email@example.com] On Behalf Of Juan Revilla
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: The Real, True *I* or Ego
K:Reincarnation makes you understand that you are a spiritual being, part of cosmos, and not just a physical entity, where karma makes you understand that "action has consequences", and of these two I think that reincarnation has the most profound influence of our thinking, where karma really only affirms our intuition.
J: I agree with you about reincarnation. Karma as a principle or a "law" is in most cases only rationalization, i.e., we can rationalize the same thing without using the concept of karma (more below). With reincarnation this cannot be done.
K:For the everyday life the knowledge about karma makes life just, as you know that the seemingly unjust incidences of fate are karmic responses of your own actions and it makes it easier to accept them and easier to handle them, and it makes it possible to handle karmic causes, from the current life, consciously within this life.
J: The traditional Christian alternative is "surrendering to the wisdom of the higher powers", but this seems to require from men today stronger soul forces because it is not aimed at the rational soul.
K: If you lie without consciously being aware of it, it becomes part of your astral body as karma, but if you are aware it becomes part of your current karma and you can handle the karma in the current life, and that is the reason, at end of the day, to think about the happenings of the day. -- Kim
The same principle can be explained by simple psychology if you change "astral body" by "unconscious", and "current karma" by "conscious awareness of how you are the creator of your life". No need for karma.
At this point I don't see the absolute or dogmatic necessity of karma. Instead of karma being indispensable today I would say that "a heightened consciousness" is what is indispensable, and this is not achieved by rationalization based on abstract principles or "laws" but by a re-education and intensification or liberation of thinking (I think Federico was saying something very similar).
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