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cosmic nutrition

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  • rickbobbs
    Dear FOlks; One of the most provocative facts that Steiner insists upon, (for a modern biologist), is that the vast majority of actual physical substance is
    Message 1 of 8 , Nov 30, 2003
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      Dear FOlks;

      One of the most provocative facts that Steiner insists upon, (for a
      modern biologist), is that the vast majority of actual physical
      substance is taken up through absorbtion by the various senses of
      highly diluted matter. This assertion has always struck me as being
      as hard to demonstrate as it is easy to mindlessly repeat.

      Imagine my surprise when, pursuing other matters, I came across this,
      apparently, non-anthroposophical reference:

      "And here I cannot refrain from quoting an example of the simplest
      diet -and the cheapest- taken from William Coles' "Art of Simpling":
      'Doctor Hackwill tells a story of a German Gentlewoman who lived for
      fourteen years without receiving any nourishment down her throat, but
      only walked frequently in a spacious Garden full of odoriferous
      Herbes and Flowers.'"

      (Elizabeth Lucas, Vegetable Cookery, 1931, William Heinemann Ltd.,
      pg. 301)

      Pretty terse!, and without further ado I can't say this is an example
      of what Steiner was talking about (e.g. the 'down her throat' doesn't
      eliminate ingestion), but I would greatly appreciate if anyone knows,
      or spots, any further reference to this or similar evidence.

      Thanks for your interest, Rick
    • Hogie McM
      Dear Rick: If you could please expound in more detail (but not too much is needed) on the exact meaning of the first parapgraph you presented, (perhaps
      Message 2 of 8 , Dec 2, 2003
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        Dear Rick:
        If you could please expound in more detail (but not too much is needed) on the exact meaning of the first
        parapgraph you presented, (perhaps including some examples), it would help this confused modern anatomist..
         
        Thanks,
        Hogie
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: rickbobbs
        Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 10:56 AM
        Subject: [anthroposophy] cosmic nutrition

        Dear FOlks;

        One of the most provocative facts that Steiner insists upon, (for a
        modern biologist), is that the vast majority of actual physical
        substance is taken up through absorbtion by the various senses of
        highly diluted matter. This assertion has always struck me as being
        as hard to demonstrate as it is easy to mindlessly repeat.

        Imagine my surprise when, pursuing other matters, I came across this,
        apparently, non-anthroposophical reference:

        "And here I cannot refrain from quoting an example of the simplest
        diet -and the cheapest- taken from William Coles' "Art of Simpling":
        'Doctor Hackwill tells a story of a German Gentlewoman who lived for
        fourteen years without receiving any nourishment down her throat, but
        only walked frequently in a spacious Garden full of odoriferous
        Herbes and Flowers.'"

        (Elizabeth Lucas, Vegetable Cookery, 1931, William Heinemann Ltd.,
        pg. 301)

        Pretty terse!, and without further ado I can't say this is an example
        of what Steiner was talking about (e.g. the 'down her throat' doesn't
        eliminate ingestion), but I would greatly appreciate if anyone knows,
        or spots, any further reference to this or similar evidence.

        Thanks for your interest, Rick






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      • walkinsnotwelcome
        I have wondered about this, not just the idea that we absorb physical substance through the air but especially what seems to be its complement, that (at least
        Message 3 of 8 , Dec 3, 2003
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          I have wondered about this, not just the idea that we absorb physical
          substance through the air but especially what seems to be its
          complement, that (at least for our bodies below the necks) this is
          our only source for physical substance. That second part doesn't seem
          like it could be right. Someone is deficient in mineral X, they eat
          some nice nourishing pills, they're not deficient anymore - if that
          works, there seems (wow, I am being cautious to the point of
          perversion) to be discrepancy here.
        • sncherr
          Steiner doesn t really say that we can survive without material substance. What he does say is that the food we take in through our digestive system is used to
          Message 4 of 8 , Dec 4, 2003
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            Steiner doesn't really say that we can survive without material
            substance. What he does say is that the food we take in through our
            digestive system is used to rebuild our nervous system during sleep.
            What we take in through our senses is the food for the rest of our
            body. When you bear in mind that the Steinerian view is of 12 senses,
            the highest being sense of ego, you can well imagine that this is
            more complicated than just sight, smell, etc.

            In adition, the Stienerian view of food we take in in the material
            way is all about forces as well. Basically, all food is viewed as a
            poison and our strength comes from the destruction of this poison and
            transmuting it to useable form by the body. Plant substance is
            healthier because it is harder to digest. The astral body of the
            animal does part of the work for us.

            I don't think you will find much material 'proof' of the way each
            sense nourishes the body. However, the information is readily
            available to sense-free thinking with effort. The body of research
            which touches on these ideas is connected with homeopathic provings.
            BTW, it is a little-known fact that one way to ingest a dose of a
            homeopathic remedy is to take the lid off the bottle and deeply
            inhale the contents. I guess this doesn't promote repeat sales very
            well, though. :-)

            namaste,

            Sarah

            --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Hogie McM" <hogie@a...> wrote:
            > Dear Rick:
            > If you could please expound in more detail (but not too much is
            needed) on the exact meaning of the first
            > parapgraph you presented, (perhaps including some examples), it
            would help this confused modern anatomist..
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Hogie
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: rickbobbs
            > To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 10:56 AM
            > Subject: [anthroposophy] cosmic nutrition
            >
            >
            > Dear FOlks;
            >
            > One of the most provocative facts that Steiner insists upon, (for
            a
            > modern biologist), is that the vast majority of actual physical
            > substance is taken up through absorbtion by the various senses of
            > highly diluted matter. This assertion has always struck me as
            being
            > as hard to demonstrate as it is easy to mindlessly repeat.
            >
            > Imagine my surprise when, pursuing other matters, I came across
            this,
            > apparently, non-anthroposophical reference:
            >
            > "And here I cannot refrain from quoting an example of the simplest
            > diet -and the cheapest- taken from William Coles' "Art of
            Simpling":
            > 'Doctor Hackwill tells a story of a German Gentlewoman who lived
            for
            > fourteen years without receiving any nourishment down her throat,
            but
            > only walked frequently in a spacious Garden full of odoriferous
            > Herbes and Flowers.'"
            >
            > (Elizabeth Lucas, Vegetable Cookery, 1931, William Heinemann Ltd.,
            > pg. 301)
            >
            > Pretty terse!, and without further ado I can't say this is an
            example
            > of what Steiner was talking about (e.g. the 'down her throat'
            doesn't
            > eliminate ingestion), but I would greatly appreciate if anyone
            knows,
            > or spots, any further reference to this or similar evidence.
            >
            > Thanks for your interest, Rick
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
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          • Hogie McM
            Dear Sarah: Thanks for responding. I wonder, for research purposes, if there is an Anthroposophically-oriented Homeopathist who has categorized the way in
            Message 5 of 8 , Dec 4, 2003
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              Dear Sarah:
              Thanks for responding.
              I wonder, for research purposes, if there is an Anthroposophically-oriented Homeopathist
              who has categorized the way in which each sense nourishes the body, and which specific regions, portions, organs and systems
              (being well-aware of the 3-fold Steinerian view of Man).
              That would be quite an interesting study indeed, an extremely important one.
              Anyone out there who would like to share their views, if such research exidts?
               
              Hogie, once Embryo
               
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: sncherr
              Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 8:18 AM
              Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: cosmic nutrition

              Steiner doesn't really say that we can survive without material
              substance. What he does say is that the food we take in through our
              digestive system is used to rebuild our nervous system during sleep.
              What we take in through our senses is the food for the rest of our
              body. When you bear in mind that the Steinerian view is of 12 senses,
              the highest being sense of ego, you can well imagine that this is
              more complicated than just sight, smell, etc.

              In adition, the Stienerian view of food we take in in the material
              way is all about forces as well. Basically, all food is viewed as a
              poison and our strength comes from the destruction of this poison and
              transmuting it to useable form by the body. Plant substance is
              healthier because it is harder to digest. The astral body of the
              animal does part of the work for us.

              I don't think you will find much material 'proof' of the way each
              sense nourishes the body. However, the information is readily
              available to sense-free thinking with effort. The body of research
              which touches on these ideas is  connected with homeopathic provings.
              BTW, it is a little-known fact that one way to ingest a dose of a
              homeopathic remedy is to take the lid off the bottle and deeply
              inhale  the contents. I guess this doesn't promote repeat sales very
              well, though. :-)

              namaste,

              Sarah

              --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Hogie McM" <hogie@a...> wrote:
              > Dear Rick:
              > If you could please expound in more detail (but not too much is
              needed) on the exact meaning of the first
              > parapgraph you presented, (perhaps including some examples), it
              would help this confused modern anatomist..
              >
              > Thanks,
              > Hogie
              >   ----- Original Message -----
              >   From: rickbobbs
              >   To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
              >   Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 10:56 AM
              >   Subject: [anthroposophy] cosmic nutrition
              >
              >
              >   Dear FOlks;
              >
              >   One of the most provocative facts that Steiner insists upon, (for
              a
              >   modern biologist), is that the vast majority of actual physical
              >   substance is taken up through absorbtion by the various senses of
              >   highly diluted matter. This assertion has always struck me as
              being
              >   as hard to demonstrate as it is easy to mindlessly repeat.
              >
              >   Imagine my surprise when, pursuing other matters, I came across
              this,
              >   apparently, non-anthroposophical reference:
              >
              >   "And here I cannot refrain from quoting an example of the simplest
              >   diet -and the cheapest- taken from William Coles' "Art of
              Simpling":
              >   'Doctor Hackwill tells a story of a German Gentlewoman who lived
              for
              >   fourteen years without receiving any nourishment down her throat,
              but
              >   only walked frequently in a spacious Garden full of odoriferous
              >   Herbes and Flowers.'"
              >
              >   (Elizabeth Lucas, Vegetable Cookery, 1931, William Heinemann Ltd.,
              >   pg. 301)
              >
              >   Pretty terse!, and without further ado I can't say this is an
              example
              >   of what Steiner was talking about (e.g. the 'down her throat'
              doesn't
              >   eliminate ingestion), but I would greatly appreciate if anyone
              knows,
              >   or spots, any further reference to this or similar evidence.
              >
              >   Thanks for your interest, Rick
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >         Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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              >
              >   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy
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              >
              >
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              Service.



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            • rick bobbette
              Dear Hogie; Thanks for your interest. A very good book that deals with this subject is Earth and Man by Karl Koenig, published by one of the bio-dynamic
              Message 6 of 8 , Dec 4, 2003
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                Dear Hogie;
                Thanks for your interest. A very good book that deals with this subject is "Earth and Man" by Karl Koenig, published by one of the bio-dynamic groups. He was a very experienced doctor (the founder of Camphill) and one of the most straightforward Steiner elaborators.
                 
                The point Steiner makes about metabolic digestion is that only a small amount of matter is 'rebuilt' through the digestive tract, from the food that has been basically destroyed, and that this feeds the nervous system, more particularly the brain... however a great many forces are taken in here. These play a role in the assembly of the finely diluted substances. This he says is part of the problem using human manure, as humans take the ego-forces out, and so these are not available back through the plants grown with it, whereas more of these forces remain in the manure of the animal.
                 
                You can maybe sense the problems - as well as the attraction - of the stories posted....
                 
                All the best, Rick


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              • Joel
                No need to get perverted. :) As I understand it, this is how it can be explained. Our bodies use energy at the most basic level to maintain health and
                Message 7 of 8 , Dec 10, 2003
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                  No need to get perverted. :)
                  As I understand it, this is how it can be explained. Our bodies use
                  energy at the most basic level to maintain health and function. In
                  most of us, we get that energy by breaking down material/physical
                  components - an thus need to replenish those components. In the case
                  of these people who have been able to directly use the energies
                  present in their environments, there is no longer a need to break
                  down components, so no need to replenish.
                  Obviously, understanding this concept entails a wider understanding
                  of how "reality" works than our common everyday allopathic
                  medicine/Western science paradigm generally accepts - but this is a
                  group talking about spirit in Earth life, after all! :)

                  --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "walkinsnotwelcome"
                  <zolarczakl@n...> wrote:
                  > I have wondered about this, not just the idea that we absorb
                  physical
                  > substance through the air but especially what seems to be its
                  > complement, that (at least for our bodies below the necks) this is
                  > our only source for physical substance. That second part doesn't
                  seem
                  > like it could be right. Someone is deficient in mineral X, they eat
                  > some nice nourishing pills, they're not deficient anymore - if that
                  > works, there seems (wow, I am being cautious to the point of
                  > perversion) to be discrepancy here.
                • rickbobbs
                  Dear wnw ; Steiner s view was that the food we ingest is most important to provide the forces used to build up the lower body, rather than the substance. This
                  Message 8 of 8 , Dec 10, 2003
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                    Dear 'wnw';


                    Steiner's view was that the food we ingest is most
                    important to provide the forces used to build up the lower body,
                    rather than the substance. This is the basis of many of his bio-
                    dynamic agriculture recommendations, as the mineral and manufactured
                    fertilizers eliminate or 'skew' these forces to our disadvantage.
                    Part of the effect (maybe all) of medicines could be the replacement
                    or supplementing of these forces, but I can't say anywhere that he
                    specified this.

                    Thanks for your interest, Rick.




                    -- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "walkinsnotwelcome"
                    <zolarczakl@n...> wrote:
                    > I have wondered about this, not just the idea that we absorb
                    physical
                    > substance through the air but especially what seems to be its
                    > complement, that (at least for our bodies below the necks) this is
                    > our only source for physical substance. That second part doesn't
                    seem
                    > like it could be right. Someone is deficient in mineral X, they eat
                    > some nice nourishing pills, they're not deficient anymore - if that
                    > works, there seems (wow, I am being cautious to the point of
                    > perversion) to be discrepancy here.
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