before everything else I have to ask you:
"have YOU read Ahmed's book or not ??"
Whatever the answer see below for some further comments of my own .
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2003 8:50 PM
Subject: RE: R: R: R: [anthroposophy] The Camp of the Saints is camped
> Dear Andrea,
> Not quite sure I understand your question. I don't find any riddle here.
> I look and see a brilliant young man who perhaps has spoken too soon
> from his brief life experiences about complex issues from a subjective
> rather than an objective view. I read Dr. Tausch's very clear and spelled
> out statement and see a man who was used; given one document to
> read and endorse only to find that the published document is different.
the value that I have to give to your reply depends on the anwer to my
I repeat: "have YOU - with your own eyes- read the book ?"
Anyway: my riddle here lies in the fact that the copy AT seems to have seen
as the definitive IS NOT the one given worldwide for translation in
> I did some "who-profits-from-this-book" research , looked at who is
> championing and found that it was organizations such as Ama Lahi,
> From the Wilderness, etc. who are using Dr. Nafeez Mosaddeq Ahmed's
> name and thesis. These are the very groups who tend to see just about
> everything that goes on in this country as being a part of some plot
> or conspiracies.
No, i really can't follow you on this path.
I'm more interested to see into each fact - maybe in Ruppert's website-
than to look for "who-proifits....?" or "cui prodest ?" like we use to say
here in Rome.( The facts are sometimes hidden under piles of mud.,..)
Following the "cui prodest" path we should have to say that Steiner
himself made Goetheanum burning, in order to create "The Foundation Stones"
> There is nothing new about that, of course. When the Okla. City bombing
> happened the same people saw the gov. behind that, too, and the same
> spin went around on all the details.
> Different administration. Same conspiratorial tales - the gov. did it, the
> building was really bombed from inside, the FBI knew it was going to
> McVey had been programmed by the men in black to carry out this deed,
> This always happens. People have agendas. The same conspiratorial nuts
come out ever time anything happens or, sometimes is expected to happen.
> Y2K we heard from the same people about how there would be terrorists
> at midnight and that FEMA would seize that opportunity to seal the borders
(which, by law they can do), take over the local police (which, by law they
can do), order over everyone to local post offices to show proof of
citizenship and register (which, by law they can do), and that a good number
of citizens would find themselves being shuffled off by Big Brother to
secret concentration camps where they would face execution by guillotine
in order to harvest their vitals for organs banks).
sorry but I 'm not able to grasp the core here
> Well, I think that by 9-12-01 any rational person could see that there is
> no Big Brother! If there really were some dire government plot to take
> country 9-11 was their most perfect of all opportunities. I guess I was
> on 9-12-03 that we were not ordered to register at our local post office.
I'd have been very glad to go register because our borders are a disaster.
Excuse me. Do you think to be able to discern what "GVT" think to be the
better opportunity for a kind of "golpe" ?:
> The problem from my perspective is that we are seeing, not secret lodges
at work, but the weaknesses of democracy in action.
Dear "Eye.." those are respectable ideological statements but they don't
say anything about some basic fact.
Here i remember only the strange behaviour of FAA and NORAD, for instance.
This has nothing to do with "weakness" but it looks like a "premeditate
failure" doesn'it ?
It has been a wonderful experiment and preferable to most other systems of
government (personally I think England's
> is better), we sure don't want to lose this experiment, but it does has it
draw backs and we are seeing them in action. We have global instability
because we change administrations so often and at election time the two
major parties are more concerned about selling themselves to the public than
the conflicting messages being sent out to the world's governments, (and at
times we get morally bankrupt people in place who lose their nuclear secret
code cards, prefer diddling their female interns, and watching a golf
tournament that answer the emergency phone call from their security advisor
telling him they have located Ben Lauden and our planes are ready for
takeoff). Intelligence gathering is flawed and the problem further
compounded by bureaucratic power-mongering.
> That it is all being controlled by some group of conspirators or secret
lodges just strikes me as absurd. The system in place is doing very well
imploding on its own. but, the same people who feed at the trough of
paranoia keep grinding out the same ol "the sky is falling" spin.
Excuse me but I'm bound here to remember what RS and tens of disciples said
and wrote about Occult Lodges. (See my post to Joel's insights about
> Last month a good friend, a First Class member, called me very up set
> having attended a private presentation to a group of anthroposophists in
> Bay area on 9-11 and how the horror and tragedy of that day was a total
fabrication, a government deception - there was really no plane that flew
> into the Pentagon, the WTC was bombed from within, the terrorists named
> were fabricated, etc. When I am told by a life time anthroposophic that
> are now convinced no plane was flown into the Pentagon, no terrorists
> the planes that hit the WTC my stomach knots up.
It's just the same "knot" that makes impossible to so many US goodwill
men to look in deep at this matter, and see the face under the mask!
Well here there is the basic difference between a good American citizen and
an Italian one. The former is not able to grasp how his own gvt could
project the mass murder of his own citizens. The latter has been accustomed
by his own country's story to think about it like an actual chance.
> Perche I have wanted to be believe that the study anthroposophy leads to
an individual becoming more discerning in their thinking, but, after years
> lists I have learned this isn't the case
Sure, if you let speak your own prejudices instead of your free thinking !
> Perche I have friends in D.C. who were involved in the horror at the
> Perche I have a friend here who lost his uncle on the first plane that
> hit the first tower at the WTC. On that plane the hostess called ground
> control and was describing the men who had taken control, where they
> had been seated and how they had just killed a " military type" by cutting
> his throat open with a box cutter. That "military type" had been a marine
> had stood up to the terrorists. He was my friend's uncle, an astronaut
and a marine. The FBI shared the tape of the stewardess' call with the
family at the
> time of his memorial service in N.J.
> Instead of going down a path about secret lodges and world domination
> by the evil forces who support Israel over the Palestinians, etc.
> I've found it more fruitful to read individuals such as Bernard Lewis who
> is in his 80s and has been studying and teaching about Islam for most of
> his adult life, and therefore is going to be more objective in his
> then the Dr. Ahmeds of this world who are, no matter how brilliant, still
> young and lacking the insight that will come to them in time as they
> I love reading the blog sites of the young, am a real fan of Salam Pax's
> Bagdad Diary, but, when it comes to judgmental tomes on the issues behind
> the problems of the world and what is going wrong and why, I prefer middle
> of the continuum thinking.
> I'm with Dr. Arno Tausch on this one, and am sorry that you can't see how
> serious a no-no it is to send someone your work asking for an endorsement,
> get it, and then change what you have written without giving that person
> chance to see the changes. Dr. Ahmed has shown his lack of integrity on
this matter. He is discredited by this act alone, so why would I care to
Again : "have YOU read Ahmed's book, buddy ?"
> Anyway, warm regards. :-)
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