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Starmann, christians, and Politics

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  • elaine upton
    My dear Starmann, You wrote that if I think all Christians are the same and all anthroposophists are Liberal Democrats then I am mistaken. Starmann, you are
    Message 1 of 1 , Apr 6, 2000
      My dear Starmann,

      You wrote that if I think all Christians are the same and all
      anthroposophists are "Liberal Democrats" then I am mistaken.

      Starmann, you are so way, way, way, way off my original point.
      I have no assumption that anthroposophists are all liberal democrats. I have
      no assumption that all christians are against the death penalty. I do get
      around, you know. I know some of who is for the death penalty, and i know
      something of who some anthropsophists vote for. That, i would think, would
      be obvious. All that has nothing to do with the posts i sent and the one i
      started on this thread.

      But, if you need to state that you, you, Starmann, are not a liberal
      democrat, then you have said it loud and clear and i have heard you.
      (Besides that, i don't call myself a liberal democrat, though you may assume
      that i do...but I am not interested in these political labels. You are the
      one who started the whole political labeling...).

      What i am interested in (and the point of my original and subsequent posts
      on this thread) is what is the relationship of politics and spirituality,
      what is the relationship of statistics and what some see as reality, and
      what does a man like George Bush have to offer as President of this country
      in which i live and grow as a spiritual being, and what is my responsibility
      in relationship to all this.

      Now, if you want to discuss any of this, beyond the political labeling,
      good. If not, you may find someone else to talk with, perhaps, but i am not

      Apparently (i don't know, but apparently), my posts have pushed your
      buttons. You are for the death penalty? You support the practice of Gov.
      Bush in presiding over these hundred executions? (This being one example of
      Bush's practices and politics...)

      You say "violent thugs" are those from which we need protection. Again, you
      do not deal with the issue i raised, and this is where the whole question of
      christianity and christian anthroposophy comes in.
      The Christ being taught that we are to "Love our enemy," to feed and clothe
      the hungry and the naked (among whom are the most violent criminals). I
      already said this in my previous post and you don't deal with this.This
      could be an interesting, loving, discussion. (For me, it is not easy to
      "Love my enemy", but it is my ideal. I would appreciate some help in talking
      about these things. I am not for the death penalty. I seek to practice what
      Jesus said: Love your enemy. Feed and clothe the hungry and naked. "Let him
      who is without sin cast the first stone."--These are things I would discuss

      --Morever, i referred to Rudolf Steiner saying that if we look deeply
      enough, we will see the Divine in even the most violent criminal. You don't
      deal with this. Instead, you write about my thinking every anthroposophist
      is a liberal democrat.

      I also wrote about Steiner's lecture (Fifth Gospel) on turning stones into
      bread. Money and its relationship to our lives. You write back that teachers
      in Utah who are paid less are the best teachers. What does that mean? Who
      decides they are the best? This is all dubious, and really rather

      So, I repeat, your post is way, way, way off the points I raised in the
      beginning, and subsequent post on this thread, points i raised in search of
      direction for dealing with difficult issues of politics and spirituality,
      death penalty and loving my enemy, seeing the divine, as Steiner says, in
      the most violent criminal.

      Blessings--Be well,

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