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Re: R: [anthroposophy] Re: Etheric Realm, Keely and the "devices""question

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  • DRStarman2001@aol.com
    ... *******Yes, but that s all I seem to hear from people in this thread is fear. And I believe it s one based on fear of the unknown, because no one here
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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      okcgbr@... writes:
      > - I can't avoid to feel a cold shudder when I think to "etheric devices".

      *******Yes, but that's all I seem to hear from people in this thread is fear. And I believe it's one based on fear of the unknown, because no one here appears to have actually worked with any of the etheric forces, not even using pendulums. It's just like the Luddite anti-technology attitude I find among so many people who find their way to anthroposophy somehow while really not knowing and despising all science and technology. Where's the will in that kind of thinking, though? That fear will not advance etheric physics, nor armchair discussions about what it might be or might not be.
      There's lots of experimental work to be done and worrying about every sort of things the intellect can dream up beforehand doesn't accomplish anything. If you started diagnosing people with sensitive crystallization, for instance (which uses the etheric forces, BTW), and then noted that your inner psychological or moral condition affected the results obtained, then you could report that and note the laws that you see operate there. (Incidentally I know people who use it and they've never observed any such: that could be because they're morally fine or because it's irrelevant.)

      My point was that, the giant redwood tree, for instance, uses etheric forces to draw its sap up from the roots to its uppermost leaves, and we can understand how this force of 'levity' works without bringing the consideration of astral and higher forces into one's thinking about it. The etheric can be examined alone without refernce to these, and understood by itself. Yes, all etheric forces are set into motion by astral and higher impulses--- but, once they're form-causing etheric forces, they operate on their own laws; rather as, once any item becomes a commodity, whether it's an onion or a Van Gogh painting, it must follow the economic laws of production, distribution and consumption.
      -starman
    • LilOleMiss
      Dear Dr. Starman, First of all, I want to try to express my very deep appreciation for your truly wonderful gift of Pfeiffer s works, and all the trouble
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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        Dear Dr. Starman,
         
        First of all, I want to try to express my very deep appreciation for your truly wonderful gift of Pfeiffer's works, and all the trouble you've gone to for our sake, plus your long wonderful submissions on the planets and very much else. These are things I hold dear in attempting some measure of knowledge - hopefully applicable knowledge - but nevertheless a help to mankind and the Spiritual Worlds.
         
        In regard to your so very true words below of some fearing etheric forces, I most definitely agree, but it is a realm we must learn about and understand in so far as we are able, since these forces surround us at all times, in my estimation. I have never mentioned my own limited experience with etheric forces, but my husband worked briefly at the power plant between Niagara Falls and Tannawanda, NY which I understood was one where Nicole Tesla did some of his own work with etheric forces. Through my husband's work here and there over the globe as we travelled with our two children and a huge Collie dog in tow, I also was exposed to many of these same etheric forces, although working from a differing perspective than his. In so far as federal security laws allowed, we shared insights and experiences into many facets of this realm, which even then I felt permeated *everything*, although I most definitely do not understand their workings as well as I should or might have been able to learn at the time. This work ranged from electrical engineering to atomic physics, including strontium 90, etc., etc. and much of NASA's extensive applications in the etheric field. I do not understand them well enough to realize much of their potential, but perhaps enough to have great respect and realization of their potential for the Good as well as the Bad. None of them, when used rightly, are to be feared, in my unenlightened opinion, but care must be taken to use and handle them carefully for the Good in all respects. 
         
        As a side remark, it seems to me a very great deal is known about this subject but not in as cohesive a manner as is needed, but the time seems to be growing short for mankind to awaken to some knowledge, however slight, to their applicability. Yes, they are used in evil ways, but also in Good ways, although mankind's practical knowledge is yet in its early stages.
         
        Thank you also for the wonderful remark about redwood trees, Dr. Starman. I am surrounded by them here with the awe and wonderment of their sight ever renewed.  
         
        For all, please forgive my manner of expression in writing - it derives from a habit in another discipline seemingly necessary at an early stage of development. But perhaps old dogs can learn new tricks.
         
        Sheila
         
        okcgbr@... writes:
        > - I can't avoid to feel a cold shudder when I think to "etheric devices".

        *******Yes, but that's all I seem to hear from people in this thread is fear. And I believe it's one based on fear of the unknown, because no one here appears to have actually worked with any of the etheric forces, not even using pendulums. It's just like the Luddite anti-technology attitude I find among so many people who find their way to anthroposophy somehow while really not knowing and despising all science and technology. Where's the will in that kind of thinking, though? That fear will not advance etheric physics, nor armchair discussions about what it might be or might not be.
           There's lots of experimental work to be done and worrying about every sort of things the intellect can dream up beforehand doesn't accomplish anything. If you started diagnosing people with sensitive crystallization, for instance (which uses the etheric forces, BTW), and then noted that your inner psychological or moral condition affected the results obtained, then you could report that and note the laws that you see operate there. (Incidentally I know people who use it and they've never observed any such: that could be because they're morally fine or because it's irrelevant.)

           My point was that, the giant redwood tree, for instance, uses etheric forces to draw its sap up from the roots to its uppermost leaves, and we can understand how this force of 'levity' works without bringing the consideration of astral and higher forces into one's thinking about it. The etheric can be examined alone without refernce to these, and understood by itself. Yes, all etheric forces are set into motion by astral and higher impulses--- but, once they're form-causing etheric forces, they operate on their own laws; rather as, once any item becomes a commodity, whether it's an onion or a Van Gogh painting, it must follow the economic laws of production, distribution and consumption.
        -starman
      • DRStarman2001@aol.com
        ... *******I don t want to go into the Tesla myths, because True Believers get so emotional; but I know of no work in etheric technology which that famed
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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          lilolemiss@... writes:
          > I have never mentioned my own limited experience with etheric forces, but my husband worked briefly at the power plant between Niagara Falls and Tannawanda, NY which I understood was one where Nicole Tesla did some of his own work with etheric forces...

          *******I don't want to go into the Tesla myths, because True Believers get so emotional; but I know of no work in etheric technology which that famed electrical engineer ever did.
          Electricity and etheric forces are opposites and cancel each other out, often violently, so there would appear to be no electrical way to work with them, except 'body electricity'. The most that's been done is that a 'killed' image of the life forces can be gotten through Kirlian photography or 'spark-gap' photography (see "The Loom of Creation" by Denis Milner & Edward Smart).


          <<<<Through my husband's work here and there over the globe as we travelled with our two children and a huge Collie dog in tow, I also was exposed to many of these same etheric forces, although working from a differing perspective than his. In so far as federal security laws allowed, we shared insights and experiences into many facets of this realm, which even then I felt permeated *everything*, although I most definitely do not understand their workings as well as I should or might have been able to learn at the time. This work ranged from electrical engineering to atomic physics, including strontium 90, etc., etc. and much of NASA's extensive applications
          > in the etheric field...


          *******NASA has no such applications and that technology you refer to is the opposite of the etheric.
          Perhaps we're using the term differently. Some specific kinds of etheric technology are sensitive crystallization, capillary dynamolysis, homeopathic dilutions, bio-dynamic preparations, Flowforms, the light and electrical devices designed by the Edgar Cayce Readings, Reich's orgone devices such as cloudbusters, the derivations of these that Constable uses for weather control and to make the elemental beings we call 'UFOs' visible (see "The Cosmic Pulse of Life" by Trevor J. Constable), radionics devices, pendulums and many other 'radiesthesia' devices that work with the same forces known by acupuncture, Ta'i Chi, Qi Gong, Contact Reflex Analysis, etc.
          The US government is doing ZIP with all of these--- with the exception of a small, recently established Office of Complimentary Medicine---contrary to the rumor-driven X-Files/Area 51 fictions so many people believe these days (which result in nonsensical things like believing "we" have secret UFO anti-gravity technology, but we regularly keep spending billions sending the Space Shuttles up the old, dangerous jet-propulsion way...I suppose to keep the
          'conspiracy' secret). But the materialist training of government employees makes almost all of them consider any etheric tech nonsense, because of the revolutionary new way of thinking it requires. It's nothing like atomic technology or electrical engineering and in fact many of its fundamental concepts fly in the face of all that.
          -starman
        • Bill
          I m not coming from fear. I m coming from looking at the whole picture using spiritual scientific investigation by working through the intellect, into, and
          Message 4 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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            I'm not coming from fear. I'm coming from looking at the whole picture using spiritual scientific investigation by working through the intellect, into, and from the heart. "Shudder" doesn't necessarily mean fear. Fear, to some extent, is present in all human beings. Reducing its influence in our lives is of utmost importance, especially when the influence is coming from distractions to our evolutionary path. Fear eclipses healing on all levels.

            The pendulum is an excellent example of something that can't be proved by modern science. It's also an excellent example in refuting formal logic.

            We know there are many levels of consciousness and, as these unwrap, we look deeper and deeper into whatever process we are looking into. You can say levity has a simple explanation but a simple explanation is not a complete explanation. And I'm not talking about intellectualizing it to the nth degree. I'm talking about feeling it.

            There's a difference between etheric forces in a plant and etheric forces in animals and humans. And even in the plant kingdom there is astral and ego present in the spiritual realm. What influence this has, if any, I'm not sure.

            Bill

            DRStarman2001@... wrote:
             okcgbr@... writes:
            - I can't avoid to feel a cold shudder when I think to "etheric devices".

            *******Yes, but that's all I seem to hear from people in this thread is fear. And I believe it's one based on fear of the unknown, because no one here appears to have actually worked with any of the etheric forces, not even using pendulums. It's just like the Luddite anti-technology attitude I find among so many people who find their way to anthroposophy somehow while really not knowing and despising all science and technology. Where's the will in that kind of thinking, though? That fear will not advance etheric physics, nor armchair discussions about what it might be or might not be.
            There's lots of experimental work to be done and worrying about every sort of things the intellect can dream up beforehand doesn't accomplish anything. If you started diagnosing people with sensitive crystallization, for instance (which uses the etheric forces, BTW), and then noted that your inner psychological or moral condition affected the results obtained, then you could report that and note the laws that you see operate there. (Incidentally I know people who use it and they've never observed any such: that could be because they're morally fine or because it's irrelevant.)

            My point was that, the giant redwood tree, for instance, uses etheric forces to draw its sap up from the roots to its uppermost leaves, and we can understand how this force of 'levity' works without bringing the consideration of astral and higher forces into one's thinking about it. The etheric can be examined alone without refernce to these, and understood by itself. Yes, all etheric forces are set into motion by astral and higher impulses--- but, once they're form-causing etheric forces, they operate on their own laws; rather as, once any item becomes a commodity, whether it's an onion or a Van Gogh painting, it must follow the economic laws of production, distribution and consumption.
            -starman

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          • LilOleMiss
            ... *******I don t want to go into the Tesla myths, Nor do I, Dr. Starman. There is more involved than simply Tesla s work in what I mentioned above, and much
            Message 5 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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              lilolemiss@... writes:
              > I have never mentioned my own limited experience with etheric forces, but my husband worked briefly at the power plant between Niagara Falls and Tannawanda, NY which I understood was one where Nicole Tesla did some of his own work with etheric forces...

              *******I don't want to go into the Tesla myths, 
               
              Nor do I, Dr. Starman. There is more involved than simply Tesla's work in what I mentioned above, and much is not available other than in applications from indirect sources. 
               
              *******Electricity and etheric forces are opposites and cancel each other out, often violently, so there would appear to be no electrical way to work with them, except 'body electricity'. The most that's been done is that a 'killed' image of the life forces can be gotten through Kirlian photography or 'spark-gap' photography (see "The Loom of Creation" by Denis Milner & Edward Smart).


              <<<<Through my husband's work here and there over the globe as we travelled with our two children and a huge Collie dog in tow, I also was exposed to many of these same etheric forces, although working from a differing perspective than his. In so far as federal security laws allowed, we shared insights and experiences into many facets of this realm, which even then I felt permeated *everything*, although I most definitely do not understand their workings as well as I should or might have been able to learn at the time. This work ranged from electrical engineering to atomic physics, including strontium 90, etc., etc. and much of NASA's extensive applications
              > in the etheric field...


              *******NASA has no such applications and that technology you refer to is the opposite of the etheric. 
              I should have mentioned - sorry - NASA does not do all, or even most, of the work done under its auspices, but contracts out very many aspects dealing with what they are noted for as well as some they are never connected with in public. Some of this work is not widely known nor is it related to their stupid space programs - sorry, but in all honesty I have no use for those applications, if one can even call them that. Some of their work is done using linear accelerators, similar to what one might find at Lawrence Livermore Labs and elsewhere from a differing aspect. 
               

              ********Perhaps we're using the term differently. Some specific kinds of etheric technology are sensitive crystallization, capillary dynamolysis, homeopathic dilutions, bio-dynamic preparations, Flowforms, the light and electrical devices designed by the Edgar Cayce Readings, Reich's orgone devices such as cloudbusters, the derivations of these that Constable uses for weather control and to make the elemental beings we call 'UFOs' visible (see "The Cosmic Pulse of Life" by Trevor J. Constable), radionics devices, pendulums and many other 'radiesthesia' devices that work with the same forces known by acupuncture, Ta'i Chi, Qi Gong, Contact Reflex Analysis, etc.
                 The US government is doing ZIP with all of these--- with the exception of a small, recently established Office of Complimentary Medicine---contrary to the rumor-driven X-Files/Area 51 fictions so many people believe these days (which result in nonsensical things like believing "we" have secret UFO anti-gravity technology, but we regularly keep spending billions sending the Space Shuttles up the old, dangerous jet-propulsion way...I suppose to keep the
              'conspiracy' secret). But the materialist training of government employees makes almost all of them consider any etheric tech nonsense, because of the revolutionary new way of thinking it requires. It's nothing like atomic technology or electrical engineering and in fact many of its fundamental concepts fly in the face of all that.
              -starman
              Dr. Starman, I do apologize if I seemed to be stating what is mentioned above in your words, and I know nothing of X-Files and UFO things nor did I mean or intend to imply a stance such as exists in your words above. I suppose what I was trying to say had better not have been attempted given security breaches of various sorts. My husband has never been a government employee, nor have I, so we were free to think for ourselves, and did. I suppose the truth of the matter is that there are many things going on "behind the scenes," so to say, leaving each one of us to discover for ourselves what exists using our own freedom of will.
              You've presented an interesting summation of new thoughts for me to ponder.
               
              Thank you,
              Sheila

            • Bill
              This is supported by the fact that the perpetual motion generator is still hanging out there somewhere, not working. Why? That s the mystery. Bill
              Message 6 of 7 , Aug 28, 2002
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                This is supported by the fact that the perpetual motion generator is still hanging out there somewhere, not working. Why? That's the mystery.

                Bill

                DRStarman2001@... wrote:
                 lilolemiss@... writes:
                I have never mentioned my own limited experience with etheric forces, but my husband worked briefly at the power plant between Niagara Falls and Tannawanda, NY which I understood was one where Nicole Tesla did some of his own work with etheric forces...

                *******I don't want to go into the Tesla myths, because True Believers get so emotional; but I know of no work in etheric technology which that famed electrical engineer ever did.
                Electricity and etheric forces are opposites and cancel each other out, often violently, so there would appear to be no electrical way to work with them, except 'body electricity'. The most that's been done is that a 'killed' image of the life forces can be gotten through Kirlian photography or 'spark-gap' photography (see "The Loom of Creation" by Denis Milner & Edward Smart).


                <<<<Through my husband's work here and there over the globe as we travelled with our two children and a huge Collie dog in tow, I also was exposed to many of these same etheric forces, although working from a differing perspective than his. In so far as federal security laws allowed, we shared insights and experiences into many facets of this realm, which even th en I felt permeated *everything*, although I most definitely do not understand their workings as well as I should or might have been able to learn at the time. This work ranged from electrical engineering to atomic physics, including strontium 90, etc., etc. and much of NASA's extensive applications
                in the etheric field...


                *******NASA has no such applications and that technology you refer to is the opposite of the etheric.
                Perhaps we're using the term differently. Some specific kinds of etheric technology are sensitive crystallization, capillary dynamolysis, homeopathic dilutions, bio-dynamic preparations, Flowforms, the light and electrical devices designed by the Edgar Cayce Readings, Reich's orgone devices such as cloudbusters, the derivations of these that Constable uses for weather control and to make the elemental beings we call 'UFOs' visible (see "The Cosmic Pulse of Life" by Trevor J. Constable), radionics devices, pendulums and many other 'radiesthesia' devices that work with the same forces known by acupuncture, Ta'i Chi, Qi Gong, Contact Reflex Analysis, etc.
                The US government is doing ZIP with all of these--- with the exception of a small, recently established Office of Complimentary Medicine---contrary to the rumor-driven X-Files/Ar ea 51 fictions so many people believe these days (which result in nonsensical things like believing "we" have secret UFO anti-gravity technology, but we regularly keep spending billions sending the Space Shuttles up the old, dangerous jet-propulsion way...I suppose to keep the
                'conspiracy' secret). But the materialist training of government employees makes almost all of them consider any etheric tech nonsense, because of the revolutionary new way of thinking it requires. It's nothing like atomic technology or electrical engineering and in fact many of its fundamental concepts fly in the face of all that.
                -starman



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