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Re: [anthroposophy] The Choice

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  • DRStarman2001@aol.com
    In a message dated 1/7/2002 2:20:21 PM, bob.cynth@sympatico.ca writes:
    Message 1 of 16 , Jan 7, 2002
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      In a message dated 1/7/2002 2:20:21 PM, bob.cynth@... writes:

      << I've been receiving, via this group, many messages from "danifyou" and I
      am simply not
      able to make sense of them. Is it me... or is it him? For the most part,
      I don't
      actively participate in this group as a contributor because I simply am not
      as far
      along the AP journey as most of you and I quite enjoy the way my life is being
      enriched by those who do actively contribute. Please accept my gratitude for
      your
      knowledge and generosity. I'm just not "getting it" with the"danifyou"'s
      posts. Are
      they simply out of my league or could someone please explain more clearly the
      point
      he/she is trying to make.

      Thank you,

      Cynthia >>

      I think you have lots of company. I've been studying anthroposophy for 25
      years and they're gibberish to me. They sound like he's been taking too many
      drugs.

      Starman
    • Cynthia & Bob
      I ve been receiving, via this group, many messages from danifyou and I am simply not able to make sense of them. Is it me... or is it him? For the most
      Message 2 of 16 , Jan 7, 2002
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        I've been receiving, via this group, many messages from "danifyou" and I am simply not
        able to make sense of them. Is it me... or is it him? For the most part, I don't
        actively participate in this group as a contributor because I simply am not as far
        along the AP journey as most of you and I quite enjoy the way my life is being
        enriched by those who do actively contribute. Please accept my gratitude for your
        knowledge and generosity. I'm just not "getting it" with the"danifyou"'s posts. Are
        they simply out of my league or could someone please explain more clearly the point
        he/she is trying to make.

        Thank you,

        Cynthia

        danifyou@... wrote:

        > One Door: The Ring, The Head, Ahriman,
        > Frank-EINSTEIN,
        > The Witch of the West; Death
        >
        > Another Door: The Flower of Oz 'I AM'
        > (Shamballah)
        > The Heart, The Sun,
        > Christus-Luciferus
        > FRANK-Incense
        > Life
        >
        > Krishna dance in the Pentagram and the Seal of Salomon on the Music of the Spheres
        > (AUM-Word) with a Skull in his hand,
        > a Dagger in the other one...
        >
        > "Calling Occupants Of Interplanetary Craft"
        >
        > :)
        >
        > "Be Master of the Sabbath...
        > My name is Lucifer, here.. My Torch!
        >
        > THE VOICE: And follow the Star of Love!..."
        >
        > "Stir the ethers!"
        >
        > DareFearless! ;-)
        >
        > DF
        >
        >
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy
        > Unsubscribe:
        > anthroposophy-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > List owner: anthroposophy-owner@yahoogroups.com
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

        --
        Every problem would lend itself to solution if we determined to make the law of truth
        and non-violence the law of life. - Mahatma Gandhi
      • eurythmy
        Dear DF, Why do you send most of your messages to all these lists? There are other anthroposophical lists you do not sent to, why? are they not of your
        Message 3 of 16 , Jan 7, 2002
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          Dear DF,
          Why do you send most of your messages to all these lists? There are other
          "anthroposophical" lists you do not sent to, why? are they not of your
          taste? This is the most unintellible element of your messages in bottles -
          botle of spirit . Could you enlighten me on this?
          Franky
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: <danifyou@...>
          To: Steiner101 <RudolfSteiner101@yahoogroups.com>; anthro-list
          <anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com>; ark-list <ark@yahoogroups.com>;
          <rosicruciansophia@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Monday, January 07, 2002 2:02 PM
          Subject: [anthroposophy] The Choice
        • lisastephzim
          ... and I am simply not ... most part, I don t ... simply am not as far ... life is being ... gratitude for your ... the danifyou s posts. Are ... clearly
          Message 4 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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            --- In anthroposophy@y..., Cynthia & Bob <bob.cynth@s...> wrote:
            > I've been receiving, via this group, many messages from "danifyou"
            and I am simply not
            > able to make sense of them. Is it me... or is it him? For the
            most part, I don't
            > actively participate in this group as a contributor because I
            simply am not as far
            > along the AP journey as most of you and I quite enjoy the way my
            life is being
            > enriched by those who do actively contribute. Please accept my
            gratitude for your
            > knowledge and generosity. I'm just not "getting it" with
            the"danifyou"'s posts. Are
            > they simply out of my league or could someone please explain more
            clearly the point
            > he/she is trying to make.
            >
            > Thank you,
            >
            > Cynthia
            >
            > danifyou@t... wrote:
            >
            > > One Door: The Ring, The Head, Ahriman,
            > > Frank-EINSTEIN,
            > > The Witch of the West; Death
            > >
            > > Another Door: The Flower of Oz 'I AM'
            > > (Shamballah)
            > > The Heart, The Sun,
            > > Christus-Luciferus
            > > FRANK-Incense
            > > Life
            > >
            > > Krishna dance in the Pentagram and the Seal of Salomon on the
            Music of the Spheres
            > > (AUM-Word) with a Skull in his hand,
            > > a Dagger in the other one...
            > >
            > > "Calling Occupants Of Interplanetary Craft"
            > >
            > > :)
            Hello Cynthia,
            I have only been on this list for a couple of days. I am not even a
            yards' length on my journey.
            I too had found Danny's post very difficult to decipher, but, at the
            same time I found them intrigueing. I want(ed) to understand. (as I
            desire to understand anthroposophy...)
            Last night, I came here to the messages and went back to Novembember
            and read all of the posts between Danny and other list members.
            I am very glad I did. I certainly am in no position to explain
            things to any of you, as I am not learned enough in the subject of
            anthroposophy, but, I now have an understanding that I did not have-
            even yesterday!
            Danny's posts are rich with symbolism. He is a wonderful poet with a
            wondeful unique style, who has a deep passion for what he writes.
            I was in awe and amazement as i read these posts (please forgive me
            for not being able to list the other members involved in these
            discussions at this moment, as they too were inspiring!).
            You will find that many of the terms/symbols that he uses have been
            mentioned before in other posts.... their meanings can be found there.
            You may not desire to go back as far as I did, but I would encourage
            those of you who do want to undertand these beautifully illustrated
            posts to a better degree to at least go back and read for yourself
            these interative posts.
            I am certain that, especially those of you who know more than I re:
            anthro (all of you, I am sure ! :) , Danny's posts wll read much
            clearer to you!
            I may be wrong on this, but I believe-(Danny, please corect me if I
            am off!) That :
            Door One is representative ofThe USA's current conflicts.
            Door Two is the author's desire to be in peace in the security of
            Christ (Love)
            :)
            Striving to learn,
            Lisa
          • DRStarman2001@aol.com
            In a message dated 1/10/2002 12:09:15 PM, lisastephzim@yahoo.com writes:
            Message 5 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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              In a message dated 1/10/2002 12:09:15 PM, lisastephzim@... writes:

              << I am certain that, especially those of you who know more than I re:
              anthro (all of you, I am sure ! :) , Danny's posts wll read much
              clearer to you! >>

              Nope, I can't make head or tail of them.
            • lisastephzim
              With the utmost respect, DRStarman, I believe that if you genuinely have a desire to understand them, and went back a little...you would make at least heads or
              Message 6 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                With the utmost respect, DRStarman, I believe that if you genuinely
                have a desire to understand them, and went back a little...you would
                make at least heads or tails out of them.
                This does surprise me a bit,it was YOUR posts to the Waldorf list
                that did inspire me to seek these other lists out.
                BTW, For this, I thank you!
                :)
                Sincerely,
                Lisa





                --- In anthroposophy@y..., DRStarman2001@a... wrote:
                >
                > In a message dated 1/10/2002 12:09:15 PM, lisastephzim@y... writes:
                >
                > << I am certain that, especially those of you who know more than I
                re:
                > anthro (all of you, I am sure ! :) , Danny's posts wll read much
                > clearer to you! >>
                >
                > Nope, I can't make head or tail of them.
              • elaineupton2001
                Hello Lisa, Starman, Danifyou , and all of this thread on Danifyou s post. Lisa, you seem to find some meaning in Danifyou s post. OK. That is as it is,
                Message 7 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                  Hello Lisa, Starman, "Danifyou", and all of this thread
                  on "Danifyou's" post.

                  Lisa, you seem to find some meaning in "Danifyou's" post. OK. That is
                  as it is, and I cannot pass judgement on that. You tell Starman that
                  you are rather surprised that he says he cannot "make heads or tails"
                  of "Danifyou's" post. Frankly, I am not surprised and tend to be with
                  Starman on this one. This does not mean I judge "Danifyou's" post as
                  bad, for maybe they serve some purpose. I don't know.

                  What I do feel I know is that it is important (for me and for anyone
                  who chooses--talk about choice!) to be as clear as possible in my
                  thinking, feeling,and willing (in this case, willing as part of my
                  expression/writing on an e-mail list), and I appreciate those who
                  likewise attempt to be clear in thinking, feeling, willing. Steiner
                  often spoke of the importance of not engaging in idle fantasy, of not
                  engaging in muddled thinking and such. Now whether "Danifyou's"
                  thinking is muddled or not, I don't know. I just know that it makes
                  no sense to me. I find it important not to spend my time with things
                  that don't make sense, so, frankly, I delete "Danifyou's" post. Some
                  may delete my posts, and if that is what they must do, OK.

                  Let us not confuse anthroposophy with muddled thinking.
                  If "Danifyou's" thinking is muddled, then it would be a mistake to
                  confuse that with some hidden anthroposophic wisdom. Steiner was
                  brilliant and what he writes is not muddled, but utterly helpful,
                  even when I have to study it long and hard. I find no such results
                  when I ponder "Danifyou's" post.

                  "Danifyou", if you feel compelled to write and feel that you are
                  providing a service, then write on, and God will be the judge. But I
                  doubt I will be reading you. I have many things to read and don't
                  need to spend my time puzzling over something that is highly dubious.

                  I mean no unkindness, but in the search for clarity and truth, I feel
                  obliged to speak this way.

                  Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very little
                  grounding in the basics of anthroposophy. I think it is better to get
                  a grounding before one starts going off into flights of poetry and
                  such. I love poetry. I write poetry, but even in the poetry, I try to
                  be concise, in the way of concise metaphors that have an aim to
                  uplift and reveal some truth and beauty. Maybe this is what you are
                  doing, Danifyou. If so, well and good for those who can follow you.
                  But based on my best discernment, I have my doubts.

                  Be well, truly.

                  Your servant,
                  elaine
                • Carol
                  I don t understand him, but I find aspects of his posts more interesting than many which I do understand. When I m tired, I can t go for it, but that s my
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                    I don't understand him, but I find aspects of his posts more
                    interesting than many which I do understand. When I'm tired,
                    I can't go for it, but that's my stuff.

                    I do know this: Steiner was in absolute love with some very
                    confusing thinkers. Steiner learned so much from people who
                    he thought were not expressing their insights very well at
                    all. So, well, that's just that.

                    carol



                    --- elaineupton2001 <elaineupton@...> wrote:
                    > Hello Lisa, Starman, "Danifyou", and all of this thread
                    > on "Danifyou's" post.
                    >
                    > Lisa, you seem to find some meaning in "Danifyou's" post.
                    > OK. That is
                    > as it is, and I cannot pass judgement on that. You tell
                    > Starman that
                    > you are rather surprised that he says he cannot "make heads
                    > or tails"
                    > of "Danifyou's" post. Frankly, I am not surprised and tend
                    > to be with
                    > Starman on this one. This does not mean I judge
                    > "Danifyou's" post as
                    > bad, for maybe they serve some purpose. I don't know.
                    >
                    > What I do feel I know is that it is important (for me and
                    > for anyone
                    > who chooses--talk about choice!) to be as clear as possible
                    > in my
                    > thinking, feeling,and willing (in this case, willing as
                    > part of my
                    > expression/writing on an e-mail list), and I appreciate
                    > those who
                    > likewise attempt to be clear in thinking, feeling, willing.
                    > Steiner
                    > often spoke of the importance of not engaging in idle
                    > fantasy, of not
                    > engaging in muddled thinking and such. Now whether
                    > "Danifyou's"
                    > thinking is muddled or not, I don't know. I just know that
                    > it makes
                    > no sense to me. I find it important not to spend my time
                    > with things
                    > that don't make sense, so, frankly, I delete "Danifyou's"
                    > post. Some
                    > may delete my posts, and if that is what they must do, OK.
                    >
                    > Let us not confuse anthroposophy with muddled thinking.
                    > If "Danifyou's" thinking is muddled, then it would be a
                    > mistake to
                    > confuse that with some hidden anthroposophic wisdom.
                    > Steiner was
                    > brilliant and what he writes is not muddled, but utterly
                    > helpful,
                    > even when I have to study it long and hard. I find no such
                    > results
                    > when I ponder "Danifyou's" post.
                    >
                    > "Danifyou", if you feel compelled to write and feel that
                    > you are
                    > providing a service, then write on, and God will be the
                    > judge. But I
                    > doubt I will be reading you. I have many things to read and
                    > don't
                    > need to spend my time puzzling over something that is
                    > highly dubious.
                    >
                    > I mean no unkindness, but in the search for clarity and
                    > truth, I feel
                    > obliged to speak this way.
                    >
                    > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with
                    > very little
                    > grounding in the basics of anthroposophy. I think it is
                    > better to get
                    > a grounding before one starts going off into flights of
                    > poetry and
                    > such. I love poetry. I write poetry, but even in the
                    > poetry, I try to
                    > be concise, in the way of concise metaphors that have an
                    > aim to
                    > uplift and reveal some truth and beauty. Maybe this is what
                    > you are
                    > doing, Danifyou. If so, well and good for those who can
                    > follow you.
                    > But based on my best discernment, I have my doubts.
                    >
                    > Be well, truly.
                    >
                    > Your servant,
                    > elaine
                    >
                    >


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                  • Lil Ole Miss
                    ... Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness. Sheila
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                      > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very little
                      > grounding in the basics of anthroposophy.>

                      Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness.

                      Sheila
                    • lisastephzim
                      ... little ... Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense to my post, This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                        --- In anthroposophy@y..., "Lil Ole Miss" <lilolemiss@m...> wrote:
                        > > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very
                        little
                        > > grounding in the basics of anthroposophy.>
                        >
                        > Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness.
                        >
                        > Sheila

                        Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense
                        to my post,

                        This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.

                        In my post , I said "if you genuinely have the desire to understand
                        them,"

                        ...if he wanted...of course it is his choice. This was not said in
                        sarcasm.
                        My post was not written in a spirit devoid of tolerant kindness and
                        openmindedness. When I said " I was surprised" , I was stating how I
                        felt, but this was not with a tone of judgement. Perhaps, I should
                        have chosen my words more carefully.
                        As for the 'flights of poetry', I was moved by the posts of Danny and
                        those he corresponded with. I had no idea that I was breaking any
                        rules here.
                        I am the first to admit that I know very little of Anthroposophy. I
                        never claimed anything more. I joined this list with a desire to
                        learn.
                        I thank you for taking the time to let me know how you feel. I
                        hadn't realized that posting was only for those who have already
                        reached a certain plateau on their path, and that the thoughts,
                        experiences, and comtemplations of those, like myself, who are new to
                        Anthroposophy are not welcome.

                        With Sincerety,
                        Lisa
                      • Lil Ole Miss
                        ... little ... Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense to my post, This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                          --- In anthroposophy@y..., "Lil Ole Miss" <lilolemiss@m...> wrote:
                          > > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very
                          little
                          > > grounding in the basics of anthroposophy.>
                          >
                          > Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness.
                          >
                          > Sheila

                          Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense
                          to my post,

                          This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.

                          In my post , I said "if you genuinely have the desire to understand
                          them,"

                          ...if he wanted...of course it is his choice.  This was not said in
                          sarcasm.
                          My post was not written in a spirit devoid of tolerant kindness and
                          openmindedness.  When I said " I was surprised" , I was stating how I
                          felt, but this was not with a tone of judgement. Perhaps, I should
                          have chosen my words more carefully.
                          As for the 'flights of poetry', I was moved by the posts of Danny and
                          those he corresponded with.  I had no idea that I was breaking any
                          rules here.
                          I am the first to admit that I know very little of Anthroposophy. I
                          never claimed anything more.  I joined this list with a desire to
                          learn. 
                          I thank you for taking the time to let me know how you feel.  I
                          hadn't realized that posting was only for those who have already
                          reached a certain plateau on their path, and that the thoughts,
                          experiences, and comtemplations of those, like myself, who are new to
                          Anthroposophy are not welcome.

                          With Sincerety,
                          Lisa

                          Lisa - GASP! You did nothing "wrong" or "out of the way" at all, that I'm aware of, or could take exception to! Gee, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding. I've watched your postings with joy, seeing your wondering hit points here and there with true searching. ACK! Please dismiss from your searching mind any idea you've said/implied/whatever/hinted/shot at/knifed/bludgeoned/etc anything...YIKES!
                          Hugz,
                          Sheila
                        • DRStarman2001@aol.com
                          ... little grounding in the basics of anthroposophy. ... Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense to my post, This was certainly
                          Message 12 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                            > > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very
                            little grounding in the basics of anthroposophy.>
                            >
                            > Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness.
                            > Sheila

                            Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense
                            to my post,
                            This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.
                            In my post , I said "if you genuinely have the desire to understand
                            them," ...if he wanted...

                            Lisa - GASP! You did nothing "wrong" or "out of the way" at all, that I'm
                            aware of, or could take exception to! Gee, I'm sorry for the
                            misunderstanding. I've watched your postings with joy, seeing your wondering
                            hit points here and there with true searching. ACK! Please dismiss from your
                            searching mind any idea you've said/implied/whatever/hinted/shot
                            at/knifed/bludgeoned/etc anything...YIKES!
                            Hugz,
                            Sheila >>

                            *******Well, gee whiz, Sheila, it sounded like you were saying she didn't
                            have basic kindness. I wasn't offended by what she said but it sounded like
                            you were saying she was offensive.

                            Perhaps an example of why unclear language (like aphorisms) should be kept to
                            a minimum?

                            Starman
                          • DRStarman2001@aol.com
                            I will have to check the planets for a rare alignment. Elaine and I agree on something. BTW I ve found Danny s posts inspired in the past, if sometimes hard to
                            Message 13 of 16 , Jan 10, 2002
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                              I will have to check the planets for a rare alignment. Elaine and I agree on
                              something.

                              BTW I've found Danny's posts inspired in the past, if sometimes hard to
                              follow due to English not being his native language. These recent ones,
                              though, have been a bit too long on obscurity for me to fathom.

                              elaineupton@... writes:
                              << Hello Lisa, Starman, "Danifyou", and all of this thread
                              on "Danifyou's" post.
                              Lisa, you seem to find some meaning in "Danifyou's" post. OK. That is
                              as it is, and I cannot pass judgement on that. You tell Starman that
                              you are rather surprised that he says he cannot "make heads or tails"
                              of "Danifyou's" post. Frankly, I am not surprised and tend to be with
                              Starman on this one. This does not mean I judge "Danifyou's" post as
                              bad, for maybe they serve some purpose. I don't know.
                              What I do feel I know is that it is important (for me and for anyone
                              who chooses--talk about choice!) to be as clear as possible in my
                              thinking, feeling,and willing (in this case, willing as part of my
                              expression/writing on an e-mail list), and I appreciate those who
                              likewise attempt to be clear in thinking, feeling, willing. Steiner
                              often spoke of the importance of not engaging in idle fantasy, of not
                              engaging in muddled thinking and such. Now whether "Danifyou's"
                              thinking is muddled or not, I don't know. I just know that it makes
                              no sense to me. I find it important not to spend my time with things
                              that don't make sense, so, frankly, I delete "Danifyou's" post. Some
                              may delete my posts, and if that is what they must do, OK.
                              Let us not confuse anthroposophy with muddled thinking.
                              If "Danifyou's" thinking is muddled, then it would be a mistake to
                              confuse that with some hidden anthroposophic wisdom. Steiner was
                              brilliant and what he writes is not muddled, but utterly helpful,
                              even when I have to study it long and hard. I find no such results
                              when I ponder "Danifyou's" post.
                              "Danifyou", if you feel compelled to write and feel that you are
                              providing a service, then write on, and God will be the judge. But I
                              doubt I will be reading you. I have many things to read and don't
                              need to spend my time puzzling over something that is highly dubious.
                              I mean no unkindness, but in the search for clarity and truth, I feel
                              obliged to speak this way.
                              Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very little
                              grounding in the basics of anthroposophy. I think it is better to get
                              a grounding before one starts going off into flights of poetry and
                              such. I love poetry. I write poetry, but even in the poetry, I try to
                              be concise, in the way of concise metaphors that have an aim to
                              uplift and reveal some truth and beauty. Maybe this is what you are
                              doing, Danifyou. If so, well and good for those who can follow you.
                              But based on my best discernment, I have my doubts.
                              Be well, truly.
                              Your servant,
                              elaine >>
                            • Lil Ole Miss
                              ... I m ... wondering ... your ... like ... to ... Right you are, Dr. Starman. It seems to me the top quote isn t even from Lisa, but from Eilene? Here s an
                              Message 14 of 16 , Jan 11, 2002
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                                > > > Lots of people come on anthroposophic e-mail lists with very
                                > little grounding in the basics of anthroposophy.>
                                > >
                                > > Exactly, including tolerant kindness and open-mindedness.
                                > > Sheila
                                >
                                > Elaine, Sheila, DRStarman, and anyone else who may have taken offense
                                > to my post,
                                > This was certainly not intended to be an attack on DRStarman.
                                > In my post , I said "if you genuinely have the desire to understand
                                > them," ...if he wanted...
                                >
                                > Lisa - GASP! You did nothing "wrong" or "out of the way" at all, that
                                I'm
                                > aware of, or could take exception to! Gee, I'm sorry for the
                                > misunderstanding. I've watched your postings with joy, seeing your
                                wondering
                                > hit points here and there with true searching. ACK! Please dismiss from
                                your
                                > searching mind any idea you've said/implied/whatever/hinted/shot
                                > at/knifed/bludgeoned/etc anything...YIKES!
                                > Hugz,
                                > Sheila >>
                                >
                                > *******Well, gee whiz, Sheila, it sounded like you were saying she didn't
                                > have basic kindness. I wasn't offended by what she said but it sounded
                                like
                                > you were saying she was offensive.
                                >
                                > Perhaps an example of why unclear language (like aphorisms) should be kept
                                to
                                > a minimum?
                                >
                                > Starman

                                Right you are, Dr. Starman. It seems to me the top quote isn't even from
                                Lisa, but from Eilene?
                                Here's an example of something Steiner said, in so many words: Paranoia is
                                rife and we must practice discrimination in our thoughts and words - *what*
                                is the person actually saying?

                                Sheila
                              • Br. Ron
                                Many modern spiritual paths overlook a very squeamish subject. And that is the realization that it is sometimes necessary to kill. ( Boooo...the crowd
                                Message 15 of 16 , Feb 5, 2002
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                                  Many modern spiritual paths overlook a very squeamish subject.
                                   
                                  And that is the realization that it is sometimes necessary to kill.
                                   
                                  ("Boooo...the crowd roars...down with Br. Ron...booo...hisssss")
                                   
                                  But it's true. We often fall into the politically correct trap of thinking
                                  'every life form is divine and worthy of existence.'
                                   
                                  Alas, I must beg to differ.  Not every animated thing is good
                                  for Our Garden of Creation.
                                   
                                  Whether it's a fig tree that doesn't produce,
                                  an infestation of aphis devouring the roses,
                                  a discordant violinist in the string section,
                                  a parasitic tumor, (or a list member who seeks to
                                  undermine the Quest for Resonance with only
                                  'death dealing,' iron shackles of dogma)
                                   
                                  The required solution is the same.
                                   
                                  Sooner or later one we must make peace with the
                                  Sword as well as the Cup...and know WHEN to use it.
                                   
                                  It is not 'unconditional acceptance' that defines a true initiate
                                  but razor sharp discernment. This is, of course, the meaning
                                  of 'Judgment Day.' 
                                   
                                  Hitler was not wholly evil.......nor was he totally wrong.
                                  (he loved children, animals, his own people...and Wagner)
                                  His error was misidentifying evil with whole races of people.   
                                   
                                  A Sword not swung in chivalry on behalf of the Maiden of Love
                                  is a dangerous thing. But no less dangerous is 'Love' that is
                                  not defined by the razor's edge of Truth
                                   
                                  Who among us can claim such precise discretion?
                                   
                                  Very few...... True initiates are very few.
                                   
                                  Yet to sidestep initiation by avoiding the necessity of
                                  choosing which weeds to pull,  has it's own consequences.
                                   
                                   
                                  Love and LVX
                                   
                                  Br. Ron
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                   
                                  ----- Original Message -----

                                  Dear Br. Ron,
                                   
                                  Herewith are my answers to your questions below:
                                   
                                  > 1. How do you know "Steiner's writings are fallible (and erroneous) and was not "carried along [or moved]
                                  by the Holy Spirit".
                                   
                                  Because Steiner's writings contradict the word of God.
                                   
                                   
                                  > 2. What makes you think the Bible is the only word of God?
                                   
                                  The Bible is God's final revelation to Man:
                                   
                                  "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times... but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son" (Heb. 1:1-2).
                                   
                                  Now, nineteen hundred years later, Anthroposophists claim that many concepts in the Bible, such as, redemption, resurrection, and everlasting life, cannot be fully understood without first studying the works of Rudolf Steiner because he had “the faculty of penetrating beyond the physical” (Roy Wilkinson, The Mission of the Christ, p. 2).
                                   
                                  Michael.


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                                • Jo Ann Schwartz
                                  Yo! Br. Ron! Almost every mail program provides you with the equivalent of a Kill File -- that is, you can set your mail program to reject mail sent by a
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Feb 5, 2002
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                                    Yo! Br. Ron!

                                    Almost every mail program provides you with the equivalent of a "Kill
                                    File" -- that is, you can set your mail program to reject mail sent by a
                                    specific address... such as Michael's. Since his subject lines are
                                    (mostly) identifiable by his 'Att: Br. Ron' syntax, you should be able to
                                    filter out replies to his posts manually if not automatically.

                                    If folks just stopped paying attention, he might go away. Or he might get
                                    so crazed that Bruce will feel the need to act. Either way, you wouldn't
                                    have to listen to it whilst waiting for the final denouement.

                                    Cheers,
                                    JoAnn


                                    --- "Br. Ron" <rlloyd@...> wrote:
                                    > Many modern spiritual paths overlook a very squeamish subject.
                                    >
                                    > And that is the realization that it is sometimes necessary to kill.
                                    >
                                    > ("Boooo...the crowd roars...down with Br. Ron...booo...hisssss")
                                    >
                                    > But it's true. We often fall into the politically correct trap of
                                    > thinking 'every life form is divine and worthy of existence.'
                                    >
                                    > Alas, I must beg to differ. Not every animated thing is good
                                    > for Our Garden of Creation.
                                    >
                                    > Whether it's a fig tree that doesn't produce,
                                    > an infestation of aphis devouring the roses,
                                    > a discordant violinist in the string section,
                                    > a parasitic tumor, (or a list member who seeks to
                                    > undermine the Quest for Resonance with only
                                    > 'death dealing,' iron shackles of dogma)
                                    >
                                    > The required solution is the same.
                                    >
                                    > Sooner or later one we must make peace with the
                                    > Sword as well as the Cup...and know WHEN to use it.
                                    >
                                    > It is not 'unconditional acceptance' that defines a true initiate
                                    > but razor sharp discernment. This is, of course, the meaning
                                    > of 'Judgment Day.'
                                    >
                                    > Hitler was not wholly evil.......nor was he totally wrong.
                                    > (he loved children, animals, his own people...and Wagner)
                                    > His error was misidentifying evil with whole races of people.
                                    >
                                    > A Sword not swung in chivalry on behalf of the Maiden of Love
                                    > is a dangerous thing. But no less dangerous is 'Love' that is
                                    > not defined by the razor's edge of Truth
                                    >
                                    > Who among us can claim such precise discretion?
                                    >
                                    > Very few...... True initiates are very few.
                                    >
                                    > Yet to sidestep initiation by avoiding the necessity of
                                    > choosing which weeds to pull, has it's own consequences.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Love and LVX
                                    >
                                    > Br. Ron
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ChristianMystics/?yguid=84589857
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: Michael Meiring
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Dear Br. Ron,
                                    >
                                    > Herewith are my answers to your questions below:
                                    >
                                    > > 1. How do you know "Steiner's writings are fallible (and erroneous)
                                    > and was not "carried along [or moved]
                                    > by the Holy Spirit".
                                    >
                                    > Because Steiner's writings contradict the word of God.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > > 2. What makes you think the Bible is the only word of God?
                                    >
                                    > The Bible is God's final revelation to Man:
                                    >
                                    > "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many
                                    > times... but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son" (Heb.
                                    > 1:1-2).
                                    >
                                    > Now, nineteen hundred years later, Anthroposophists claim that many
                                    > concepts in the Bible, such as, redemption, resurrection, and
                                    > everlasting life, cannot be fully understood without first studying the
                                    > works of Rudolf Steiner because he had "the faculty of penetrating
                                    > beyond the physical" (Roy Wilkinson, The Mission of the Christ, p. 2).
                                    >
                                    > Michael.
                                    >
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