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Re: Sleep on it!

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  • Stephen Hale
    ... My experience of this lecture is that Steiner really felt the punishment of the Treaty of Versailles, which was just two weeks and two days away. Thus, he
    Message 1 of 12 , Oct 10, 2008
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      --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mason
      <robertsmason_99@...> wrote:
      >
      > To All:
      >
      > I was browsing through a recent posting at the
      > eLib --
      > <http://wn.rsarchive.org/Lectures/SomChr_index.html>,
      > and it was interesting, but not much that was
      > unexpected -- then I came across (yet another)
      > of Steiner's statements that startled me, in
      > that it is so penetrating, sweeping, and
      > categorical:
      >
      > >>The man of to-day cannot form sensible
      > decisions at all if he does not wake up with
      > them in the morning.<<
      >
      > RS was speaking in Germany in the aftermath of
      > the First World War (indeed, while the Allied
      > starvation blockade of Germany was still in
      > force), and he was explaining a little about
      > the way such bad decisions were made that led
      > to the outbreak of the war, and relating these
      > catastrophic decisions to the changes that have
      > come about in Man's soul-life in the past few
      > centuries. And then he goes on to explain
      > that sweeping statement:
      >
      > >>This is true, however strange it may sound,
      > and men will recognise it more and more from
      > external acts. It is not necessary that we
      > should be conscious of these decisions; in our
      > sub-consciousness we live through in the night
      > what we can experience on the following day.
      > Man has not yet got so far as to be able to
      > survey it prophetically, but that is not the
      > point. If you harbour a thought at 3:30 or 6
      > o'clock [PM; I think he means], it may be a
      > thought that you have already had in the night
      > and now arises in you again. If, however, a
      > thought arises that you have not already formed
      > in the night but which is produced from out of
      > the events of the day, it cannot be a
      > reasonable thought in the case of the man of
      > to-day. The man of to-day has to draw his most
      > important impulses from the spiritual world.
      > These do not come from the physical world at
      > all. To-day we cannot but be "unreasonable" if
      > we do not bring our decisions with us, if we do
      > not appeal to this life in the spiritual world.
      > When our "astral body" is free at night, i.e.,
      > outside the physical and "etheric" bodies and
      > together with the spiritual world, that which
      > is most essential takes place; it is prepared
      > for the Reason of the day (and more so than in
      > the case of our ancestors). The moment of
      > waking should be sacred for the modern man. He
      > should feel: I come from the spiritual world
      > and enter the physical; all that is good, all
      > that makes me capable of being a reasonable
      > man, I have experienced between falling asleep
      > and waking up, through intercourse with the
      > spiritual world, through intercourse with the
      > dead I have known in life and who have died
      > before me â€" in short, through intercourse with
      > those who are no longer in a physical body. I
      > experience it when I am with them in the purely
      > spiritual world. From this experience I ought
      > to draw the fundamental mood of sacred regard
      > for the moment of waking; this fundamental
      > feeling will then make it possible for me
      > throughout the day to say in one case "Here I
      > am helped by a spiritual impulse" and in
      > another case "Here I receive no help; this must
      > not be decided before to-morrow."<<
      >
      > -- Of course, we already have the saying *sleep
      > on it*, but how many of us have really made it
      > a rule for our lives? And how much of our
      > messed-up lives could be explained by our
      > failure to practice that principle? Steiner's
      > sweeping statement suggests that it could well
      > explain a lot.
      >
      > . . . anyway: The whole lecture is well worth
      > reading, and strikes other chords within,
      > especially given the current political/financial
      > situation. For instance, speaking of the news
      > of his day, Steiner remarked:
      >
      > >>The delegates to Versailles whom we [the
      > Germans] have sent are as unfitted as possible
      > to understand the present moment of world
      > history.<<
      >
      > This is uncomfortably, chillingly resonant with
      > this observer in the USA. It seems that in all
      > the time that has passed since RS was speaking,
      > despite all the blood that has flowed and all
      > the suffering, nothing is essentially different
      > in politics here and now as compared to
      > Steiner's time and place (except maybe that
      > weaponry is far more dangerous and deadly). RS
      > said elsewhere that the worst rise to the top,
      > and who could say now that *this* unhappy fact
      > has changed?

      My experience of this lecture is that Steiner really felt the
      punishment of the Treaty of Versailles, which was just two weeks and
      two days away. Thus, he was being desultory in advance of the final
      decree. Two months later, Adelheid Peterson would find him
      disheveled and somewhat despondent, even as he was forming the first
      Steiner school for children in Stuttgart.

      Always the striver, new questions concerning conducting effective
      meetings got the energies going again. Adelheid Peterson wrote a
      book about it. And Rudolf Steiner would go on to pursue the social
      question in ever greater detail. He begins to formulate in more
      detail just how the 30 to 40 leaders of Europe prior to the "great
      war" were brought into a state of confusion and diminishment of
      consciousness that brought about the fateful collection of decisions
      that caused the war. This topic, which he had first assessed back in
      August of 1914, became more and more the subject of concern. Just
      who caused the confusion of consciousness in the european leaders in
      order to effect the outbreak of WWI?

      In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western brotherhood of
      America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the second
      world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement in the
      form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.

      Steve
    • Stephen Hale
      ... Check this out for more details. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?threaded=1&l=1
      Message 2 of 12 , Oct 11, 2008
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        --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
        wrote:
        > In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western brotherhood of
        > America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the second
        > world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement in the
        > form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.

        Check this out for more details.

        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?threaded=1&l=1
      • moniker_9
        ... http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?threaded=1&l=1 There s a website at alpheus.org, some of which is concerned with an
        Message 3 of 12 , Oct 11, 2008
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          You wrote:

          > > In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western brotherhood of
          > > America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the second
          > > world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement in the
          > > form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.
          >
          > Check this out for more details.
          >
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?threaded=1&l=1

          There's a website at alpheus.org, some of which is concerned with
          an esoteric/occult interpretation of history.You might find it
          interesting. Larry
        • Stephen Hale
          ... brotherhood of ... second ... in the ... threaded=1&l=1 ... with ... I have it, Larry, and you sent it to me about two years ago. Has alot to do with
          Message 4 of 12 , Oct 11, 2008
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            --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "moniker_9" <moniker_9@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > You wrote:
            >
            > > > In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western
            brotherhood of
            > > > America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the
            second
            > > > world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement
            in the
            > > > form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.
            > >
            > > Check this out for more details.
            > >
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?
            threaded=1&l=1
            >
            > There's a website at alpheus.org, some of which is concerned
            with
            > an esoteric/occult interpretation of history.You might find it
            > interesting. Larry

            I have it, Larry, and you sent it to me about two years ago. Has
            alot to do with Annie Besant's version of theosophy. So, didn't miss
            it, and appreciated that you sent it along. We also talked about
            Bill Cooper and the lie of the moon landings. Cooper was shot by
            Arizona police a few years ago after going crazy and making himself
            a "supposed" menace against apprehension. It short, he was murdered
            in order to shut him up.

            Steve
          • Stephen Hale
            ... brotherhood of ... second ... in the ... threaded=1&l=1 ... with ... Hey you . Tell me about yourself, and what brings you to these parts, because you
            Message 5 of 12 , Oct 11, 2008
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              --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "moniker_9" <moniker_9@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > You wrote:
              >
              > > > In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western
              brotherhood of
              > > > America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the
              second
              > > > world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement
              in the
              > > > form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.
              > >
              > > Check this out for more details.
              > >
              > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/anthroposophy/message/14898?
              threaded=1&l=1
              >
              > There's a website at alpheus.org, some of which is concerned
              with
              > an esoteric/occult interpretation of history.You might find it
              > interesting. Larry

              Hey "you". Tell me about yourself, and what brings you to these
              parts, because you have always been rather weak in your offerings,
              although I have always found them rather pertinent. I don't miss
              much, and watch for you in order to give support. You generally
              ignore my opportunities to expound, which must mean I don't know what
              I am talking about. At least, you must think so.

              Steve
            • Mikko Nuuttila
              I see that many of you are concerned with what can be termed as government conspiracies; check out www.davidicke.com. I don t know if it is has ever been
              Message 6 of 12 , Oct 11, 2008
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                I see that many of you are concerned with what can be termed as government conspiracies; check out www.davidicke.com. I don't know if it is has ever been mentioned on the list, as I am new here. David Icke has really wild views and I recommend his books and videos, too. The foremost idea of David is the so-called Reptilian Agenda, where some people try to suppress our brain functioning to the lizard level, to the central core of the brain called the reptilian brain in brain research. This would have been going on since the Sumer phase of history.

                Mikko


                To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
                From: sardisian01@...
                Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 04:18:05 +0000
                Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: Sleep on it!

                --- In anthroposophy@ yahoogroups. com, "moniker_9" <moniker_9@. ..>
                wrote:
                >
                > You wrote:
                >
                > > > In October of 1920 he names the culprit; the western
                brotherhood of
                > > > America. They caused the war, and would go on to create the
                second
                > > > world war, wherein we have quite specific data of involvement
                in the
                > > > form of Brown Brothers Harriman and Prescott Bush.
                > >
                > > Check this out for more details.
                > >
                > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/anthroposo phy/message/ 14898?
                threaded=1&l= 1
                >
                > There's a website at alpheus.org, some of which is concerned
                with
                > an esoteric/occult interpretation of history.You might find it
                > interesting. Larry

                Hey "you". Tell me about yourself, and what brings you to these
                parts, because you have always been rather weak in your offerings,
                although I have always found them rather pertinent. I don't miss
                much, and watch for you in order to give support. You generally
                ignore my opportunities to expound, which must mean I don't know what
                I am talking about. At least, you must think so.

                Steve




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              • Stephen Hale
                ... government conspiracies; check out www.davidicke.com. I don t know if it is has ever been mentioned on the list, as I am new here. David Icke has really
                Message 7 of 12 , Oct 12, 2008
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                  --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, Mikko Nuuttila <bellmeine@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > I see that many of you are concerned with what can be termed as
                  government conspiracies; check out www.davidicke.com. I don't know if
                  it is has ever been mentioned on the list, as I am new here. David
                  Icke has really wild views and I recommend his books and videos, too.
                  The foremost idea of David is the so-called Reptilian Agenda, where
                  some people try to suppress our brain functioning to the lizard
                  level, to the central core of the brain called the reptilian brain in
                  brain research. This would have been going on since the Sumer phase
                  of history.
                  >
                  > Mikko

                  David Icke's is a good example of the workings of the occult movement
                  in the latter 20th century, just before the entry into the third
                  millennium. Majesty Twelve is another example of the same type of
                  activity; all with underlying agendas in favor of the same occult
                  movement that Steiner took pains to describe in GA254, "The Occult
                  Movement in the Nineteenth Century."

                  It is shocking indeed that the so-called "Reptilian Agenda",
                  proffered by David Icke's since the 1990's is in fact absolutely
                  true, from a spiritual-scientific standpoint. Steiner approached the
                  subject again in this excerpt from a lecture given on November 29,
                  1919, in which he recalls the manner in which confusion and the
                  obscuring of consciousness in the 30 to 40 great leaders of Europe
                  was in reality an act of "black magic". Steiner would go on to
                  elaborate the full implications in GA200, beginning on October 17,
                  1920. - Steve


                  "My dear friends, it is a significant, an important result of
                  spiritual-scientific research which is to be taken very, very
                  seriously, that we have already entered the period of Earth evolution
                  when certain beings make themselves felt who upon Jupiter — the next
                  state of Earth evolution — will have advanced to the form of man, a
                  different form of man, to be sure, but which, nevertheless, may be
                  compared with the being of man. For we will be different beings on
                  Jupiter. These so-to-speak Jupiter men exist already now just as we
                  existed upon the Moon. They exist, of course not externally visible;
                  but I explained to you recently what it means to be externally
                  visible, and that man is also a supersensible being. Supersensibily
                  these beings are very decidedly present.

                  I emphasize once more: it is an extremely serious truth that certain
                  beings make themselves felt which exist in the environment of
                  mankind. They make themselves felt more and more since the middle of
                  the fifteenth century. These beings possess chiefly the impulse of a
                  force which is very similar to the human force of will, that force of
                  will of which I told you yesterday that it exists in the deeper
                  strata of the human consciousness. These invisible beings are related
                  to that element of which ordinary consciousness thus remains
                  unconscious today; but they already make themselves very strongly
                  felt in the development of present-day humanity.

                  For the person who takes spiritual research truly seriously this is a
                  problem of great magnitude. I was confronted with this problem
                  especially strongly — at the time I spoke to a number of our friends
                  about it in one or another form — I was confronted with this problem
                  in a demanding fashion, as it were, when, in the year 1914, this war
                  catastrophe broke in upon us. One had to ask oneself: How did an
                  event overtake European mankind which it is impossible to gauge as to
                  its causes in the way that is customary in regard to previous
                  historical events? The one who knows that not more than thirty or
                  forty people participated in Europe in the decisive events of the
                  year 1914, and who also knows the soul condition in which most of
                  these people were, will be confronted by this significant problem.
                  For most of these people, as strange as it may sound today, my dear
                  friends, most of these people had a dulled, obscured state of
                  consciousness. During the last few years much has occurred that was
                  caused by a dulled human consciousness. In the decisive places of the
                  year 1914 we see everywhere that the most important decisions of the
                  end of July and the beginning of August were reached with an obscured
                  consciousness; and this has continued on right into our present day.
                  This is a problem, terrifying in its nature. If we investigate it
                  spiritual-scientifically, then we find that these obscured
                  consciousnesses were the gateways through which precisely these will-
                  beings were able to take possession of the consciousness of these
                  men; they took possession of the obscured, veiled consciousness of
                  these human beings and acted with their consciousness. And these
                  beings who thus took possession, who are still sub-human beings, what
                  kind of beings are they? We have to pose this question very
                  seriously: What kind of beings are they?"

                  http://wn.rsarchive.org/Lectures/MissMich/19191129p01.html
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