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Re: Back in the 4th epoch ...

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  • carol
    Oops, Greco/Latin and Roman... ... in ... These ... even ... in ... retained ... place, ... in ... who ... Catholism, ... materialistic ... when ... this ...
    Message 1 of 110 , Jun 3, 2008
      Oops, Greco/Latin and Roman...


      --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      > Caryn: "Surely you mean materialist progress here as the romans
      > plundered they way through the countryside?"
      >
      >
      > Not exactly, I was referring to how human thought, up until the time
      in
      > which a more externalized, scientific outlook took hold of people,
      > employed forms principally derived from Greco-Latin folk souls and the
      > respective philosophical and in one case, theological traditions.
      These
      > would still have reflected themselves in the manner in which plots of
      > land (in the older sectors) where subdivided, how paths and roads were
      > laid out, how architecture dating back many centuries was expressed
      even
      > certain aspects to horituculture would shown to have been estblished
      in
      > older times.....
      >
      > I imagine in the earlier part of the 19th century, Europe still
      retained
      > many century old 'samples' of pre-scientific thought thus souls of the
      > time would have absorbed these, through impressions of various kinds.
      > The locations in which significant soul activity would have taken
      place,
      > may have retained traces of these, and that those living at the time
      in
      > which Goethe lived, might have still been able to catch a 'whiff' of
      > them..
      >
      > Caryn, I find that you do great injustice to the multidute of souls
      who
      > managed to shine the light of Christ onto the social plane through
      > whatever conditions were presented to them at the time of their
      > incarnations by admonishing all things Catholic since it's inception.
      > There seems to have been varying levels of spiritual activity within
      > specific groups of people, throughout the course of human history. It
      > does exist that certain profoundly intrumental figures had at given
      > moments in the later parts of human history carried out their life's
      > work through some form of affiliation with this outward ecclesiastic
      > establishment.
      >
      > How they managed this rests on the creative abilities of these
      > individuals, I am sure.
      >
      > I suspect that Goethe in his time rejected all things which did not
      > permit absolute freedom for the soul thus including not only
      Catholism,
      > but also certain elite powers (branches of military and state powers)
      > which not only sought control over the masses for the sake of personal
      > gain but also willed to employ scientific thinking in too
      materialistic
      > a manner. Even at the time of Descartes, there was disagreement amonst
      > philosophers on how scientific thought could cover the study of man
      when
      > an established tendency to doubt already existed, and when coupling
      this
      > with an easier access to the printed word, the risk for denying man's
      > eternal link using this method was quite evident.
      >
      > Caryn, If you think that I am in agreement with the Inquisition and
      all
      > previous attempts to suppress mystery knowledge by military means, you
      > are dead wrong. I am dead set against such activity even today,
      however
      > this fact seems to have flown by you. I haven't clearly seen you show,
      > through your writtings, a recognition of what spiritual value all the
      > political discussion taking place on this forum relates to.
      >
      > Moreover, you have quickly admonished artistic expressions which show,
      > through their form, a tradional yet deeply Christian quality by
      slating
      > it as deriving itself from the outward Catholic establishment and
      > therefore to be considered bad.
      >
      > This makes me wonder upon what exactly lies in store in Caryn personal
      > 'bad section' and what exactly does Caryn find admissable.
      >
      > I guess I've manage to bring this all to the fundamental right for
      all,
      > to form for themselves their very OWN philosophic outlook. This, I
      > beleive, is fundamental to bringing true freedom of soul to reality
      and
      > further towards the implementation of the conscious soul epoch. The
      > right to one's philosophic outlook is institutionally understood, in
      our
      > day.
      >
      > Throughout the GA 186 lectures, in which only 1 is available at the
      > archives, one can find a wonderful mix of philosophical, spiritual and
      > political interpretation for now and the coming times..
      >
      > Carol.
      >
      >
      >
      > PS. It's not exactly back to the 4th epoch- it's about retrieving the
      > flowing picture conciousness of the Greek period, which lay in rest
      > while the Hebraic 'abstract' conciousness too it's time for
      maturation.
      >
      >
      > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carynlouise24"
      > carynlouise24@ wrote:
      > >
      > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" organicethics@
      > > wrote:
      > >
      > > > Caryn, are you repeating that what I have illustrated through my
      > > > writting shows evidence to the reason Goethe rejected all things
      > > > Catholic?
      > >
      > > ?
      > >
      > > > In so doing, are you offering your own conviction
      > > that 'protestantism'is the way to go?
      > >
      > > ?
      > >
      > >
      > > > I'd just like to bring to your attention that in Europe at the
      time
      > > > Goethe lived, the architecture, as well the manner in which the
      > > roads,countryside would have been laid out, would have reflected in
      > > not so sublime a manner, the history of the spiritual progress
      > > made by the people, throughout centuries. This people would
      > > >experience at the level of soul.
      > >
      > > Surely you mean materialist progress here as the romans plundered
      > > they way through the countryside?
      > >
      > >
      > > > In his daily encounters with people, Goethe would have shared in
      > > > conversation, share in the experience with Lutheran minded
      > > people along with Catholic Christians, among others. He would
      > > have marveled at what Artistic heritage still lay before the people,
      > > itself more often than not, bearing throughout itself, a colouring
      > > > of Roman Catholic historic influence.
      > >
      > > Yes, the roman catholic influence was very colourful – the
      colour
      > red
      > > comes to mind; blood and fire – very colourful.
      > >
      > >
      > > > In my study of Descartes, it seems that a scientific method of
      > > > thinking was not allowed to penetrate European society until after
      > > his death and that until then, speculative thought, overlooked by
      > > the Roman Catholic Church was institutionally implemented. It seems
      > > to me that it would have been difficult for Goethe to avoid all soul
      > > >imprints belonging to Catholism's legacy.
      > >
      > > Institutionally implemented really gets the creative juices going
      > > doesn't.
      > >
      > > For example; Giordano Burno, the Phoenician Astronomer, was arrested
      > > and kept in custody for seven years by the roman church– to try
      > > and `reform' him from his astronomy observations and conclusions
      > > which he steadfastly refused to do so he they burnt him at the
      > > stake.
      > >
      > >
      > > >It seems to me that it would have been difficult for Goethe to
      avoid
      > > all soul imprints belonging to Catholism's legacy.
      > >
      > > You right there rats all over the place although I am sure he knew
      > > some excellent poets himself being one.
      > >
      > >
      > > > Goethe would have walked along paths, viewed castles etc in which
      > > the remnants of a rich history of mystical Christianity, Catholicism
      > > >and later Lutheran experience still lay on display.
      > >
      > > … as he thought about the caves and the Cathars last outpost.
      > >
      > >
      > > > If I were to present an analogy by saying that Goethe, through his
      > > > having lived in Mecca all his life, was of the same racial
      > > grouping and then because he rejected Islam, was not at all
      > > influenced on the level of soul by it, would you beleive me 100
      > > >per cent?
      > >
      > > I don't do analogies.
      > >
      > > >would you beleive me 100 per cent?
      > >
      > > No.
      > >
      > > > PS: I beleive it was Steiner that said that if the answer is easy,
      > > >then it's not taking into account the necessary spiritual
      variables.
      > >
      > > True.
      > >
      > >
      > > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carynlouise24"
      > > > <carynlouise24@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > What is this mumbo jumbo?
      > > > >
      > > > > I repeat this is why Goethe would have nothing to do with
      anything
      > > > > catholic.
      > > > >
      > > > > Yes, I have great respect for the spoken Word, Carol.
      > > > >
      > > > > Saint John
      > > > > And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the
      > > > > everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth,
      > > and
      > > > > to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Saying
      with
      > > a
      > > > > loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his
      > > > > judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth,
      and
      > > > > the sea, and the fountains of waters. And there followed another
      > > > > angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city,
      > > because
      > > > > she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her
      > > > > fornication.
      > > > >
      > > > > And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her,
      my
      > > > > people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye
      receive
      > > not
      > > > > of her plagues, For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God
      > > hath
      > > > > remembered her iniquities.
      > > > >
      > > > > Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her
      > > according to
      > > > > her works: in the cup which she hath filled to her double.
      > > > >
      > > > > How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so
      > > much
      > > > > torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a
      > > > > queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.
      > > > >
      > > > > Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and
      mourning,
      > > and
      > > > > famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is
      > > the
      > > > > Lord God who judgeth her.
      > > > >
      > > > > And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and
      > > lived
      > > > > deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when
      > > they
      > > > > shall see the smoke of her burning, Standing afar off for the
      > > fear
      > > > > of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city of Babylon,
      > > that
      > > > > mighty city! For in one hour is thy judgment come.
      > > > >
      > > > > And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her;
      for
      > > no
      > > > > man buyeth their merchandise any more: The merchandise of gold,
      > > and
      > > > > silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and scarlet, and all
      > > > > thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner
      > > vessels
      > > > > of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble, And
      > > > > cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine,
      > > and
      > > > > oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and
      horses,
      > > > > and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.
      > > > >
      > > > > And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from
      thee,
      > > and
      > > > > all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee,
      > > and
      > > > > thou shalt find them no more at all.
      > > > >
      > > > > The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her,
      shall
      > > > > stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing.
      > > And
      > > > > saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine
      > > linen,
      > > > > and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious
      > > stones,
      > > > > and pearls! For in one hour to great riches is come to nought.
      > > And
      > > > > every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and
      > > as
      > > > > many as trade by sea, stood afar off.
      > > > >
      > > > > And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What
      > > city
      > > > > is like unto this great city! And they cast dust on their heads,
      > > and
      > > > > cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city,
      > > > > wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason
      of
      > > her
      > > > > costliness! For in one hour she is made desolate.
      > > > >
      > > > > Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and
      prophets;
      > > for
      > > > > God hath avenged you on her.
      > > > >
      > > > > And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and
      > > cast
      > > > > it into the sea, saying, thus with violence shall that great
      city
      > > > > Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.
      > > > >
      > > > > And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and
      > > > > trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no
      > > craftsman,
      > > > > of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and
      > > the
      > > > > sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee;
      > > > >
      > > > > And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee;
      and
      > > the
      > > > > voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more
      at
      > > > > all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth;
      > > for
      > > > > by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.
      > > > >
      > > > > And in her was found the blood of the prophets, and of saints,
      > > and of
      > > > > all that were slain upon the earth.
      > > > >
      > > > > Our Father who art in heaven
      > > > > Hallow be thou Name
      > > > > Thy Kingdom Come
      > > > > And Thou will be done
      > > > > On Earth as it is
      > > > > In Heaven.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" organicethics@
      > > > > wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Caryn: "Where are your morals little one?"
      > > > > >
      > > > > > With outmost dismay, I beseach you to allow me to point to
      where
      > > > > you may
      > > > > > find the answer to your question, seeing as you have great
      > > respect
      > > > > for
      > > > > > the printed word.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://www.alchemywebsite.com/chymwed3.html
      > > > > > <http://www.alchemywebsite.com/chymwed3.html>
      > > > > >
      > > > > > "....Now as soon as the lovely day was broken, and the bright
      > > Sun,
      > > > > > having raised himself above the hills, had again took himself
      > > to his
      > > > > > appointed office in the high Heaven, my good champions began
      to
      > > > > rise out
      > > > > > of their beds, and leisurely to make themselves ready for the
      > > > > > Inquisition. Whereupon, one after another, they came again
      into
      > > the
      > > > > > hall, and saying good morning, demanded how we had slept that
      > > > > night; and
      > > > > > having seen our bonds, there were some that reproved us for
      > > being so
      > > > > > cowardly, and because we had not, rather, like them, hazarded
      > > upon
      > > > > all
      > > > > > adventures. However, some of them whose hearts still smote
      them
      > > > > made no
      > > > > > loud cry of the business. We excused ourselves with our
      > > ignorance,
      > > > > > hoping we should now soon be set at liberty, and learn wisdom
      by
      > > > > this
      > > > > > disgrace, that they on the contrary had not yet altogether
      > > escaped;
      > > > > and
      > > > > > perhaps their greatest danger was still to come.
      > > > > > At length everyone being assembled again, the trumpets began
      > > again
      > > > > to
      > > > > > sound and the kettle drums to beat as formerly, and we then
      > > imagined
      > > > > > nothing other but that the Bridegroom was ready to present
      > > himself;
      > > > > > which nevertheless was a huge mistake. For it was again the
      > > Virgin
      > > > > of
      > > > > > yesterday, who had arrayed herself all in red velvet, and
      girded
      > > > > herself
      > > > > > with a white scarf. On her head she had a green wreath of
      > > laurel,
      > > > > which
      > > > > > greatly suited her. Her train was now no more of small tapers,
      > > but
      > > > > > consisted of two hundred men in armour, who were all (like
      her)
      > > > > clothed
      > > > > > in red and white.
      > > > > > Now as soon as they were alighted from the throne, she came
      > > > > straight to
      > > > > > us prisoners, and after she had saluted us, she said in few
      > > > > words: "That
      > > > > > some of you have been aware of your wretched condition is
      hugely
      > > > > > pleasing to my most mighty Lord, and he is also resolved you
      > > shall
      > > > > fare
      > > > > > the better for it".
      > > > > > And having seen me in my habit, she laughed and said,
      "Goodness!
      > > > > Have
      > > > > > you also submitted yourself to the yoke? I imagined you would
      > > have
      > > > > made
      > > > > > yourself very smug". With which words she caused my eyes to
      run
      > > > > over.
      > > > > > After which she commanded that we should be unbound, and
      coupled
      > > > > > together and placed in a station where we might easily see the
      > > > > Scales.
      > > > > > For, she said, it may yet fare better with them, than with the
      > > > > > presumptuous who still stand here at liberty.
      > > > > > Meanwhile the scales, which were entirely of gold, were hung
      up
      > > in
      > > > > the
      > > > > > middle of the hall; there was also a little table covered with
      > > red
      > > > > > velvet, and seven weights placed on it. First of all there was
      a
      > > > > pretty
      > > > > > big one, next four little ones, lastly two great ones. And
      these
      > > > > weights
      > > > > > were so heavy in proportion to their bulk, that no man can
      > > believe
      > > > > or
      > > > > > comprehend it. But each of the armoured men had, together with
      a
      > > > > naked
      > > > > > sword, a strong rope; these she distributed according to the
      > > number
      > > > > of
      > > > > > weights into seven bands, and out of every band chose one for
      > > their
      > > > > own
      > > > > > weight; and then again sprang up into her high throne. Now as
      > > soon
      > > > > as
      > > > > > she had made her reverence, in a very shrill tone she began to
      > > > > speak as
      > > > > > follows:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Whoever goes into an artist's room
      > > > > > And nothing knows of painting
      > > > > > And yet will speak with much display
      > > > > > Will yet be mocked by everyone.
      > > > > > And he who enters artist's orders
      > > > > > Who hath not been selected
      > > > > > And begins to paint with much display
      > > > > > Will yet be mocked by everyone.
      > > > > > And who will to a wedding come
      > > > > > And hath not bidden been,
      > > > > > And yet doth come with much display
      > > > > > Will yet be mocked by everyone.
      > > > > > And who will climb upon these scales
      > > > > > And find he weigheth not,
      > > > > > But is shot up with mighty crash
      > > > > > Will yet be mocked by everyone.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > As soon as the Virgin had finished speaking, one of the pages
      > > > > commanded
      > > > > > each one to place himself according to his order, and one
      after
      > > > > another
      > > > > > to step in. Which one of the Emperors made no scruple of, but
      > > first
      > > > > of
      > > > > > all bowed himself a little towards the Virgin, and afterwards
      in
      > > > > all his
      > > > > > stately attire went up: whereupon each Captain put in his
      > > weight,
      > > > > > against which (to the wonder of all) he held out. But the last
      > > was
      > > > > too
      > > > > > heavy for him, so that he must go forth; and that he did with
      so
      > > > > much
      > > > > > anguish that (as it seemed to me) the Virgin herself had pity
      on
      > > > > him,
      > > > > > and beckoned to her people to hold their peace; yet the good
      > > > > Emperor was
      > > > > > bound and delivered over to the Sixth Band. Next after him
      again
      > > > > there
      > > > > > came another Emperor, who stepped haughtily into the Scale,
      and,
      > > > > having
      > > > > > a great thick book under his gown, he imagined he would not
      > > fail;
      > > > > but he
      > > > > > was scarcely able to abide the third weight, and was
      > > unmercifully
      > > > > flung
      > > > > > down, and his book in that upheaval fell from him, and all the
      > > > > soldiers
      > > > > > began to laugh, and he was delivered up bound to the Third
      Band.
      > > > > Thus it
      > > > > > went also with some of the other Emperors, who were all
      > > shamefully
      > > > > > laughed at and put in captivity.
      > > > > > After these there came forth a short little man with a curled
      > > brown
      > > > > > beard, also an Emperor, who after the usual reverence got up,
      > > and
      > > > > held
      > > > > > out so steadfastly, that I thought that had there been more
      > > weights
      > > > > > ready he would have outstood them. To him the Virgin
      immediately
      > > > > arose,
      > > > > > and bowed before him, making him put on a gown of red velvet,
      > > and
      > > > > > finally gave him a branch of laurel, of which she had a good
      > > store
      > > > > upon
      > > > > > her throne, upon the steps of which she asked him to sit down.
      > > Now
      > > > > how
      > > > > > it fared with the rest of the Emperors, Kings and Lords after
      > > him,
      > > > > would
      > > > > > take too long to recount; but I cannot leave unmentioned that
      > > few of
      > > > > > those great personages held out. However, various eminent
      > > virtues
      > > > > > (beyond my hopes) were found in many. One could stand out
      this,
      > > the
      > > > > > second another, some two, some three, four or five, but few
      > > could
      > > > > attain
      > > > > > to the just perfection; and everyone who failed was miserably
      > > > > laughed at
      > > > > > by the bands.
      > > > > > After the Inquisition had also passed over the gentry, the
      > > learned,
      > > > > and
      > > > > > unlearned, and all the rest, and in each condition perhaps
      one,
      > > it
      > > > > may
      > > > > > be two, but for the most part none, was found perfect, it came
      > > at
      > > > > length
      > > > > > to those honest gentlemen the vagabond cheaters, and rascally
      > > > > Lapidem
      > > > > > Spitalanficum makers, who were set upon the Scale with such
      > > scorn
      > > > > that I
      > > > > > myself, in spite of all my grief, was ready to burst my belly
      > > with
      > > > > > laughing, nor could the very prisoners themselves refrain. For
      > > the
      > > > > most
      > > > > > part could not abide that severe trial, but were jerked out of
      > > the
      > > > > Scale
      > > > > > with whips and scourges, and led to the other prisoners, but
      to
      > > a
      > > > > > suitable band. Thus of so great a throng so few remained, that
      > > I am
      > > > > > ashamed to reveal their number. However, there were persons of
      > > > > quality
      > > > > > also amongst them, who notwithstanding were (like the rest)
      > > honoured
      > > > > > with velvet robes and wreaths of laurel.
      > > > > > The Inquisition being completely finished, and none but we
      poor
      > > > > coupled
      > > > > > hounds standing aside, at length one of the Captains stepped
      > > forth,
      > > > > and
      > > > > > said, "Gracious Madam, if it please your Ladyship, let these
      > > poor
      > > > > men
      > > > > > who acknowledged their misunderstanding be set upon the Scale
      > > too,
      > > > > > without their incurring any danger of penalty, and only for
      > > > > recreation's
      > > > > > sake, if perhaps anything that is right may be found amongst
      > > them".
      > > > > > In the first place I was in great perplexity, for in my
      anguish
      > > > > this was
      > > > > > my only comfort, that I was not to stand in such ignominy, or
      > > to be
      > > > > > lashed out of the Scale. For I did not doubt that many of the
      > > > > prisoners
      > > > > > wished that they had stayed ten nights with us in the hall.
      Yet
      > > > > since
      > > > > > the Virgin consented, so it must be, and we were untied and
      one
      > > > > after
      > > > > > another set up. Now although the most part miscarried, they
      were
      > > > > neither
      > > > > > laughed at, nor scourged, but peaceably placed on one side. My
      > > > > companion
      > > > > > was the fifth, and he held out bravely, whereupon all, but
      > > > > especially
      > > > > > the Captain who made the request for us, applauded him, and
      the
      > > > > Virgin
      > > > > > showed him the usual respect. After him again two more were
      > > > > dispatched
      > > > > > in an instant. But I was the eighth.
      > > > > > Now as soon as (with trembling) I stepped up, my companion who
      > > > > already
      > > > > > sat by in his velvet looked friendlily upon me, and the Virgin
      > > > > herself
      > > > > > smiled a little. But for as much as I outstood all the
      weights,
      > > the
      > > > > > Virgin commanded them to draw me up by force, wherefore three
      > > men
      > > > > also
      > > > > > hung on the other side of the beam, and yet nothing could
      > > prevail.
      > > > > > Whereupon one of the pages immediately stood up, and cried out
      > > > > > exceedingly loud, "THAT'S HE": upon which the other
      > > replied, "Then
      > > > > let
      > > > > > him gain his liberty"; which the Virgin accorded. And, being
      > > > > received
      > > > > > with due ceremonies, the choice was given me to release one of
      > > the
      > > > > > captives, whosoever I pleased; whereupon I made no long
      > > > > deliberation,
      > > > > > but elected the first Emperor whom I had long pitied, who was
      > > > > > immediately set free, and with all respect seated amongst us.
      > > > > > Now the last being set up, and the weights proving too heavy
      for
      > > > > him, in
      > > > > > the meantime the Virgin had spotted my roses, which I had
      taken
      > > out
      > > > > of
      > > > > > my hat into my hands, and thereupon presently through her page
      > > > > > graciously requested them of me, and I readily sent them to
      her.
      > > > > > And so this first Act was finished about ten in the morning.
      > > > > Whereupon
      > > > > > the trumpets began to sound again, which nevertheless we could
      > > not
      > > > > as
      > > > > > yet see. Meantime the bands were to step aside with their
      > > > > prisoners, and
      > > > > > await the judgement. After which a council of the seven
      captains
      > > > > and us
      > > > > > was set, and the business was propounded by the Virgin as
      > > > > President, who
      > > > > > desired each one to give his opinion how the prisoners were to
      > > be
      > > > > dealt
      > > > > > with. The first opinion was that they should all be put to
      > > death,
      > > > > yet
      > > > > > one more severely than another, namely those who had
      > > presumptuously
      > > > > > intruded themselves contrary to the express conditions. Others
      > > would
      > > > > > have them kept close prisoners. Both of which pleased neither
      > > the
      > > > > > President, nor me. At length by one of the Emperors (the same
      > > whom
      > > > > I had
      > > > > > freed), my companion, and myself, the affair was brought to
      this
      > > > > point:
      > > > > > that first of all the principal Lords should with a fitting
      > > respect
      > > > > be
      > > > > > led out of the Castle; others might be carried out somewhat
      more
      > > > > > scornfully. These would be stripped, and caused to run out
      > > naked;
      > > > > the
      > > > > > fourth should be hunted out with rods, whips or dogs. Those
      who
      > > the
      > > > > day
      > > > > > before willingly surrendered themselves, might be allowed to
      > > depart
      > > > > > without any blame. And last of all those presumptuous ones,
      and
      > > > > they who
      > > > > > behaved themselves so unseemly at dinner the day before,
      should
      > > be
      > > > > > punished in body and life according to each man's demerit.
      This
      > > > > opinion
      > > > > > pleased the Virgin well, and obtained the upper hand. There
      was
      > > > > moreover
      > > > > > another dinner vouchsafed them, which they were soon told
      about.
      > > > > But the
      > > > > > execution was deferred till twelve noon.
      > > > > > Herewith the Senate arose, and the Virgin also, together with
      > > her
      > > > > > attendants, returned to her usual quarter. But the uppermost
      > > table
      > > > > in
      > > > > > the room was allotted to us, they requesting us to take it in
      > > good
      > > > > part
      > > > > > until the business was fully dispatched. And then we should be
      > > > > conducted
      > > > > > to the Lord Bridegroom and the Bride, with which we were at
      > > present
      > > > > well
      > > > > > content. Meanwhile the prisoners were again brought into the
      > > hall,
      > > > > and
      > > > > > each man seated according to his quality. They were likewise
      > > told to
      > > > > > behave themselves somewhat more civilly than they had done the
      > > day
      > > > > > before, about which they yet did not need to have been
      > > admonished,
      > > > > for
      > > > > > without this, they had already put up their pipes.
      > > > > > And this I can boldly say, not with flattery, but in the love
      of
      > > > > truth,
      > > > > > that commonly those persons who were of the highest rank best
      > > > > understood
      > > > > > how to behave themselves in so unexpected a misfortune. Their
      > > > > treatment
      > > > > > was but indifferent, yet respectful; neither could they yet
      see
      > > > > their
      > > > > > attendants, but to us they were visible, at which I was
      > > exceedingly
      > > > > > joyful. Now although Fortune had exalted us, yet we did not
      take
      > > > > upon us
      > > > > > more than the rest, advising them to be of good cheer, the
      event
      > > > > would
      > > > > > not be so bad. Now although they would gladly have us reveal
      > > their
      > > > > > sentence, yet we were so deeply obligated that none of us
      dared
      > > > > open his
      > > > > > mouth about it.
      > > > > > Nevertheless we comforted them as well as we could, drinking
      > > with
      > > > > them
      > > > > > to see if the wine might make them any more cheerful. Our
      table
      > > was
      > > > > > covered with red velvet, beset with drinking cups of pure
      > > silver and
      > > > > > gold, which the rest could not behold without amazement and
      very
      > > > > great
      > > > > > anguish. But before we had seated ourselves, in came the two
      > > pages,
      > > > > > presenting everyone on the Bridegroom's behalf with the Golden
      > > > > Fleece
      > > > > > with a flying Lion, requesting us to wear them at the table,
      > > and as
      > > > > > became us, to observe the reputation and dignity of the Order
      > > which
      > > > > his
      > > > > > Majesty had now vouchsafed us; and we should be ratified with
      > > > > suitable
      > > > > > ceremonies. This we received with profoundest submission,
      > > promising
      > > > > > obediently to perform whatsoever his Majesty should please.
      > > Besides
      > > > > > these, the noble page had a schedule in which we were set down
      > > in
      > > > > order.
      > > > > > And for my part I should not otherwise wish to conceal my
      > > place, if
      > > > > > perhaps it might not be interpreted as pride in me, which is
      > > > > expressly
      > > > > > against the fourth weight....
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Caryn, please consider reading the entire tale.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://www.alchemywebsite.com/chymwed1.html
      > > > > > <http://www.alchemywebsite.com/chymwed1.html>
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
    • holderlin66
      Bradford comments; Notes of Study on Ahriman s Playbook against the Michael School Look carefully Anthro students. The Amero currency is already printed. The
      Message 110 of 110 , Jul 17, 2008

        Bradford comments;  Notes of Study on Ahriman's Playbook against the Michael School

        Look carefully Anthro students.  The Amero currency is already printed.  The intent was to create the disaster so that the children would all cry out, help us, save us.  The whole idea was to drop the entire income of Americans downward, outsource jobs, and send trillions, trillions overseas to Iraq or rather into the pockets of contractors like Haliburton, literally it might be called draining the swamp.  Some think tanks might call it draining the economic swamp and clearing the swamp land for a whole new world of Amero to match the Euro.  But what shall we hear day in and day out?  We shall hear the scream and yowl of the public against the reality that all this has been planned and in the works.  Create the disease and make America pay for the cure.  It is right here in front of us.... destroy, drown and drain the dollar, good bye dollar and by draining the entire swamp... shatter the American Dream which has become a nightmare built on Ahrimanic lies....

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TShPYA-OuPs

        Keith Fitz-Gerald
        Investment Director
        Money Morning/The Money Map Report

        http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/07/10/dark-pools/

        We can almost hear that ominous "Jaws" theme music in the background and can see that huge dorsal fin as it slices threateningly through the water - knowing full well that the real terror is hidden beneath the water's surface.

        But this time around, it's not a "Great White" that's sparking our fears; it's a well-capitalized and broadly based series of secret stock exchanges known as "Dark Pools of Liquidity," "Dark Liquidity," or just "Dark Pools."

        Most investors have never even heard the term - and are truly shocked to discover these "off-the-books" trading networks actually exist.

        But to Wall Street insiders looking to anonymously move billions of dollars in stocks, bonds, and other investment instruments, dark pools are de rigueur - especially when you're an institutional trader who doesn't want to reveal your intentions or your actions to the "rest" of the market, until after the fact when the orders are "printed."

        And that makes these dark pools of capital highly problematic when it comes transparency: There is literally none in most pools and only limited visibility in others.

        Dark Pools: From Trading Haven to Heavyweight

        Dark Pools are electronic "crossing networks" that offer institutional investors many of the same benefits associated with making trades on the stock exchanges' public limit order books - without tipping their hands to others, meaning publicly quoted prices aren't affected. This is the capital markets' version of a godsend - especially for traders who desire to move large blocks of shares without the public investors ever knowing.

        Some examples of so-called crossing networks include Liquidnet Inc., Pipeline, the Posit unit of Investment Technology Group (ITG), or the SIGMA X unit of Goldman Sachs Group Inc. (GS).

        In an era in which "secret" transactions contributed to what's shaping up to be the largest credit crisis in history, you'd think that any mechanism that allows insiders to trade in complete secrecy and with total anonymity would be scrutinized more closely than a Roger Clemens vitamin shot. But that's not the case with Dark Pools.

        As has long been the case, the old boys really do like to operate behind closed doors, on the other side of the "velvet rope" - beyond which the un-anointed daily working stiff may never pass. And Dark-Pool operators are only getting more private as computerized trading becomes more sophisticated and large-scale-order placement evolves into a science all to itself.

        Dark Pool ownership involves almost the entire institutional-trading sector, consisting of independents, broker/dealer-owned pools, consortiums and even - as hard as this is to imagine, given the public's trust - the stock exchanges themselves (See accompanying chart).

        And business is booming.

        According to the latest data, nearly 12% of daily U.S. stock-trading volume is presently conducted via the 40 or so Dark Pools operated by the "usual suspects."

        According to The Wall Street Journal, Credit Suisse Group AG (ADR: CS) is assembling a network of 30 Dark Pool partners, while JP Morgan Chase & Co. (JPM) is trying to become the Google Inc. (GOOG) of the Dark Pool world by aligning itself with Neovest Inc. Not to be left out, Goldman Sachs recently struck reciprocal deals with rivals UBS AG (UBS) and Morgan Stanley (MS) to allow previously proprietary trading algorithms to work on each other's desktop trading systems.

        This is something the stock exchanges don't want to see because it strips them of order execution revenue. Which is why they're getting into the game, too. At the present time, the Nasdaq (NDAQ) alone shunts some 18% of its volume - or roughly 350 million shares a day - through what insiders euphemistically refer to as its "non-displayed platforms," and also has struck a deal with five unnamed Dark Pool operators that are rumored to route nearly half of the total Dark-Pool volume in the United States today.

        NYSE Euronext (NYX) plans to connect up to 30 such pools, so don't think for a New York minute that this isn't a global phenomenon - Dark Pools exist all around the globe.

        We're still in the early days of this movement. That means there are still lots of things to be worked out from a technical standpoint. For instance, there's very little in the way of proprietary software that enables any Dark Pool operators to "talk" with their competition.

        But we think that's going to change in a real hurry in the next few years, when as much as 50% of all U.S. trading volume will be handled by "Dark Pool Alliances."

        Dark Pool Downers?

        While it's hard to say just how this will affect individual investors like us, my experience as a professional trader suggests that there are a few "realities" we can count upon.

        As you might expect, not all of them are good.

        Let's look at the top three:

        • First, as more volume moves to the so-called Dark Pools, the very notion of what constitutes "public pricing" becomes suspect. Practically speaking, if we're seeing only 50% of the trading volume in a given stock, who's to say that the pricing we're seeing is accurate if the other half remains a mystery.
        • Second, the small- and mid-cap stocks that for so long have been the domain of smaller investors will likely become harder to trade. The reason: Dark Pools will absorb the liquidity that's presently out in the open, just as a "black hole" in outer space sucks in all the matter that's nearby. The net effect could be that smaller transactions become more inefficient, or that public pricing actually disconnects from private pricing. Either way, individual investors may not get the best possible prices.
        • Third, you can bet regulators will get interested if there is even a whiff of impropriety at the expense of smaller investors who perceive (and rightly so) that they are being "locked out" of the markets by the big boys yet again.

        On the other hand, maybe those regulators don't care at all. With the economy going the way it is right now, there's plenty more to worry about… like making it out of the water and back up onto the beach before the music stops and "you-know-who" grabs you from below……da-dun…da-dun….da-dun….da-dun."

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TShPYA-OuPs

        Bradford previously;

        "Carol brought what is arising is an antidote to the Euro, the Canada, U.S. Mexico Amero currency and minted and newly printed currency and reshuffling the entire market dominos so that U.S.A. as we know is already going under and was planned to go under and deliberately set to shrivel America and, bring about the destruction, raze the whole system, cause immense Patriotic Panic, perhaps use a mighty nuclear strike on Iran, but surely like burning a factory for the Insurance Money, sinking a ship, like the American Dollar,  by shrinking America, bringing consumers, retailers to their knees, so weakening the masses and causing such a recession or depression that a whole new cry and yowel is all fix it please, fix it please, Oh please fix it for us oh great leaders of the Economy, Oh please fix it for us so that we shall not waste away and suffer.  But we have to have pictures, news at five of suffering, bread lines, rice lines, we have to feel as if banks are closing and businesses are dying right and left, for without the drama that they are creating, and the news is marketing, the plan to disrupt the entire Nationalistic Dollar could be very, very hard on the emotionally immature humans who consider themselves so self important as Americans. 

        "The cry rings out Oh fix it for us even though, like Pharmo Industry, you created the disease, and then you mareketed the cure, you created the situation in the plans, in the works that would bring about one of these wonderful Goethean ideas for manipulation,  contraction, contraction, shrink and then the heros come with a plan to save us all, walla EXPANSION.  Good ole painful, News at Five, contraction, plummet, death and great savior of the universe Expansion, but naturally you are all poorer and at the level they want you at.  Even though the Think Tanks had this plan in operation for years and years.... Really if you understand Orwell's 1984, if you understand Eurasia or the Euro... whole giant economic blocks of Ahrimanic Economic and falsely shadowed Threefold World and Threefold Economy insertions, you understand that Americanadamex.... AMERO Liars, who were never as honest and straight up as Dr. Steiner.  Ahrimanic Intentions and greed have never wanted to share out the Rights and Brotherhood and Cultural Life associated with a healthy economy."

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