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RE: [anthroposophy] Re: On the road with the dharma bums

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  • Stephen Rowlison
    WISDOM: is the right use of knowledge. TRIUNE SELF: The indivisible self-knowing and immortal One; its identity and knowledge part as knower; its rightness and
    Message 1 of 13 , Jan 2, 2008
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      WISDOM: is the right use of knowledge.

      TRIUNE SELF: The indivisible self-knowing and immortal One; its identity and knowledge part as knower; its rightness and reason part as thinker, in the Eternal; and, its desire and feeling part as doer, existing periodically on the earth.


      KNOWLEDGE IS OF TWO KINDS: real or Self-knowledge and sense- or human knowledge. Self-knowledge of the Triune Self is inexhaustible and immeasurable and is common to the knowers of all Triune Selves. It is not dependent on the senses though it includes all that has taken place in the worlds; this concerns everything from the least developed unit of nature to the all-knowing Triune Self of the worlds throughout the entirety of time in the Eternal. It is the real and unchanging knowledge at once available in the minutest detail and as one perfectly related and complete whole.

      Sense-knowledge, science, or human knowledge, is the accumulated and systematized sum of the facts of nature observed as natural laws, or experienced by the doers through their undeveloped senses and imperfect bodies. And the knowledge and statements of the laws have to be changed from time to time.

      KNOWLEDGE OF THE DOER: is the essence of the doer's learning by thinking. The Light freed from its attachments and restored to the noetic atmosphere, in the balancing of its thoughts, is unattached and unattachable, and therefore knowledge; it is not human "knowledge".

      KNOWLEDGE OF THE THINKER OF THE TRIUNE SELF: includes all knowledge concerning the administration of law and justice to its doer, and in the doer's relation to other doers in human bodies, through their thinkers. All thinkers know the law. They are always in agreement with each other and with their knowers in the administering of destiny to their respective doers in human bodies. Their knowledge of law and justice precludes doubt and prevents the possibility of favoritism. The doer in every human body gets its destiny as it makes it. That is, law and justice.

      KNOWLEDGE OF THE KNOWER OF THE TRIUNE SELF, SELF-KNOWLEDGE: comprises and embraces everything in the four worlds. As selfness it is knowledge, and as I-ness it identifies and is the identity of the knowledge. It served its apprenticeship to nature as a nature unit. There it was conscious as its function successively in every part of the nature machine of time. When it became a Triune Self in the Self-knowing Light of its Intelligence in the Eternal, every function as which it was successively conscious in time is at once available, unlimited by time, in the Eternal. The I-ness of the knower identifies each function and is the identity as which the unit was conscious, and the selfness of the knower knows and is the knowledge of each such function separately, as in time, and all together compositely in the Eternal. This knowledge is conveyed to the thinker by the minds of I-ness and selfness, and may be available to the doer as conscience in rightness, and as intuition in reason.

      KNOWLEDGE, NOETIC (THE WORLD OF KNOWLEDGE): is composed of the noetic atmospheres of all the knowers of Triune Selves. There all the knowledge of every Triune Self is available and at the service of every other knower.


      Harold Waldwin Percival - Thnking and Destiny


      To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
      From: avarohanam@...
      Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2008 11:18:28 +0000
      Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: On the road with the dharma bums


      Do not subjugate wisdom with knowledge. Knowledge is but a form of fleeting logic, whereas wisdom surpasses knowledge and beyond. Wisdom is the timeless mother lode of all knowledge





































































      .
       
      Sahana
      Hari Kamboji        Sa ne da pa ma ga ma re ga re sa
      You will not grow if you sit in a beautiful flower garden, but you will grow if you are sick, if you are in pain, if you experience losses, if you do not put your head in the sand, but take the pain and learn to accept it, not as a curse or punishment, but as a gift to you with a very, very specific purpose.



      Support the World Aids Awareness campaign this month with Yahoo! for Good
    • Lee A.
      steven, When reviewing old emails, it was pleasure to revisit some content from what I consider to be one of the most unheralded classics of metaphysicis in
      Message 2 of 13 , Jan 4, 2008
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        steven,
         
        When reviewing old emails, it was pleasure to revisit some content from what I consider to be one of the most unheralded classics of metaphysicis in the 20th century- Thinking and Destiny. Totally original in content and source. It has one of the best descriptions of initation in the Great Way vol 2. . It stands with Occult Science, the Secret Doctrine, and Cosmo Conception as one the masterworks of metaphysical experience.
         
        Lee 

        ----- Original Message ----
        From: Stephen Rowlison <srowlison@...>
        To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2008 5:43:23 PM
        Subject: RE: [anthroposophy] Re: On the road with the dharma bums


        WISDOM: is the right use of knowledge.

        TRIUNE SELF: The indivisible self-knowing and immortal One; its identity and knowledge part as knower; its rightness and reason part as thinker, in the Eternal; and, its desire and feeling part as doer, existing periodically on the earth.


        KNOWLEDGE IS OF TWO KINDS: real or Self-knowledge and sense- or human knowledge. Self-knowledge of the Triune Self is inexhaustible and immeasurable and is common to the knowers of all Triune Selves. It is not dependent on the senses though it includes all that has taken place in the worlds; this concerns everything from the least developed unit of nature to the all-knowing Triune Self of the worlds throughout the entirety of time in the Eternal. It is the real and unchanging knowledge at once available in the minutest detail and as one perfectly related and complete whole.

        Sense-knowledge, science, or human knowledge, is the accumulated and systematized sum of the facts of nature observed as natural laws, or experienced by the doers through their undeveloped senses and imperfect bodies. And the knowledge and statements of the laws have to be changed from time to time.

        KNOWLEDGE OF THE DOER: is the essence of the doer's learning by thinking. The Light freed from its attachments and restored to the noetic atmosphere, in the balancing of its thoughts, is unattached and unattachable, and therefore knowledge; it is not human "knowledge".

        KNOWLEDGE OF THE THINKER OF THE TRIUNE SELF: includes all knowledge concerning the administration of law and justice to its doer, and in the doer's relation to other doers in human bodies, through their thinkers. All thinkers know the law. They are always in agreement with each other and with their knowers in the administering of destiny to their respective doers in human bodies. Their knowledge of law and justice precludes doubt and prevents the possibility of favoritism. The doer in every human body gets its destiny as it makes it. That is, law and justice.

        KNOWLEDGE OF THE KNOWER OF THE TRIUNE SELF, SELF-KNOWLEDGE: comprises and embraces everything in the four worlds. As selfness it is knowledge, and as I-ness it identifies and is the identity of the knowledge. It served its apprenticeship to nature as a nature unit. There it was conscious as its function successively in every part of the nature machine of time. When it became a Triune Self in the Self-knowing Light of its Intelligence in the Eternal, every function as which it was successively conscious in time is at once available, unlimited by time, in the Eternal. The I-ness of the knower identifies each function and is the identity as which the unit was conscious, and the selfness of the knower knows and is the knowledge of each such function separately, as in time, and all together compositely in the Eternal. This knowledge is conveyed to the thinker by the minds of I-ness and selfness, and may be available to the doer as conscience in rightness, and as intuition in reason.

        KNOWLEDGE, NOETIC (THE WORLD OF KNOWLEDGE): is composed of the noetic atmospheres of all the knowers of Triune Selves. There all the knowledge of every Triune Self is available and at the service of every other knower.


        Harold Waldwin Percival - Thnking and Destiny


        To: anthroposophy@ yahoogroups. com
        From: avarohanam@yahoo. co.uk
        Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2008 11:18:28 +0000
        Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: On the road with the dharma bums


        Do not subjugate wisdom with knowledge. Knowledge is but a form of fleeting logic, whereas wisdom surpasses knowledge and beyond. Wisdom is the timeless mother lode of all knowledge





































































        .
         
        Sahana
        Hari Kamboji        Sa ne da pa ma ga ma re ga re sa
        You will not grow if you sit in a beautiful flower garden, but you will grow if you are sick, if you are in pain, if you experience losses, if you do not put your head in the sand, but take the pain and learn to accept it, not as a curse or punishment, but as a gift to you with a very, very specific purpose.



        Support the World Aids Awareness campaign this month with Yahoo! for Good



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      • holderlin66
        Is There Really No Way Out? There are some things that we know today. We may not know the details but we know they happened. We know that Diebold fixed the New
        Message 3 of 13 , Jan 10, 2008
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          Is There Really No Way Out?

          There are some things that we know today. We may not know the details but we know they happened. We know that Diebold fixed the New Hampshire primary so that Giuliani and Huckabee would finish ahead of Ron Paul. According to disparities between hand counts and computer counts along with exit polls and given the proof of missing votes in Sutton, NH as well as other places it's a given that shit happened again.

          There are real questions concerning the difference in voting results between Obama and Clinton as well. Given what happened in Ohio twice and given what happened in Florida and other places, we know that voter fraud is a reality and that it is shaping the world in which we live by determining who is elected. The motive for this is money and power. You need money and power to shape the vote so that you can have still more money and power.

          We now know that there was an event staged in The Strait of Hormuz a couple of days ago. We see evidence of faked video and we find that no one can even determine who the boats belonged to and where the threatening audio came from. The Navy says the voice could have come from anywhere; from the sea, on shore… maybe even out of the sky. Well, I'll let you read about it here http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=7821

          We know that Bush has launched his Major Embarrassment Tour of the Middle East in which he will do his pigeon on a window ledge performance and the special `bobbing plastic flamingo on drinking glass' routine for Israel .

          It takes a special kind of man to be a george w. bush. Imagine being the front man for policies that have totally screwed up the country you were entrusted to protect as well as throwing the entire world into political and financial chaos. Imagine strutting around like a peacock after having achieved nothing but disorder. Imagine meeting with intelligent people in many countries who know beyond a shadow of doubt that you are a posturing fool and a no-talent circus clown. Imagine pulling this off while looking like a drunk who has pissed himself and managed to crash an uptown dinner party.

          I could not do this. You could not do this. It takes a very `special' kind of person. I think of Bush as the forklift in Alien2 and Dick Cheney as the operator of the forklift. Moving along to the inside of Dick Cheney's head you find someone like Bennie Netanyahu masturbating to a kiddy snuff film. Believe me, the truth of the matter is no more absurd than this imagery and is quite possibly worse.

          One thing is certain, the neo-cons and their banking buddies along with assorted corporate weasels and world leaders trussed up like the black gangster in Pulp Fiction, with a gag-reflex, red ping pong ball in his mouth are ramping it up. They are making for the final stage of what we have watched in process these past years. You may be sure that the one thing not under consideration is how much collateral damage this is going to result in.

          We are faced with something new this time around. I might liken it to Watergate and the Kennedy assassination but this is so much bigger than those. The present state of criminal enterprise engaged in by the present US administration is beyond anything that has come before. Please note that this administration was not legally elected once. We know this.

          Many a dark secret lies hidden at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave and near points East, West, South and North. Sibel Edmonds gives us a small look in. There is ever so much more than this. High treason has certainly been committed as well as mass murder and probably every other crime there is. We really do sail on uncharted waters at this time. We've never been anywhere like this before and there is no telling what lies ahead.

          I'm not a fly on the wall so I have to use things like inductive and deductive reasoning. I have to use intuition and whatever talents I may possess at my present level of personal evolution. As you know, this is an opinion blog. I don't like to play Madame Cleo. I speculate and a few thousand people will read it and whatever is going on is going to continue going on, regardless of what is written here or who reads it.

          Last time Mr. All Hat and no Cattle went to the Middle East bad things followed. We know now that Iran has no nuclear weapons program. But… we knew Saddam had no WMD's, at least some of us did- and said so before the troops ever went into Iraq . Let's not allow reality to rear its ugly head because reality and facts and `what is' are no match for the shape shifters at the helm.

          Russia is about to install some highly efficient and flexible missiles in Iran . These missiles will radically change the options available to those who have Iran in the gun-sights. Once these missiles go in, everything changes. In all likelihood this is why bush is off to Israel to get a good rogering. The time is now if they want to humble Iran . They could do it after too but it would come at a far greater cost.

          This is not to suggest that assault on Iran is imminent. This is just to say, given what we have seen in the past that… it looks like that. They're up to something. The clock is ticking on this administration. Some have told me that it doesn't matter who is in charge. Some have told me that there's nothing anyone can do. Some have told me that everyone, everywhere is a part of the conspiracy and it is possible that I am the only person on Earth who isn't and that will change as soon as I get into any position to influence anything. According to some of these people even the unborn are working for the Zionazi's.

          Meanwhile Planet X is coming and most of us are going to be toast. I've been hearing about that too. I don't know anything about it. I've heard so many things that sound preposterous and I have seen things that I know to be true and which are also preposterous so all I can do is go on doing what I do and trusting that things are not as rigidly controlled and colossally screwed and unfixable as I am told.

          What can one say to those who tell us that everyone is working for the dark side? What hope is there in that? As frightening and unpredictable as this world may be there are a lot of beautiful things and real heroes in it. There are millions of good people who struggle each day to improve the lives of others. I know this. You're not going to doom and gloom me into despair. That said… I would ask you to look at the connections between bush slithering on his belly to his masters… to the event in The Strait of Hormuz… to the Russian missiles… to the administration's ticking clock and what things it has been up to in it's time…

          The time for voices of outrage is now. Citizens of New Hampshire must scream bloody murder. You have got to rise up in an angry and unstoppable mob and demand an end to Diebold and its proven criminal enterprise. You are so much stronger collectively than your oppressors. You cannot count on voices in the main stream. How many Keith Olbermann's are there? This is the people's job this time. This is a rank and file thing.

          It may be that nothing in the works can be stopped. How does that change anything? If every time it looked like we were helpless and could do nothing and we did nothing we would not be here now. We didn't come all this long way to die on our knees before scoundrels and thieves. I just don't believe that the bad guys win. I can't believe that and I don't think you believe it either.

        • holderlin66
          Is America a Good Nation? Is she a Great Nation? Let s examine the evidence. Of late to quickly reveal the hearts of America s leaders I tell people about
          Message 4 of 13 , Jan 10, 2008
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            Is America a Good Nation? Is she a Great Nation? Let's examine the evidence. Of late to quickly reveal the hearts of America's leaders I tell people about World War I's Belgian War Relief. During the Great War, the citizens on the home front were extolled to donate to help the widows and orphans of war weary Belgium. The British loaded food and other supplies onto railroad cars in Belgium and sent them across no man's land into German occupied territory to feed the soldiers who were killing British husbands, fathers, sons and brothers. Britain lost 750,000 during the war. Several times that many died after the war from wounds they received during the war. All of them were killed by enemy soldiers who had been fed by the Allied leaders and their favorite charity, Belgian War Relief.

            http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ceasestobegood.php

            America's leaders knew that the Great War would have ended in 1915 or 1916 if Wall Street had not promised that America would enter the war. In fact America entered World War I precisely so the war would last longer and kill even more people than it otherwise would have. Our leaders made no demand that Belgian War Relief be discontinued prior to U.S. entry to protect our troops in the trenches. Nor did they demand that the British stop the flow of other war materiel through Sweden, Spain and Portugal. What the allies did demand was that the war continue until a Jewish Communist dictatorship was established in Russia and a Jewish colony was created in Palestine. That 60,000,000 human beings were killed in the Soviet Union was of no concern to our leaders. That 35,000 Americans died during World War I and more than 8,000 were blinded did not bother them. That another 100,000 American soldiers died from their wounds before Armistice Day in 1928 does not merit a footnote in their writings. They are not concerned about us. I have always wondered why we care for those who do not care for us.

            So I now ask you, does a Good Nation kill tens of millions of innocent people on a whim? And even if we are a Good People how long will we continue to have a Great Nation with leaders like ours?

            More recently we went to war with Iraq and Afghanistan. Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11. Iraq had no Weapons of Mass Destruction and no ties with Al Qaeda. In fact they were enemies. All of this was known before the invasion. Yet the controlled news media did not share these facts with us until after the occupation had become a disaster. So why are we killing so many innocent people and sacrificing the lives of so many of our young soldiers and marines? Bear with me a minute as we go back in time to 4-19-1995 to shed light on 9-11 the event that first galvanized the public to support the "War on Terror."

            On 4-19-1995 morning a 52 year-old woman was in the Social Security office in the Alfred Murrah building in Oklahoma City when she looked out the window and saw a man she later learned was Timothy McVeigh get out of a yellow Ryder truck and walk across the street. About half a minute later she saw a second man get out of the same truck and walk away. Then a bomb exploded, the building collapsed and she lost her leg. Nineteen people saw McVeigh with another man that morning and the day before. None of these witnesses were called to place McVeigh at the scene of the greatest crime in modern American history until 9-11. 168 people were killed that day including 19 children in the daycare center. Why would the Department of Justice (DOJ) not call eye witnesses unless they needed to protect the man who actually did light the fuse? The FBI and DOJ both acted to protect the man who left the Ryder truck after McVeigh and therefore was most likely to have lit the fuse to the truck bomb.

            Many different sources and witnesses have traced the plot to destroy the Oklahoma City federal building to Elohim City, a supposed right wing extremist compound in northeast Oklahoma. Two weeks prior to the bombing there was a meeting held at that compound. Court records redacted the name of one participant. It only identified him as being from Morris Dees's Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) which has often run infiltration programs in behalf of the FBI and Department of Justice. The other two participants were Robert Millar, a Canadian Jewish psychologist, and Andreas Strassmeir, a German Jewish man who had served as an intelligence officer in the German Army. The Bureau of Alcohol and Tobacco agents in Oklahoma City were outside the Murrah building in combat gear all night long on the night of the 18th and into the morning of the 19th. None of the BATF agents were inside when the bomb detonated. Nor were any of their children in the daycare center. The only BATF employee inside the building was the woman who answered the phones until the building collapsed.

            The FBI said on 4-19-1995 that the Ryder truck contained a 1,200 pound fertilizer bomb parked 40 feet from the building and was the sole cause of the collapse. The next day the the size of the bomb was upgraded to 4,200 pounds and then to 5,200 pounds, but the FBI claimed it was still this one bomb that took down the Murrah building. General Ben Partin who was in charge of ordnance (i.e. bombs) for the U.S. Air Force issued a report immediately after the bombing giving compelling evidence that the truck bomb did not take down the Murrah building. He pointed out that interior columns were taken out and that columns between the Ryder truck and those interior columns were left in tact. This is not possible scientifically so the FBI and the DOJ lied. The Congress and the Senate were given individual copies of the Partin report. Not one Senator began a filibuster to stop all voting until the FBI told the truth. Not one congressman refused to vote for any appropriations in the House until the DOJ told the truth. Ask yourself this question: Do Great Nations allow the government to protect the persons who set off bombs inside a building that killed 168 of its own citizens including 19 children age five and under?

            Let's revisit 9-11-2001. On that morning bombs went off inside both the North and South Towers of the World Trade Center even before the two planes struck. There were multiple witnesses to this fact. And we also have multiple witnesses to a bomb that was detonated 3 ½ minutes prior to Flight 77 striking the Pentagon. Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld admitted to a press conference on 9-10-2001 that he could not trace 2.3 trillion dollars (That's trillions not billions) in Department of Defense spending. Flight 77 was originally headed towards Rumsfeld's office until it took a 270 degree turn and came in at 400 plus mph barely 20 feet above ground and hit in the exact same area where a bomb had already killed 40 military auditors who were attempting to trace those missing trillions of dollars.

            I do not want to dwell at length on 9-11. But WTC Tower 7 which was not struck by a plane also collapsed that day. The BBC announced the collapse of WTC 7 some 20 minutes before it happened. It collapsed in 6.5 seconds. Videos of the building reveal that there were no fires hot enough to melt the glass windows. This means the temperature inside the building was below 800 to 900 degrees and was therefore not hot enough to melt steel. Let me describe how a controlled demolition works so you will understand what really happened. You place thermite or better yet thermate which are cutting agents at 45 degree angles adjacent to each of the girders every two floors. If you are not familiar with thermate you can look it up at Wikipedia. It is a cutting agent that burns at 4,800 degrees and melts steel in seconds. You would also need to place detonation charges to bring down the building and to attach wires running from the cutting agents and the bombs to a central control computer. The bombs and cutting agents have to go off in the proper order so that one floor is not left intact and does not resist the collapsing floors above it. If each successive floor resists the fall of the floors, it could take 100 seconds for a building to collapse and even then you could not guarantee that it would fall straight down. This is called the pancake effect and can take up to 100 seconds to complete. The persons who took down the WTC on 9-11 successfully took out all of the support columns on all of the floors simultaneously. And they did that three times in one day without alerting either the national news media or the DOJ and FBI.

            I now ask you this question: Do Good Nations blow up buildings with thousands of people inside in order to scare the general population into declaring war on an innocent nation and kill more than 1,000,000 people during a senseless occupation? Can America still be considered Great? It certainly is no longer Good.

            Currently the leaders of both political parties have approved the use of Depleted Uranium. It was used by Clinton in his Kosovo campaign and in Iraq in his air strikes to enforce the no-fly zone. Depleted Uranium is twice as heavy as lead so it can penetrate an enemy tank. It is pyrophoric meaning it bursts into flames and cooks the occupants. It is radioactive so it irradiates the bad guys, induces cancer in them and gives birth defects to their unborn children too. The fly in the ointment is that DU after it goes pyrophoric is converted into particles less than one micron in size which means they can become permanently airborne and do the same to our soldiers and marines as they did to our enemies. In fact even support military personnel and our allies in neighboring countries are exposed. DU can also get into the soil and water. The half-life of Depleted Uranium is 4.5 billion years so we are poisoning the planet for a very long time. Do Great Nations poison future generations including the unborn children of their own soldiers? I say No, but the leaders of both political parties continue to kill those who have volunteered to defend their country.

            Thousands of tons of Depleted Uranium were dropped on Iraq and Afghanistan in order, I believe, to destroy those nations and to set an example to any country that refuses to bow to the joint will of the United States and Israel.

            So why are we still in Iraq? Does anything about the Iraq war make sense? The occupation is a terror generator and is not a valid part of the alleged war against terror. I believe that the people who killed the military auditors at the Pentagon, and took down World Trade Center Towers 1, 2 and 7 in controlled demolitions wanted us to destroy Iraq and Iran. It is as if the perpetrators of 9-11 had the power to blow and whistle and announce "I want you to begin killing and to keep killing until I blow the whistle again to stop." They have not yet blown the whistle the second time to tell us we can stop killing and dying. Our leaders want these current wars to continue for a reason.

            As I said in my previous article, I believe that Bush has put 17,500 sailors and marines in the Persian Gulf precisely so their ships can be sunk by Iran's Russian made anti-ship missiles after the Israelis strike Iran with American donated bunker busting nuclear weapons. Our self-appointed leaders are willing to sacrifice the lives of 17,500 sailors and marines just so they can start World War III. Great nations do not kill whenever the politicians and the media tells incredible lies. Everything we have been told about every war from 1914 to the invasion of Iraq has been a lie. How real were our wars when both sides had the same bankers? The only really true statement we can make about our wars is that we killed tens of millions of people and sacrificed the lives of our soldiers for nothing.

            The American dollar is on the verge of total collapse. We are obviously being led to World War III at this time because our leaders do not expect America to survive as a sovereign nation for more than a year or two. They have stolen our government. They have sacrificed the lives of those men and women who enlisted in the military mistakenly thinking they are defending their country. Our leaders are insane. They will destroy America and the world.

            America long ago ceased to be either Good or Great. We have one last chance in the coming year to do something Great as a people. We must reject all of their lies. We must reject all of their wars. We must no longer believe anything we see in their controlled press. We must realize there is no Opposition Party. Both the Democrats and the Republicans are war parties and were long ago bought and paid for by Wall Street and by the Zionists.

            The Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), the Bilderberg Society and the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) have announced their plan to form a North American Union (NAU) merging America with Canada and Mexico by 2010. I see no reason why a nation that is neither Good nor Great should not surrender its sovereignty. Of course the citizens of the nation that used to be known as America might object to their new status as serfs on the Global Plantation. I know they will be angry when they discover that the coming hyperinflation will permamently cut their real after tax wages by 50% and their savings by 90%. But I explained that in my prevoius essays.

            As I said in my last essay, I believe we will soon have martial law. I have since made plans to leave America before it becomes a dictatorship. We have at least a few months left of relative freedom. I am fortunate to have a profession which can be practiced overseas.

            I was born an American. I was born free. I loved the country I knew as a child. I will always be an American even though the country I loved will soon cease to exist. It is with great sadness that I announce my decision to leave my native land before it dies.

            I am under no illusions about the nature of the people who think they own our government. They have declared unto themselves the new power of Extraordinary Rendition which means they believe they have the right to kidnap, imprison, torture, and even kill any person anywhere in the world. I want to leave this country not because I am foolish enough to think it will make me safe but because I can no longer justify being part of the Greatest Force for Evil in the twenty-first century.

          • carol
            Bradford asked: So why are we killing so many innocent people and sacrificing the lives of so many of our young soldiers and marines? I think it has to do
            Message 5 of 13 , Jan 26, 2008
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              Bradford asked: "So why are we killing so many innocent people and sacrificing the lives of so many of our young soldiers and marines? "

              I think it has to do with being on the wrong side of a higher conquest.

               

               

               

               

               


              --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "holderlin66" <holderlin66@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > Is America a Good Nation? Is she a Great Nation? Let's examine the
              > evidence. Of late to quickly reveal the hearts of America's leaders I
              > tell people about World War I's Belgian War Relief. During the Great
              > War, the citizens on the home front were extolled to donate to help the
              > widows and orphans of war weary Belgium. The British loaded food and
              > other supplies onto railroad cars in Belgium and sent them across no
              > man's land into German occupied territory to feed the soldiers who were
              > killing British husbands, fathers, sons and brothers. Britain lost
              > 750,000 during the war. Several times that many died after the war from
              > wounds they received during the war. All of them were killed by enemy
              > soldiers who had been fed by the Allied leaders and their favorite
              > charity, Belgian War Relief.
              > http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ceasestobegood.php
              > <http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ceasestobegood.php>
              > America's leaders knew that the Great War would have ended in 1915 or
              > 1916 if Wall Street had not promised that America would enter the war.
              > In fact America entered World War I precisely so the war would last
              > longer and kill even more people than it otherwise would have. Our
              > leaders made no demand that Belgian War Relief be discontinued prior to
              > U.S. entry to protect our troops in the trenches. Nor did they demand
              > that the British stop the flow of other war materiel through Sweden,
              > Spain and Portugal. What the allies did demand was that the war continue
              > until a Jewish Communist dictatorship was established in Russia and a
              > Jewish colony was created in Palestine. That 60,000,000 human beings
              > were killed in the Soviet Union was of no concern to our leaders. That
              > 35,000 Americans died during World War I and more than 8,000 were
              > blinded did not bother them. That another 100,000 American soldiers died
              > from their wounds before Armistice Day in 1928 does not merit a footnote
              > in their writings. They are not concerned about us. I have always
              > wondered why we care for those who do not care for us.
              > So I now ask you, does a Good Nation kill tens of millions of innocent
              > people on a whim? And even if we are a Good People how long will we
              > continue to have a Great Nation with leaders like ours?
              > More recently we went to war with Iraq and Afghanistan. Iraq had nothing
              > to do with 9-11. Iraq had no Weapons of Mass Destruction and no ties
              > with Al Qaeda. In fact they were enemies. All of this was known before
              > the invasion. Yet the controlled news media did not share these facts
              > with us until after the occupation had become a disaster. So why are we
              > killing so many innocent people and sacrificing the lives of so many of
              > our young soldiers and marines? Bear with me a minute as we go back in
              > time to 4-19-1995 to shed light on 9-11 the event that first galvanized
              > the public to support the "War on Terror."
              > On 4-19-1995 morning a 52 year-old woman was in the Social Security
              > office in the Alfred Murrah building in Oklahoma City when she looked
              > out the window and saw a man she later learned was Timothy McVeigh get
              > out of a yellow Ryder truck and walk across the street. About half a
              > minute later she saw a second man get out of the same truck and walk
              > away. Then a bomb exploded, the building collapsed and she lost her leg.
              > Nineteen people saw McVeigh with another man that morning and the day
              > before. None of these witnesses were called to place McVeigh at the
              > scene of the greatest crime in modern American history until 9-11. 168
              > people were killed that day including 19 children in the daycare center.
              > Why would the Department of Justice (DOJ) not call eye witnesses unless
              > they needed to protect the man who actually did light the fuse? The FBI
              > and DOJ both acted to protect the man who left the Ryder truck after
              > McVeigh and therefore was most likely to have lit the fuse to the truck
              > bomb.
              > Many different sources and witnesses have traced the plot to destroy the
              > Oklahoma City federal building to Elohim City, a supposed right wing
              > extremist compound in northeast Oklahoma. Two weeks prior to the bombing
              > there was a meeting held at that compound. Court records redacted the
              > name of one participant. It only identified him as being from Morris
              > Dees's Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) which has often run
              > infiltration programs in behalf of the FBI and Department of Justice.
              > The other two participants were Robert Millar, a Canadian Jewish
              > psychologist, and Andreas Strassmeir, a German Jewish man who had served
              > as an intelligence officer in the German Army. The Bureau of Alcohol and
              > Tobacco agents in Oklahoma City were outside the Murrah building in
              > combat gear all night long on the night of the 18th and into the morning
              > of the 19th. None of the BATF agents were inside when the bomb
              > detonated. Nor were any of their children in the daycare center. The
              > only BATF employee inside the building was the woman who answered the
              > phones until the building collapsed.
              > The FBI said on 4-19-1995 that the Ryder truck contained a 1,200 pound
              > fertilizer bomb parked 40 feet from the building and was the sole cause
              > of the collapse. The next day the the size of the bomb was upgraded to
              > 4,200 pounds and then to 5,200 pounds, but the FBI claimed it was still
              > this one bomb that took down the Murrah building. General Ben Partin who
              > was in charge of ordnance (i.e. bombs) for the U.S. Air Force issued a
              > report immediately after the bombing giving compelling evidence that the
              > truck bomb did not take down the Murrah building. He pointed out that
              > interior columns were taken out and that columns between the Ryder truck
              > and those interior columns were left in tact. This is not possible
              > scientifically so the FBI and the DOJ lied. The Congress and the Senate
              > were given individual copies of the Partin report. Not one Senator began
              > a filibuster to stop all voting until the FBI told the truth. Not one
              > congressman refused to vote for any appropriations in the House until
              > the DOJ told the truth. Ask yourself this question: Do Great Nations
              > allow the government to protect the persons who set off bombs inside a
              > building that killed 168 of its own citizens including 19 children age
              > five and under?
              > Let's revisit 9-11-2001. On that morning bombs went off inside both the
              > North and South Towers of the World Trade Center even before the two
              > planes struck. There were multiple witnesses to this fact. And we also
              > have multiple witnesses to a bomb that was detonated 3 ½ minutes
              > prior to Flight 77 striking the Pentagon. Secretary of Defense Donald
              > Rumsfeld admitted to a press conference on 9-10-2001 that he could not
              > trace 2.3 trillion dollars (That's trillions not billions) in Department
              > of Defense spending. Flight 77 was originally headed towards Rumsfeld's
              > office until it took a 270 degree turn and came in at 400 plus mph
              > barely 20 feet above ground and hit in the exact same area where a bomb
              > had already killed 40 military auditors who were attempting to trace
              > those missing trillions of dollars.
              > I do not want to dwell at length on 9-11. But WTC Tower 7 which was not
              > struck by a plane also collapsed that day. The BBC announced the
              > collapse of WTC 7 some 20 minutes before it happened. It collapsed in
              > 6.5 seconds. Videos of the building reveal that there were no fires hot
              > enough to melt the glass windows. This means the temperature inside the
              > building was below 800 to 900 degrees and was therefore not hot enough
              > to melt steel. Let me describe how a controlled demolition works so you
              > will understand what really happened. You place thermite or better yet
              > thermate which are cutting agents at 45 degree angles adjacent to each
              > of the girders every two floors. If you are not familiar with thermate
              > you can look it up at Wikipedia. It is a cutting agent that burns at
              > 4,800 degrees and melts steel in seconds. You would also need to place
              > detonation charges to bring down the building and to attach wires
              > running from the cutting agents and the bombs to a central control
              > computer. The bombs and cutting agents have to go off in the proper
              > order so that one floor is not left intact and does not resist the
              > collapsing floors above it. If each successive floor resists the fall of
              > the floors, it could take 100 seconds for a building to collapse and
              > even then you could not guarantee that it would fall straight down. This
              > is called the pancake effect and can take up to 100 seconds to complete.
              > The persons who took down the WTC on 9-11 successfully took out all of
              > the support columns on all of the floors simultaneously. And they did
              > that three times in one day without alerting either the national news
              > media or the DOJ and FBI.
              > I now ask you this question: Do Good Nations blow up buildings with
              > thousands of people inside in order to scare the general population into
              > declaring war on an innocent nation and kill more than 1,000,000 people
              > during a senseless occupation? Can America still be considered Great? It
              > certainly is no longer Good.
              > Currently the leaders of both political parties have approved the use of
              > Depleted Uranium. It was used by Clinton in his Kosovo campaign and in
              > Iraq in his air strikes to enforce the no-fly zone. Depleted Uranium is
              > twice as heavy as lead so it can penetrate an enemy tank. It is
              > pyrophoric meaning it bursts into flames and cooks the occupants. It is
              > radioactive so it irradiates the bad guys, induces cancer in them and
              > gives birth defects to their unborn children too. The fly in the
              > ointment is that DU after it goes pyrophoric is converted into particles
              > less than one micron in size which means they can become permanently
              > airborne and do the same to our soldiers and marines as they did to our
              > enemies. In fact even support military personnel and our allies in
              > neighboring countries are exposed. DU can also get into the soil and
              > water. The half-life of Depleted Uranium is 4.5 billion years so we are
              > poisoning the planet for a very long time. Do Great Nations poison
              > future generations including the unborn children of their own soldiers?
              > I say No, but the leaders of both political parties continue to kill
              > those who have volunteered to defend their country.
              > Thousands of tons of Depleted Uranium were dropped on Iraq and
              > Afghanistan in order, I believe, to destroy those nations and to set an
              > example to any country that refuses to bow to the joint will of the
              > United States and Israel.
              > So why are we still in Iraq? Does anything about the Iraq war make
              > sense? The occupation is a terror generator and is not a valid part of
              > the alleged war against terror. I believe that the people who killed the
              > military auditors at the Pentagon, and took down World Trade Center
              > Towers 1, 2 and 7 in controlled demolitions wanted us to destroy Iraq
              > and Iran. It is as if the perpetrators of 9-11 had the power to blow and
              > whistle and announce "I want you to begin killing and to keep
              > killing until I blow the whistle again to stop." They have not yet
              > blown the whistle the second time to tell us we can stop killing and
              > dying. Our leaders want these current wars to continue for a reason.
              > As I said in my previous article, I believe that Bush has put 17,500
              > sailors and marines in the Persian Gulf precisely so their ships can be
              > sunk by Iran's Russian made anti-ship missiles after the Israelis strike
              > Iran with American donated bunker busting nuclear weapons. Our
              > self-appointed leaders are willing to sacrifice the lives of 17,500
              > sailors and marines just so they can start World War III. Great nations
              > do not kill whenever the politicians and the media tells incredible
              > lies. Everything we have been told about every war from 1914 to the
              > invasion of Iraq has been a lie. How real were our wars when both sides
              > had the same bankers? The only really true statement we can make about
              > our wars is that we killed tens of millions of people and sacrificed the
              > lives of our soldiers for nothing.
              > The American dollar is on the verge of total collapse. We are obviously
              > being led to World War III at this time because our leaders do not
              > expect America to survive as a sovereign nation for more than a year or
              > two. They have stolen our government. They have sacrificed the lives of
              > those men and women who enlisted in the military mistakenly thinking
              > they are defending their country. Our leaders are insane. They will
              > destroy America and the world.
              > America long ago ceased to be either Good or Great. We have one last
              > chance in the coming year to do something Great as a people. We must
              > reject all of their lies. We must reject all of their wars. We must no
              > longer believe anything we see in their controlled press. We must
              > realize there is no Opposition Party. Both the Democrats and the
              > Republicans are war parties and were long ago bought and paid for by
              > Wall Street and by the Zionists.
              > The Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), the Bilderberg Society and the
              > Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) have announced
              > their plan to form a North American Union (NAU) merging America with
              > Canada and Mexico by 2010. I see no reason why a nation that is neither
              > Good nor Great should not surrender its sovereignty. Of course the
              > citizens of the nation that used to be known as America might object to
              > their new status as serfs on the Global Plantation. I know they will be
              > angry when they discover that the coming hyperinflation will permamently
              > cut their real after tax wages by 50% and their savings by 90%. But I
              > explained that in my prevoius essays.
              > As I said in my last essay, I believe we will soon have martial law. I
              > have since made plans to leave America before it becomes a dictatorship.
              > We have at least a few months left of relative freedom. I am fortunate
              > to have a profession which can be practiced overseas.
              > I was born an American. I was born free. I loved the country I knew as a
              > child. I will always be an American even though the country I loved will
              > soon cease to exist. It is with great sadness that I announce my
              > decision to leave my native land before it dies.
              > I am under no illusions about the nature of the people who think they
              > own our government. They have declared unto themselves the new power of
              > Extraordinary Rendition which means they believe they have the right to
              > kidnap, imprison, torture, and even kill any person anywhere in the
              > world. I want to leave this country not because I am foolish enough to
              > think it will make me safe but because I can no longer justify being
              > part of the Greatest Force for Evil in the twenty-first century.
              >

            • Stephen Hale
              ... opinion? ... is so ... I m not even going to respond to this except to say that opinions aren t worth the time to take time. My nose was up your ass in
              Message 6 of 13 , Feb 4, 2008
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                --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "swirling_dervish"
                <blue_star_in@...> wrote:
                >
                > Opinions are like noses.
                >
                > Everybody has one.
                >
                > You wouldn't live in someone else's nose, so why live in their
                opinion?
                > Just because someone says something, this does not make it so. It
                is so
                > only when it's so inside of you, so check things out.
                >
                > And don't insist that other people live your opinion. Let them do
                > things the way they want.
                >
                > Tra la la

                I'm not even going to respond to this except to say that opinions
                aren't worth the time to take time. My nose was up your ass in
                relation to your dirty life, but no more. Please believe this, as I
                thought it was over. I purposely ignored your odd private e-mails
                to me in hopes that you would finally understand that I meant no
                harm in delving into your pathetic life situation. I thought,
                well.... I just thought, so leave it there alone; and me.

                Steve
              • carol
                Karen: There is noble virtue in unshakable endurance of whatever comes but there is also dignity in the refusal of meaningless torture and humiliation. Once
                Message 7 of 13 , Feb 5, 2008
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                  Karen: "There is noble virtue in unshakable endurance of whatever comes but there is also dignity in the refusal of meaningless torture and humiliation.

                  Once again, that was very 'Rosicrucian' of you. Very nice balancing!

                  Carol.


                  --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "swirling_dervish" <blue_star_in@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > There is noble virtue in unshakable endurance of whatever comes,
                  > but
                  > there is also dignity in the refusal of meaningless torture and
                  > humiliation.
                  >

                • robin wolfe
                  Courage is fear holding on a minute longer. swirling_dervish wrote: As long as you take yourself to
                  Message 8 of 13 , Feb 18, 2008
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                    Courage is fear holding on a minute longer.


                    swirling_dervish <blue_star_in@...> wrote:
                    As long as you take yourself to be a person, a body and a mind,
                    separate from the stream of life, having a will of its own, pursuing
                    its own aims, you are living merely on the surface, and whatever you
                    do will be short-lived and of little value, mere straw to feed the
                    flames of vanity.



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                  • robin wolfe
                    Those who bring sunshine to the lives of others cannot keep it from themselves. Have a blessed day! R ... Hello Dear ! She who expects to change the world will
                    Message 9 of 13 , Feb 19, 2008
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                      Those who bring sunshine to the lives of others cannot keep it from themselves.

                      Have a blessed day!
                      R

                      swirling_dervish <kosmicdance@...> wrote:

                      >
                      > Courage is fear holding on a minute longer.

                      Hello Dear !

                      She who expects to change the world will be disappointed,
                      she must change her view.
                      When this is done,
                      then tolerance will come,
                      forgiveness will come,
                      and there will be nothing she cannot bear.
                      Mmmm..

                      Now what shall I do next? This is the question. I was just about to
                      pack my toys and go but then Mr Holderlin66 reappeared with a jelly
                      fish tale.

                      Mmmm.. So I can't say I have come up with anything so far that I may
                      be able to impress him with. So I shall write to you instead.

                      At least he makes me think whereas with the mr hale I feel he thinks
                      he's worked everything out and he's just here to tell all us useless
                      slobs what its all about.

                      Mmmm..
                      Well he can go and suck an egg as far as I am concerned.

                      :)

                      Yes..

                      She who expects to change the world will be disappointed,
                      she must change her view.
                      When this is done,
                      then tolerance will come,
                      forgiveness will come,
                      and there will be nothing she cannot bear.

                      Even mr hale.



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                    • robin wolfe
                      It is the enemy who can truly teach us to practice the virtues of compassion and tolerance. -The Dalai LamaI aykaamayee wrote:
                      Message 10 of 13 , Feb 25, 2008
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                        It is the enemy who can truly teach us to practice the virtues of compassion and tolerance.


                        -The Dalai LamaI

                        aykaamayee <anunda-@...> wrote:
                        Words do not teach.

                        True knowing comes from life experience.

                        We offer these words, that they might stimulate your thinking.

                        Truly, a teacher is a stimulator of thought.
                        ****

                        Perception is a programme.

                        There are no true ideas.

                        As you believe so it is...


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