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Fwd: Re: Marie Steiner's Negro Dances

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  • tmasthenes13
    ... wrote: Tarjei, I m quite baffled by your negative reaction to Michael Howell s posting about the Nigerian man who agrees with Dr. James
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 28, 2007
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      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13"
      <TomBuoyed@...> wrote:

      Tarjei,

      I'm quite baffled by your negative reaction to Michael Howell's
      posting about the Nigerian man who agrees with Dr. James Watson about
      the failures of his own Negro race (Mercury people) compared to the
      white race (Jupiter people) and the Asians (Mars people).

      If Rudolf Steiner were alive today, I've sure he would agree with the
      Nigerian on the social level, so I see the posting as very relevant
      and in line with the topics of discussion here. Just as Watson's
      racial views in the social arena do not diminish his genius
      achievements in science, so do Steiner's racial views not diminish his
      philosophical and spiritual science achievements. What's the big deal
      about their racist thinking?

      Maybe it's because own racial ideology was formed long before I
      discovered Steiner. In my early life, it was developed by my being a
      devout Irish Roman Catholic growing up in the tenements of NYC. But
      then, when I studied physics at an engineering college, I was exposed
      to the geek form of racism, which is exactly the form I recognize in
      Watson, as a natural, even innocent expression of his geeky, Aspergian
      3-parts xenophobia and 1-part paranoia. It's not an overt hatred of
      blacks; it's more an intrinsic fear of them.

      When I came to Steiner, the racism part was never an issue for me
      precisely because the level of racist ideology I encountered among
      anthroposophists was equal to the level I brought with me. In physics,
      we call it "Sympathetic Vibratory Resonance."

      Anyway, Micahel Howell's posting was quite synchronous with my
      decision to post the following passage from Marie Steiner.

      So let's leave Rudolf alone for awhile and look at what his wife said
      about the racial issue. Somehow, these passages of Marie, written in
      1927 resonate very well with the Nigerian man's article that Michael
      Howell posted.

      I urge people to read them both side by side.


      What I am going to quote below is a page from the foreword written by
      Marie Steiner to her husband's lecture cycle "Eurythmy as Visible
      Speech." The edition I have is the 2nd edition, published in 1944. I
      haven't seen any modern editions, so it would be interesting to see
      how much, if not all of Marie's words would be redacted or deleted today.


      Marie is writing this introduction to the eurythmy lectures of 1924 in
      November 1927. She is in England but she refers a lot to the
      performing arts in Paris. In the lead up to the section I quote, she
      talks about the modern technology (of 1927) as mechanizing art and
      human culture, citing as examples the "shrill sound of the wireless"
      the "rasping sounds of the gramophone," the "whirring of the film."

      [She has a point. We mechanize so much better today!!! No more
      shrilling, rasping or whirring, unless intended]

      She then proceeds to tear into modern music and then reports on her
      shock at seeing the sexy legs of actresses exposed and flaunted on
      stage. But that she says, is only "lack of beauty."

      Now I begin the quote (from pages vi and vii of the Foreword)


      =========================================================
      . . . What is still worse is that the very speech and gesture has been
      affected by this mechanical, noisy music, which rattles from all the
      gramophones, from the wireless, from the pianolas, and which even in
      many of the best London theatres has taken the place of the orchestra.
      They carry on their ceaseless noise during the intervals, drumming
      their hard sounds into the head and deadening the consciousness of the
      ego.

      When, at the end of a performance the conventional phrase of `God save
      the King' is played and the audience rises to its feet, without the
      slightest pause the music falls into some wild jazz. Where is the need
      of breathing space or a moment's consideration?—the machine needs no
      such thing. But the lack of any transition between two contrasted
      moods has a stultifying effect upon the soul.

      Young girls enter the stage, or drawing-room, even in Paris, with that
      rolling movement of hips and shoulders which negro dances have made
      second nature.

      They themselves do not notice this eternal rolling movement of the
      limbs: the effect is almost that of a wound-up doll, or of hypnosis.
      In woods, on the sea-shore, everywhere one is horrified by the sound
      of the gramophone and the sight of partners indulging in this sliding,
      rolling motion.

      Dancing, which seemed to be dying out when the decorative elegant
      French dances lost their charm, when even the waltz and the polka had
      failed to interest, has come to life again in the crude and primitive
      form of imitated negro dances.

      `We like the rhythm' several girls replied, when I inquired what was
      so fascinating about these dances.—But this rhythm is in reality no
      rhythm. It is anti-rhythmic, it is an earth force which whirls
      upwards, an overemphasized or furtive and indistinct beat, an
      increased blood pulsation coupled with lowered consciousness.

      One only needs to look at the figures of the dancers, with their
      vacant, expressionless faces, to be convinced that this is
      so,—especially so with the men, who now, young and old alike, have
      suddenly developed a passion for dancing. These dances appeal to the
      lower instincts, and for this reason they have as adherents even the
      most blasé, and those whose souls have become lifeless and barren.

      But that which was merely animal nature in the case of the negro has
      with us become mechanical.

      The demons of machinery here find means of access; they gain a hold on
      the human being through his movement, through his vitality. They do
      not only influence his brain, but enter into this externalizing of
      that which should remain as inner mood of the soul. The mechanical
      musical instruments exercise their powerful, soul- deadening forces,
      doing away with all atmosphere and feeling. And this non-rhythmic,
      mechanical element is even reflected in the manner of speech of modern
      actors on the stage. . . .

      ==========================================================

      Rock'n'Roll anyone? Hip-hop Gangsta rap? What would Marie and Rudolf
      say about today's music?

      Does anyone else find a supreme irony here in that the most recent
      biographer of Rudolf Steiner was just elected to the Rock'n'Roll Hall
      of Fame in Cleveland?

      And in the context of our racial discussion, that his group's name is:
      Blondie?

      (Not Blackie, or Brownie, or even Whitey, but Blondie!!!)

      Nobody could make this stuff up! Even in Hollywood, right Dottie?

      Dottie, would you have this "negro dance" with me?

      Tom

      ====================

      --- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com, "elfuncle"
      <hisholiness@> wrote:
      >
      > It appears to me, Mr. Howell, that while considering yourself an
      > anthroposophist (I assume), your posting of this article to this
      > particular Yahoo Group, especially under the present circumstances and
      > the propaganda warfare wielded by PLANS and the WC, which you're very
      > familiar with, you are hereby revealing a total lack of social
      > intelligence in addition to extremely poor taste -- in my humble
      opinion.
      >
      > I recognize that Mr. Dugan has sentenced you to a week on the bench
      > for *repeatedly* violating his rule against off-topic posts (another
      > indication that you lack intelligence imho), but I suggest you return
      > to the Abyss where the absence of certain faculties is commonplace,
      > where you can continue to convince Peter S and others that
      > anthroposophists are indeed racists.
      >
      > In other words, Mr Howell: You're an idiot.
      >
      > In love and light and warmth and lots of honey,
      >
      > Tarjei
      ===========================================
      >

      --- End forwarded message ---
    • Valerie Walsh
      ... Dear Tom, Since you didn t place Rock and Roll or Hip Hop in quotes I wonder if you do not think that Negro Dance is a recognized dance form or perhaps
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 28, 2007
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        --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@...>
        wrote:


        > Rock'n'Roll anyone? Hip-hop Gangsta rap? What would Marie and Rudolf
        > say about today's music?

        > Dottie, would you have this "negro dance" with me?

        Dear Tom,

        Since you didn't place Rock and Roll or Hip Hop in quotes I wonder if
        you do not think that Negro Dance is a recognized dance form or perhaps
        should not be recognized as such. I assume that you are
        offering/soliciting an imitation/approximation of the real thing
        thereby necessitating quotes.-Val
      • tmasthenes13
        ... ============================================== Hi Val, No, I am merely quoting the exact phrase from the Marie Steiner excerpt. Tom
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 28, 2007
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          --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Valerie Walsh" <wdenval@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@>
          > wrote:
          >
          >
          > > Rock'n'Roll anyone? Hip-hop Gangsta rap? What would Marie and Rudolf
          > > say about today's music?
          >
          > > Dottie, would you have this "negro dance" with me?
          >
          > Dear Tom,
          >
          > Since you didn't place Rock and Roll or Hip Hop in quotes I wonder if
          > you do not think that Negro Dance is a recognized dance form or perhaps
          > should not be recognized as such. I assume that you are
          > offering/soliciting an imitation/approximation of the real thing
          > thereby necessitating quotes.-Val
          ==============================================

          Hi Val,

          No, I am merely quoting the exact phrase from the Marie Steiner excerpt.

          Tom
        • isenhart7
          ... said ... Dear Tom, I consider this prompting of yours to be incredibly un-PC of you as that would require the cutting down of about ten billion trees. ...
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 29, 2007
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            --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@...>
            wrote:

            > So let's leave Rudolf alone for awhile and look at what his wife
            said
            > about the racial issue. Somehow, these passages of Marie, written in
            > 1927 resonate very well with the Nigerian man's article that Michael
            > Howell posted.
            >
            > I urge people to read them both side by side.

            Dear Tom,

            I consider this prompting of yours to be incredibly un-PC of you as
            that would require the cutting down of about ten billion trees.

            > =========================================================


            Idang Alibi, Daily Trust (Abuja, Nigeria), October 25, 2007:

            A few days ago, the Nobel Laureate, Dr James Watson, made a remark
            that is now generating worldwide uproar, especially among the blacks.

            Marie Steiner, in 1927:

            > . . . What is still worse is that the very speech and gesture has
            been
            > affected by this mechanical, noisy music,

            He said what to me looks like a self-evident truth. He told The
            Sunday Times of London in an interview that in his humble opinion,
            black people are less intelligent than the White people.

            >which rattles from all the
            > gramophones, from the wireless, from the pianolas, and which even in
            > many of the best London theatres has taken the place of the
            orchestra.

            Since then, some of us cannot hear anything else but the outrage of
            black people who feel demeaned by what Watson has said.

            > They carry on their ceaseless noise during the intervals, drumming
            > their hard sounds into the head and deadening the consciousness of
            the
            > ego.

            So many people have called the man names. To be expected, some have
            said he is a racist.

            > When, at the end of a performance the conventional phrase of `God
            save
            > the King' is played and the audience rises to its feet, without the
            > slightest pause the music falls into some wild jazz.

            Some even wonder how a "foolish" man like Watson could have won the
            Nobel Prize. Even white people who, deep in their heart, agree with
            Watson want to be politically correct so they condemn the man.

            >Where is the need
            > of breathing space or a moment's consideration?—the machine needs no
            > such thing. But the lack of any transition between two contrasted
            > moods has a stultifying effect upon the soul.

            Why are we blacks becoming so reactive, so sensitive to any remarks,
            no matter how well-meaning, about our failure as a race?

            >
            > Young girls enter the stage, or drawing-room,

            Why are we becoming like the Jews who see every accusation as a
            manifestation of anti-Semitism?

            >even in Paris,

            I do not know what constitutes intelligence. I leave that to our so-
            called scholars. But I do know that in terms of organising society
            for the benefit of the people living in it, we blacks have not shown
            any intelligence in that direction at all. I am so ashamed of this
            and sometimes feel that I ought to have belonged to another race.


            > with that rolling movement of hips and shoulders which negro dances
            have made
            > second nature.

            Nigeria my dear country is a prime example of the inferiority of the
            black race when compared to other races. Let somebody please tell me
            whether it is a manifestation of intelligence if a people cannot
            organise a free, fair and credible election to choose who will lead
            them.

            > They themselves do not notice this eternal rolling movement of the
            > limbs:

            Is it intelligence that we cannot provide simple pipe-borne water for
            the people? Our public school system has virtually collapsed. Is that
            a sign of intelligence? Our roads are impassable. In spite of the
            numerous sources that nature has made available to us to tap for
            energy to run our industries and homes, we have no steady supply of
            electricity. Yet electricity is the bedrock of industrialisation.

            >the effect is almost that of a wound-up doll, or of hypnosis.
            > In woods, on the sea-shore, everywhere one is horrified

            When you agree with the school of Watson, some say you are incorrect
            because all these failures are a result of poor leadership. Why must
            it be us blacks who must always suffer poor leadership? Is that not a
            manifestation of unintelligence?

            by the sound
            > of the gramophone and the sight of partners indulging in this
            sliding,
            > rolling motion.

            In the name of international trade, bilateral co-operation,
            globalisation and other subterfuges, the norm in the world today is
            for smart people to appropriate the wealth of other people for
            themselves and their countries.

            > Dancing, which seemed to be dying out when the decorative elegant
            > French dances lost their charm, when even the waltz and the polka
            had
            > failed to interest,

            But more among the blacks than any other race, the practice is to
            steal from their own country and salt away to other people's country.
            Is it intelligence that our leaders steal billions of naira and hide
            in other people's country?

            has come to life again in the crude and primitive
            > form of imitated negro dances.

            Anywhere in the world today where you have a concentration of black
            people among other races, the poorest, the least educated, the least
            achieving, and the most violent group among those races will be the
            blacks.

            > `We like the rhythm' several girls replied, when I inquired what was
            > so fascinating about these dances

            When indices of underdevelopment are given, black people and
            countries are sure to occupy the bottom of the ladder. If we are
            intelligent, why do we not carry first when statistics of development
            are given?

            >—But this rhythm is in reality no
            > rhythm.

            Look at the African continent. South Africa is the most developed
            country because of the presence of whites there. This may be an
            uncomfortable truth for many of us but it exists nevertheless. If the
            whites had been driven away after independence, we would have seen a
            steady decline of that country.

            >It is anti-rhythmic,

            In terms of natural endowment, Africa ought to be the richest of the
            continents but see the mess we have made of the potential for
            greatness which God in his infinite wisdom has bestowed upon us. We
            have proved totally incapable of harnessing the abundant natural
            resources to become great. Today, there is a renewed scramble for the
            wealth of Africa. China, our new "friend", does not bother about the
            genocide against fellow blacks in the Sudan by the Arabs who control
            the affairs of that country. They say they do not want to interfere
            in the internal affairs of any country. All they want is the oil in
            Sudan to run their industries. Yet, we blacks have not seen the
            Chinese action as an affront to our sensitivities. Every race takes
            us for granted because we are so weak and so foolish, if you permit
            me to say it.

            >it is an earth force which whirls
            > upwards, an overemphasized or furtive and indistinct beat, an
            > increased blood pulsation coupled with lowered consciousness.

            I am really pained by our gross underachievement as a race. Instead
            of regarding bitter truths expressed by the likes of Watson as a wake-
            up call for us to engage in sober reflection, we take to the
            expression of woolly sentiment.

            > One only needs to look at the figures of the dancers, with their
            > vacant, expressionless faces, to be convinced that this is
            > so

            For me, this type of reaction is a further evidence of our
            unintelligence. A man of intelligence recognises genuine criticism
            against him and takes steps to improve himself in order to prove his
            critics wrong. But for us blacks, our reaction is to abuse the man
            who expresses worries about our backwardness.

            >—especially so with the men, who now, young and old alike, have
            > suddenly developed a passion for dancing.

            Other races are deeply worried about us because we are a problem to
            the world. We suffer from the five Ds: disorderliness, debts,
            diseases, deaths and disasters. Our disorderliness affects others or
            else they won't be too bothered about us. Many are afraid because our
            diseases could infect them. Polio has been eradicated all over the
            world yet it is still found in Nigeria here. When they give us money
            to help us eradicate it, our thieving officials will embezzle the
            money; the virus will spread and endanger the health of not only our
            people but other people as well.

            These dances appeal to the
            > lower instincts,

            Out of a shared sense of humanity, some cannot bear to see how we die
            in thousands almost every day from clearly preventable diseases and
            causes. For years now, our people die extremely painful but perfectly
            preventable deaths from buildings which collapse because they were
            poorly constructed. How can you tell me we are as intelligent as
            others when we set traps for ourselves in the name of houses and
            others do not do so? Some people are extremely frustrated about us.
            If they have a way of avoiding us, they will be too glad to do so
            because we are a problem.

            >and for this reason they have as adherents even the
            > most blasé, and those whose souls have become lifeless and barren.

            As I write this, I do so with great pains in my heart because I know
            that God has given intelligence in equal measure to all his children
            irrespective of the colour of their skin. The problem with us black
            people is that we have refused to use our intelligence to organise
            ourselves socially and politically.

            >
            > But that which was merely animal nature in the case of the negro has
            > with us become mechanical.

            It should worry us that we do not invent things. We do not go to the
            moon. Our societies are not well-organised. We have the shortest
            lifespan of all the races. Something must be wrong with us. Why are
            we not like others? Our scholars will be quick to say that these are
            not the only ways of measuring intelligence. They will quote other
            scholars to adumbrate their point, but the fact remains that we are
            not showing intelligence. Others are showing it more than we're
            doing. If they are not more intelligent than we are, let someone tell
            me how to put it. God himself must be frustrated with his black
            children. They must be an embarrassment to him. He has given us
            everything he has given to other of his children; why are his black
            children not manifesting their own gift?

            > The demons of machinery here find means of access; they gain a hold
            on
            > the human being through his movement, through his vitality.

            A few years ago, the whites used to contemptuously call the
            Japanese "little Japs". Today, the Japanese and other Asians have
            pulled themselves up by the bootstrap and have arrived. No one speaks
            of the Japanese or Asians with contempt anymore. When people like
            Watson speak about us in unedifying terms, we should take it as a
            challenge to prove them wrong by sitting down to plan how we can
            become world-beaters.

            They do
            > not only influence his brain, but enter into this externalizing of
            > that which should remain as inner mood of the soul.

            If our political leaders are the reason for our backwardness, we
            should resolve to get the kind of leaders who will be instrument for
            our rapid progress. I may not know how intelligence is measured but
            my limited knowledge of intelligence is that it can also be measured
            by the kind of leaders a people decide to have. If, for instance, our
            professors preside over the massive rigging of elections, it means
            that we do not have very intelligent professors. Such rigged
            elections will no doubt produce unintelligent leaders. Such
            unintelligent leaders will do stupid things which will prove that we
            are not as intelligent as other races. Do I sound confusing or
            intelligent?

            The mechanical
            > musical instruments exercise their powerful, soul- deadening forces,
            > doing away with all atmosphere and feeling.

            I am ready for some of our `patriotic' intellectuals who will write
            and abuse me for the `outrage' I have expressed here but I stick to
            my guns: we lack intelligence and as stated in the Bible, anyone who
            lacks intelligence should cry unto God who is the custodian of wisdom
            to bestow some upon him. We should go on our knees today and ask God
            why we do not appear as intelligent as our other brothers. I am
            confident God will reveal to us what we must do, and urgently too, to
            change our terribly unflattering circumstances.

            And this non-rhythmic,
            > mechanical element is even reflected in the manner of speech of
            modern
            > actors on the stage. . . .
          • isenhart7
            ... the ... his ... deal ... Dear Tom, I am apparently working through this post backwards. I would argue that thinking is a process and a view is a perception
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 29, 2007
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              --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@...>
              wrote:

              > If Rudolf Steiner were alive today, I've sure he would agree with
              the
              > Nigerian on the social level, so I see the posting as very relevant
              > and in line with the topics of discussion here. Just as Watson's
              > racial views in the social arena do not diminish his genius
              > achievements in science, so do Steiner's racial views not diminish
              his
              > philosophical and spiritual science achievements. What's the big
              deal
              > about their racist thinking?

              Dear Tom,

              I am apparently working through this post backwards. I would argue
              that thinking is a process and a view is a perception or perhaps a
              conclusion. I believe Watson referred to his statement as an opinion.
              If it is true, as you say, that Watson's racial views in the social
              area do not diminish his genius achievements in science is it also
              true that Watson's genius achievements in science do not provide him
              credibility in the social arena?-Val
            • isenhart7
              ... Hall ... Tom, I think it just goes to show you how prescient those early Anthroposophists really were. It s quite sobering, really. ... Rudolf ... The
              Message 6 of 7 , Nov 1, 2007
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                > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@>
                > wrote:

                > Does anyone else find a supreme irony here in that the most recent
                > biographer of Rudolf Steiner was just elected to the Rock'n'Roll
                Hall
                > of Fame in Cleveland?
                >
                > And in the context of our racial discussion, that his group's name
                is:
                > Blondie?

                Tom, I think it just goes to show you how prescient those early
                Anthroposophists really were. It's quite sobering, really.

                > Rock'n'Roll anyone? Hip-hop Gangsta rap? What would Marie and
                Rudolf
                > say about today's music?

                The underlying question, it seems to me, is are they sympatico with
                the Blues or not? Seems to me from what Marie divulges here that she,
                at least, was asking the question "Who put the Hot in Hottentot" or
                was it "What makes the Hottentot so Hot," I forgot. But hey, she was
                wondering long before Hollywood ever set her question to music. Which
                brings me to, of course, who do you envision playing Marie Steiner in
                the upcoming film?-Val

                . . . What is still worse is that the very speech and gesture has been
                affected by this mechanical, noisy music, which rattles from all the
                gramophones, from the wireless, from the pianolas, and which even in
                many of the best London theatres has taken the place of the orchestra.

                (Well if I had money
                Tell you what I'd do
                I'd go downtown)

                They carry on their ceaseless noise during the intervals, drumming
                their hard sounds into the head and deadening the consciousness of
                the ego. When, at the end of a performance the conventional phrase of
                `God save the King' is played and the audience rises to its feet,
                without the slightest pause the music falls into some wild jazz.
                Where is the need of breathing space or a moment's consideration?—the
                machine needs no such thing. But the lack of any transition between
                two contrasted moods has a stultifying effect upon the soul.

                (and buy a mercury or two)

                Young girls enter the stage, or drawing-room, even in Paris, with that
                rolling movement of hips and shoulders which negro dances have made
                second nature.

                (Crazy bout a mercury
                Lord I'm crazy bout a mercury)

                They themselves do not notice this eternal rolling movement of the
                limbs: the effect is almost that of a wound-up doll, or of hypnosis.
                In woods, on the sea-shore, everywhere one is horrified by the sound
                of the gramophone and the sight of partners indulging in this sliding,
                rolling motion.

                (I'm gonna buy me a mercury
                And cruise it up and down the road)

                Dancing, which seemed to be dying out when the decorative elegant
                French dances lost their charm, when even the waltz and the polka had
                failed to interest,

                (Well the girl I love
                I stole her from a friend)

                has come to life again in the crude and primitive
                form of imitated negro dances.

                (He got lucky, stole her back again)

                `We like the rhythm' several girls replied, when I inquired what was
                so fascinating about these dances.

                (She heard he had a mercury
                Lord she's crazy bout a mercury
                I'm gonna buy me a mercury
                And cruise it up and down the road)

                —But this rhythm is in reality no
                rhythm. It is anti-rhythmic, it is an earth force which whirls
                upwards, an overemphasized or furtive and indistinct beat, an
                increased blood pulsation coupled with lowered consciousness.

                (Well hey now mama
                You look so fine
                Ridin round in your mercury 49
                Crazy bout a mercury
                Lord I'm crazy bout a mercury
                I'm gonna buy me a mercury
                And cruise it up and down the road)

                One only needs to look at the figures of the dancers, with their
                vacant, expressionless faces, to be convinced that this is
                so

                (Well my baby went out
                She didn't stay long)

                ,—especially so with the men, who now, young and old alike, have
                suddenly developed a passion for dancing. These dances appeal to the
                lower instincts, and for this reason they have as adherents even the
                most blasé, and those whose souls have become lifeless and barren.

                (Bought herself a mercury, come a cruisin home)

                But that which was merely animal nature in the case of the negro has
                with us become mechanical.

                (She's crazy bout a mercury
                Yeah she's crazy bout a mercury)

                The demons of machinery here find means of access; they gain a hold on
                the human being through his movement, through his vitality. They do
                not only influence his brain, but enter into this externalizing of
                that which should remain as inner mood of the soul.

                (And cruise it up and down the road)

                The mechanical musical instruments exercise their powerful, soul-
                deadening forces,doing away with all atmosphere and feeling. And this
                non-rhythmic,mechanical element is even reflected in the manner of
                speech of modern actors on the stage. . . .

                (And cruise it up and down the road)
              • isenhart7
                ... Because, after all, who doesn t resonate with Rock and Roll and Hip Hop Gansta Rap?-Val Its ya boy lil flip We just had a tragedy april 16 monday 715 am So
                Message 7 of 7 , Nov 1, 2007
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                  --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "isenhart7" <isenhart7@...>
                  wrote:

                  > The underlying question, it seems to me, is are they sympatico with
                  > the Blues or not?

                  Because, after all, who doesn't resonate with Rock and Roll and Hip
                  Hop Gansta Rap?-Val

                  Its ya boy lil flip We just had a tragedy april 16 monday 715 am So i
                  thought it would be selfish no to speak on it So everybody who lost
                  somebody at virginia tech on monday you can play this to help you get
                  by (yeah) If you're lost you can look--and you will find me (you can
                  find me) Time after time (time after time we go through stuff like
                  this) If you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting (we keeping yall
                  in our prayers) Time after time (chyeah) If you're lost you can look--
                  and you will find me (rest in peace to everybody) Time after time If
                  you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting (we burning candles) Time
                  after time Imagine waking up for class And not knowing what about to
                  happen to you This is coming from the heart Flip aint just rapping to
                  ya See I did been in situations like this And it make you wonder
                  where Jesus Christ is People die before they got a chance to graduate
                  Is it me or did the police react rather late Too many shot too many
                  guns too many war stories And I saw people just out of windows four
                  stories Imagine how the parents felt when they got the news
                  Especially when they couldnt even tell who was who So we pray for
                  each one of yall who lost a child And that brave man who excaped the
                  Holacaust I heard the news They said they had chains on the doors
                  Then later on they interveiwing at the gun store Then later on they
                  let the classmates talk about him But his screen play should have let
                  you know he had a problem If you're lost you can look--and you will
                  find me (rest in peace) Time after time (its ya boy flip gates) If
                  you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting (i got your back) Time
                  after time (yeah) If you're lost you can look--and you will find me
                  (we praying for all the families) Time after time (I got a white
                  candle lit right now) If you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting
                  (yeah) Time after time (rest in peace) We fighting war over there but
                  we got wars over here I aint gonna lie i got shot But your boy still
                  here Now my vision clear And everybody aint your friend Would you
                  want to know if you could see how your life would end And i dont know
                  nobody at the school But im a human too And if you care about others
                  Thats what humans do And even though my album out I can take the time
                  to greive Cause if i had a tragedy I hope you would do the same for
                  me So if you see me in the streets show your boy some love Im a
                  millionaire but im a educated thug And to the people aint been to
                  virginia yet When you come make sure you think about Virginia Tech We
                  lost alot of good people on the bad day And i know how it feel cause
                  my cousins past away So next time you feeling down about your
                  situation Just take this Lil Flip record to your local station If
                  you're lost you can look--and you will find me (we prayin for
                  everybody) Time after time (time after time) If you fall I will catch
                  you--I'll be waiting (yeahh) Time after time (Your boy lil Flip got
                  your back) If you're lost you can look--and you will find me (they
                  can hate on me all they want) Time after time (How many artists are
                  gonna take the time out to do this?) If you fall I will catch you--
                  I'll be waiting (I live in the studio) Time after time (Yeah) We
                  dedicate this to everybody who lost somebody they love Bother,
                  Sister, uncle, Nephew,husband, wife,son daughter, aunt, uncle,
                  grandfather, grandmother, everybody on September 11th, everybody at
                  Virginia Tech Everybody man Its your boy Flip gangster, your number
                  one fly boy Aye This how I do it baby I live in the studio This worth
                  nothing This is how I do it man Houston in the building man Holla at
                  your boy Rest in peace to everybody who lost their life at Virginia
                  Tech Im out If you're lost you can look--and you will find me Time
                  after time If you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting Time after
                  time If you're lost you can look--and you will find me Time after
                  time If you fall I will catch you--I'll be waiting Time after time
                  Time after time
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