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Judith von halle and Edith Maryon

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  • tmasthenes13
    =============================================================== Late Breaking News from Father Tom s Stigmata News Service (SNS)
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 11, 2007
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      ===============================================================
      Late Breaking News from Father Tom's Stigmata News Service (SNS)
      ===============================================================

      September 11, 2007

      A native German subscriber to the medtarot Yahoo group (Meditations of
      the Tarot), hereinafter identified as S., posted today that Judith von
      Halle claims to be the reincarnation of Edith Maryon, the sculptor who
      guided Rudolf Steiner to create the wooden statue of the
      Representative of Man.

      Details are written in a book, not yet translated into German,
      entitled: "Das Christliche aus dem Holz herausschlagen: Rudolf
      Steiner, Edith Maryon und die Christus-Plastik"

      ("Christ Hewn out of Wood: Rudolf Steiner, Edith Maryon and the Christ
      Sculpture"

      The book is published by the Goetheanum this year, so apparently
      Judith is more accepted in Dornach than she is in Berlin. Furthermore,
      she spoke at a conference on the Representative of Man sculpture at
      the Goetheanum back in February, so she can't be as much of a
      divisive heretic to the Dornach Vorstand as she is to the German Vorstand.

      S. spoke of the great confusion in the Berlin Society caused by Judith
      and her Stigmata. He states that she possesses great original esoteric
      insights, but that she also feels forced to defend herself against the
      Pharisee-like Anthropsophists who judge her gift as atavistic and
      therefore evil. The result is that she uses somewhat formulaic
      concepts in writing that strike S. as "schematic and clumsy." He
      wonders if she felt forced to defend herself in this way so that she
      could answer the charge that she is not a thinking person because of
      the Stigmata.

      S. ended his message with a report of a fascinating discussion among
      his spiritual and clairvoyant friends: whether Judith von Halle in
      her life as Edith Maryon was "forced" in some way to work on the
      sculpture with Rudolf Steiner. And that now in this life as Judith,
      she was equally "forced" to receive the Stigmata as either a karmic
      compensation (punishment) or a karmic reward for her work on the statue.

      ====================================================
    • carol
      I beleive it was in Letters, Documents and After-Death Communications - Rudolf Steiner s association with Helmuth and Eliz von Moltke- (Light For The
      Message 2 of 17 , Sep 11, 2007
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        I beleive it was in 'Letters, Documents and After-Death Communications'-
        Rudolf Steiner's association with Helmuth and Eliz von Moltke- (Light
        For The Millennium) that reference is made to the work needed to be
        done at the end of the Millennium. All to do with the projected
        Ahrimanic incarnation.

        I find the discussion below somewhat superficial, somewhat self
        absorbed in 'the Society's ' communal, institutional life.

        Who is anyone to call what afflicts her 'atavistic'? Is the phenomena
        of Star Children atavist? Was Francis d'Assis atavistic because he
        related to animals? Was Jesus atavistic because he offered his ego over
        to the Christic Spirit Being? Was Rudolf Steiner atavistic because he
        allowed himself to be summoned to action by 'visiting spirit beings'?

        When extra ordinary spirit phenomena are made manifest, one should
        preferably look up to the Devachanic realms to find out why they are
        occuring.

        I remember reading in Crisis in Civilization by Bondarev that he thought
        that if Rudolf Steiner were to present himself incarnated on this day,
        he would be ridiculed by the Anthroposophic Society.

        I think what's important is to be attentive to cues given by the person
        in question, in this case Judith. In all that she says, she should
        reveal somewhat of a base structure to her 'chosen' status. A spiritual
        base structure which fits into what else is occuring out of spirit.

        If she isn't quite able to define it, clever Anthros with strong
        intuitive capabilities may be able to.








        --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "tmasthenes13" <TomBuoyed@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > ===============================================================
        > Late Breaking News from Father Tom's Stigmata News Service (SNS)
        > ===============================================================
        >
        > September 11, 2007
        >
        > A native German subscriber to the medtarot Yahoo group (Meditations of
        > the Tarot), hereinafter identified as S., posted today that Judith von
        > Halle claims to be the reincarnation of Edith Maryon, the sculptor who
        > guided Rudolf Steiner to create the wooden statue of the
        > Representative of Man.
        >
        > Details are written in a book, not yet translated into German,
        > entitled: "Das Christliche aus dem Holz herausschlagen: Rudolf
        > Steiner, Edith Maryon und die Christus-Plastik"
        >
        > ("Christ Hewn out of Wood: Rudolf Steiner, Edith Maryon and the Christ
        > Sculpture"
        >
        > The book is published by the Goetheanum this year, so apparently
        > Judith is more accepted in Dornach than she is in Berlin. Furthermore,
        > she spoke at a conference on the Representative of Man sculpture at
        > the Goetheanum back in February, so she can't be as much of a
        > divisive heretic to the Dornach Vorstand as she is to the German
        Vorstand.
        >
        > S. spoke of the great confusion in the Berlin Society caused by Judith
        > and her Stigmata. He states that she possesses great original esoteric
        > insights, but that she also feels forced to defend herself against the
        > Pharisee-like Anthropsophists who judge her gift as atavistic and
        > therefore evil. The result is that she uses somewhat formulaic
        > concepts in writing that strike S. as "schematic and clumsy." He
        > wonders if she felt forced to defend herself in this way so that she
        > could answer the charge that she is not a thinking person because of
        > the Stigmata.
        >
        > S. ended his message with a report of a fascinating discussion among
        > his spiritual and clairvoyant friends: whether Judith von Halle in
        > her life as Edith Maryon was "forced" in some way to work on the
        > sculpture with Rudolf Steiner. And that now in this life as Judith,
        > she was equally "forced" to receive the Stigmata as either a karmic
        > compensation (punishment) or a karmic reward for her work on the
        statue.
        >
        > ====================================================
        >
      • Stephen Hale
        ... Communications - ... (Light ... be ... Maybe that was one of the reasons why Steiner at the CC of 1923 conducted an initiation of the members. ...
        Message 3 of 17 , Sep 11, 2007
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          --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@...>
          wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > I beleive it was in 'Letters, Documents and After-Death
          Communications'-
          > Rudolf Steiner's association with Helmuth and Eliz von Moltke-
          (Light
          > For The Millennium) that reference is made to the work needed to
          be
          > done at the end of the Millennium. All to do with the projected
          > Ahrimanic incarnation.

          Maybe that was one of the reasons why Steiner at the CC of 1923
          conducted an initiation of the members.
          >
          > I find the discussion below somewhat superficial, somewhat self
          > absorbed in 'the Society's ' communal, institutional life.
          >
          > Who is anyone to call what afflicts her 'atavistic'? Is the
          phenomena
          > of Star Children atavist? Was Francis d'Assis atavistic because he
          > related to animals? Was Jesus atavistic because he offered his
          ego over
          > to the Christic Spirit Being? Was Rudolf Steiner atavistic
          because he
          > allowed himself to be summoned to action by 'visiting spirit
          beings'?

          It sounds like some people understand the implications of atavism as
          it relates to the Eighth Sphere, doesn't it?
          >
          > When extra ordinary spirit phenomena are made manifest, one should
          > preferably look up to the Devachanic realms to find out why they
          are
          > occuring.

          I find that the dialogue is even closer than that.
          >
          > I remember reading in Crisis in Civilization by Bondarev that he
          thought
          > that if Rudolf Steiner were to present himself incarnated on this
          day,
          > he would be ridiculed by the Anthroposophic Society.

          The same has been said for the physical return of Christ.
          >
          > I think what's important is to be attentive to cues given by the
          person
          > in question, in this case Judith. In all that she says, she
          should
          > reveal somewhat of a base structure to her 'chosen' status. A
          spiritual
          > base structure which fits into what else is occuring out of spirit.

          I believe that it is true. More now than two days ago.
          >
          > If she isn't quite able to define it, clever Anthros with strong
          > intuitive capabilities may be able to.

          I trust that true intuition is rather absent the cleverness.
        • Stephen Hale
          ... One of my considerations from the outset in this matter concerns why Peter Tradowsky wanted to absolve the center there in Berlin from the national
          Message 4 of 17 , Sep 11, 2007
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            --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@>
            > wrote:
            > > I find the discussion below somewhat superficial, somewhat self
            > > absorbed in 'the Society's ' communal, institutional life.

            One of my considerations from the outset in this matter concerns why
            Peter Tradowsky wanted to absolve the center there in Berlin from the
            national anthroposophic body. Does anyone know why this independence
            was sought?

            Another consideration is this: What if the center there in Berlin had
            wanted to remain securely within the scope and purpose of the main body
            in Germany, and even Dornach? Would Judith von Halle have had her
            stigmata experience anyway? And if she did, under these perfect
            conditions of normalcy, what would the reaction have been then?
          • holderlin66
            http://www.freie-vereinigung.de/buecher.html Judith von Halle was born in Berlin in 1972. She attended school in
            Message 5 of 17 , Sep 11, 2007
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              http://www.freie-vereinigung.de/buecher.html


              Judith von Halle was born in Berlin in 1972. She attended school in Germany and the U.S. and studied architecture, graduating in 1998. She encountered Anthroposophy in 1997 and began working as a staff member at Rudolf Steiner House in Berlin, where she also lectured from 2001, whole maintaining an architectural practice. In 2004, her life was transformed when she received the stigmata. Her first book was published in German in 2005, and she now works principally as a lecturer and author. She lives with her husband in Berlin.

              And If He Had Not Been Raised... (Paperback)
                       The Stations of Christ's Path to Spirit Man

              The Lord's Prayer (Paperback)
                       An Esoteric Study

              The Lord's Prayer (Hardcover)
                       The Living Word of God

              Lord's Prayer, The: An Esoteric Study
              The Lord's Prayer stands at the heart of Christianity. Over the past two millennia it has been spoken millions of times by millions of people around the world. Rudolf Steiner affirms the power of this prayer, given by Jesus Christ himself, and encourages us to begin to understand it at deeper levels. Such an understanding, he explains, is now necessary for humanity's further development. In the four lectures he gave on this subject, collected here under one cover, Rudolf Steiner penetrates the esoteric meanings of the Lord's Prayer, relating its seven petitions to the seven spiritual and physical bodies of the human being. He also discusses the difference between prayer and meditation, and shows how true prayer is selfless in nature. This volume features an introduction by Judith von Halle, whose work is valued for her experiential knowledge of the Lord's Prayer and the events of Christ's life. June 2006; Trans. rvd. P. Wehrle, Intro. J. von Halle (4 lectures from GAs 96 + 97);

               

              Edith Maryon

              The name given to the Foundation hints at its idealistic and spiritual roots.

              Edith Maryon (1872 London-1924 Dornach) was educated at the Royal College of Art in London and accomplished her studies as a sculptress. After an intense and promising activity as a sculptress in Great Britain she was, from 1914 to the end of her days, a close assistant to Rudolf Steiner (1861-1925) and was significantly involved in Steiner's plastic and architectural work.

              In addition to her artistic activity, she was deeply involved with social problems issues and was particularly interested in the impact of architecture and plastic work upon man and his social behaviour, i.e. how to create thereby a beneficial atmosphere for people living together.

              This was also the period during which she was committed to the building of houses for Goetheanum employees.  The three so-called Eurythmy houses at Dornach which she designed, together with Rudolf Steiner, are a vivid artistic testimony to her work.

              Her contemporaries particularly appreciated her reliability as well as her marked practical turn of mind, which, together with her idealism and her dedication, proved to generate a beneficial debate on social issues and left a rich heritage in artistic works and impulses. These character traits of Edith Maryon are to this day an inspiration to the employees of the Foundation.

            • Stephen Hale
              ... But that s the whole point. To be a fully individualized I AM throughout eternity, rather than merely recognizing oneself as a drop in the cosmic ocean.
              Message 6 of 17 , Sep 13, 2007
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                --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@...>
                wrote:
                > Take for example the term "I AM" the existence of Being outside the
                > time/space paradigm. Anthros appy this to their time and space
                > bound SELF IMAGE !

                But that's the whole point. To be a fully individualized "I AM"
                throughout eternity, rather than merely recognizing oneself as a drop
                in the cosmic ocean.

                There is a BIG reason for that self image. And whether you like it or
                not, you've got one. In fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense.
              • organicethics@sympatico.ca
                Steve wrote: And whether you like it or not, you ve got one. In fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense Now now, mustn t attack the personality part of
                Message 7 of 17 , Sep 13, 2007
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                  Steve wrote:"And whether you like it or not, you've got one. In fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense"

                  Now now, mustn't attack the 'personality' part of the individual in question, that wouldn't exactly be admirable anthroposophic ethics, now would it?

                  Thoughts, spoken and written words ARE living forces, and I think it's best to keep a good check for how we, as living souls, influence the dynamics of the human social fabric even onto it's spirit side.

                  Just practical Anthroposophy, I think!




                  >
                  > From: "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
                  > Date: 2007/09/13 Thu PM 10:26:24 EDT
                  > To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: Judith von halle and Edith Maryon
                  >
                  > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > Take for example the term "I AM" the existence of Being outside the
                  > > time/space paradigm. Anthros appy this to their time and space
                  > > bound SELF IMAGE !
                  >
                  > But that's the whole point. To be a fully individualized "I AM"
                  > throughout eternity, rather than merely recognizing oneself as a drop
                  > in the cosmic ocean.
                  >
                  > There is a BIG reason for that self image. And whether you like it or
                  > not, you've got one. In fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • Stephen Hale
                  ... fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense ... in question, that wouldn t exactly be admirable anthroposophic ethics, now would it? I ll let you answer
                  Message 8 of 17 , Sep 13, 2007
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                    --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, <organicethics@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Steve wrote:"And whether you like it or not, you've got one. In
                    fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense"
                    >
                    > Now now, mustn't attack the 'personality' part of the individual
                    in question, that wouldn't exactly be admirable anthroposophic
                    ethics, now would it?

                    I'll let you answer that. Please review.
                    >
                    > Thoughts, spoken and written words ARE living forces, and I think
                    it's best to keep a good check for how we, as living souls,
                    influence the dynamics of the human social fabric even onto it's
                    spirit side.
                    >
                    > Just practical Anthroposophy, I think!

                    I take the position that I stand up for what I believe in, and when
                    challenged to take three steps back, like you most often do, I speak
                    up. It must be the Michael spirit in dialogue with me, which I also
                    know for a fact. Michael has an impulse, just as Christ has an
                    impulse. Christ says "turn the other cheek", while Michael
                    says, "put those pompous spiritual dilettantes in their place".

                    So, it becomes my effort to achieve a harmonious balance point
                    between these two very strong, and very complementary spiritual
                    Beings. And I do, whether you like it or not.

                    I do try. Michael told me to give you another chance, and Christ
                    said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                  • carol
                    Steve wrote: I do try. Michael told me to give you another chance, and Christ said: Just give her extra luggage space . Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow
                    Message 9 of 17 , Sep 13, 2007
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                      Steve wrote: "I do try. Michael told me to give you another chance, and
                      Christ said: "Just give her extra luggage space".

                      Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow at that, while MY Etheric Christ out
                      yonder glows of a powerfuly all penetrating, warm, ever embracing cosmic
                      light.

                      MY Etheric Christ once allowed me to know that he serves me as I serve
                      him. I don't know HIM to address group dynamics. MY Etheric Christ is
                      WAYYY too lofty for that.

                      --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, organicethics@ wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Steve wrote:"And whether you like it or not, you've got one. In
                      > fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent sense"
                      > >
                      > > Now now, mustn't attack the 'personality' part of the individual
                      > in question, that wouldn't exactly be admirable anthroposophic
                      > ethics, now would it?
                      >
                      > I'll let you answer that. Please review.
                      > >
                      > > Thoughts, spoken and written words ARE living forces, and I think
                      > it's best to keep a good check for how we, as living souls,
                      > influence the dynamics of the human social fabric even onto it's
                      > spirit side.
                      > >
                      > > Just practical Anthroposophy, I think!
                      >
                      > I take the position that I stand up for what I believe in, and when
                      > challenged to take three steps back, like you most often do, I speak
                      > up. It must be the Michael spirit in dialogue with me, which I also
                      > know for a fact. Michael has an impulse, just as Christ has an
                      > impulse. Christ says "turn the other cheek", while Michael
                      > says, "put those pompous spiritual dilettantes in their place".
                      >
                      > So, it becomes my effort to achieve a harmonious balance point
                      > between these two very strong, and very complementary spiritual
                      > Beings. And I do, whether you like it or not.
                      >
                      > I do try. Michael told me to give you another chance, and Christ
                      > said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                      >
                    • Stephen Hale
                      ... chance, and ... Christ out ... cosmic ... serve ... is ... I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single- handedly, kept the Etheric Christ
                      Message 10 of 17 , Sep 13, 2007
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                        --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@...>
                        wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Steve wrote: "I do try. Michael told me to give you another
                        chance, and
                        > Christ said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                        >
                        > Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow at that, while MY Etheric
                        Christ out
                        > yonder glows of a powerfuly all penetrating, warm, ever embracing
                        cosmic
                        > light.
                        >
                        > MY Etheric Christ once allowed me to know that he serves me as I
                        serve
                        > him. I don't know HIM to address group dynamics. MY Etheric Christ
                        is
                        > WAYYY too lofty for that.

                        I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-
                        handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to
                        mankind back in July of this year. These are issues and
                        pronouncements that I take very seriously. I know becaue the
                        television is turned off when I read your posts, believe me.

                        So, in anticipation of Sunday, I look for a well considered answer.
                        But only because you said it could be possible then; after
                        Saturday. Again, I look always for truth and sincerity, but I'll
                        fight you on the small and egotistical points, just like your China
                        friend. It's possible that she's your alter ego, as we all have one
                        over on the other side.

                        When you say: "MY Etheric Christ out yonder glows of a powerfuly all
                        penetrating, warm, ever embracing cosmic light", this accords with
                        my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can
                        override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to make
                        the wrong choice, which is ours to do.

                        And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready, with a
                        beam that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His words
                        in our personal dialogues; for that is where He Is.
                      • organicethics@sympatico.ca
                        I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to mankind back in July of this
                        Message 11 of 17 , Sep 14, 2007
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                          "I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to mankind back in July of this year."

                          Steve, you've got to get this real strait. I do NOTHING single handedly. If in my conscious soul experience I catch glimpses of certain sub strata levels of activity, including the one which 'holds' my eternal self, then it should be of no surprise that it would be possible for me, when beings of the higher realms permit it, to take witness LOVING, CARING, Michealmic 'operations'.

                          I'm sorry, I can't reveal anything else. If you were mature enough you would surely be doing the same thing and know why to maintain discretion..

                          There is nothing far flung about this; if you were an anthroposophist of pure heart and INTEGRITY, you would KNOW why it is imprudent to push this further.

                          This beautiful earth that we share as our living space is also the dwelling place for UN-Christic forms of thought and will forces.

                          I have no intention of tangling myself up with them.


                          >
                          > From: "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
                          > Date: 2007/09/14 Fri AM 12:12:15 EDT
                          > To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: Judith von halle and Edith Maryon
                          >
                          > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@...>
                          > wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Steve wrote: "I do try. Michael told me to give you another
                          > chance, and
                          > > Christ said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                          > >
                          > > Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow at that, while MY Etheric
                          > Christ out
                          > > yonder glows of a powerfuly all penetrating, warm, ever embracing
                          > cosmic
                          > > light.
                          > >
                          > > MY Etheric Christ once allowed me to know that he serves me as I
                          > serve
                          > > him. I don't know HIM to address group dynamics. MY Etheric Christ
                          > is
                          > > WAYYY too lofty for that.
                          >
                          > I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-
                          > handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to
                          > mankind back in July of this year. These are issues and
                          > pronouncements that I take very seriously. I know becaue the
                          > television is turned off when I read your posts, believe me.
                          >
                          > So, in anticipation of Sunday, I look for a well considered answer.
                          > But only because you said it could be possible then; after
                          > Saturday. Again, I look always for truth and sincerity, but I'll
                          > fight you on the small and egotistical points, just like your China
                          > friend. It's possible that she's your alter ego, as we all have one
                          > over on the other side.
                          >
                          > When you say: "MY Etheric Christ out yonder glows of a powerfuly all
                          > penetrating, warm, ever embracing cosmic light", this accords with
                          > my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can
                          > override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to make
                          > the wrong choice, which is ours to do.
                          >
                          > And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready, with a
                          > beam that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His words
                          > in our personal dialogues; for that is where He Is.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • carol
                          Steve wrote: this accords with my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to
                          Message 12 of 17 , Sep 14, 2007
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                            Steve wrote: "this accords with my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to make the wrong choice, which is ours to do.

                            And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready, with a beam that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His words in our personal dialogues; for that is where He Is."

                            Mister Hale, if you had taken to heart what I wrote on occasion concerning the veiling of the Etheric Christ, you would understand that 'grand scale' electric magnetic activity directed at masses of earthly inhabitants, complemented by the active soul forces of a designated Black Magician (assuming his occult mask)- in sinc with the desires of an incarnated individual (of the stature of a Star Child) assuming Ahriman's occult cleverness is all, taken together, quite a 'lethal' mix.

                            It's enough to create the occult 'backdrop' for a smooth sailing police state: it's what it takes to configurate the sublime background logistics for Police State polished criminality.

                            All the while, earthly inhabitants wallow in their depressions and 'hibernating' body experiences because of extreme (earthly) magnetic chaos. (re the zombie in an aritificial electro magnetic environment)

                            It's funny that having expressed some knowledge of NASA's secret scientific endevours, you should express such willow washy statements concerning Micheal and the Etheric Christ as if never an outside influence could prevent humankind from knowing them.

                            What do you think is represented WITHIN THE HARMONY of all, great and small, pure organic processes and substances? (Keeping in mind that the Earth itself is a living being).


                            --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" organicethics@
                            > wrote:
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Steve wrote: "I do try. Michael told me to give you another
                            > chance, and
                            > > Christ said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                            > >
                            > > Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow at that, while MY Etheric
                            > Christ out
                            > > yonder glows of a powerfuly all penetrating, warm, ever embracing
                            > cosmic
                            > > light.
                            > >
                            > > MY Etheric Christ once allowed me to know that he serves me as I
                            > serve
                            > > him. I don't know HIM to address group dynamics. MY Etheric Christ
                            > is
                            > > WAYYY too lofty for that.
                            >
                            > I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-
                            > handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to
                            > mankind back in July of this year. These are issues and
                            > pronouncements that I take very seriously. I know becaue the
                            > television is turned off when I read your posts, believe me.
                            >
                            > So, in anticipation of Sunday, I look for a well considered answer.
                            > But only because you said it could be possible then; after
                            > Saturday. Again, I look always for truth and sincerity, but I'll
                            > fight you on the small and egotistical points, just like your China
                            > friend. It's possible that she's your alter ego, as we all have one
                            > over on the other side.
                            >
                            > When you say: "MY Etheric Christ out yonder glows of a powerfuly all
                            > penetrating, warm, ever embracing cosmic light", this accords with
                            > my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can
                            > override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to make
                            > the wrong choice, which is ours to do.
                            >
                            > And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready, with a
                            > beam that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His words
                            > in our personal dialogues; for that is where He Is.
                            >
                          • Stephen Hale
                            Why do I feel disappointed for this response? Maybe because I was waiting for Sunday, not Friday. But you couldn t wait til then, in order to give my
                            Message 13 of 17 , Sep 14, 2007
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                              Why do I feel disappointed for this response? Maybe because I was
                              waiting for Sunday, not Friday. But you couldn't wait til then, in
                              order to give my interest and concern the warmth it was looking
                              for. Thanks anyway, because it gives the gist of it, although I
                              still believe that Christs' evolution in the etheric body of the
                              earth served to establish the moral form that would serve our
                              present condition in spite of all the evil that exists today.
                              Consider please that evil must exist in order for the supreme good
                              to win out in the end. And I trust that Christ would not have
                              reappeared in any light inferior to this eventual victory.

                              --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, <organicethics@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > "I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-
                              handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled to
                              mankind back in July of this year."
                              >
                              > Steve, you've got to get this real strait. I do NOTHING single
                              handedly. If in my conscious soul experience I catch glimpses of
                              certain sub strata levels of activity, including the one
                              which 'holds' my eternal self, then it should be of no surprise
                              that it would be possible for me, when beings of the higher realms
                              permit it, to take witness LOVING, CARING, Michealmic 'operations'.
                              >
                              > I'm sorry, I can't reveal anything else. If you were mature
                              enough you would surely be doing the same thing and know why to
                              maintain discretion..
                              >
                              > There is nothing far flung about this; if you were an
                              anthroposophist of pure heart and INTEGRITY, you would KNOW why it
                              is imprudent to push this further.
                              >
                              > This beautiful earth that we share as our living space is also the
                              dwelling place for UN-Christic forms of thought and will forces.
                              >
                              > I have no intention of tangling myself up with them.
                              >
                              >
                              > >
                              > > From: "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
                              > > Date: 2007/09/14 Fri AM 12:12:15 EDT
                              > > To: anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com
                              > > Subject: [anthroposophy] Re: Judith von halle and Edith Maryon
                              > >
                              > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@>
                              > > wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > Steve wrote: "I do try. Michael told me to give you another
                              > > chance, and
                              > > > Christ said: "Just give her extra luggage space".
                              > > >
                              > > > Well, MY Michael raised his eyebrow at that, while MY Etheric
                              > > Christ out
                              > > > yonder glows of a powerfuly all penetrating, warm, ever
                              embracing
                              > > cosmic
                              > > > light.
                              > > >
                              > > > MY Etheric Christ once allowed me to know that he serves me as
                              I
                              > > serve
                              > > > him. I don't know HIM to address group dynamics. MY Etheric
                              Christ
                              > > is
                              > > > WAYYY too lofty for that.
                              > >
                              > > I am very interested in how you helped, or maybe even single-
                              > > handedly, kept the Etheric Christ from being completely veiled
                              to
                              > > mankind back in July of this year. These are issues and
                              > > pronouncements that I take very seriously. I know becaue the
                              > > television is turned off when I read your posts, believe me.
                              > >
                              > > So, in anticipation of Sunday, I look for a well considered
                              answer.
                              > > But only because you said it could be possible then; after
                              > > Saturday. Again, I look always for truth and sincerity, but
                              I'll
                              > > fight you on the small and egotistical points, just like your
                              China
                              > > friend. It's possible that she's your alter ego, as we all have
                              one
                              > > over on the other side.
                              > >
                              > > When you say: "MY Etheric Christ out yonder glows of a powerfuly
                              all
                              > > penetrating, warm, ever embracing cosmic light", this accords
                              with
                              > > my own experience, and it is my understanding that no force can
                              > > override this fact. Only humans now weakly conscious enough to
                              make
                              > > the wrong choice, which is ours to do.
                              > >
                              > > And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready,
                              with a
                              > > beam that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His
                              words
                              > > in our personal dialogues; for that is where He Is.
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Stephen Hale
                              It s true that I don t trust alot of the gonzo I read about today. I find that it tends to represent the antithesis of what Rudolf Steiner had to say at the
                              Message 14 of 17 , Sep 14, 2007
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                                It's true that I don't trust alot of the 'gonzo' I read about
                                today. I find that it tends to represent the antithesis of what
                                Rudolf Steiner had to say at the very end about technics and its
                                relationship to the sub-earthly. I see this flowing through the
                                earthly and human condition today, no doubt. But I still believe;
                                in fact it is more a conviction, that the Etheric Christ stands
                                alone, waiting only for the cosmic intelligence of humans to reach
                                His fingers.

                                And there is no doubt that we can thank Michael for that; for
                                Michael is to Christ what Christ is to God. And Rudolf Steiner was
                                the emissary of Michael in bringing forth the cosmic intelligence at
                                the mineral level at the turn of the 20th century.

                                Cosmic intelligence has a premature formulation that goes back 1341
                                years, but it was astral and not mineral. Thus, for this span of
                                time, external history represents the record of outward achievements
                                wherein the earth has been exploited for its resource values as a
                                developing mineral sphere. As well, mankind has been effectively
                                imprisoned within this logic of a materialistic sphere alone. This
                                is what represents seminal arabism. Although this arabism would be
                                outgrown eventually by the 13th century, as the famous fresco of
                                Aquinas shows, it would continue to prosper in a form extended with
                                the overthrow of the Knights Templar in 1314 (1307-1314). And with
                                the beginning of the Hundred Years War between France and England
                                five years after 1332, an even more evil form of this seminal
                                arabism would take hold of the world and human affairs.

                                So, consider 1998 + 5 = 2003, and the present extension of the War
                                on Terror to Iraq and all other points in this campaign again world
                                terrorism in favor of world democracy. And then consider what form
                                of being stands behind this effort; an effort for freedom that
                                really means enslavement. Then consider how technics serves this
                                form of conquest in the very place where the asuric-ahrimanic being
                                has its greates magnetic concentration.

                                It's a no-brainer, even for me. The western secret societies have
                                risen to such a power of world control that the economic god stands
                                to topple the other two arms of its particular trinity (three-fold
                                social order), for its own dominance. That's the situation today.

                                And it only serves to highlight this summer's discourse on the
                                Eighth Sphere and the occult movement behind it. It was addressed
                                for a reason, and actually should be taken right through this
                                upcoming Michael season as a good cause.



                                --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "carol" <organicethics@...>
                                wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > Steve wrote: "this accords with my own experience, and it is my
                                > understanding that no force can override this fact. Only humans now
                                > weakly conscious enough to make the wrong choice, which is ours to
                                do.
                                >
                                > And that's the difference. The Etheric Christ shines ready, with a
                                beam
                                > that waits for all, and Michael hopes that we'll hear His words in
                                our
                                > personal dialogues; for that is where He Is."
                                >
                                > Mister Hale, if you had taken to heart what I wrote on occasion
                                > concerning the veiling of the Etheric Christ, you would understand
                                that
                                > 'grand scale' electric magnetic activity directed at masses of
                                earthly
                                > inhabitants, complemented by the active soul forces of a designated
                                > Black Magician (assuming his occult mask)- in sinc with the
                                desires of
                                > an incarnated individual (of the stature of a Star Child) assuming
                                > Ahriman's occult cleverness is all, taken together, quite
                                a 'lethal'
                                > mix.
                              • Stephen Hale
                                ... outside ... space ... This is true, bur the goal of earth evolution is to mature the ego that Christ gave us; thus, a self-reflective image represents a
                                Message 15 of 17 , Sep 15, 2007
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                                  --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@...>
                                  wrote:
                                  >
                                  > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale"
                                  > <sardisian01@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@>
                                  > > wrote:
                                  > > > Take for example the term "I AM" the existence of Being
                                  outside
                                  > the
                                  > > > time/space paradigm. Anthros appy this to their time and
                                  space
                                  > > > bound SELF IMAGE !
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > >
                                  > > But that's the whole point. To be a fully individualized "I AM"
                                  > > throughout eternity, rather than merely recognizing oneself as a
                                  > drop
                                  > > in the cosmic ocean.
                                  >
                                  > Self importance and self pity are just opposite sides of the same
                                  > coin.

                                  This is true, bur the goal of earth evolution is to mature the ego
                                  that Christ gave us; thus, a self-reflective image represents a real
                                  standard to start with. Rather than the legendary illusory
                                  reflection in the pond of maya, which has the Indian culture still
                                  worshipping the cow as the supreme being over the human caste
                                  system, and its historical brutality, the coin has still two more
                                  sides, thus four; which indicates exponential growth of the human
                                  ego to Godmanhood.
                                  >
                                  > Your weakness is due to your conviction that you were born into
                                  the
                                  > world. In reality the world is ever recreated in you and by you.
                                  See
                                  > everything as emanating from the light which is the source of your
                                  > own Being.

                                  My weakness is everybody's weakness, even yours. To love the earth
                                  is a weakness of the flesh that stands to give great rewards; for to
                                  lose one's first love, i.e., earth, is to give up three-
                                  dimensionality and the object-picture consciousness that represents
                                  earth evolution. If you carry your logic and its illusory pride
                                  further, you only hold yourself back in the retarded sense. But you
                                  will carry over to Jupiter just like Lucifer and Ahriman carried
                                  over to earth. And all will benefit.
                                • Stephen Hale
                                  ... outside ... space ... Ego sees judgments and labels because it is immature, and founded on the intellectual soul. Innocence has its basis in the fact that
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Sep 15, 2007
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                                    --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@...>
                                    wrote:
                                    >
                                    > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Hale"
                                    > <sardisian01@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "xjxj_xanis" <xjxj_xanis@>
                                    > > wrote:
                                    > > > Take for example the term "I AM" the existence of Being
                                    outside
                                    > the
                                    > > > time/space paradigm. Anthros appy this to their time and
                                    space
                                    > > > bound SELF IMAGE !
                                    > >
                                    > > But that's the whole point. To be a fully individualized "I AM"
                                    > > throughout eternity, rather than merely recognizing oneself as a
                                    > drop
                                    > > in the cosmic ocean.
                                    > >
                                    > > There is a BIG reason for that self image. And whether you like
                                    > it or
                                    > > not, you've got one. In fact, a rather BIG ONE in the apparent
                                    > sense.
                                    >
                                    > Ego sees only judgments and labels and has an extremely distorted
                                    > and fragmented point of view. Innocence has no reflection and is
                                    > beyond mind, and is not conditioned by expectations.

                                    Ego sees judgments and labels because it is immature, and founded on
                                    the intellectual soul. Innocence has its basis in the fact that we
                                    are largely following a system that we do not understand, which is
                                    why the image of the lamb is so profound.
                                    >
                                    > It is my destiny to play an infinite number of roles but none of
                                    > these roles are myself. In a state of innocence I have no self
                                    > image.

                                    Everyone has a self image. You only choose to live in denial, which
                                    is a psychological matter.
                                  • Stephen Hale
                                    ... anything other ... I make the simple assertion that ego consciousness is the goal of earth evolution through Christ and the deed on Golgotha. Out of the
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Sep 17, 2007
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                                      --- In anthroposophy@yahoogroups.com, "Kosmicdance@..."
                                      <kosmicdance@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Hmmm... and so you go - full circle back to judgements and labels.
                                      > :)
                                      > But you have not convinced me that you have experienced cosmic
                                      > consciousness, or God consciousness or unity consciousness or
                                      anything other
                                      > than ego based awareness in sleeping dreaming and waking.
                                      >
                                      > ?

                                      I make the simple assertion that ego consciousness is the goal of
                                      earth evolution through Christ and the deed on Golgotha. Out of the
                                      unconscious ego the astral body, etheric body, and physical body
                                      have been systematically enhanced and complexified into Sentient
                                      Soul, Intellectual Soul, and Consciousness Soul. The Conscious Ego,
                                      born out of an evolutionary impulse since the last third of the 19th
                                      century, begins the process of further transformations into Spirit
                                      Self, Life Spirit, and Spirit Man. Thus, the Mystery of Golgotha is
                                      realized beginning with this incarnation. The ability to say "I Am"
                                      to oneself, and know it as a matter of individualized consciousness
                                      is coincident with the fact that the fourth cultural epoch was
                                      recapitulated in the first five hundred years of the fifth (1413-
                                      1913), thus establishing the intellectual soul as an evolutionary
                                      bestowal for all humanity. This recapitulation forms the necessary
                                      grounding in the mineral world at the solid level of objective
                                      representation needed for ego consciousness in its initial stage;
                                      thus earth is "thy first love" due to the realization that is
                                      afforded through the occordination of intellect and individuality.

                                      And it stands to only grow in terms of ego maturity in conjunction
                                      with the higher knowledge afforded by the science of the spirit; and
                                      thinking paves the way.
                                      >
                                      > Thats okay. I don't expect you to be an enlightened or profound,
                                      neither do
                                      > I expect you to understand anything outside of a fragmented
                                      distorted ego
                                      > awareness - at this stage.
                                      >
                                      > Does an ant think that everything else in the world is another ant?
                                      > Hmmm...
                                      >
                                      > :)
                                      >
                                      > ?
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