- A certain M Hale wrote: It is actually centered in the moon that is now out there separated from the earth. This will be proved in Steiner s own words. It sMessage 1 of 70 , Aug 1, 2007View SourceA certain M Hale wrote: "It is actually centered in the moon that is now
out there separated from the earth. This will be proved in Steiner's own
It's interesting that you actually see in Steiner's words confirmation
of your statement. I certainly don't, and hopefully many others don't.
How in heaven's name have you managed to find the 8th sphere in the moon
based on Anthroposophical spiritual science, and where Steiner himself
spoke of something extremely obscure and within that which surrounds us
"...So it will be useless to look for the Eighth Sphere anywhere in the
...I have said that the Eighth Sphere has something to do with the
residue left from the Old Moon and its evolution.
...That is to say: it must be presumed at the outset that the Eighth
Sphere is found by way of visionary Imaginations.
..This will give you an inkling that the Eighth Sphere is to be observed
within the Earth Sphere. It cannot properly be drawn either above or
below; to depict the reality it would have to be sketched into the Earth
--- In email@example.com, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...>
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Stephen Hale"
> sardisian01@ wrote:
> > --- In email@example.com, "Stephen Hale"
> > <sardisian01@> wrote:
> > > Now, what I will say next is that the Eighth Sphere is co-
> > > with the physical moon. It is actually centered in the moon
> > is
> > > now out there separated from the earth. This will be proved in
> > > Steiner's own words. And from there we can move on to how
> > > astronauts could have ever gone to a physical moon so inundated
> > with
> > > materiality, yet lacking a mineral basis.
> "And now we have reached the point where we can say more
> specifically than has hitherto been possible, what the Eighth Sphere
> is in reality.-This is a matter most intimately connected with the
> spiritual aspect of evolution in the nineteenth century."
> I shall try to characterize what is called the "Eighth Sphere" in
> order that we may have a foundation for describing the development
> of the spiritual movement in the nineteenth century and at the
> beginning of the twentieth. The Eighth Sphere cannot be anything
> that belongs to the material world, for I have shown you that the
> greatest fallacy is that the physical Moon is directly conmnected
> with the Eighth Sphere; and I tried to make it comprehensible that
> the actual foundation of the error consists in the fact that this
> pointed to something material and physical.
> From this you will be able to conjecture, even if not fully to
> understand, that what is called the Eighth Sphere can have nothing
> directly to do with anything within the material world-that is to
> say, what can be perceived by man's senses and thought out on the
> basis of sensory perception has no part in the Eighth Sphere. So it
> will be useless to look for the Eighth Sphere anywhere in the
> material world.
> You now have indications by means of which some approach can be made
> in thought to a conception of the Eighth Sphere. I have said that
> the Eighth Sphere has something to do with the residue left from the
> Old Moon and its evolution. On the Old Moon, man's natural mode of
> perception was visionary and imaginative in character, so that any
> substantiality to be discerned in the Eighthy Sphere must be found
> with this kind of vision. That is to say: it must be presumed at
> the outset that the Eighth Sphere is found by way of visionary
> How was it that the expression "Eighth Sphere" came to be used?-You
> know that human evolution takes its course through the seven spheres
> of Saturn, Sun, Moon, Earth, Jupiter, Venus, Vulcan. We will
> conceive that besides these seven spheres there is still something
> else which lies outside them and yet is in some way related to the
> Earth. Here, then, we have a sphere, visible only to visionary-
> imaginative clairvoyance, which stands there as an Eighth Sphere
> over and above the seven which constitute the domain of the ordered
> and regular evolution of mankind. All such sketches are, of course,
> diagrammatic; one is obliged to draw separately spheres which can
> only be observed each within the others. For you will certainly
> have realized from our studies that as long as a man is within the
> material world, makes his observations through the senses and thinks
> with the intellect, he is standing in the Fourth Sphere, the Earth
> Sphere. If he develops his faculties of soul sufficiently to be
> able to see the Third Sphere, the Moon Sphere, then he takes a far
> flight-but not in the spatial sense. He observes, not from another
> place, but physically speaking, spatially speaking, from the same
> place. These seven spheres ought therefore in reality to be drawn
> within one another. They are successive stages and states of
> evolution and, fundamentally, such a diagram is of no other value
> than as if one were to say: human beings develop from birth to the
> seventh year in a first stage, from the seventh to the fourteenth
> year in a second stage, and so on. The being who has developed from
> the first to the seventh year cannot be thought of as separate from
> the being who is developing from the seventh until the fourteenth
> year. Neither is it correct to think of the seven successive
> spheres or stages of the Earth's evolution as separate from each
> This will give you an inkling that the Eighth Sphere is to be
> observed within the Earth Sphere. It cannot properly be drawn
> either above or below; to depict the reality it would have to be
> sketched into the Earth Sphere. I have often given a crude example
> to express what is here meant.-Just as the physical air is around
> us, so is the Spiritual around us; we have to look for the Spiritual
> within what is actually physical in our environment. Hence it must
> be presumed that just as the spiritual is round about us, so we must
> also look for the Eighth Sphere in our environment. This means that
> an organ enabling man to perceive the Eighth Sphere would have to be
> developed, just as his physical senses enable him to perceive the
> material Earth. He could then experience the Eighth Sphere quite
> consciously; but unconsciously he is always within it-just as we are
> always within the air, even if we are not aware of it. And if we
> have developed an organ for experiencing the Eighth Sphere, we are
> conscious of it around us. So that if the Eighth Sphere is to be
> described, it must obviously be described as a realm in which we are
> living all the time."
> --From Lecture 5, "The Occult Movement in the Nineteenth Century".
- I m sorry, we don t seem to be speaking the same language, strangely enough. But that which is common between us both, is that we both inhabit this earth onMessage 70 of 70 , Aug 11, 2007View Source
I'm sorry, we don't seem to be speaking the same language, strangely enough. But that which is common between us both, is that we both inhabit this earth on this year 2007. We share the same language of communication. We also read works by Steiner. I invite you to glance at this excerpt from The Metamorphosis of Intelligence-The Fundamental Social Demands of our Time. From this passage, you may be able to gain a hint or even an understanding of how, and under what circumstances I think.
I personally don't feel that I should be compelled to pay lip service to specific elements of the American folk soul in any way, shape or form if I choose not to. I feel that I am entitled, through the authority held by the heavens even, to live freely, in spirit, in the deepest sense of the word and in the form that I'm able to discover through my own hard efforts ...
Again, my own translation from French to English, pratically word for word.
"...If you study historic rapports (relationships) within a symptomatology of history, you will find the following: it appears that Protestantism is all natural to instinctive intelligence, which is inbred in occidental Europe and America, an 'evidence' that manifests itself often enough in political and religious life. This absolutely self evident instinct impregnates all, it does not require a particular dispositon, even though here and there, you will find the hearts of reformists quite enflamed by it. Instinctive Protestantism has no need to call upon Reform as was the case in central Europe; it exists naturally in the West, we could even say: the West is born protestant, central European discusses protestantly, for precisely, protestantism calls forth discussion on intelligent things. In this instance, it is not inborn.
Russia, for it's part, pushes it away, refuses it, doesn't want of it and being Russian, it cannot accept it. Russianism and Protestantism do not support each other.
That which I've spoken of has value not only in a confessional point of view but expresses itself within all the cultural impulse. Take for example how the West receives Marxism. It is over there greeted as a protest against (former) ancient property rights, etc... in the center, we discuss of these same subjects, we will quarell over them, doubt them, we'll say many unecessary things, all of which is significant to the caracter of the peoples of central Europe. In the East, it takes on strange forms, there we transpose it, we recompose it completely and there we find it penetrated by and colored in Orthodoxy. It's not carried over into ideation, but only into the manner in which the Russian places himself in front of it, how he imprints it with Orthodoxical faith.
This comment (remark) reveals just how much it is necessary to draw back from exterior assessments in order to have an indepth view. You will understand much if you develop in yourselves the habit to say to yourselves, when facing all phenomena in life: words in the way that we use them today, have become ' used money'; what is thought of things and expressed through language, never corresponds to it's exact truth. One must go even deeper, I would say, the protestantism in the way that it defines itself today, through habit in how we form thought, is no longer capable of expressing anything real. You see, it is so necessary to overcome the image of the word, the image of the idea, in order to apprehend it's truth in a way that is living.....
(And a few pages later)
...So when a person scolds another, it's not because the one being scolded is like this or like that, but because the scolder experiences the need to scold and wishes to be relieved of it.
This has now to do with considering things in a way other than the one of which we are accustomed. Grasping Spiritual Science at the deepest levels of the soul is in many circumstances, quite other, than what even anthroposophist represent for themselves..." RS.
The Metamorphosis of Intelligence- The Fundamental Social Demands of our Time. Dornach 15.12.1918
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Stephen Hale" <sardisian01@...> wrote:
> --- In email@example.com, "carol" organicethics@ wrote:
> > I remember the title contained the words: realite vraie- Real Reality?
> > Anyway, I will write Mark and ask him to resend it to me.
> > So back to square one, again.
> > That's if, you are willing to STUDY as opposed to throwing around your
> > Will.
> From this point forward I will give you the big wide berth that you
> deserve, or maybe "need" is a better word.