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  • holderlin66
    Christopher wrote: The most disturbing thing I ever read about Steiner was from a short lecture given in 1946 at the Threefold Community in NY state. I always
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 9, 2007
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      Christopher wrote:

      "The most disturbing thing I ever read about Steiner was from a
      lecture given in 1946 at the Threefold Community in NY state. I
      always thought Steiner was the rational one during the Krishnamurti
      fiasco of the Theosophical Society. From what I understood, Steiner
      completely rejected Theosophical attempts to pass a boy off as the
      reincarnation of Maitreya. However, then I discovered this little

      Bradford comments;

      It is wonderful that one can always discover little gems everywhere.
      As a Waldorf Teacher, Waldorf Teachers are very, active people. Most
      of the time they hardly have time for anything but class room
      preparation and Main Lesson prep; with paintings, math, myth and
      history, anatomy, botany...you know the usual rich, rich, subject
      matter presented in the most magnificent way possible. The study of
      Animals, gemstones, geometry that arises from the crystals and is
      part of the atomic table...how all this interweaves and shines into
      man...How Rome and the explorers...Oh well, it is intense being a
      Waldorf Teacher. Very little time is spent on much else than
      researching the next block and holding it, presenting it before the
      eyes of young people with a richness unknown in public schools.

      However we do manage to present different festival plays. Do and
      perform rich festivals through the year. At one of those festivals
      during the year, the Shepherds Play, or the Three Kings Play might
      arise and in the background of study, there is ever richer and
      richer insight drawn to the depth of what one prepares as one
      teaches the three aspects...

      Those three aspects are Athletic or Will intelligence-; Emotional or
      Art Intelligence; and Intellect or brain intelligence. The three
      fields appear lopsided and in incomplete manifestation in young
      people. Getting a dominating Sports brain will intelligence to
      understand Art and emotional intelligence is very, very important
      for the state of the triadic balance of the soul. Teaching in a
      balanced way...where the mathematical and brainy systems get a
      workout, Art gets a workout and active games and will and group
      dynamics gets a work out...are all aspects of looking over the
      classroom and bringing a balance to tendencies.

      Of course part of the issue of translating your meaning is to be
      certain about the difference between Manes and Manu. These are very
      different beings. So maybe you could tell me what you know of the
      the difference between Manes and Manu.

      However I can't fault great, great souls like Pekka Ervast for
      understanding and working with Rudolf Steiner. Many, many great
      souls understood that Steiner was bringing something very, very new
      to the education of humanity.

      "Pekka Ervast is the most important Finnish theosophical writer. He
      lived 1875-1934 and wrote about 70 books and hold about 1 500
      lectures. Between the years 1907-1917 Ervast worked as the ceneral
      secretery of Finnish Theosophical Society, but gave up Theosophical
      Society, lead by Mrs. Annie Besant and Mr. C. W. Leadbeater, because
      he could'nt accept their opinions concerning the World War and Jiddu
      Krishnamurti as new World Teacher."

      On post 10803 of this list you may find

      "These Kings are also great Sages of the "Old School" (which had
      an "oriental flavour") and they can be called Mahachohan,
      Boddhisattva and Manu. They come to pay homage to the New Spiritual
      King, Christ. This Tale and the scene about the Kings around the
      Christ Child can also be taken as a prediction conserning future,
      when the altar in the middle of the (threefolded) society is Christ.

      "The gift of Melchior (=Mahachohan) is gold and it is naturally
      connected to the economic sector.The Frankencense of Balthazar
      (=Boddhisattva) deals with the culture parliament. The true
      Frankencense, incence, wich makes the "air sweet", is proper
      education, Christ-centered religion, Spiritual Science and true art.
      The gift of Caspar (=Manu) was the embalming Pine Myrrh and this
      refers to death and also to immortality. Manu is the leader of the
      State or political sector and in the old India there were the Laws
      of Manu. But Manu is also a "leader" (or father) of a Race, and it
      is through a new Race how humanity as a whole have been connected to
      immortality in the material sense of the term. Finally we must also
      win individually over death by building the immortal resurrection
      body and as Dr. Steiner has mentioned, we can get the "seed" to this
      vehicle from Christ Jesus.

      "Mr. Ervast calls these three Magi the High Ministers in the School
      of Melchizedek. This "giving of the gifts" can then be seen also as
      a some kind of a "preliminary transformation" from the Old Covenant
      to the new One. If this incident in considered as a fact of the
      unseen world, then it is probably better to connect it to the Birth
      that occured in the banks of Jordan.

      "The three different streams in Christianity is also a very
      interesting subject. It might be too daring to connect the three
      streams directly to the three departments, which have been discussed
      earlier. Anyway there is an affinity between the Johannine
      Christianity and the culture department / Boddhisattva. St. Peter's
      stream is connected to economy parliament; e.g. the newcomers had to
      give their property to the apostoles, when they joined that
      congeration. Then I must somehow connect St. Paul to Manu; a new
      human type can be seen in St. Paul after his Damascus experience
      ("not I, but Christ in me").

      "There were problems though, especially in the St. Peter stream. St.
      John was initiated by Christ Jesus Himself and the Damascus
      Experience was not even possible before the Mystery of Golgotha. St.
      Paul had his great Initiation in his way to Damascos. Nothing of
      this magnitude happened to Peter. I have felt that the "real leader"
      in this stream should have been St. Stephen, who got his "Damascus
      Vision" when he was stoned to death. Mr. Ervast has said that from
      the gaze of dying St. Stephen Saul got a "fire" to his soul, which
      eventually "bursted to flames" in the road to Damascos, changing
      Saul completely.

      "When I think about the central teachings of Christ Jesus, which are
      gathered in the Sermon on the Mount, there are three distinct
      topics: New commandments (two "general" and five spesific) given to
      replace the old ones given by Moses, the Beatitutes and Our Father –
      prayer/meditation. The first one of these is connected to the St.
      Peters' stream. This ethical "Rock Bottom" has been missing from our
      culture; it was only after the achievements of Leo Tolstoy, when the
      real fruits of this stream began to emerge again and after that Mr.
      Ervast has studied extensively this subject.

      Warm Regards

      Christopher brought

      "The threefold social order of Rudolf Steiner is particularly a
      preparatory work to bring about a future incarnation of Manes. I
      once discussed with Rudolf Steiner the question of when would be the
      proper time for the application of etheric forces for technical
      uses. He said that this would be when the threefold order is
      established. He said that Manes could not find a suitable body yet,
      that all the forces he would be able to bring to an incarnation
      would be destroyed by modern education. Therefore he said that
      Waldorf education needed first to come into being and that the
      threefold social order must also come into being.Therefore I would
      see it as our immediate task to bring about this threefold order
      first through thought and then through action, so that Manes can
      incarnate. By karma, Manes' incarnation would be due by the end of
      the century. Whether this will be possible I do not know, but if the
      threefold social order and Waldorf education were established he
      could incarnate. I see it as our task to make the preparations so
      that he can incarnate again."
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