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Re: [anthroposophy] Aging, memory, reality, death

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  • Danny F.
    ... I think as simplistic as it may sound, the degenerative diseases as Alzheimer are direct result of materialistic culture, as we know the more we age the
    Message 1 of 3 , Jul 15 8:39 AM
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      --- elaine upton <elaineupton@...> wrote:
      > Dear anthroposophy list,
      > Do any of you have any sources or wisdom on the questions of aging,
      > memory
      > loss, sense of reality, and approach to death?
      >
      > I ask this as i watch my parents aging, losing memory, losing
      > ordinary sense
      > of reality, and in the case of my partner's parent, approaching
      > death, it
      > seems (approaching with what seems to me like fear and denial).
      >
      > I notice that when i am with my parents, i look at them with
      > tenderness, as
      > they become more childlike and helpless. I also have to swallow some
      > sadness, that they are so changed, and i foolishly want them to
      > remain as
      > they were in younger years (oh, that one is foolish and complicated,
      > since
      > in younger years i did not always like them...funny).
      >
      > But more, i find that my sense of reality changes, alongside the
      > changes
      > they undergo. I look at them, with compassion, i believe, but from a
      > distance (at times). And i see that their bodies are frail and almost
      >
      > fading. Their reality is not in the physical body. I remember the
      > exercise
      > Steiner gave (somewhere, in the karma lectures, i believe) to imagine
      > a
      > person with no limbs, no this , no that, until finally there is no
      > physical
      > body, and then you will see the being, and their karma. I see my
      > parents'
      > bodies fading, and their memories and sense of reality (ordinary
      > reality of
      > time, names, etc.) fades, and i think i am in an "unreal" world when
      > i am
      > with them. What used to matter not only no longer matters, but
      > doesn't even
      > seem to exist anymore. Wow!
      > Then, i look around and ask: what matters? What is real?
      >
      > Alzheimer's Disease (maybe my parents have this): that one can really
      > cause
      > one to question reality, what is real? What matters?
      >
      > An exercise given: to separate the essential from the unessential,
      > the
      > transitory from the eternal...That one seems especially important for
      > me
      > now.
      >
      > I will appreciate the sharing of any wisdom on this subject of aging,
      > memory
      > loss, dying, sense of reality, what is essential and enduring.
      >
      > in thanksgiving,
      > elaine

      I think as simplistic as it may sound, the degenerative diseases as
      Alzheimer are direct result of materialistic culture, as we know the
      more we age the more we go towards the spiritual. I think
      a disease as Alzheimer occur as a schock transition from the physical
      to the unavoidable entrance in the spiritual, the spirit does seem
      to want to dissociate from the physical in a conflictuous way, for
      having lived in a too much physical fashion in the course of it's
      incarnation, it is a split because of the too much spirit sunk in
      matter centrifugaly let us says, the movement towards the periphery
      gets heightened with the same strenght I would say, where there was
      not health before because of materialism, now gets obvious in it's
      polar reaction towards the periphery. Materialism is the non healthy
      fashion of our time, this is the mainstream, "new" diseases therefore
      are getting mainstream. Thats's how I see it actually.

      Regards,
      Danny

      =====
      "Anthroposophy does not want to impart knowledge.
      It seeks to awaken life."

      --Rudolf Steiner

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    • Danny F.
      ... The word I meant was actually not centrifugal , but rather centripetal , sorry. Regards, Danny ===== Anthroposophy does not want to impart knowledge. It
      Message 2 of 3 , Jul 15 1:39 PM
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        --- "Danny F." <premabrahma@...> wrote:
        >
        > --- elaine upton <elaineupton@...> wrote:
        > > Dear anthroposophy list,
        > > Do any of you have any sources or wisdom on the questions of aging,
        > > memory
        > > loss, sense of reality, and approach to death?
        > >
        > > I ask this as i watch my parents aging, losing memory, losing
        > > ordinary sense
        > > of reality, and in the case of my partner's parent, approaching
        > > death, it
        > > seems (approaching with what seems to me like fear and denial).
        > >
        > > I notice that when i am with my parents, i look at them with
        > > tenderness, as
        > > they become more childlike and helpless. I also have to swallow
        > some
        > > sadness, that they are so changed, and i foolishly want them to
        > > remain as
        > > they were in younger years (oh, that one is foolish and
        > complicated,
        > > since
        > > in younger years i did not always like them...funny).
        > >
        > > But more, i find that my sense of reality changes, alongside the
        > > changes
        > > they undergo. I look at them, with compassion, i believe, but from
        > a
        > > distance (at times). And i see that their bodies are frail and
        > almost
        > >
        > > fading. Their reality is not in the physical body. I remember the
        > > exercise
        > > Steiner gave (somewhere, in the karma lectures, i believe) to
        > imagine
        > > a
        > > person with no limbs, no this , no that, until finally there is no
        > > physical
        > > body, and then you will see the being, and their karma. I see my
        > > parents'
        > > bodies fading, and their memories and sense of reality (ordinary
        > > reality of
        > > time, names, etc.) fades, and i think i am in an "unreal" world
        > when
        > > i am
        > > with them. What used to matter not only no longer matters, but
        > > doesn't even
        > > seem to exist anymore. Wow!
        > > Then, i look around and ask: what matters? What is real?
        > >
        > > Alzheimer's Disease (maybe my parents have this): that one can
        > really
        > > cause
        > > one to question reality, what is real? What matters?
        > >
        > > An exercise given: to separate the essential from the unessential,
        > > the
        > > transitory from the eternal...That one seems especially important
        > for
        > > me
        > > now.
        > >
        > > I will appreciate the sharing of any wisdom on this subject of
        > aging,
        > > memory
        > > loss, dying, sense of reality, what is essential and enduring.
        > >
        > > in thanksgiving,
        > > elaine
        >
        > I think as simplistic as it may sound, the degenerative diseases as
        > Alzheimer are direct result of materialistic culture, as we know the
        > more we age the more we go towards the spiritual. I think
        > a disease as Alzheimer occur as a schock transition from the
        > physical
        > to the unavoidable entrance in the spiritual, the spirit does seem
        > to want to dissociate from the physical in a conflictuous way, for
        > having lived in a too much physical fashion in the course of it's
        > incarnation, it is a split because of the too much spirit sunk in
        > matter centrifugaly let us says, the movement towards the periphery



        The word I meant was actually not 'centrifugal', but rather
        'centripetal', sorry.

        Regards,
        Danny




        =====
        "Anthroposophy does not want to impart knowledge.
        It seeks to awaken life."

        --Rudolf Steiner

        __________________________________________________
        Do You Yahoo!?
        Get Yahoo! Mail � Free email you can access from anywhere!
        http://mail.yahoo.com/
      • elaine upton
        Thanks, Danny, for your reply to my question on Alzheimer s and aging and memory/orientation loss. Yes, what you say seems true to me, and there are ... A
        Message 3 of 3 , Jul 17 8:12 AM
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          Thanks, Danny, for your reply to my question on Alzheimer's and aging and
          memory/orientation loss. Yes, what you say seems true to me, and there are
          lessons here for me and for any and all on aging well:


          > I think as simplistic as it may sound, the degenerative diseases as
          > Alzheimer are direct result of materialistic culture, as we know the
          > more we age the more we go towards the spiritual. I think
          > a disease as Alzheimer occur as a schock transition from the physical
          > to the unavoidable entrance in the spiritual, the spirit does seem
          > to want to dissociate from the physical in a conflictuous way,


          A conflicting way, yes.


          >for
          > having lived in a too much physical fashion in the course of it's
          > incarnation, it is a split because of the too much spirit sunk in
          > matter centrifugaly let us says,


          Yes, so there is the need to focus more on spiritual, separate the essential
          from the unessential, the enduring from the transitory, as the exercise
          suggests.

          Thanks, and be well,
          elaine


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