11216Re: Beware of...
- Jan 7, 2006--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Robert Mason <robertsmason_99@y...> wrote:
> I have already in my AT posts tried to explainFYI, I read your posts on A_T. Interesting. Still
> why I wrote and posted what you call my
> "censure of Joel". (Tried, at considerable
> length and in considerable detail, especially
> in my long post to Stephen Clarke.) None of my
> explanations depend upon an assumption or
> premise that I am "guileless", or
> guiltless. You may be of the opinion that my
> explanations are somehow inadequate, but I see
> no indication here that you have read and
> seriously considered them. If you would cite
> them and tell me exactly why you (presumably)
> consider them to be inadequate, then maybe we
> could proceed from there. But now, I don't see
> any point in merely repeating essentially what
> I have already written.
am wondering why you choose to be the champion and
take it upon yourself to castigate Joel unless you
are one of those rare humans who are guileless.
> As I already said in my previous post here,I honor that each person has the right to express
> this matter belongs not just to the past but
> also to the present. Joel still posts on his
> website the "Perspective" essay; this brings
> the whole "Maitreya" thing right into the
> present: he is still saying it. More
> importantly, he is still "doing it"'; he is
> still acting from the same, sick mind-set --
> acting upon other people.
themselves; however, your persistent attempts to
characterize Joel, or any one for that matter, as
having a sick mind-set, appears to be a chronic
problem that borders on vindictiveness.
> But he does claim (obliquely, deviously) to beSo what! Suppose he is as mad as a hatter. Would
> the New World-Teacher of Anthroposophy, and
> (again) more importantly, he is acting upon
> that mad presumption.
this not be a lesson that he has to learn either
during this incarnation or during excarnation?
What if Joel is the New World-teacher of
Anthroposophy? Do we not, as individuals, need to
inwardly accept or reject that premise for
ourselves? is that not our responsibility to read
what he wrote and then after due diligence come to
our own decision? Of course this is true.
Your argument, as I recall, centers around
protecting those folks who are less learned from
Joel, is this not so?
> I suppose I have beams enough, but so what?So what? Would that not indicate that with a beam
> That doesn't mean that I can't add two plus two
> and come out somewhere between three and five.
> And it doesn't mean that I have to swallow all
> the BS that anyone might want to feed me.
> Still less does it mean that I must stand idly
> by while someone is feeding BS to other people.
in your eye that you might be unable to see clearly
because of the beam?
Of course you do not have to swallow the BS of
others. If you did so, then the lessons that you
will have to learn because of your swallowing is a
lesson that you will have to learn in this
incarnation, or in excarnation and the next
incarnation. Life is an LE (learning experience).
Learn now. Learn later. But we all will have to
learn the lesson.
Now when you get to the part of attempting to
interfere in the lessons that others need to learn,
that is a whole other matter. In my opinion, unless
one is guileless, guiltless and a host of other
words like: blameless, not to blame, without fault,
above reproach, above suspicion, in the clear,
unimpeachable, irreproachable, faultless, sinless,
spotless, immaculate, unsullied, uncorrupted,
undefiled, untainted, unblemished, untarnished,
impeccable. then one has the necessary qualities of
heart and head to intercede in the karma of others.
You know, someone like Christ. Are you that kind of
> I have not attended any 12-step meetings, but IOf course addicts and alcoholics in the early
> am aware of the doctrine. I have done some
> "group work" of a less doctrinaire and more
> intensive kind. And to a large extent, my
> experiences in and around such groups have
> educated me about the kinds of tricks that some
> people (especially manipulative addicts) will
> play, about the BS they will pitch, and about
> the depths of the perversity that madness can
> reach. I have learned to ask questions and to
> be alert to evasions. I have learned:
> that talk is cheap,
> that actions speak louder than words,
> that ye shall know them by their fruits,
> and to keep my eye on the bottom line.
stages of recovery are manipulative and devious. I
have been in recovery for 20 years and still met
folks with long term sobriety who have not outgrown
those character traits. Truth to be told, I met
Anthroposophist, Theosophists, Christians, Muslims,
Born Agains, etc, who are manipulative and devious.
The Shadow knows no limits and has no favorites.
You are writing about them, just as you write about
Joel...with prejudice. How is it that you see so
clearly? What stage of the evolutionary spiral do
you find yourself posited upon that qualifies you
to judge others?
You say you have learned that talk is cheap. Is not
writing about others also cheap? That actions speak
louder than words. Why so many words written about
Joel? By their fruits...where can we find the
produce of your mind that is not aimed directly at
the personal criticism or judgement of another?
What is the bottom line here? Is it about persons;
about persons' relationship to the Spiritual
hierarchy; about persons' relationship to Christ and
Michael; does the bottom line ultimately refer to
the Earth and humanities responsibility toward the
Earth's future incarnation as a Sun Being? What is
the bottom line for you Robert?
> -- I'm guessing that you are struggling withI have been clean and sober from mood-altering
> some kind of addiction and working with some
> kind of 12-step program. I hope that you are
> aware that such "meetings" have their dangers
> as well as their benefits. (Kinda like e-
> groups.) You can do some good "work" and meet
> some helpful people there, but you might also
> meet some "users", in the other sense of the
> word. Such people will try to run all sorts of
> tricky, manipulative games on you, and if you
> let them get very close to you, you will likely
> regret it bitterly. (That's a big reason why
> some "self-help" groups have the rule that the
> members may have no social relations with each
> other outside the meetings.) It does seem that
> many "users" are just that, in both senses of
> the word.
chemicals of a solid, liquid or gaseous form for 20
years. For 18 years I have help countless hundreds
of people move towards becoming physically vital, emotionally
stable and mentally clear about who they are and
their relationship to the Greater Whole. I
completed the Saturn cycle two years ago.
Hell, Robert, the world is filled with users! So
what else is new that you can broadcast?
There is a pattern unfolding in your writing. I
wonder if you are aware of it?
> I hope that you keep your BS meter with youMy BS meter is finely tuned and calibrated. That is
> at all times, keep it calibrated, keep good
> batteries in it, and set the alarm to LOUD.
why I asked you why you continue to take Joel to
task as the alarm is sounded forth after reading
your homily about Joel.
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