- Welcome Steve,
Thank you for coming on board to our site...from your ancient
waterway in W. Minnesota or coastal Santa Cruz, California, to each
Mutual friend Marion Dahm spoke frequently and fondly of you,
Steve, was enthusiastic about the work you were doing in regard to
the Kensington Runestone, ancient viking seafarer exploration of
North America, and especially mooring stones. Days prior to Marion's
untimely death, I'd spent over an hour on the phone reading to him,
verbatum, letters you and others had posted to the PreColumbian
Inscriptions and Ohio Rock "thor" group message boards. Marion
remarked that you were a real sleuth and no doubt possessed the same
kind of passion and energy for the kind of work that both of you
were doing. He added, that you would need it. I, too, miss him very
much. See Posts #30, 31, & 35 to this group, particularly the fine
eulogy about Marion from Ancient Waterways Society member Pam Giese
that she wrote to the "thor group" and also included in a post to
Surveyor James Scherz, also a longtime friend of Marion, had been
planning an October, 2006 trip with Marion up to Lake Nipigon or
Nippising (cannot redcall the name of the Canadian lake) prior to the
AAAPF Conference. Jim is courting my good friend Laurie in Central
Wisconsin and spends considerable amounts of time in the Wausau area.
He stopped yesterday while I was seated reading posts. I showed him
the Ancient Waterways Society web site and your post, which he asked
me to run a print of. Also a couple of posts from Stan re: the AES
meeting Jan. 18th (which he plans to attend), along with the whale
bone and MSNBC article about the upcoming documentary on the Great
Lakes 10,000 years ago.
I have long been using the name "Ancient Waterways Society" based on
papers by retired UW Madison prof. James Scherz, also from
writings and talks by Fred Rydholm, author/researcher David Hoffman,
and others. Marion Dahm also included himself as a member of
an "Ancient Waterways Society" but did not own a computer in order to
follow group posts. All three friends listed above held very close
ties with Marion Dahm, housed him when Marion asked me to transport
him through northern Wisconsin, Keweenaw Peninsula, Marquette, then
down along Lake Michigan to Door County where Marion was following up
a lead seeking his first mooring stone in that area.
In your post, Steve, did you indicate that you purchased an entire
set of the mid-1800's survey maps of Minnesota? Dr. Scherz is
working with a survey group researching the origins of the
Mississippi River and we wondered if a single survey map can be
purchased. I want to mention to this group, by the way, that when I
first told him an Ancient Waterways Society web page had been set up,
Jim thought this site would be a good place for researchers to
display papers. He offered a full 24 page research article to us to
post to this site, which he also sells through the Ancient American
Magazine Book Club. The retired professor doesn't have an operational
computer; I don't own Microsoft Word, am using dial-up service, and
neither the computer nor myself has the sophistication to download
large files. Title page of Jim's paper reads:
"OLD WATER LEVELS AND WATERWAYS During the Ancient Copper Mining Era
(about 3000 BC to 1000 BC)"
James P. Scherz, Prof. Emeritus
Dept. of Civil and Environmental Engineering
(Surveying and Mapping Section)
University of Wisconsin
David Hoffman, mentioned above, emailed a day or two ago he was
having difficulty signing on as a member of this web group so that he
could write posts. His latest work on ancient seafarers into the
Great Lakes focuses on a N. Wisconsin origin of the Wisconsin River.
I emailed back to David that I believe one must first sign on as a
member of Yahoo groups, which includes obtaining a Yahoo email
address. When I joined my first Yahoogroup (PreColumbian
Inscriptions), a post to the group from Mike White assisted me step-
by-step in joining. I have been unable to find Mike's helpful message
to that site.
Before signing off, I wish to include other web groups mentioned
in this letter. A few of us posting here view Messages or are
members of the other specialty Yahoogroups:
PreColumbain Inscriptions (host Mike White):
The Thor (Ohio Rock) site (host William Smith):
American Runestones (recently resurrected by Steven Hilgren):
Ancient American Artifact Preservation Foundation (AAAPF), host Rick
Looking forward to hearing more about your work. Also from those of
you who continue on patiently, as members, despite the sometimes
infrequency of posts. We do hope that the letters posted here make
it worthwhile. Any comments or ideas to improve this web page would
M. Susan English
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "hilgren"
Hi Susan,Stan and other members
My name is Steve and I am from west central minnesota. I do
ancient viking research and have found an interesting map that members
may not have. There are a set of 48 maps that are the original land
survey from the mid 1800,s. These maps cover an area from the dakota
minnesota border, east thru wisconsin and Michigan. They are very
detailed and the whole set is over $200. Each map is 2x3 and is $5 and
can be ordered separately. These maps are copywrited and so can be
only purchased from the Trygg Land Office in Ely minnesota...
These maps have been a great help in my research. They show clearly
the higher water marks that the first settlers were encountering and
the waterways that were once the highways to the interior.
In the last year I have began viewing the glass not as half full or
half empty but as FULL and the midwest covered by water and large
shallow inland seas. I started with an all blue picture and then
started dropping the waters and mapping the islands as they began to
emerge. Soon I could then see the remains of these inland seas and
ancient waterways on the trygg land maps.
On the (KRS) kensington runestone, the last line says, "from this
island,year 1362"..... ISLAND???.Where was the water???
I have tried this last year to picture the more extreme high waters
that would correspond with the different dates. Norse explorers of
1362, viking explorers of a 1000 years ago and then even more ancients
of 2-5 thousand years ago.
In july I found a new higher water mark and have begun mapping these
beaches. I am working on these maps this winter and mapping these
islands as the ancients would have found them.
Thanks and happy hunting in the new year.
- Good Sunday Morning
Hi Susan and thanks for your reply. It is always good
to hear from you. My internet is wireless and portable
but seasonal and when I get to rural minnesota it
stops. BUT a new coffee shop has just opened in
Alexandria and I will now be able to get online a few
minutes a week. Here in california I live next to the
silicon valley and have the best ,,but then the north
woods of minnesota is the dark side of the moon.
...I do not have much interest in the west coast
waterways other than walking along them but I do try
to use it for it,s cutting edge tech and it gives me a
bit of time away to correspond,read, etc.
Susan wrote: "Steve, did you indicate that you
purchased an entire
set of the mid-1800's survey maps of Minnesota? Dr.
working with a survey group researching the origins of
Mississippi River and we wondered if a single survey
map can be
I have only 4 maps and they sell for $6 each and can
be purchased separately. It would take you about 10
maps for the upper mississippi. At their site you are
given a map to chose from: Minn,
#1,2,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,19 and iowa #1. are the numbers
I would guess???that would get the river bottom of
please,,NOW,however you need to see the world a bit
different than you may be use too...I am trying to
paint a new picture for EVERYONE based on the
discoverys of this last year. There is NO upper
mississippi river BUT it is a center and deepest point
of a LARGE inland sea. The west shore of this sea is
here in west central minnesota and the east shore is
not yet visible and may be near Duluth. When I put all
my maps together and put it up on the wall,,,out
jumped the new sea and the beaches along the edge of
that sea are marked on these maps. Here in west
central minn is two large islands and a cluster of
smaller islands on witch is the KRS.
ALSO,,,please note,,,there is no old upper
mississippi river valley before 1400,s,,,,Schoolcraft
was the indian agent who found itasca BUT Zebulin Pike
found the source somewhere else and I have a map that
also shows it in west central minnesota. Itasca was a
good place for a park, thats all! The lake in west
central minn is higher than itasca and also flows 3
directions and to the missippi,red river and hudson
bay and to lake superior.
you also wrote: "mailed back to David that I believe
one must first sign on as a
member of Yahoo groups, which includes obtaining a
that is probably best but not maybe necessary,,,but i
do notice that it is easyier to load photos to FILES
rather than photos.
I also belong to Thor and Pre columbus and American
This week I will be trying to scan my maps and
sattelite photos into my laptop and then post to your
sites and mine.They will give you a better look at
these maps. I spend hours looking at them and trying
to defind these ancient shores. ODDLY too,,these maps
have all the log cabins at the time and now have led
me to finding many of them too.
I look foreward to discussions in the coming month.
There is so much to do,,,as the picture on the puzzle
box gets clearer and clearer and bigger too. The beach
I found on this hillside this last summer is a WHOLE
NEW WORLD,,or old. This is maybe the highest watermark
of that greatflood on this inland sea.
I would call this new sea,,, Lake MARION or the
Marion OCEAN or the marion sea?????and i did get to
show him that sea last summer and we drove along it,s
beach. Here is the small bay which is a swamp today
and has my ship and also along this great new beach I
took the mooring stone photo with marion and leland.
I wish that some of these unused buttons on here
could be used and one was an excitement button,,,as I
would be pressing it often. I have learned to read the
KRS and the map on it. I would be pressing that
excitement button again...!?
Also i would hope that you and your friends know
about the free google earth and the new updates that
make flying obselete. They make tracing the river
simpler and it,s always a clear and sunny summer day
have a great day
ps,,susan...i got poor grades in english and my typing
skills have now graduated to two fingers....I took
shop class ,,,and have been building new homes and
remodeling for 25years. sorry!
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