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Re: Underwater "road" or "structure"?

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  • bigalemc2
    Herb - Yeah, you got an enigma on your hands, Dude. Good find! Yes, it might be natural, but I am leaning to it being something man made from a relatively
    Message 1 of 13 , Jan 15, 2008
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      Herb -

      Yeah, you got an enigma on your hands, Dude. Good find!

      Yes, it might be natural, but I am leaning to it being something man
      made from a relatively recent time period. To me, that is the Occam's
      razor on this. It makes what the images show make sense in the simplest
      way. Oh, it would be lovely if it is something from the copper age,
      but. . .

      From the images, it would certainly seem to be man made, rather than
      naturally occurring. Those cracks being at 90 degrees (mostly) is one
      point in favor of man made. Nature tends to not do things in 90-degree
      patterns - though one can't rule it out.

      That non-continuous crack in that one spot seem to rule out nature; if
      there were stresses in the stone that caused it to crack along some
      crystalline fault (like a diamond would do), I would expect the crack to
      extend across the entirety, IMHO. I can speculate on ways that the
      break wouldn't be fully across the area, but they have problems in
      themselves, so I threw them out of the argument.

      I think it best to find old records, preferably maps. If man made, this
      will show up there. No one builds without leaving some record. Roads
      of whatever kind are labor intensive, so no one would go to that trouble
      and then not put it on a map.

      I'd recommend also to see how long it extends, as soon as possible. If
      it is a road, there will be much more of it. If it is a stone bottom
      put in for a post-Columbian ford, then there should be some remnants of
      a real road on both sides of the river. It may not appear obvious right
      near the bank, due to erosion, occasional flooding, etc., so looking
      many feet away from the banks might give the best results.

      All this is speculation and - like your thoughts on the web page - can
      get you going in all kinds of directions. A few more facts can cut that
      all way down. The best way to narrow down the possibilities is to go
      get more facts. Take more photos, make some measurements, search under
      and around the vegetation, blah, blah, blah.

      Time to do some detective work...

      --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "herbswoods"
      <herbswoods@...> wrote:
      > Steve:
      > Thanks for the thoughtful response. I agree with everything you said
      > and all those things need to be done. Photos #4 & 5 are pretty
      > amazing, esp. #5 which shows very precise alignment.
      > You asked if the stucture has a crown to it From the photo it does
      > look like it, but in memory it seems that the structure was level. I
      > could be wrong, however, as I was not there very long. I didn't even
      > try to dislodge or move a block or otherwise test anything. It just
      > didn't occur to me at the time to test anything. All I wanted was to
      > obtain photographs and happily I was able to do.
      > It's probably of natural origin, but it's fun to speculate as the
      > region is a legend-haunted one.
      > HW
    • Susan
      Steve Garcia., Herb, and All I see from the enlargement in your (Steve G. s) email what you are referring to and perhaps send the enlargement to Herb s
      Message 2 of 13 , Jan 15, 2008
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        Steve Garcia., Herb, and All

        I see from the enlargement in your (Steve G.'s) email what you are
        referring to and perhaps send the enlargement to Herb's emailbox, too.
        With the imprint of the green into the circle on the unenlarged photo
        on Herb's web site, I am wondering if Herb might have laid a circular
        tripod or other poles into silt/mud into the river bottom at that
        spot to cause the imbedded circular 'ring' since Herb has the photos
        and was there. Herb, is there a lot of silt in parts of the river,
        and what do you think? I was snorkeling at Rock Lake near Madison
        years ago after a sweat lodge by a bunch of New Agers after reading
        Frank Jospeh's Pyramids of Rock Lake book. Deep, deep silt, and he
        speaks of the difficulty of investigating rock or any other
        structures beneath deep, still water such as lakes, esp. in
        agricultural or urban areas.

        Sorry I am posting so much but at a dormant time away
        from 'fieldwork' and most of us are up at least to our knees in snow,
        isn't this armchair line of inquiry interesting? Remember that some
        of this group's data can be applied to other, future leads and
        avenues of investigation.

        Welcome new member Richard from MA (Maine or Massechucetts?)


        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Stephen Garcia
        <puppet@...> wrote:
        > Susan -
        > I noted the comment by Chris and that particular photo, too, but -
        > it is my old fogy eyes - all I see is a long leaf curled up. I saw
        > round thing and wanted to see something there, but that is all I
        > Is it actually something IN the stone? Or is it an optical
        > I mean, it seems essentially the same color as the undersides of
        > other leaves in the photo.
        > At the same time, I DID wonder why Herb took the picture. If not
        > that, then what for? My only guess was to show the tangle he had
        > swim through.
        > But if it is a really something in the stone, that is, of course, a
        > different story.
        > ***
        > Okay: I saved the image to my hard drive, then opened it in a
        > program and zoomed in on that 'circle'. It appears to me to be a
        > in a continuation - the end - of the long, slender leaf that
        > diagonally across the image in a slightly sinuous pattern from the
        > left. I can even follow the leaf between the two - the sinuous
        part and
        > the loop at the end.
        > There even seems to be another leaf below it.
        > Here is the enlargement of that area:
        > Somebody tell me I am wrong...
        > Herb? Did you actually see something there? Was this something on
        > photo when you saw it later?
        > Steve Garcia
        > Susan wrote:
        > >
        > > Herb, Steve, and All,
        > >
        > > When I first opened the email reply from Christopher it had on the
        > > page one of your little photos. Now it isn't and it boggles my
        > > But I see what he was referreing to. Maybe Steve Garcia does, too.
        > > He is an engineer and long into ancient studies. Steve is a
        > > personal friend of Christopher Dunn, Hatcher Childress and some of
        > > their associates while I am more an acquaintence through
        > >
        > > Do you fellows and members at this message board see the circle
        > > within the green reedy photo on Herb's new web page (within the
        > > paragraph "That day, chilled by the...")?
        > >
        > > Dunn had written..."This photograph has a round depression in it
        > > looks remarkably precise. Can you find out more? Thanks, Chris"
        > > __
        > >
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