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Re: Trowels, not backhoes

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  • Susan
    All, I am very pleased to see two of our members, Rick Osman and Vince Barrows will be discussing Vince s involvement at Cahokia tomorrow night on the one hour
    Message 1 of 4 , Sep 11, 2007
      All,

      I am very pleased to see two of our members, Rick Osman and Vince
      Barrows will be discussing Vince's involvement at Cahokia tomorrow
      night on the one hour Oopa Loopa Cafe radio program. The web site
      states 7PM and, for first-time listneners, I assume it is Eastern
      Standard Time/EST. No doubt the conversation will also turn to
      Vince's research and listing of over 12,000 tablets.

      Previous Ancient Waterways posts in regard to Vince's Cahokia and
      tablets involvements, refer to Posts # 374, 372, 132, 111, 74, 73, &
      72.

      The beauty about web message boards such as this is that we can do a
      search on a particular subject or member and retrieve a list of back
      posts.

      Rick, you have been doing a superb job of bringing so many people and
      their research to the forefront in your radio program and web
      correspondence. I heard from several they particularly enjoyed your
      interesting and fairly recent dialogue with Steve Garcia. Thank you,
      too, for all you do. Looking forward to Vince's interview tomorrow.
      As usual, am working until 930 PM Thursday and will have to catch the
      program archives later.

      M. Susan English
      P.S. If there is anyone looking to share a room with one or more
      persons at the conference, please let me or conference Board Members
      know. I just found a couple of roommates myself. Thanks, Pam!

      --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Osmon"
      <ozman@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Hello Loopers!!
      >
      > This week we welcome Mr. Vince Barrows. Vince is spreading the word
      > regarding the irrepable damage done to Monks Mound recently under
      the
      > official description of "emergency repairs". These "repairs"
      removed a large
      > amount of soil that was simply hauled off and dumped. I'll let Vince
      > describe the actions and the ultimate losses caused by this ill-
      advised
      > action. Following is a post Vince made to Ancient Waterways:
      >
      > I would like to call your attention to the recent
      > damage done to one our states historic treasures. In
      > this case, the damage was done by the same people and
      > agencies that were responsible for protecting it.
      >
      > I am referring to the recent misguided attempts to
      > stabilize Monks Mound at the Cahokia Mounds State
      > Historic Site. Cahokia Mounds is the center of an
      > ancient Indian civilization. It contains a series of
      > earthen mounds, the largest of which is Monks Mound.
      > There are also hiking trails and a museum with a
      > visitor's center. Monks mound is by far the largest
      > mound of the complex. It was the foundation for the
      > Chief's temple.
      >
      > Historically, Monks Mound has also been subject to
      > erosion and slumping. During August 2007, an attempt
      > was made to prevent further erosion and stabilize the
      > structure. This involved cutting terraces into the
      > sides of the mound with backhoes (see photo).
      > Approximately 30,000 cubic feet of mound material was
      > removed and hauled away in dump trucks.
      >
      > No attempt was made to properly excavate these
      > terraces, record what was encountered or to sift the
      > material that was removed. Broken pottery, cedar
      > posts, and limestone blocks were encountered. Also
      > encountered were distinct layers of brightly colored
      > material. Quite possibly, these were brightly colored
      > surfaces covering earlier mounds. These layers of
      > colored soil may have included Native American
      > symbols. With the destructive excavation methods used,
      > we will never know.
      >
      > It should be remembered that Monks Mound is not a
      > single mound of dirt on which a temple was
      > constructed. Rather, it is a sequence of temples and
      > royal burials built one upon the other. The mound is
      > likely the best preserved record of thousands of years
      > of Native American civilization.
      >
      > Hopefully the state can review the manner in which
      > historic treasures are protected. Hopefully the people
      > responsible for this destruction can be held
      > accountable for the damage.
      >
      > For more information, see
      > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cahokia
      >
      > Other images and info:
      > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cahokia
      >
      > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:TriNotch
      >
      > Vince Price: I also have information about several tablets that
      were found
      > on Monks Mound including the Quincy Tablet, The crosshatched
      sandstone
      > tablet, the Peabody Snakestone tablet, and the birdman tablet
      >
      > http://s243.photobucket.com/albums/ff280/Marburg72/
      >
      > I hope you can listen to our discussion this Thursday, 13
      September, 2007
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Last week's show featured anthropologist Dale Drinnon. Dale and I
      talked
      > about the evidence of giants. We also segued into several other
      subjects..
      > You can listen to that segment HERE
      >
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > -----------------------------------
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > -----------------------------------
      >
      > Frode Omdahl drew my attention to an important resource
      >
      > http://www.canadiana.org/eco.php?page=PageView&id=738a6ab7f0906f4e
      >
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > ----------------------------------
      >
      > Silent secrets of the sea
      >
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > -----------------------------------
      >
      > Prehistoric find located beneath the waves
      >
      > (How did people drive pilings 6000 years ago?)
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > ---------
      >
      > The show's web site, oopaloopacafe.com, is finally live. Updates
      and needed
      > edits will go in this week.
      >
      > Any suggestions will be considered, any misspellings or other gaffs
      you
      > might find, please let me know. Thanks
      >
      >
      ======================================================================
      ====
      >
      > If at any time you no longer wish to receive these weekly
      reminders, simply
      > reply to this email and I will reluctantly and gently remove you
      from the
      > list.
      >
      > Your host
      > Rick Osmon, aka Oz
      > http://oopaloopacafe.com
      > http://blogtalkradio.com/oopa-loopa-cafe
      >
      > Call in during show (646) 652-2720
      >
      > IM to "oopaloopacafe" on Yahoo Messenger or Windows Live messenger,
      during
      > show
      >
      > Mobile (not during show, please) (812) 259-1102
      >
      > ozman@...
      > No virus found in this outgoing message.
      > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
      > Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.12/997 - Release Date:
      9/9/2007
      > 10:17 AM
      >
    • Rick Osmon
      Hi Susan/all. The show starts at 9 PM eastern Thursday, September 13th, not sure where you found 7 PM, unless you re computer is set on Mountain time. Just go
      Message 2 of 4 , Sep 11, 2007
        Hi Susan/all. The show starts at 9 PM eastern Thursday, September 13th, not sure where you found 7 PM, unless you're computer is set on Mountain time. 

        Just go to blogtaldradio.com/oopa-loopa-cafe  a couple minutes before the hour and click on the "Listen" button. Or, now that the oopaloopacafe.com  site is up and running, you can go to the main page and click on the button there at the appointed time  (unabashed self-promotion).

        I had a long conversation with Vince regarding the damage to the mound. The pictures only tell part of the story, Vince will fill in some details that just don't come through in the photos. The whole affair is downright appalling.

        Yes, I'm certain we'll get to his study (and extensive work) regarding the tablets. There is grist there for several segments of OLC, but we'll probably have to give those tablets a "lick and a promise" for this one.

        If anyone missed the links for the photos, you can find them here

        I promise I'll get back to the discussion with Steve regarding Hapgood and Velikosky, but it will probably be a couple weeks into November before my schedule frees up a little. The conference, moving,  and my upcoming wedding is eating much, much time...

        Oz




        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Susan" <beldingenglish@...> wrote:
        >
        > All,
        >
        > I am very pleased to see two of our members, Rick Osman and Vince
        > Barrows will be discussing Vince's involvement at Cahokia tomorrow
        > night on the one hour Oopa Loopa Cafe radio program. The web site
        > states 7PM and, for first-time listneners, I assume it is Eastern
        > Standard Time/EST. No doubt the conversation will also turn to
        > Vince's research and listing of over 12,000 tablets.
        >
        > Previous Ancient Waterways posts in regard to Vince's Cahokia and
        > tablets involvements, refer to Posts # 374, 372, 132, 111, 74, 73, &
        > 72.
        >
        > The beauty about web message boards such as this is that we can do a
        > search on a particular subject or member and retrieve a list of back
        > posts.
        >
        > Rick, you have been doing a superb job of bringing so many people and
        > their research to the forefront in your radio program and web
        > correspondence. I heard from several they particularly enjoyed your
        > interesting and fairly recent dialogue with Steve Garcia. Thank you,
        > too, for all you do. Looking forward to Vince's interview tomorrow.
        > As usual, am working until 930 PM Thursday and will have to catch the
        > program archives later.
        >
        > M. Susan English
        > P.S. If there is anyone looking to share a room with one or more
        > persons at the conference, please let me or conference Board Members
        > know. I just found a couple of roommates myself. Thanks, Pam!
        >
        > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Osmon"
        > ozman@ wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Hello Loopers!!
        > >
        > > This week we welcome Mr. Vince Barrows. Vince is spreading the word
        > > regarding the irrepable damage done to Monks Mound recently under
        > the
        > > official description of "emergency repairs". These "repairs"
        > removed a large
        > > amount of soil that was simply hauled off and dumped. I'll let Vince
        > > describe the actions and the ultimate losses caused by this ill-
        > advised
        > > action. Following is a post Vince made to Ancient Waterways:
        > >
        > > I would like to call your attention to the recent
        > > damage done to one our states historic treasures. In
        > > this case, the damage was done by the same people and
        > > agencies that were responsible for protecting it.
        > >
        > > I am referring to the recent misguided attempts to
        > > stabilize Monks Mound at the Cahokia Mounds State
        > > Historic Site. Cahokia Mounds is the center of an
        > > ancient Indian civilization. It contains a series of
        > > earthen mounds, the largest of which is Monks Mound.
        > > There are also hiking trails and a museum with a
        > > visitor's center. Monks mound is by far the largest
        > > mound of the complex. It was the foundation for the
        > > Chief's temple.
        > >
        > > Historically, Monks Mound has also been subject to
        > > erosion and slumping. During August 2007, an attempt
        > > was made to prevent further erosion and stabilize the
        > > structure. This involved cutting terraces into the
        > > sides of the mound with backhoes (see photo).
        > > Approximately 30,000 cubic feet of mound material was
        > > removed and hauled away in dump trucks.
        > >
        > > No attempt was made to properly excavate these
        > > terraces, record what was encountered or to sift the
        > > material that was removed. Broken pottery, cedar
        > > posts, and limestone blocks were encountered. Also
        > > encountered were distinct layers of brightly colored
        > > material. Quite possibly, these were brightly colored
        > > surfaces covering earlier mounds. These layers of
        > > colored soil may have included Native American
        > > symbols. With the destructive excavation methods used,
        > > we will never know.
        > >
        > > It should be remembered that Monks Mound is not a
        > > single mound of dirt on which a temple was
        > > constructed. Rather, it is a sequence of temples and
        > > royal burials built one upon the other. The mound is
        > > likely the best preserved record of thousands of years
        > > of Native American civilization.
        > >
        > > Hopefully the state can review the manner in which
        > > historic treasures are protected. Hopefully the people
        > > responsible for this destruction can be held
        > > accountable for the damage.
        > >
        > > For more information, see
        > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cahokia
        > >
        > > Other images and info:
        > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cahokia
        > >
        > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:TriNotch
        > >
        > > Vince Price: I also have information about several tablets that
        > were found
        > > on Monks Mound including the Quincy Tablet, The crosshatched
        > sandstone
        > > tablet, the Peabody Snakestone tablet, and the birdman tablet
        > >
        > > http://s243.photobucket.com/albums/ff280/Marburg72/
        > >
        > > I hope you can listen to our discussion this Thursday, 13
        > September, 2007
        > >
        > > ________________________________________________________________
        > >
        > > Last week's show featured anthropologist Dale Drinnon. Dale and I
        > talked
        > > about the evidence of giants. We also segued into several other
        > subjects..
        > > You can listen to that segment HERE
        > >
        > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        > > -----------------------------------
        > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        > > -----------------------------------
        > >
        > > Frode Omdahl drew my attention to an important resource
        > >
        > > http://www.canadiana.org/eco.php?page=PageView&id=738a6ab7f0906f4e
        > >
        > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        > > ----------------------------------
        > >
        > > Silent secrets of the sea
        > >
        > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        > > -----------------------------------
        > >
        > > Prehistoric find located beneath the waves
        > >
        > > (How did people drive pilings 6000 years ago?)
        > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        > > ---------
        > >
        > > The show's web site, oopaloopacafe.com, is finally live. Updates
        > and needed
        > > edits will go in this week.
        > >
        > > Any suggestions will be considered, any misspellings or other gaffs
        > you
        > > might find, please let me know. Thanks
        > >
        > >
        > ======================================================================
        > ====
        > >
        > > If at any time you no longer wish to receive these weekly
        > reminders, simply
        > > reply to this email and I will reluctantly and gently remove you
        > from the
        > > list.
        > >
        > > Your host
        > > Rick Osmon, aka Oz
        > > http://oopaloopacafe.com
        > > http://blogtalkradio.com/oopa-loopa-cafe
        > >
        > > Call in during show (646) 652-2720
        > >
        > > IM to "oopaloopacafe" on Yahoo Messenger or Windows Live messenger,
        > during
        > > show
        > >
        > > Mobile (not during show, please) (812) 259-1102
        > >
        > > ozman@
        > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
        > > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
        > > Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.12/997 - Release Date:
        > 9/9/2007
        > > 10:17 AM
        > >
        >
      • Susan
        Hi Rick, Sorry to have put an incorrect time for the upcoming radio interview in my post; I have deleted the old web site altogether. If the first web site you
        Message 3 of 4 , Sep 12, 2007
          Hi Rick,

          Sorry to have put an incorrect time for the upcoming radio interview
          in my post; I have deleted the old web site altogether. If the first
          web site you listed in your last post is clicked, the last radio
          shows are all listed as 7PM. The second web link/new OLC site you
          list reads 9PM eastern, 6PM pacific.

          I suggest people use only the new one when entering the archives or
          to listen to a current show. Otherwise, there may be confusion by
          some re: the correct start time.

          Thanks again for all that you do, Rick. You indeed are busy. Thanks
          for being such a viable part of our web group.

          MSE

          --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Osmon"
          <ozman@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Hi Susan/all. The show starts at 9 PM eastern Thursday, September
          13th,
          > not sure where you found 7 PM, unless you're computer is set on
          Mountain
          > time.
          >
          > Just go to blogtaldradio.com/oopa-loopa-cafe
          > <http://www.blogtalkradio.com/hostpage.aspx?host_id=2579> a couple
          > minutes before the hour and click on the "Listen" button. Or, now
          that
          > the oopaloopacafe.com <http://oopaloopacafe.com/index.html> site
          is up
          > and running, you can go to the main page and click on the button
          there
          > at the appointed time (unabashed self-promotion).
          >
          > I had a long conversation with Vince regarding the damage to the
          mound.
          > The pictures only tell part of the story, Vince will fill in some
          > details that just don't come through in the photos. The whole
          affair is
          > downright appalling.
          >
          > Yes, I'm certain we'll get to his study (and extensive work)
          regarding
          > the tablets. There is grist there for several segments of OLC, but
          we'll
          > probably have to give those tablets a "lick and a promise" for this
          one.
          >
          > If anyone missed the links for the photos, you can find them here
          > <http://oopaloopacafe.com/current_nl.html>
          >
          > I promise I'll get back to the discussion with Steve regarding
          Hapgood
          > and Velikosky, but it will probably be a couple weeks into November
          > before my schedule frees up a little. The conference, moving, and
          my
          > upcoming wedding is eating much, much time...
          >
          > Oz
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"
          > <beldingenglish@> wrote:
          > >
          > > All,
          > >
          > > I am very pleased to see two of our members, Rick Osman and Vince
          > > Barrows will be discussing Vince's involvement at Cahokia tomorrow
          > > night on the one hour Oopa Loopa Cafe radio program. The web site
          > > states 7PM and, for first-time listneners, I assume it is Eastern
          > > Standard Time/EST. No doubt the conversation will also turn to
          > > Vince's research and listing of over 12,000 tablets.
          > >
          > > Previous Ancient Waterways posts in regard to Vince's Cahokia and
          > > tablets involvements, refer to Posts # 374, 372, 132, 111, 74,
          73, &
          > > 72.
          > >
          > > The beauty about web message boards such as this is that we can
          do a
          > > search on a particular subject or member and retrieve a list of
          back
          > > posts.
          > >
          > > Rick, you have been doing a superb job of bringing so many people
          and
          > > their research to the forefront in your radio program and web
          > > correspondence. I heard from several they particularly enjoyed
          your
          > > interesting and fairly recent dialogue with Steve Garcia. Thank
          you,
          > > too, for all you do. Looking forward to Vince's interview
          tomorrow.
          > > As usual, am working until 930 PM Thursday and will have to catch
          the
          > > program archives later.
          > >
          > > M. Susan English
          > > P.S. If there is anyone looking to share a room with one or more
          > > persons at the conference, please let me or conference Board
          Members
          > > know. I just found a couple of roommates myself. Thanks, Pam!
          > >
          > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Osmon"
          > > ozman@ wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Hello Loopers!!
          > > >
          > > > This week we welcome Mr. Vince Barrows. Vince is spreading the
          word
          > > > regarding the irrepable damage done to Monks Mound recently
          under
          > > the
          > > > official description of "emergency repairs". These "repairs"
          > > removed a large
          > > > amount of soil that was simply hauled off and dumped. I'll let
          Vince
          > > > describe the actions and the ultimate losses caused by this ill-
          > > advised
          > > > action. Following is a post Vince made to Ancient Waterways:
          > > >
          > > > I would like to call your attention to the recent
          > > > damage done to one our states historic treasures. In
          > > > this case, the damage was done by the same people and
          > > > agencies that were responsible for protecting it.
          > > >
          > > > I am referring to the recent misguided attempts to
          > > > stabilize Monks Mound at the Cahokia Mounds State
          > > > Historic Site. Cahokia Mounds is the center of an
          > > > ancient Indian civilization. It contains a series of
          > > > earthen mounds, the largest of which is Monks Mound.
          > > > There are also hiking trails and a museum with a
          > > > visitor's center. Monks mound is by far the largest
          > > > mound of the complex. It was the foundation for the
          > > > Chief's temple.
          > > >
          > > > Historically, Monks Mound has also been subject to
          > > > erosion and slumping. During August 2007, an attempt
          > > > was made to prevent further erosion and stabilize the
          > > > structure. This involved cutting terraces into the
          > > > sides of the mound with backhoes (see photo).
          > > > Approximately 30,000 cubic feet of mound material was
          > > > removed and hauled away in dump trucks.
          > > >
          > > > No attempt was made to properly excavate these
          > > > terraces, record what was encountered or to sift the
          > > > material that was removed. Broken pottery, cedar
          > > > posts, and limestone blocks were encountered. Also
          > > > encountered were distinct layers of brightly colored
          > > > material. Quite possibly, these were brightly colored
          > > > surfaces covering earlier mounds. These layers of
          > > > colored soil may have included Native American
          > > > symbols. With the destructive excavation methods used,
          > > > we will never know.
          > > >
          > > > It should be remembered that Monks Mound is not a
          > > > single mound of dirt on which a temple was
          > > > constructed. Rather, it is a sequence of temples and
          > > > royal burials built one upon the other. The mound is
          > > > likely the best preserved record of thousands of years
          > > > of Native American civilization.
          > > >
          > > > Hopefully the state can review the manner in which
          > > > historic treasures are protected. Hopefully the people
          > > > responsible for this destruction can be held
          > > > accountable for the damage.
          > > >
          > > > For more information, see
          > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cahokia
          > > >
          > > > Other images and info:
          > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cahokia
          > > >
          > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:TriNotch
          > > >
          > > > Vince Price: I also have information about several tablets that
          > > were found
          > > > on Monks Mound including the Quincy Tablet, The crosshatched
          > > sandstone
          > > > tablet, the Peabody Snakestone tablet, and the birdman tablet
          > > >
          > > > http://s243.photobucket.com/albums/ff280/Marburg72/
          > > >
          > > > I hope you can listen to our discussion this Thursday, 13
          > > September, 2007
          > > >
          > > > ________________________________________________________________
          > > >
          > > > Last week's show featured anthropologist Dale Drinnon. Dale and
          I
          > > talked
          > > > about the evidence of giants. We also segued into several other
          > > subjects..
          > > > You can listen to that segment HERE
          > > >
          > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
          ----
          > > --------
          > > > -----------------------------------
          > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
          ----
          > > --------
          > > > -----------------------------------
          > > >
          > > > Frode Omdahl drew my attention to an important resource
          > > >
          > > > http://www.canadiana.org/eco.php?
          page=PageView&id=738a6ab7f0906f4e
          > > >
          > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
          ----
          > > --------
          > > > ----------------------------------
          > > >
          > > > Silent secrets of the sea
          > > >
          > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
          ----
          > > --------
          > > > -----------------------------------
          > > >
          > > > Prehistoric find located beneath the waves
          > > >
          > > > (How did people drive pilings 6000 years ago?)
          > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
          ----
          > > --------
          > > > ---------
          > > >
          > > > The show's web site, oopaloopacafe.com, is finally live. Updates
          > > and needed
          > > > edits will go in this week.
          > > >
          > > > Any suggestions will be considered, any misspellings or other
          gaffs
          > > you
          > > > might find, please let me know. Thanks
          > > >
          > > >
          > >
          ======================================================================
          > > ====
          > > >
          > > > If at any time you no longer wish to receive these weekly
          > > reminders, simply
          > > > reply to this email and I will reluctantly and gently remove you
          > > from the
          > > > list.
          > > >
          > > > Your host
          > > > Rick Osmon, aka Oz
          > > > http://oopaloopacafe.com
          > > > http://blogtalkradio.com/oopa-loopa-cafe
          > > >
          > > > Call in during show (646) 652-2720
          > > >
          > > > IM to "oopaloopacafe" on Yahoo Messenger or Windows Live
          messenger,
          > > during
          > > > show
          > > >
          > > > Mobile (not during show, please) (812) 259-1102
          > > >
          > > > ozman@
          > > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
          > > > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
          > > > Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.12/997 - Release Date:
          > > 9/9/2007
          > > > 10:17 AM
          > > >
          > >
          >
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