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"Learning Native Wisdom"

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  • Ted Sojka
    There is a great book called Learning Native Wisdom , by Gary Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2 Gary has spent a life, learning
    Message 1 of 25 , Apr 10 8:34 AM


      There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary Holthaus,  University Press of Kentucky,   ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2 


      Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone.  He visited my town for three months this past Winter.   He met many local people here in Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what they had to say.

      At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,  adorned with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.  

      The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"

      It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that among the Innuit is many thousands of years.   I think most  ancient waterways people would have a good read with this book.  As the culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up call on how we can weather this coming event.   The hackneyed word "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models that have been around for thousands of years.   If any of you get the book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on this site.

      ted
    • james m clark jr
      Thanks again Ted, Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
      Message 2 of 25 , Apr 14 11:07 PM
        Thanks again Ted,

        Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
        and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.

        Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.

        Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.

        Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient

        Read more:
        http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
        und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD

        Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.

        http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/

        posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it

        Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.

        be well,
        jamey


        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
        > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
        >
        >
        > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
        > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
        > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
        > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
        > they had to say.
        >
        > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
        > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
        > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
        > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
        >
        > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
        > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
        >
        > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
        > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
        > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
        > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
        > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
        > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
        > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
        > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
        > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
        > this site.
        >
        > ted
        >
      • quarefremeruntgentes7@yahoo.com
        I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.* Jeff *My great-great grandmother was a
        Message 3 of 25 , Apr 15 2:18 AM
          I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*

          Jeff

          *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.


          Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

          -----Original Message-----
          From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
          Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
          To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
          Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

          Thanks again Ted,

          Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
          and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.

          Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.

          Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.

          Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient

          Read more:
          http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
          und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD

          Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.

          http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/

          posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it

          Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.

          be well,
          jamey


          --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
          > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
          >
          >
          > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
          > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
          > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
          > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
          > they had to say.
          >
          > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
          > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
          > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
          > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
          >
          > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
          > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
          >
          > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
          > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
          > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
          > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
          > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
          > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
          > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
          > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
          > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
          > this site.
          >
          > ted
          >




          ------------------------------------

          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • james m clark jr
          I m not sure I d use intrude. It seems very differnt now than it use to be. I m not sure if it s because I m older or if natural youthfulness has actually
          Message 4 of 25 , Apr 15 4:57 AM
            I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
            now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
            I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
            grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
            by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
            and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
            stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
            older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
            my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
            the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
            was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
            well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
            was so dark.

            can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
            not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
            yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.

            be well,
            jamey

            --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
            >
            > I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
            >
            > Jeff
            >
            > *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
            >
            >
            > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
            > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
            > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
            > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
            >
            > Thanks again Ted,
            >
            > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
            > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
            >
            > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
            >
            > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
            >
            > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
            >
            > Read more:
            > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
            > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
            >
            > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
            >
            > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
            >
            > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
            >
            > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.
            >
            > be well,
            > jamey
            >
            >
            > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
            > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
            > >
            > >
            > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
            > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
            > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
            > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
            > > they had to say.
            > >
            > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
            > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
            > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
            > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
            > >
            > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
            > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
            > >
            > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
            > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
            > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
            > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
            > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
            > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
            > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
            > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
            > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
            > > this site.
            > >
            > > ted
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
          • quarefremeruntgentes7@yahoo.com
            Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about internet pretendians. She did an hour long program about them on blogtalkradio.com . Jeff Sent via
            Message 5 of 25 , Apr 15 5:22 AM
              Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on blogtalkradio.com .

              Jeff


              Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

              -----Original Message-----
              From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
              Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
              To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
              Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

              I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
              now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
              I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
              grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
              by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
              and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
              stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
              older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
              my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
              the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
              was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
              well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
              was so dark.

              can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
              not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
              yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.

              be well,
              jamey

              --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
              >
              > I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
              >
              > Jeff
              >
              > *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
              >
              >
              > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
              > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
              > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
              > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
              >
              > Thanks again Ted,
              >
              > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
              > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
              > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
              >
              > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
              >
              > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
              >
              > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
              >
              > Read more:
              > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
              > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
              >
              > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
              >
              > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
              >
              > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
              >
              > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.
              >
              > be well,
              > jamey
              >
              >
              > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
              > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
              > >
              > >
              > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
              > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
              > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
              > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
              > > they had to say.
              > >
              > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
              > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
              > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
              > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
              > >
              > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
              > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
              > >
              > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
              > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
              > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
              > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
              > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
              > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
              > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
              > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
              > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
              > > this site.
              > >
              > > ted
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >




              ------------------------------------

              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • quarefremeruntgentes7@yahoo.com
              In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an Italian impersonating a Native American. Jeff Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T ... From:
              Message 6 of 25 , Apr 15 5:27 AM
                In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an Italian impersonating a Native American.

                Jeff


                Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

                -----Original Message-----
                From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on blogtalkradio.com .

                Jeff


                Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

                -----Original Message-----
                From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                was so dark.

                can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.

                be well,
                jamey

                --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
                >
                > I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                >
                > Jeff
                >
                > *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                >
                >
                > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                >
                > Thanks again Ted,
                >
                > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                >
                > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
                >
                > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
                >
                > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
                >
                > Read more:
                > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                >
                > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                >
                > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                >
                > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                >
                > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.
                >
                > be well,
                > jamey
                >
                >
                > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@> wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                > >
                > >
                > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                > > they had to say.
                > >
                > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                > >
                > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                > >
                > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
                > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                > > this site.
                > >
                > > ted
                > >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >




                ------------------------------------

                Yahoo! Groups Links





                ------------------------------------

                Yahoo! Groups Links
              • Ted Sojka
                Gary is anything but a pretend native, but a competent writer and scholar. He gained his ideas from teaching in many places where native wisdom is not dead,
                Message 7 of 25 , Apr 15 7:45 AM
                  Gary is anything but a pretend native, but a competent writer and scholar.  He gained his ideas from teaching in many places where native wisdom is not dead, and getting to know natives as persons, culture, and religion. He realized that what was being taught in schools was killing their cultures.  He quotes an Alaskan Secretary of education who announces that it is his goal to do just that among the North Slope tribes!    This book is for the rest of us non natives.  While he is not a Farley Mowatt type writer, with great stories and insights, his work is a good wake up call to all of us.  
                  On Apr 15, 2012, at 1:07 AM, james m clark jr wrote:

                   

                  Thanks again Ted,

                  Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                  and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.

                  Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.

                  Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.

                  Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient

                  Read more:
                  http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                  und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD


                  Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.

                  http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/

                  posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it

                  Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.

                  be well,
                  jamey


                  --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                  > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                  >
                  >
                  > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                  > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                  > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                  > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                  > they had to say.
                  >
                  > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                  > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                  > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                  > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                  >
                  > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                  > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                  >
                  > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                  > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                  > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                  > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                  > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                  > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                  > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
                  > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                  > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                  > this site.
                  >
                  > ted
                  >


                • charles bruns
                  My mother grew up in S Dakota, social worked, and knew lots of Indians + families.  Did not meet any affluent ones (ha,ha), but moved to Duluth.  While
                  Message 8 of 25 , Apr 15 7:47 AM
                    My mother grew up in S Dakota, social worked, and knew lots of Indians + families.  Did not meet any affluent ones (ha,ha), but moved to Duluth.  While working fuel assistance she met _____ Ravenfeather from New York, a dynamic woman with coarse black hair (dye?).  Of course whe wore moccasins, black dresses, and dripped Mexican silver and beads.  She asked to handle all 'native' peoples due to her special affinity (not stated).  Remember, she will be the one to decide how much heating you can have in the winter.  Anyway Duluth is a very Anishenabe city, we used to have more people from Red & Nett Lake than from Africa.  I have First Nation friends ( see my site, www.savageart.com ) and their reaction ranged from laughter when asked about her to a fellow whoes mother had been handled by her who described what he would do with a knife so she never use a pen again.  She fooled them for about a heartbeat.  If you want to know what a real urban winter camp is like, contact me off site.  charbruns@... 

                    From: "quarefremeruntgentes7@..." <quarefremeruntgentes7@...>
                    To: Ancient Waterways Society <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 7:27 AM
                    Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                     
                    In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an Italian impersonating a Native American.

                    Jeff


                    Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                    Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                    To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                    Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                    Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on blogtalkradio.com .

                    Jeff


                    Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                    Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                    To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                    Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                    I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                    now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                    I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                    grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                    by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                    and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                    stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                    older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                    my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                    the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                    was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                    well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                    was so dark.

                    can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                    not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                    yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.

                    be well,
                    jamey

                    --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
                    >
                    > I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                    >
                    > Jeff
                    >
                    > *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                    >
                    >
                    > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                    > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                    > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                    > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                    >
                    > Thanks again Ted,
                    >
                    > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                    > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                    >
                    > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
                    >
                    > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
                    >
                    > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
                    >
                    > Read more:
                    > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                    > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                    >
                    > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                    >
                    > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                    >
                    > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                    >
                    > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.
                    >
                    > be well,
                    > jamey
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                    > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                    > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                    > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                    > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                    > > they had to say.
                    > >
                    > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                    > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                    > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                    > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                    > >
                    > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                    > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                    > >
                    > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                    > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                    > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                    > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                    > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                    > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                    > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
                    > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                    > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                    > > this site.
                    > >
                    > > ted
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >




                    ------------------------------------

                    Yahoo! Groups Links





                    ------------------------------------

                    Yahoo! Groups Links





                  • charles bruns
                    I grew up on a sheep ranch.  We hayed, butchered, etc. on red clay that mainly grew rocks.  Part of the troika of three families cooping on labor &
                    Message 9 of 25 , Apr 15 8:04 AM
                      I grew up on a sheep ranch.  We hayed, butchered, etc. on red clay that mainly grew rocks.  Part of the troika of three families cooping on labor & equiptment was Jerry King (Mr. King to be and Jerry to my dad).  We was awful dark, but then everyone was who worked outside sun to sun.  His eyes looked like all the other 'french' guys I knew, (LeGarde, DuHaime, Savage), angular cheeks, etc.  No one in the fifties was Indian, or would admit it, and one day I asked him if he was related to the King of France, he laughed (as did everyone else in the hayloft) and said, "Sure."  char bruns

                      From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@...>
                      To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 6:57 AM
                      Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                       
                      I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                      now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                      I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                      grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                      by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                      and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                      stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                      older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                      my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                      the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                      was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                      well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                      was so dark.

                      can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                      not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                      yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.

                      be well,
                      jamey

                      --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
                      >
                      > I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                      >
                      > Jeff
                      >
                      > *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                      >
                      >
                      > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                      > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                      > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                      > To: <
                      href="mailto:ancient_waterways_society%40yahoogroups.com" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:ancient_waterways_society%40yahoogroups.com">ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                      > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                      >
                      > Thanks again Ted,
                      >
                      > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                      > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                      > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                      >
                      > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                      Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
                      >
                      > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
                      >
                      > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
                      >
                      > Read more:
                      >
                      target=_blank>http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                      > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                      >
                      > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                      >
                      > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                      >
                      > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                      >
                      > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I
                      forget I'm not.
                      >
                      > be well,
                      > jamey
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                      > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                      > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                      > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                      > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                      > > they had to say.
                      > >
                      > > At the Library here I picked up the book on
                      Native Wisdom, adorned
                      > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                      > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                      > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                      > >
                      > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                      > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                      > >
                      > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                      > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                      > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                      > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                      > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                      > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                      > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                      models
                      > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                      > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                      > > this site.
                      > >
                      > > ted
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >



                    • charles bruns
                      it is  called being a member of the Wannabee Tribe.  chb From: quarefremeruntgentes7@yahoo.com To: Ancient Waterways
                      Message 10 of 25 , Apr 15 8:09 AM
                        it is  called being a member of the Wannabee Tribe.  chb

                        From: "quarefremeruntgentes7@..." <quarefremeruntgentes7@...>
                        To: Ancient Waterways Society <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 4:18 AM
                        Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                         
                        I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*

                        Jeff

                        *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.


                        Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                        Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                        To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                        Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                        Thanks again Ted,

                        Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                        and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.

                        Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.

                        Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.

                        Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient

                        Read more:
                        http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                        und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD

                        Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.

                        http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/

                        posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it

                        Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.

                        be well,
                        jamey


                        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                        > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                        >
                        >
                        > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                        > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                        > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                        > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                        > they had to say.
                        >
                        > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                        > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                        > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                        > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                        >
                        > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                        > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                        >
                        > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                        > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                        > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                        > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                        > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                        > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                        > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
                        > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                        > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                        > this site.
                        >
                        > ted
                        >




                        ------------------------------------

                        Yahoo! Groups Links





                      • Susan
                        Jamey, re: your stating at the end of your post below, ... Perhaps I don t state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use
                        Message 11 of 25 , Apr 15 2:59 PM
                          Jamey, re: your stating at the end of your post below, ..." Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not...."

                          I personally have always considered you a 'legitimate' member of this group and as welcome as others here, I appreciate your contributions of many interesting links and ideas to our site.  
                          I am not computer savy at all and do not seem to be improving, but many of the suggestions you submit and languagung, including computer and 'archy' lingo, seems to go well over my head to the point that I cannot even comment on the ideas. There may be others here who feel the same way.  Because we do not have a group Moderator as groups such as PreColumbian Inscriptions and other YahooGroups have, most Posts here go uncommented upon, unless by the membership, and I am always glad especially to see posts that obviously took some time and thought to receive acknowledgement by one or more, or better yet, discussion.

                          Maybe Vince or Stan understands what your last post -- I believe sent yesterday -- is referring to re: YahooGroup Apps being considered for this group....

                          I am glad you are involved in a number of other groups, Jamey, but I hope you will consider yourself a valued member of Ancient Waterways Society.  

                          The abovementioned book listed in the Subject heading of this post retails for around $50, and beyond the pockbook of many here if unable to get it via interlibrary loan.  In the meantime, I would very much welcome it if Jamey, Ted, or someone do a review, or cite interesting passages from "Learning Native Wisdom", or any book related to our group's interests.

                          I always enjoyed Mike White's fine book reviews over at PreColumbian Inscriptions.  The hosts/co-hosts and others such as Steve Garcia from AWS have been members of Mike's group long before our group was founded.  In fact, because of our respect for that group, many of the suggestions and founding principles we carried over to our society.

                          Susan

                          --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Thanks again Ted,
                          >
                          > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                          > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                          >
                          > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2 members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we currently realize.
                          >
                          > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is costly.
                          >
                          > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could relace pricey perfume ingredient
                          >
                          > Read more:
                          > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                          > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                          >
                          > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                          >
                          > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                          >
                          > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                          >
                          > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I forget I'm not.
                          >
                          > be well,
                          > jamey
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka tedsojka@ wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                          > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana, Hudson
                          > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                          > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                          > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                          > > they had to say.
                          > >
                          > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                          > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old photo
                          > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                          > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                          > >
                          > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                          > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                          > >
                          > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                          > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                          > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                          > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                          > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                          > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                          > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using models
                          > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                          > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                          > > this site.
                          > >
                          > > ted
                          > >
                          >
                        • Mark Bennett
                          It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody and he certainly
                          Message 12 of 25 , Apr 16 5:27 AM
                            It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                            the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody and
                            he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                            about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                            long story about being “forced” into eating a corned beef by Jesse Lansky
                            and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                            rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30’s,40’s) was
                            to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                            (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and have
                            the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark

                            > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an
                            > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                            >
                            > Jeff
                            >
                            >
                            > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                            >
                            > -----Original Message-----
                            > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                            > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                            > To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                            > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                            >
                            > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                            > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                            > blogtalkradio.com .
                            >
                            > Jeff
                            >
                            >
                            > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                            >
                            > -----Original Message-----
                            > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                            > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                            > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                            > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                            >
                            > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                            > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                            > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                            > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                            > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                            > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                            > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                            > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                            > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                            > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                            > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                            > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                            > was so dark.
                            >
                            > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                            > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                            > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                            >
                            > be well,
                            > jamey
                            >
                            > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                            > quarefremeruntgentes7@... wrote:
                            >>
                            >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I
                            >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                            >>
                            >> Jeff
                            >>
                            >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no
                            >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                            >>
                            >> -----Original Message-----
                            >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                            >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                            >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                            >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                            >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                            >>
                            >> Thanks again Ted,
                            >>
                            >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                            >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                            >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                            >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                            >>
                            >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                            >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                            >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                            >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                            >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough
                            >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take
                            >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                            >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups.
                            >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we
                            >> currently realize.
                            >>
                            >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                            >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is
                            >> costly.
                            >>
                            >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                            >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                            >>
                            >> Read more:
                            >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                            >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                            >>
                            >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                            >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                            >>
                            >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                            >>
                            >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding
                            >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                            >>
                            >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short
                            >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more
                            >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                            >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I
                            >> forget I'm not.
                            >>
                            >> be well,
                            >> jamey
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@>
                            >> wrote:
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                            >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                            >> Hudson
                            >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                            >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                            >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                            >> > they had to say.
                            >> >
                            >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                            >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                            >> photo
                            >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                            >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                            >> >
                            >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                            >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                            >> >
                            >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                            >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                            >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                            >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                            >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                            >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                            >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                            >> models
                            >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                            >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                            >> > this site.
                            >> >
                            >> > ted
                            >> >
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> ------------------------------------
                            >>
                            >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                          • james m clark jr
                            I could be wrong but I don t think Gary was ever in doubt Ted. Jeff seems to be either addressing me or how crazy it can get in a public groups in general
                            Message 13 of 25 , Apr 16 8:49 AM
                              I could be wrong but I don't think Gary was ever in doubt Ted.
                              Jeff seems to be either addressing me or how crazy it can get in a public groups in general perhaps. The Google group Jeff brought up was one of the first groups I started in. It's no different in Yahoo! public groups. I'm quit frank in either public or private groups myself it makes no difference. Although the posers are sought out like yellow jackets swarming around pear trees at harvest time they will evenually go away but not before invited to Native 2 Native 2 from Google alt. Native if it's no one but Little Red Hawk I will count it as a blessing but the last I heard he needed a pc... which isn't the case as it was in 2002 03 04. Yahoo! Chat is like google groups it will be there forever and not used much anywhere except perhaps at Native 2 Native 2.

                              be well,
                              jamey



                              --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Gary is anything but a pretend native, but a competent writer and
                              > scholar. He gained his ideas from teaching in many places where
                              > native wisdom is not dead, and getting to know natives as persons,
                              > culture, and religion. He realized that what was being taught in
                              > schools was killing their cultures. He quotes an Alaskan Secretary of
                              > education who announces that it is his goal to do just that among the
                              > North Slope tribes! This book is for the rest of us non natives.
                              > While he is not a Farley Mowatt type writer, with great stories and
                              > insights, his work is a good wake up call to all of us.
                              > On Apr 15, 2012, at 1:07 AM, james m clark jr wrote:
                              >
                              > > Thanks again Ted,
                              > >
                              > > Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                              > > review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                              > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                              > > and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                              > >
                              > > Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                              > > would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                              > > April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                              > > members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                              > > isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had
                              > > enough criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                              > > may take some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully
                              > > Susan Stan & Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options
                              > > at Yahoo! Groups. This will enhances group particapation greatly I
                              > > think sooner than we currently realize.
                              > >
                              > > Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                              > > effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris
                              > > is costly.
                              > >
                              > > Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                              > > relace pricey perfume ingredient
                              > >
                              > > Read more:
                              > > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo
                              > > \
                              > > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-
                              > > article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                              > >
                              > > Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                              > > Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                              > >
                              > > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                              > >
                              > > posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                              > > regarding the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                              > > prefer it
                              > >
                              > > Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to
                              > > short stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                              > > 98% more active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I
                              > > am not a ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                              > > Sometime I forget I'm not.
                              > >
                              > > be well,
                              > > jamey
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                              > > <tedsojka@> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                              > > > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                              > > Hudson
                              > > > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                              > > > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                              > > > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                              > > > they had to say.
                              > > >
                              > > > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                              > > > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                              > > photo
                              > > > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably
                              > > an
                              > > > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                              > > >
                              > > > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                              > > > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                              > > >
                              > > > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                              > > > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                              > > > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                              > > > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake
                              > > up
                              > > > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                              > > > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must
                              > > be
                              > > > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                              > > models
                              > > > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                              > > > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                              > > > this site.
                              > > >
                              > > > ted
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • james m clark jr
                              ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty. COME AND GET IT!! Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia Georgia
                              Message 14 of 25 , Apr 16 5:59 PM
                                ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                COME AND GET IT!!

                                Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak Tree if I recall the archives correctly.

                                be well,
                                jamey

                                --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett" <mlbennett@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                                > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody and
                                > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                                > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                                > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by Jesse Lansky
                                > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                                > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30's,40's) was
                                > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                                > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and have
                                > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark
                                >
                                > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an
                                > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                > >
                                > > Jeff
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                > >
                                > > -----Original Message-----
                                > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                                > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                > > To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                > >
                                > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                                > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                > >
                                > > Jeff
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                > >
                                > > -----Original Message-----
                                > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                                > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                > > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                > >
                                > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                > > was so dark.
                                > >
                                > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                                > >
                                > > be well,
                                > > jamey
                                > >
                                > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                > >>
                                > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I
                                > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                > >>
                                > >> Jeff
                                > >>
                                > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no
                                > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                > >>
                                > >> -----Original Message-----
                                > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                > >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                > >>
                                > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                > >>
                                > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                                > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                > >>
                                > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                                > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                                > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                                > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                                > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough
                                > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take
                                > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                                > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups.
                                > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we
                                > >> currently realize.
                                > >>
                                > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                                > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is
                                > >> costly.
                                > >>
                                > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                                > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                > >>
                                > >> Read more:
                                > >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                                > >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                                > >>
                                > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                                > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                > >>
                                > >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                > >>
                                > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding
                                > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                                > >>
                                > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short
                                > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more
                                > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                                > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I
                                > >> forget I'm not.
                                > >>
                                > >> be well,
                                > >> jamey
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@>
                                > >> wrote:
                                > >> >
                                > >> >
                                > >> >
                                > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                                > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                > >> >
                                > >> >
                                > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                                > >> Hudson
                                > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                                > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                                > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                                > >> > they had to say.
                                > >> >
                                > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                                > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                                > >> photo
                                > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                                > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                > >> >
                                > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                > >> >
                                > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                                > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                                > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                                > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                                > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                                > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                                > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                                > >> models
                                > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                                > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                                > >> > this site.
                                > >> >
                                > >> > ted
                                > >> >
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >> ------------------------------------
                                > >>
                                > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                > >>
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > ------------------------------------
                                > >
                                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > ------------------------------------
                                > >
                                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                >
                              • Mark Bennett
                                It was a corned beef sandwich and probably from one of the best deli s in LA. Mark
                                Message 15 of 25 , Apr 16 7:16 PM
                                  It was a corned beef sandwich and probably from one of the best deli's in
                                  LA. Mark



                                  > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                  > COME AND GET IT!!
                                  >
                                  > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia
                                  > Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard was
                                  > alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water mill
                                  > or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak Tree if I
                                  > recall the archives correctly.
                                  >
                                  > be well,
                                  > jamey
                                  >
                                  > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                  > <mlbennett@...> wrote:
                                  >>
                                  >> It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                                  >> the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody
                                  >> and
                                  >> he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                                  >> about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                                  >> long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by Jesse
                                  >> Lansky
                                  >> and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                                  >> rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30's,40's)
                                  >> was
                                  >> to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                                  >> (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and
                                  >> have
                                  >> the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark
                                  >>
                                  >> > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for
                                  >> being an
                                  >> > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Jeff
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                  >> >
                                  >> > -----Original Message-----
                                  >> > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                                  >> > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                  >> > To: Ancient Waterways
                                  >> Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                  >> > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                                  >> > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                  >> > blogtalkradio.com .
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Jeff
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                  >> >
                                  >> > -----Original Message-----
                                  >> > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                                  >> > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                  >> > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                  >> > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                  >> >
                                  >> > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                  >> > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                  >> > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                  >> > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                  >> > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                  >> > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                  >> > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                  >> > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                  >> > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                  >> > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                  >> > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                  >> > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                  >> > was so dark.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                  >> > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                  >> > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > be well,
                                  >> > jamey
                                  >> >
                                  >> > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                  >> > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although
                                  >> I
                                  >> >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Jeff
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have
                                  >> no
                                  >> >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> -----Original Message-----
                                  >> >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                  >> >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                  >> >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                  >> >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                  >> >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Thanks again Ted,
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                                  >> >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                  >> >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                  >> >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                                  >> >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                                  >> >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                                  >> >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                                  >> >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had
                                  >> enough
                                  >> >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may
                                  >> take
                                  >> >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                                  >> >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo!
                                  >> Groups.
                                  >> >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than
                                  >> we
                                  >> >> currently realize.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                                  >> >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris
                                  >> is
                                  >> >> costly.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                                  >> >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Read more:
                                  >> >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                                  >> >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                                  >> >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                  >> regarding
                                  >> >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to
                                  >> short
                                  >> >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98%
                                  >> more
                                  >> >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                                  >> >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime
                                  >> I
                                  >> >> forget I'm not.
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> be well,
                                  >> >> jamey
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                  >> <tedsojka@>
                                  >> >> wrote:
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                                  >> >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                                  >> >> Hudson
                                  >> >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                                  >> >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                                  >> >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and
                                  >> what
                                  >> >> > they had to say.
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                  >> adorned
                                  >> >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                                  >> >> photo
                                  >> >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably
                                  >> an
                                  >> >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                  >> >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                                  >> >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                  >> ancient
                                  >> >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                                  >> >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake
                                  >> up
                                  >> >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                                  >> >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must
                                  >> be
                                  >> >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                                  >> >> models
                                  >> >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get
                                  >> the
                                  >> >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion
                                  >> on
                                  >> >> > this site.
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >> > ted
                                  >> >> >
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> ------------------------------------
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >> >>
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > ------------------------------------
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > ------------------------------------
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >>
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                • james m clark jr
                                  aarrr!! BurnHEART/Bernard Sorry about Mark, AWS, ... and you to Leola Dolee L.A. has walmart subs in their deli s now? ...mmm mmm Vegan corn beef sub please!!
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Apr 17 7:53 AM
                                    aarrr!! BurnHEART/Bernard
                                    Sorry about Mark, AWS,
                                    ... and you to Leola Dolee



                                    L.A. has walmart subs in their deli's now?
                                    ...mmm mmm Vegan corn beef sub please!!
                                    Hold the Tofu! Speaking of Tofu has anybody
                                    beside me tried to flame broil a Hebrew National
                                    hotdog... Reminded me of abraham & Daniel escaping
                                    the firey furnace.

                                    Examples of YahooGroup! Apps avalible for Yahoo Groups throughout post. What this would means for AWS members. Once moderators enable an application this would enable members to become a grouplet. Become a grouplet to whatever degree you want. These grouplet applcations as far as I know are applied only to Yahoo Groups! Online site or link

                                    http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ancient_waterways_society/grouplets/subscriptions

                                    And perhaps depending on applied apps is more like academic setting
                                    As you can see if you visit link or the AWS Homepage -- above Chat there it is right above it in Group Labs (Beta)-- Applications -- There are no apps currently at AWS. They have to be activated by group moderator In fact in 45 public & private groups 1 group only one had used only one app and had deleted that one and enabled it again the very next day. Other than that 15 years of yahoo groups have been cought in the digital dustben like staring lab rats. And the tools to make them stable was just a click away, unapplied unseen hidden and hanging on by a thread.

                                    Applications have been here for years at YahooGroups! Way before cell phone craze and multimedia apps

                                    could we use a:

                                    How To (Instructions) Enable group members to share "how
                                    to" guides

                                    This is an app. I didn't need to create a folder last year.
                                    In fact regarding secure issues & attachments there is an additional app for photos a total of 3 links to add photo at AWS. If applied to AWS this could be used for family, events, lectures, tours, sites,
                                    and yes there are 2 app for Maps a people map and location map and even a RSVP App for events or a created event that tracks how many folks are planning on atending an event. And all these tools and more could be at every AWS members disposal.

                                    The more you share as a grouplet the better the group can function is an idea to many have ignored. This would make group moderatation a whole lot easier and promote group responiblity and task managagement. Although AWS is a public group grouplet information is not disclosed to the general public.

                                    Reviews
                                    Enable your group to share reviews of restaurants, local businesses and services, electronics, movies, music, and more. Or create your own AWS review application.


                                    AWS has elected to be a Public Outlet to Ancient Waterways Society composed of AWS Members collectively as a body of International colleges from a verity of backgrounds and first nation peoples for the general public.

                                    People Map
                                    The People Map provides an easy way for group members to
                                    share where they're from and can also be used to create a dynamic
                                    address book for the group or to create group specific profiles.

                                    Places Map
                                    A great way for group members to share information about
                                    places that are relevant to the group. You can customize the map to make it about a specific type of place (e.g. restaurants or dog parks or tourist attractions) or leave it open to anything.


                                    Hold the Swiss...oh!!
                                    Hold the PASTRAMI Ohh No!! BLOOD SAUSAGE sandwish please.. No!!!
                                    Don't get me wrong I would love to try some really good corn beef.
                                    Irish family lives in FLa. Jewish family are proud to be... from the Father Land? Humm Stockholm Syndrome posers Some want in... some want out.

                                    Anywho... I have a good idea of where to look on the East Coast.
                                    West Coast: Los Angeles 34.0522° N, 118.2428° W
                                    East Coast: Conyers Ga 33.6675° N, 84.0178° W

                                    Conyers is about 25m just outside of Atlanta

                                    ...as a side order I'll take the Red no.40 Jello
                                    with cherry peppers & turkey bacon and a small bowl
                                    of your best broccoli soup! It's a Kosher thing...
                                    What's that... is the pink slime okay by me?
                                    Your the pre-cooked sandwich maker... suprise me.
                                    Yes! Freshly graded cheddar please. I expect the
                                    best in L.A. sub shops.

                                    Dude this a Fallout 3 New Vasas mod in L.A RPG's!!
                                    It's hard to imagine good corn beef at a sub slop
                                    at the chowhound chow all-day-long but if you insist
                                    that it is so good Jews & Muslims can eat here in peace
                                    ...okay perhaps not all that.

                                    I'd rather take my chances in the Resturant
                                    captial of the South in Conyers Georgia with once an
                                    excellent Ladino sub shop ... I wished!! It was a
                                    pressed tuna on toasted whole wheat sub is a Kosher fav.
                                    altough my first was made at the Frontera Mex-Mex Grill.
                                    Make them myself now. There is a local favorite Mexican
                                    eatery in Macon: Tacos La Playita noted for excellent casadia's wonderful serloin steak burritos and the best ever guacamole.

                                    If the Counry Kitchen buffet is still an all you can eat buffet
                                    for 8 to 10 bucks this place is unbelievable. Perhsps
                                    a non Kosher affiliation but when good health ratings
                                    are high and large sellection of fine fresh baked goods, dishes
                                    casseroles. Main course including Blackened Baked Alaskian Cod
                                    perhaps the best on ice on the entire East Coast. If
                                    it's not in Conyers it's not a Country Kitchen. An excelent
                                    stop for passerbys clubs, schools to bussiness lunchin.

                                    Biker Clubs & perhaps Societies can make request to the american spirit tv show to request touring suggestion segments you would like see. Warm Spings Georgia was the latest episode here in the southeast est

                                    American Spirit TV:
                                    LinkedIN
                                    Facebook
                                    Youtube

                                    be well,
                                    jamey

                                    --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett" <mlbennett@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > It was a corned beef sandwich and probably from one of the best deli's in
                                    > LA. Mark
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                    > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                    > >
                                    > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia
                                    > > Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard was
                                    > > alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water mill
                                    > > or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak Tree if I
                                    > > recall the archives correctly.
                                    > >
                                    > > be well,
                                    > > jamey
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                    > > <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                    > >>
                                    > >> It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                                    > >> the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody
                                    > >> and
                                    > >> he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                                    > >> about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                                    > >> long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by Jesse
                                    > >> Lansky
                                    > >> and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                                    > >> rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30's,40's)
                                    > >> was
                                    > >> to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                                    > >> (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and
                                    > >> have
                                    > >> the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark
                                    > >>
                                    > >> > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for
                                    > >> being an
                                    > >> > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Jeff
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > -----Original Message-----
                                    > >> > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                    > >> > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                    > >> > To: Ancient Waterways
                                    > >> Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > >> > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                                    > >> > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                    > >> > blogtalkradio.com .
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Jeff
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > -----Original Message-----
                                    > >> > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                    > >> > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                    > >> > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > >> > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                    > >> > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                    > >> > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                    > >> > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                    > >> > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                    > >> > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                    > >> > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                    > >> > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                    > >> > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                    > >> > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                    > >> > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                    > >> > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                    > >> > was so dark.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                    > >> > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                    > >> > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > be well,
                                    > >> > jamey
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                    > >> > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although
                                    > >> I
                                    > >> >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Jeff
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have
                                    > >> no
                                    > >> >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> -----Original Message-----
                                    > >> >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                    > >> >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                    > >> >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > >> >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >> >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Thanks again Ted,
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                                    > >> >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                    > >> >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                    > >> >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                                    > >> >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                                    > >> >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                                    > >> >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                                    > >> >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had
                                    > >> enough
                                    > >> >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may
                                    > >> take
                                    > >> >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                                    > >> >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo!
                                    > >> Groups.
                                    > >> >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than
                                    > >> we
                                    > >> >> currently realize.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                                    > >> >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris
                                    > >> is
                                    > >> >> costly.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                                    > >> >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Read more:
                                    > >> >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                                    > >> >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                                    > >> >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                    > >> regarding
                                    > >> >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to
                                    > >> short
                                    > >> >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98%
                                    > >> more
                                    > >> >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                                    > >> >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime
                                    > >> I
                                    > >> >> forget I'm not.
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> be well,
                                    > >> >> jamey
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                    > >> <tedsojka@>
                                    > >> >> wrote:
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                                    > >> >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                                    > >> >> Hudson
                                    > >> >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                                    > >> >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                                    > >> >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and
                                    > >> what
                                    > >> >> > they had to say.
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                    > >> adorned
                                    > >> >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                                    > >> >> photo
                                    > >> >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably
                                    > >> an
                                    > >> >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                    > >> >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                                    > >> >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                    > >> ancient
                                    > >> >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                                    > >> >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake
                                    > >> up
                                    > >> >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                                    > >> >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must
                                    > >> be
                                    > >> >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                                    > >> >> models
                                    > >> >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get
                                    > >> the
                                    > >> >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion
                                    > >> on
                                    > >> >> > this site.
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >> > ted
                                    > >> >> >
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> ------------------------------------
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    > >> >>
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > ------------------------------------
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > ------------------------------------
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >>
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                  • charles bruns
                                    send me all you want.  alot depends on if you are hungry.  chb From: james m clark jr To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com Sent:
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Apr 17 9:23 AM
                                      send me all you want.  alot depends on if you are hungry.  chb

                                      From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@...>
                                      To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                      Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"

                                       
                                      ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                      COME AND GET IT!!

                                      Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak Tree if I recall the archives correctly.

                                      be well,
                                      jamey

                                      --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett" <mlbennett@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                                      > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody and
                                      > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                                      > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                                      > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by Jesse Lansky
                                      > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                                      > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30's,40's) was
                                      > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                                      > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and have
                                      > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark
                                      >
                                      > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an
                                      > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                      > >
                                      > > Jeff
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                      > >
                                      > > -----Original Message-----
                                      > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@...
                                      > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                      > > To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                      > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                      > >
                                      > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                                      > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                      > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                      > >
                                      > > Jeff
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                      > >
                                      > > -----Original Message-----
                                      > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@...>
                                      > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                      > > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                      > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                      > >
                                      > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                      > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                      > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                      > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                      > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                      > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                      > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                      > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                      > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                      > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                      > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                      > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                      > > was so dark.
                                      > >
                                      > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                      > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                      > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                                      > >
                                      > > be well,
                                      > > jamey
                                      > >
                                      > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                      > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                      > >>
                                      > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I
                                      > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Jeff
                                      > >>
                                      > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no
                                      > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                      > >>
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                      > >>
                                      > >> -----Original Message-----
                                      > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                      > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                      > >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                      > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                      > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                                      > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                      > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                      > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                                      > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                                      > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                                      > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                                      > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough
                                      > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take
                                      > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                                      > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups.
                                      > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we
                                      > >> currently realize.
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                                      > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is
                                      > >> costly.
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                                      > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Read more:
                                      > >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                                      > >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                                      > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                      > >>
                                      > >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                      > >>
                                      > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding
                                      > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short
                                      > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more
                                      > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                                      > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I
                                      > >> forget I'm not.
                                      > >>
                                      > >> be well,
                                      > >> jamey
                                      > >>
                                      > >>
                                      > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@>
                                      > >> wrote:
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                                      > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                                      > >> Hudson
                                      > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                                      > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                                      > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                                      > >> > they had to say.
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                                      > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                                      > >> photo
                                      > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                                      > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                      > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                                      > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                                      > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                                      > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                                      > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                                      > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                                      > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                                      > >> models
                                      > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                                      > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                                      > >> > this site.
                                      > >> >
                                      > >> > ted
                                      > >> >
                                      > >>
                                      > >>
                                      > >>
                                      > >>
                                      > >> ------------------------------------
                                      > >>
                                      > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      > >>
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > ------------------------------------
                                      > >
                                      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > ------------------------------------
                                      > >
                                      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      >



                                    • james m clark jr
                                      I hear ya Charlie, AWS could have it s own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way. We could call
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Apr 17 2:30 PM
                                        I hear ya Charlie,

                                        AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.

                                        We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund


                                        For Sale
                                        Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.

                                        I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County Georgia.
                                        They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members

                                        min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.

                                        Give Away
                                        Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members, this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.

                                        be well,
                                        jamey


                                        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns <charbruns@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > send me all you want.  alot depends on if you are hungry.  chb
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@...>
                                        > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                        > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >  
                                        > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                        > COME AND GET IT!!
                                        >
                                        > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                        >
                                        > be well,
                                        > jamey
                                        >
                                        > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett" <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double check on
                                        > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes Cody and
                                        > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost immediately,
                                        > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me to a
                                        > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by Jesse Lansky
                                        > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I keep
                                        > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula (30's,40's) was
                                        > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the Mexicans
                                        > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes) and have
                                        > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed. Mark
                                        > >
                                        > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued for being an
                                        > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Jeff
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                        > > >
                                        > > > -----Original Message-----
                                        > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                        > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                        > > > To: Ancient Waterways Society<ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                        > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about "internet
                                        > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                        > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Jeff
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                        > > >
                                        > > > -----Original Message-----
                                        > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                        > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                        > > > To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                        > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                        > > >
                                        > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                        > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                        > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                        > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                        > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                        > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                        > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                        > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                        > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                        > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                        > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                        > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                        > > > was so dark.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                        > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                        > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the word.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > be well,
                                        > > > jamey
                                        > > >
                                        > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                        > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned, although I
                                        > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Jeff
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I have no
                                        > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                        > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                        > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                        > > >> To: <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                        > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers abstrat
                                        > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                        > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                        > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought this
                                        > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of Slumber Event
                                        > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only produced 2
                                        > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov. Scott. Joe
                                        > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has had enough
                                        > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it may take
                                        > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan Stan &
                                        > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at Yahoo! Groups.
                                        > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner than we
                                        > > >> currently realize.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide wont be
                                        > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although ambergris is
                                        > > >> costly.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery could
                                        > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Read more:
                                        > > >> http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-vomit-fo\
                                        > > >> und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc9KNuJD
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at Ancient
                                        > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply regarding
                                        > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't prefer it
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due to short
                                        > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly 98% more
                                        > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am not a
                                        > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be. Sometime I
                                        > > >> forget I'm not.
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> be well,
                                        > > >> jamey
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka <tedsojka@>
                                        > > >> wrote:
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by Gary
                                        > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky, ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska, Montana,
                                        > > >> Hudson
                                        > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my town for
                                        > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people here in
                                        > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met and what
                                        > > >> > they had to say.
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom, adorned
                                        > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a fine old
                                        > > >> photo
                                        > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them, probably an
                                        > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                        > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul, and that
                                        > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most ancient
                                        > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As the
                                        > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be a wake up
                                        > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed word
                                        > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says it must be
                                        > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work, using
                                        > > >> models
                                        > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you get the
                                        > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for discussion on
                                        > > >> > this site.
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >> > ted
                                        > > >> >
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> ------------------------------------
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                        > > >>
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > ------------------------------------
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > ------------------------------------
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • Rick O
                                        Marbles were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher. Most of the clay and
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Apr 19 6:15 AM
                                          "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                          this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.

                                          Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                          30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                          spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                          crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                          cranium.

                                          These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                          found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                          Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                          the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?

                                          Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                          Scott Wolter.



                                          --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                          <jameyboy@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                          >
                                          > jmcjr
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                          jameyboy@ wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                          > >
                                          > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                          despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                          > >
                                          > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > For Sale
                                          > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                          can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                          of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                          > >
                                          > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                          Georgia.
                                          > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                          early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                          may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                          AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                          > >
                                          > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                          > >
                                          > > Give Away
                                          > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                          to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                          entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                          this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                          > >
                                          > > be well,
                                          > > jamey
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                          <charbruns@> wrote:
                                          > > >
                                          > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                          > > >
                                          > > >
                                          > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                          > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                          > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                          > > >
                                          > > >
                                          > > >
                                          > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                          > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                          Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                          was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                          mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                          Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > be well,
                                          > > > jamey
                                          > > >
                                          > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                          <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                          check on
                                          > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                          Cody and
                                          > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                          immediately,
                                          > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                          to a
                                          > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                          Jesse Lansky
                                          > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                          keep
                                          > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                          (30's,40's) was
                                          > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                          Mexicans
                                          > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                          and have
                                          > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                          Mark
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                          for being an
                                          > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Jeff
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                          > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                          > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                          > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                          Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                          Wisdom"
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                          "internet
                                          > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                          > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Jeff
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                          > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                          > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                          > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                          Wisdom"
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                          > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                          > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                          > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                          > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                          > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                          > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                          > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                          > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                          > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                          > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                          > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                          > > > > > was so dark.
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                          > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                          > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                          word.
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > be well,
                                          > > > > > jamey
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                          > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                          although I
                                          > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Jeff
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                          have no
                                          > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                          > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                          > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                          > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                          Wisdom"
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                          abstrat
                                          > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                          > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                          > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                          this
                                          > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                          Slumber Event
                                          > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                          produced 2
                                          > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                          Scott. Joe
                                          > > > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has
                                          had enough
                                          > > > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                                          may take
                                          > > > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan
                                          Stan &
                                          > > > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at
                                          Yahoo! Groups.
                                          > > > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner
                                          than we
                                          > > > > >> currently realize.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide
                                          wont be
                                          > > > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although
                                          ambergris is
                                          > > > > >> costly.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery
                                          could
                                          > > > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Read more:
                                          > > > > >>
                                          http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-\
                                          vomit-fo\
                                          > > > > >>
                                          und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc\
                                          9KNuJD
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at
                                          Ancient
                                          > > > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                          regarding
                                          > > > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                                          prefer it
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due
                                          to short
                                          > > > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                                          98% more
                                          > > > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am
                                          not a
                                          > > > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                                          Sometime I
                                          > > > > >> forget I'm not.
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> be well,
                                          > > > > >> jamey
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                          <tedsojka@>
                                          > > > > >> wrote:
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by
                                          Gary
                                          > > > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky,
                                          ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska,
                                          Montana,
                                          > > > > >> Hudson
                                          > > > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my
                                          town for
                                          > > > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people
                                          here in
                                          > > > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met
                                          and what
                                          > > > > >> > they had to say.
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                          adorned
                                          > > > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a
                                          fine old
                                          > > > > >> photo
                                          > > > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them,
                                          probably an
                                          > > > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                          > > > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul,
                                          and that
                                          > > > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                          ancient
                                          > > > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As
                                          the
                                          > > > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be
                                          a wake up
                                          > > > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed
                                          word
                                          > > > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says
                                          it must be
                                          > > > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work,
                                          using
                                          > > > > >> models
                                          > > > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you
                                          get the
                                          > > > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for
                                          discussion on
                                          > > > > >> > this site.
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >> > ted
                                          > > > > >> >
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> ------------------------------------
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                          > > > > >>
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > >
                                          > >
                                          >
                                        • Deb Twigg
                                          Actually, SRAC (waverly, ny) has tons of these in all sizes and shapes... Very few are a marble size...many are closer to a tennis ball size, some even
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Apr 19 6:35 AM
                                            Actually, SRAC (waverly, ny) has tons of these in all sizes and shapes... Very few are a marble size...many are closer to a tennis ball size, some even softball sized. We also have the discoidals and the other flattened "game pieces", as well as bolo stones...which clearly were flung as a weapon or hunting stone after being tied onto a leather strap... My point is that the round balls range into sizes that doubtfully were easy to be used with a slingshot .. And a perfectly round stone takes a long time to make to be used when another unworked pebble many times would do...For that reason I would think that rolling was the obvious reason for the worked sphere shape as well as the discoidals  (which are also always made of hard stone too and usually banged up)- for whatever purpose, gaming or anything else a round shape can be used for...

                                            Just another opinion!

                                            Deb Twigg
                                            Executive Director
                                            SRAC
                                            607-727-3111

                                            On Apr 19, 2012, at 9:15 AM, "Rick O" <ozman@...> wrote:

                                             

                                            "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                            this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.

                                            Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                            30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                            spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                            crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                            cranium.

                                            These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                            found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                            Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                            the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?

                                            Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                            Scott Wolter.

                                            --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                            <jameyboy@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                            >
                                            > jmcjr
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                            jameyboy@ wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                            > >
                                            > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                            despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                            > >
                                            > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > For Sale
                                            > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                            can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                            of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                            > >
                                            > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                            Georgia.
                                            > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                            early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                            may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                            AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                            > >
                                            > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                            > >
                                            > > Give Away
                                            > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                            to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                            entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                            this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                            > >
                                            > > be well,
                                            > > jamey
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                            <charbruns@> wrote:
                                            > > >
                                            > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                            > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                            > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                            > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                            Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                            was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                            mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                            Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > be well,
                                            > > > jamey
                                            > > >
                                            > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                            <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                            > > > >
                                            > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                            check on
                                            > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                            Cody and
                                            > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                            immediately,
                                            > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                            to a
                                            > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                            Jesse Lansky
                                            > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                            keep
                                            > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                            (30's,40's) was
                                            > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                            Mexicans
                                            > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                            and have
                                            > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                            Mark
                                            > > > >
                                            > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                            for being an
                                            > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Jeff
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                            > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                            > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                            > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                            Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                            Wisdom"
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                            "internet
                                            > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                            > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Jeff
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                            > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                            > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                            > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                            Wisdom"
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                            > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                            > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                            > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                            > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                            > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                            > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                            > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                            > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                            > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                            > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                            > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                            > > > > > was so dark.
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                            > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                            > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                            word.
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > be well,
                                            > > > > > jamey
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                            > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                            although I
                                            > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Jeff
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                            have no
                                            > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                            > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                            > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                            > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                            Wisdom"
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                            abstrat
                                            > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                            > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                            > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                            this
                                            > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                            Slumber Event
                                            > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                            produced 2
                                            > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                            Scott. Joe
                                            > > > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has
                                            had enough
                                            > > > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                                            may take
                                            > > > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan
                                            Stan &
                                            > > > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at
                                            Yahoo! Groups.
                                            > > > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner
                                            than we
                                            > > > > >> currently realize.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide
                                            wont be
                                            > > > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although
                                            ambergris is
                                            > > > > >> costly.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery
                                            could
                                            > > > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Read more:
                                            > > > > >>
                                            http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-\
                                            vomit-fo\
                                            > > > > >>
                                            und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc\
                                            9KNuJD
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at
                                            Ancient
                                            > > > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                            regarding
                                            > > > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                                            prefer it
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due
                                            to short
                                            > > > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                                            98% more
                                            > > > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am
                                            not a
                                            > > > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                                            Sometime I
                                            > > > > >> forget I'm not.
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> be well,
                                            > > > > >> jamey
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                            <tedsojka@>
                                            > > > > >> wrote:
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by
                                            Gary
                                            > > > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky,
                                            ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska,
                                            Montana,
                                            > > > > >> Hudson
                                            > > > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my
                                            town for
                                            > > > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people
                                            here in
                                            > > > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met
                                            and what
                                            > > > > >> > they had to say.
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                            adorned
                                            > > > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a
                                            fine old
                                            > > > > >> photo
                                            > > > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them,
                                            probably an
                                            > > > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                            > > > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul,
                                            and that
                                            > > > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                            ancient
                                            > > > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As
                                            the
                                            > > > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be
                                            a wake up
                                            > > > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed
                                            word
                                            > > > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says
                                            it must be
                                            > > > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work,
                                            using
                                            > > > > >> models
                                            > > > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you
                                            get the
                                            > > > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for
                                            discussion on
                                            > > > > >> > this site.
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >> > ted
                                            > > > > >> >
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> ------------------------------------
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                            > > > > >>
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > > >
                                            > > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > >
                                            >

                                            =
                                          • Larry Hancock
                                            I once read how real marbles were made anciently by placing a small rounded stone in a hole or depressioin in the rock and letting running water fall on it and
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Apr 19 6:52 AM
                                              I once read how real marbles were made anciently by placing a small rounded stone in a hole or depressioin in the rock and letting running water fall on it and turn it until it was perfectly rounded.

                                              --- On Thu, 4/19/12, Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...> wrote:

                                              From: Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...>
                                              Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                              To: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                              Cc: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                              Date: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 9:35 AM

                                               

                                              Actually, SRAC (waverly, ny) has tons of these in all sizes and shapes... Very few are a marble size...many are closer to a tennis ball size, some even softball sized. We also have the discoidals and the other flattened "game pieces", as well as bolo stones...which clearly were flung as a weapon or hunting stone after being tied onto a leather strap... My point is that the round balls range into sizes that doubtfully were easy to be used with a slingshot .. And a perfectly round stone takes a long time to make to be used when another unworked pebble many times would do...For that reason I would think that rolling was the obvious reason for the worked sphere shape as well as the discoidals  (which are also always made of hard stone too and usually banged up)- for whatever purpose, gaming or anything else a round shape can be used for...

                                              Just another opinion!

                                              Deb Twigg
                                              Executive Director
                                              SRAC
                                              607-727-3111

                                              On Apr 19, 2012, at 9:15 AM, "Rick O" <ozman@...> wrote:

                                               

                                              "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                              this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.

                                              Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                              30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                              spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                              crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                              cranium.

                                              These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                              found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                              Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                              the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?

                                              Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                              Scott Wolter.

                                              --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                              <jameyboy@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                              >
                                              > jmcjr
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                              jameyboy@ wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                              > >
                                              > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                              despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                              > >
                                              > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > For Sale
                                              > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                              can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                              of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                              > >
                                              > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                              Georgia.
                                              > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                              early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                              may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                              AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                              > >
                                              > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                              > >
                                              > > Give Away
                                              > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                              to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                              entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                              this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                              > >
                                              > > be well,
                                              > > jamey
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                              <charbruns@> wrote:
                                              > > >
                                              > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                              > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                              > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                              > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                              Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                              was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                              mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                              Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > be well,
                                              > > > jamey
                                              > > >
                                              > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                              <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                              check on
                                              > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                              Cody and
                                              > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                              immediately,
                                              > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                              to a
                                              > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                              Jesse Lansky
                                              > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                              keep
                                              > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                              (30's,40's) was
                                              > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                              Mexicans
                                              > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                              and have
                                              > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                              Mark
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                              for being an
                                              > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Jeff
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                              > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                              > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                              > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                              Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                              Wisdom"
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                              "internet
                                              > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                              > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Jeff
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                              > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                              > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                              > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                              Wisdom"
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                              > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                              > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                              > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                              > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                              > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                              > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                              > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                              > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                              > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                              > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                              > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                              > > > > > was so dark.
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                              > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                              > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                              word.
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > be well,
                                              > > > > > jamey
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                              > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                              although I
                                              > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Jeff
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                              have no
                                              > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                              > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                              > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                              > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                              Wisdom"
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                              abstrat
                                              > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                              > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                              > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                              this
                                              > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                              Slumber Event
                                              > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                              produced 2
                                              > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                              Scott. Joe
                                              > > > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has
                                              had enough
                                              > > > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                                              may take
                                              > > > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan
                                              Stan &
                                              > > > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at
                                              Yahoo! Groups.
                                              > > > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner
                                              than we
                                              > > > > >> currently realize.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide
                                              wont be
                                              > > > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although
                                              ambergris is
                                              > > > > >> costly.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery
                                              could
                                              > > > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Read more:
                                              > > > > >>
                                              http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-\
                                              vomit-fo\
                                              > > > > >>
                                              und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc\
                                              9KNuJD
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at
                                              Ancient
                                              > > > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                              regarding
                                              > > > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                                              prefer it
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due
                                              to short
                                              > > > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                                              98% more
                                              > > > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am
                                              not a
                                              > > > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                                              Sometime I
                                              > > > > >> forget I'm not.
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> be well,
                                              > > > > >> jamey
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                              <tedsojka@>
                                              > > > > >> wrote:
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by
                                              Gary
                                              > > > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky,
                                              ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska,
                                              Montana,
                                              > > > > >> Hudson
                                              > > > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my
                                              town for
                                              > > > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people
                                              here in
                                              > > > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met
                                              and what
                                              > > > > >> > they had to say.
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                              adorned
                                              > > > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a
                                              fine old
                                              > > > > >> photo
                                              > > > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them,
                                              probably an
                                              > > > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                              > > > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul,
                                              and that
                                              > > > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                              ancient
                                              > > > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As
                                              the
                                              > > > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be
                                              a wake up
                                              > > > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed
                                              word
                                              > > > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says
                                              it must be
                                              > > > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work,
                                              using
                                              > > > > >> models
                                              > > > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you
                                              get the
                                              > > > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for
                                              discussion on
                                              > > > > >> > this site.
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >> > ted
                                              > > > > >> >
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> ------------------------------------
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                              > > > > >>
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > >
                                              >

                                              =
                                            • Deb Twigg
                                              Neat! Deb Twigg Executive Director SRAC 607-727-3111 www.SRACenter.org
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Apr 19 7:01 AM
                                                Neat!

                                                Deb Twigg
                                                Executive Director
                                                SRAC
                                                607-727-3111

                                                On Apr 19, 2012, at 9:52 AM, Larry Hancock <hancocklarry40@...> wrote:

                                                 

                                                I once read how real marbles were made anciently by placing a small rounded stone in a hole or depressioin in the rock and letting running water fall on it and turn it until it was perfectly rounded.

                                                --- On Thu, 4/19/12, Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...> wrote:

                                                From: Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...>
                                                Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                                To: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                                Cc: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                                Date: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 9:35 AM

                                                 

                                                Actually, SRAC (waverly, ny) has tons of these in all sizes and shapes... Very few are a marble size...many are closer to a tennis ball size, some even softball sized. We also have the discoidals and the other flattened "game pieces", as well as bolo stones...which clearly were flung as a weapon or hunting stone after being tied onto a leather strap... My point is that the round balls range into sizes that doubtfully were easy to be used with a slingshot .. And a perfectly round stone takes a long time to make to be used when another unworked pebble many times would do...For that reason I would think that rolling was the obvious reason for the worked sphere shape as well as the discoidals  (which are also always made of hard stone too and usually banged up)- for whatever purpose, gaming or anything else a round shape can be used for...

                                                Just another opinion!

                                                Deb Twigg
                                                Executive Director
                                                SRAC
                                                607-727-3111

                                                On Apr 19, 2012, at 9:15 AM, "Rick O" <ozman@...> wrote:

                                                 

                                                "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                                this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.

                                                Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                                30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                                spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                                crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                                cranium.

                                                These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                                found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                                Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                                the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?

                                                Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                                Scott Wolter.

                                                --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                <jameyboy@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                                >
                                                > jmcjr
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                jameyboy@ wrote:
                                                > >
                                                > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                                > >
                                                > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                                despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                                > >
                                                > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > For Sale
                                                > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                                can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                                of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                                > >
                                                > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                                Georgia.
                                                > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                                early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                                may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                                AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                                > >
                                                > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                                > >
                                                > > Give Away
                                                > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                                to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                                entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                                this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                                > >
                                                > > be well,
                                                > > jamey
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                                <charbruns@> wrote:
                                                > > >
                                                > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                                > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                                > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                                > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                                Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                                was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                                mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                                Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > be well,
                                                > > > jamey
                                                > > >
                                                > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                                <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                                check on
                                                > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                                Cody and
                                                > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                                immediately,
                                                > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                                to a
                                                > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                                Jesse Lansky
                                                > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                                keep
                                                > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                                (30's,40's) was
                                                > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                                Mexicans
                                                > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                                and have
                                                > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                                Mark
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                                for being an
                                                > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > Jeff
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                                > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                                > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                                Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                Wisdom"
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                                "internet
                                                > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                                > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > Jeff
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                                > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                Wisdom"
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                                > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                                > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                                > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                                > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                                > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                                > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                                > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                                > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                                > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                                > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                                > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                                > > > > > was so dark.
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                                > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                                > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                                word.
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > be well,
                                                > > > > > jamey
                                                > > > > >
                                                > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                                > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                                although I
                                                > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> Jeff
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                                have no
                                                > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                                > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                                > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                Wisdom"
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                                abstrat
                                                > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                                > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                                > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                                > > > > >>
                                                > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                                this
                                                > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                                Slumber Event
                                                > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                                produced 2
                                                > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                                Scott. Joe
                                                > > > > >>

                                              • james m clark jr
                                                If Im not mistaken Larry mon, it seems it may have been our Sting Stone Stan (Min.Stan) who may have brought this up last year regarding these marbles that
                                                Message 23 of 25 , Apr 19 10:19 AM
                                                  If Im not mistaken Larry mon, it seems it may have been our Sting Stone Stan (Min.Stan) who may have brought this up last year regarding these marbles that somewhat favor turtle eggs but smaller or around the subject of Klerksdorp spheres also.

                                                  be well,
                                                  jamey mon

                                                  --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Larry Hancock <hancocklarry40@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > I once read how real marbles were made anciently by placing a small rounded stone in a hole or depressioin in the rock and letting running water fall on it and turn it until it was perfectly rounded.
                                                  >
                                                  > --- On Thu, 4/19/12, Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > From: Deb Twigg <deb_twigg@...>
                                                  > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                                  > To: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  > Cc: "ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com" <ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  > Date: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 9:35 AM
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >  
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Actually, SRAC (waverly, ny) has tons of these in all sizes and shapes... Very few are a marble size...many are closer to a tennis ball size, some even softball sized. We also have the discoidals and the other flattened "game pieces", as well as bolo stones...which clearly were flung as a weapon or hunting stone after being tied onto a leather strap... My point is that the round balls range into sizes that doubtfully were easy to be used with a slingshot .. And a perfectly round stone takes a long time to make to be used when another unworked pebble many times would do...For that reason I would think that rolling was the obvious reason for the worked sphere shape as well as the discoidals  (which are also always made of hard stone too and usually banged up)- for whatever purpose, gaming or anything else a round shape can be used for...
                                                  > Just another opinion!
                                                  >
                                                  > Deb TwiggExecutive DirectorSRAC607-727-3111www.SRACenter.org
                                                  > On Apr 19, 2012, at 9:15 AM, "Rick O" <ozman@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >  
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                                  >
                                                  > this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                                  >
                                                  > 30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                                  >
                                                  > spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                                  >
                                                  > crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                                  >
                                                  > cranium.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                                  >
                                                  > found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                                  >
                                                  > Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                                  >
                                                  > the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                                  >
                                                  > Scott Wolter.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                  >
                                                  > <jameyboy@> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > jmcjr
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                  >
                                                  > jameyboy@ wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                                  >
                                                  > despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > For Sale
                                                  >
                                                  > > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                                  >
                                                  > can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                                  >
                                                  > of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                                  >
                                                  > Georgia.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                                  >
                                                  > early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                                  >
                                                  > may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                                  >
                                                  > AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > Give Away
                                                  >
                                                  > > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                                  >
                                                  > to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                                  >
                                                  > entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                                  >
                                                  > this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > be well,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > jamey
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                                  >
                                                  > <charbruns@> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                                  >
                                                  > Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                                  >
                                                  > was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                                  >
                                                  > mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                                  >
                                                  > Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > be well,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > jamey
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                                  >
                                                  > <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                                  >
                                                  > check on
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                                  >
                                                  > Cody and
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                                  >
                                                  > immediately,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                                  >
                                                  > to a
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                                  >
                                                  > Jesse Lansky
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                                  >
                                                  > keep
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                                  >
                                                  > (30's,40's) was
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                                  >
                                                  > Mexicans
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                                  >
                                                  > and have
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                                  >
                                                  > Mark
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                                  >
                                                  > for being an
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Jeff
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                                  >
                                                  > Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                  >
                                                  > Wisdom"
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                                  >
                                                  > "internet
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Jeff
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                  >
                                                  > Wisdom"
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > was so dark.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                                  >
                                                  > word.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > be well,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > jamey
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                                  >
                                                  > although I
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Jeff
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                                  >
                                                  > have no
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                  >
                                                  > Wisdom"
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                                  >
                                                  > abstrat
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                                  >
                                                  > this
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                                  >
                                                  > Slumber Event
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                                  >
                                                  > produced 2
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                                  >
                                                  > Scott. Joe
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has
                                                  >
                                                  > had enough
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                                                  >
                                                  > may take
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan
                                                  >
                                                  > Stan &
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at
                                                  >
                                                  > Yahoo! Groups.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner
                                                  >
                                                  > than we
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> currently realize.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide
                                                  >
                                                  > wont be
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although
                                                  >
                                                  > ambergris is
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> costly.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery
                                                  >
                                                  > could
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Read more:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-\
                                                  >
                                                  > vomit-fo\
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc\
                                                  >
                                                  > 9KNuJD
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at
                                                  >
                                                  > Ancient
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                                  >
                                                  > regarding
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                                                  >
                                                  > prefer it
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due
                                                  >
                                                  > to short
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                                                  >
                                                  > 98% more
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am
                                                  >
                                                  > not a
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                                                  >
                                                  > Sometime I
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> forget I'm not.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> be well,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> jamey
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                                  >
                                                  > <tedsojka@>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by
                                                  >
                                                  > Gary
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky,
                                                  >
                                                  > ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska,
                                                  >
                                                  > Montana,
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Hudson
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my
                                                  >
                                                  > town for
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people
                                                  >
                                                  > here in
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met
                                                  >
                                                  > and what
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > they had to say.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                                  >
                                                  > adorned
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a
                                                  >
                                                  > fine old
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> photo
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them,
                                                  >
                                                  > probably an
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul,
                                                  >
                                                  > and that
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                                  >
                                                  > ancient
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As
                                                  >
                                                  > the
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be
                                                  >
                                                  > a wake up
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed
                                                  >
                                                  > word
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says
                                                  >
                                                  > it must be
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work,
                                                  >
                                                  > using
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> models
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you
                                                  >
                                                  > get the
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for
                                                  >
                                                  > discussion on
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > this site.
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> > ted
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> ------------------------------------
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >>
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > > >
                                                  >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > =
                                                  >
                                                • james m clark jr
                                                  I only have 8 out of 109 Oz Only one clay the rest marble No quartz marbles recovered. Can t recall how many of those It wasn t many something like 89 marble
                                                  Message 24 of 25 , Apr 19 5:05 PM
                                                    I only have 8 out of 109 Oz
                                                    Only one clay the rest marble
                                                    No quartz marbles recovered.
                                                    Can't recall how many of those
                                                    It wasn't many something like

                                                    89 marble
                                                    14 quartz
                                                    7 clay

                                                    or whatever I said at AWS sometime
                                                    back.

                                                    Cousin kept one I suppose I had given
                                                    a few away that were marble and struck
                                                    one with a solid blow one I must of
                                                    thought was quartz split it about center
                                                    as man tring to dive a 8p nail with
                                                    a forceful intenton of sinking it in
                                                    2 licks. 1 tiny chip was missing as
                                                    I eye-balled it some more to see how
                                                    off centered I was which was barely
                                                    noticable from the halves... as I said
                                                    before this stone had a core in the
                                                    center. Never seen nothing like it.
                                                    Pit on one half the core in the other
                                                    dead center as far as I could tell.

                                                    When my brother had first shown me
                                                    these marbles and he told me where he
                                                    had found them at being on a horse ranch
                                                    I had assume that they may have been
                                                    some type of gall stone until I seen
                                                    the clay ones in the fish tank I really
                                                    had no interest in them.

                                                    If these babies were a projectile these
                                                    bad boy wasn't intended to rattle some
                                                    brains...damn Yuchi blow gun perhap?

                                                    be well,
                                                    jamey







                                                    --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Rick O" <ozman@...> wrote:
                                                    >
                                                    > "Marbles" were more for playing head games and it is a bit ironic that
                                                    > this comes in a thread that also mentions kosher vs non-kosher.
                                                    >
                                                    > Most of the clay and stone "marbles" found in NA sites are about 27 to
                                                    > 30 mm in diameter. Some are heavily damaged. In order for the hard
                                                    > spheres to become so heavily damaged, they had to either have been
                                                    > crunched by farm implements or had to hit something very hard, like a
                                                    > cranium.
                                                    >
                                                    > These objects are almost certainly missiles for slings. When they are
                                                    > found in any other part of the world, that is the immediate presumption.
                                                    > Yet, when found in a Native American site, we jump to children's toys as
                                                    > the presumption. What is wrong with this picture?
                                                    >
                                                    > Jamie, I would very much like the opportunity to run a few of these past
                                                    > Scott Wolter.
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                    > <jameyboy@> wrote:
                                                    > >
                                                    > > ...was at 103 dropped to 101 now at 88 AWS members within a day.
                                                    > >
                                                    > > jmcjr
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "james m clark jr"
                                                    > jameyboy@ wrote:
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > I hear ya Charlie,
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > AWS could have it's own Barter System or fund raiser. Personally I
                                                    > despize the term handout. Being greatful goes either way.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > We could call it the AWS Keep Charlie out of the Corn Beef Cans Fund
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > For Sale
                                                    > > > Create an easy way for people to buy and sell from each other. You
                                                    > can choose to customize the application to make it about a specific type
                                                    > of item (e.g. bicycles or tickets or ) or leave it open to anything.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > I have 8 clay marble & marble marbles found in Monroe County
                                                    > Georgia.
                                                    > > > They could have been made for Creek Cherokee East Africans or for
                                                    > early settlement childern around the Treaty of Indian Springs. If some
                                                    > may recall these are of the 109 I use to have and was going to give to
                                                    > AWS members... which ironiclly currently is at 101 members
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > min. Value is estimated at $200.00 each.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > Give Away
                                                    > > > Whether you're a Freecycling or Freesharing group that is dedicated
                                                    > to giving stuff away or you're a group that is about something else
                                                    > entirely but just wants to make exchanges possible among group members,
                                                    > this application makes it easier for folks to give stuff away.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > be well,
                                                    > > > jamey
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, charles bruns
                                                    > <charbruns@> wrote:
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > send me all you want. alot depends on if you are hungry. chb
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > From: james m clark jr <jameyboy@>
                                                    > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 7:59 PM
                                                    > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native Wisdom"
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > ... one thing is for certian canned corn beef is nasty.
                                                    > > > > COME AND GET IT!!
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > Burnheat family aka Bernard family were among earlest settlers in
                                                    > Senoia Georgia following the Indian Springs Treaty. Sim Clower Burnard
                                                    > was alotted 20,000 acers here and following the Civil War built a water
                                                    > mill or grist mill on Bear Creek and laid to rest under a nearby Oak
                                                    > Tree if I recall the archives correctly.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > be well,
                                                    > > > > jamey
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Bennett"
                                                    > <mlbennett@> wrote:
                                                    > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > It was very interesting to read what you wrote. After a double
                                                    > check on
                                                    > > > > > the internet I agree with you. I once spent a day with Iron Eyes
                                                    > Cody and
                                                    > > > > > he certainly played the Native American. He asked, almost
                                                    > immediately,
                                                    > > > > > about my ethnicity. When I told him I was Jewish he subjected me
                                                    > to a
                                                    > > > > > long story about being "forced" into eating a corned beef by
                                                    > Jesse Lansky
                                                    > > > > > and how it was totally disguising. Since reading this post I
                                                    > keep
                                                    > > > > > rethinking that day. The traditional Hollywood formula
                                                    > (30's,40's) was
                                                    > > > > > to have Anglos play the cowboys, Italians and Jews play the
                                                    > Mexicans
                                                    > > > > > (you can spot a Brooklyn gesture among some in the crowd scenes)
                                                    > and have
                                                    > > > > > the Mexicans play the Indians with the real Indians unemployed.
                                                    > Mark
                                                    > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > In a related case, I have heard that Iron Eyes Cody was sued
                                                    > for being an
                                                    > > > > > > Italian impersonating a Native American.
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Jeff
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                    > > > > > > From: quarefremeruntgentes7@
                                                    > > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 12:22:46
                                                    > > > > > > To: Ancient Waterways
                                                    > Societyancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Subject: Re: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                    > Wisdom"
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Hello, Mr. Clark. Consider asking Brenda Golden about
                                                    > "internet
                                                    > > > > > > pretendians." She did an hour long program about them on
                                                    > > > > > > blogtalkradio.com .
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Jeff
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
                                                    > > > > > > From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                    > > > > > > Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 11:57:58
                                                    > > > > > > To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > > Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                    > Wisdom"
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > I'm not sure I'd use intrude. It seems very differnt
                                                    > > > > > > now than it use to be. I'm not sure if it's because
                                                    > > > > > > I'm older or if natural youthfulness has actually
                                                    > > > > > > grown up just a tad bit. Trust is a hard thing to come
                                                    > > > > > > by in righting wrongs. Being a non native as you are
                                                    > > > > > > and not knowing your great great grandmother isn't
                                                    > > > > > > stange. I knew my great grandmother but not as the
                                                    > > > > > > older grandkids did. Being that kid was strange. And
                                                    > > > > > > my grandfather I'll never forget when I was 5 he came in
                                                    > > > > > > the house and shut the door when I realized suddenly it
                                                    > > > > > > was only him and I in the living room. I knew him very
                                                    > > > > > > well, yet it never donged on me to ever ask him why he
                                                    > > > > > > was so dark.
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > can't say that I've ever come across "pretendian" before;
                                                    > > > > > > not that I can recall of. Is this in a slanguage dictionary
                                                    > > > > > > yet? Seems there would be at least 2 or 3 meaning for the
                                                    > word.
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > be well,
                                                    > > > > > > jamey
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com,
                                                    > > > > > > quarefremeruntgentes7@ wrote:
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> I am wondering about the Native Google group you mentioned,
                                                    > although I
                                                    > > > > > >> would not want to intrude, being a non-native.*
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Jeff
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> *My great-great grandmother was a Native American, however, I
                                                    > have no
                                                    > > > > > >> inclination to be a pretendian --Jeff.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
                                                    > > > > > >> From: "james m clark jr" <jameyboy@>
                                                    > > > > > >> Sender: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > >> Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2012 06:07:41
                                                    > > > > > >> To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > >> Reply-To: ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > > >> Subject: [ancient_waterways_society] Re: "Learning Native
                                                    > Wisdom"
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Thanks again Ted,
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Currently I am seeking permission to use Hilery B Bookers
                                                    > abstrat
                                                    > > > > > >> review for Learning Native Wisdom at:
                                                    > > > > > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/native2native2
                                                    > > > > > >> and in a Native 2 timeline sometime later.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Gary's book was first published online on April 22. I thought
                                                    > this
                                                    > > > > > >> would be an excellant opener prior to Awakening Day of
                                                    > Slumber Event
                                                    > > > > > >> April 22 at Native 2. So far pronmotinal skills has only
                                                    > produced 2
                                                    > > > > > >> members and I have yet to inviite Joe Wakins or Fla. Gov.
                                                    > Scott. Joe
                                                    > > > > > >> isn't the newsgroup type and Gov. Scott more than likely has
                                                    > had enough
                                                    > > > > > >> criticism. More than likey this will be a yearly atempt so it
                                                    > may take
                                                    > > > > > >> some time to incline an ear in the long run. Hopefully Susan
                                                    > Stan &
                                                    > > > > > >> Vince will give the AWS group most of the App options at
                                                    > Yahoo! Groups.
                                                    > > > > > >> This will enhances group particapation greatly I think sooner
                                                    > than we
                                                    > > > > > >> currently realize.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Hopefully the Inuit/NANA & other coastal natives worldwide
                                                    > wont be
                                                    > > > > > >> effected much right away by the pefuming industry although
                                                    > ambergris is
                                                    > > > > > >> costly.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Subsitute for ambergris -- or whale vomit -- found; Discovery
                                                    > could
                                                    > > > > > >> relace pricey perfume ingredient
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Read more:
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/fashion/subsitute-ambergris-whale-\
                                                    > vomit-fo\
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > und-discovery-relace-pricey-perfume-ingredient-article-1.1058714#ixzz1rc\
                                                    > 9KNuJD
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Jeff also sent an email to Sitting Owl and Oz besides me at
                                                    > Ancient
                                                    > > > > > >> Waterways somewhat as a heads up or alert.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/a-difficult-choice-on-water/
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> posted this at American Indian Injustice along with my reply
                                                    > regarding
                                                    > > > > > >> the Dine 5 days later. Not accustom to email and I don't
                                                    > prefer it
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Not sure why he didn't send it to you also Ted... perhaps due
                                                    > to short
                                                    > > > > > >> stay... at any rate, AWS is currently at 101 which is roughly
                                                    > 98% more
                                                    > > > > > >> active than Native 2. Perhaps I don't state enough that I am
                                                    > not a
                                                    > > > > > >> ligit AWS member and perhaps not as welcome as I use to be.
                                                    > Sometime I
                                                    > > > > > >> forget I'm not.
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> be well,
                                                    > > > > > >> jamey
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, Ted Sojka
                                                    > <tedsojka@>
                                                    > > > > > >> wrote:
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > There is a great book called "Learning Native Wisdom", by
                                                    > Gary
                                                    > > > > > >> > Holthaus, University Press of Kentucky,
                                                    > ISBN978-0-8131-2487-2
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > Gary has spent a life, learning from others in Alaska,
                                                    > Montana,
                                                    > > > > > >> Hudson
                                                    > > > > > >> > Bay area, and about anywhere he has gone. He visited my
                                                    > town for
                                                    > > > > > >> > three months this past Winter. He met many local people
                                                    > here in
                                                    > > > > > >> > Northeast Iowa, and wrote some reflections on those he met
                                                    > and what
                                                    > > > > > >> > they had to say.
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > At the Library here I picked up the book on Native Wisdom,
                                                    > adorned
                                                    > > > > > >> > with photos of native fisherman in aluminum boats and a
                                                    > fine old
                                                    > > > > > >> photo
                                                    > > > > > >> > of a traditional fishing net being mended by one of them,
                                                    > probably an
                                                    > > > > > >> > Edwin S Curtis photo or contemporay.
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > The subtitle is , "What traditional cultures teach us about
                                                    > > > > > >> > Subsistence, Sustainability, and Spirituality"
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > It is wonderful story about education for the long haul,
                                                    > and that
                                                    > > > > > >> > among the Innuit is many thousands of years. I think most
                                                    > ancient
                                                    > > > > > >> > waterways people would have a good read with this book. As
                                                    > the
                                                    > > > > > >> > culture we have ignores global warning signs, this might be
                                                    > a wake up
                                                    > > > > > >> > call on how we can weather this coming event. The hackneyed
                                                    > word
                                                    > > > > > >> > "sustainable" is part of the answer. bit Mr. Holthaus says
                                                    > it must be
                                                    > > > > > >> > part of the culture and its beliefs, before ti will work,
                                                    > using
                                                    > > > > > >> models
                                                    > > > > > >> > that have been around for thousands of years. If any of you
                                                    > get the
                                                    > > > > > >> > book from your library it would make a good topic for
                                                    > discussion on
                                                    > > > > > >> > this site.
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >> > ted
                                                    > > > > > >> >
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> ------------------------------------
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                    > > > > > >>
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > ------------------------------------
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > > >
                                                    > > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > >
                                                    > >
                                                    >
                                                  • minnesotastan@yahoo.com
                                                    If Im not mistaken Larry mon, it seems it may have been our Sting Stone Stan (Min.Stan) who may have brought this up last year regarding these marbles that
                                                    Message 25 of 25 , Apr 28 5:43 PM
                                                      " If Im not mistaken Larry mon, it seems it may have been our Sting
                                                      Stone Stan (Min.Stan) who may have brought this up last year regarding
                                                      these marbles that somewhat favor turtle eggs but smaller or around the
                                                      subject of Klerksdorp spheres also."

                                                      "I once read how real marbles were made anciently by placing a small
                                                      rounded stone in a hole or depressioin in the rock and letting running
                                                      water fall on it and turn it until it was perfectly rounded."

                                                      I don't remember having commenting on that topic in the past.
                                                      Near-perfect spheres can certainly be created by water tumbling a rock
                                                      in a depression (just find a river with some holes in the underlying
                                                      bedrock or holes at the base of cascades and look in the bottom). But
                                                      that kind of process takes forever. I'm sure ancient people would have
                                                      "harvested" such spheres for various purposes, but can't conceive of
                                                      them placing stones there in an effort to create spheres.

                                                      Just my opinion.
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