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check out article & web page on Wisconsin Copper Miners (Herbert Wagner)

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  • Susan
    Stan, Jamey, Rick, Vince,and All, Jamey, I would agree with Stan referring to you as Dr. Clark. In fact, the kind of intensive research all of you are doing in
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 6, 2007
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      Stan, Jamey, Rick, Vince,and All,

      Jamey, I would agree with Stan referring to you as Dr. Clark.
      In fact, the kind of intensive research all of you are doing in your
      recent posts, you seem to be well representing the depth and breadth of
      research I believe PhD's in ancient sociocultural and scientific
      research did, more around the turn of the century into the 1930's
      before they became more specialized and vested in university and
      private foundations. Not meaning to be unfair, but generalizing. A
      few courageous, open-minded PhD's are 'out there' and willing to work
      with groups such as AAAPF and web sites as our own. Drs. John White and
      William Conner who both wrote to me recently and will be actively
      involved in the 2007 AAAPF/MES/Thor conference and tour of Ft. Ancient,
      Ohio mounds. They work cordially with lay persona and professionals.
      There need not be schisms and ill feelings among diverse people and
      groups diligently seeking higher truths re: human pre-history.
      _______
      I was trying to find a photo of a large, grooved stone tool or
      hammerstone such as the hundreds I have seen at the Ontonagon Co.
      Historical Society used in the ancient copper mines aroudn Lake
      Superior. Found this marvelous NW Wisconsin-Lake Supeior web site whch
      includes Mississippi-St. Croix River area copper mining. Hope the
      writer/author of the Harley site joins us. Good mention of Jonathon
      Carver who is landed often at the Misery Bay Lake Superior campsite I
      frequent on trips north of Ontonagon (Porcupine Mts.), Mi...

      Click here: Wisconsin's Ancient Copper Miners or
      http://www.atthecreation.com/wis.anc/%20cu.mines.html

      I can't keep up with all of your Posts and fascinating responses here.
      Thank you; I am pleased to be associated with each of you!

      Susan English
    • james m. clark jr.
      Well since you put it like that Susan it is way to much of a westernized Idea for me, however it is along the lines of a few indigenous concepts and values,
      Message 2 of 3 , Mar 6, 2007
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        Well since you put it like that Susan it is way to much of a
        westernized Idea for me, however it is along the lines of a few
        indigenous concepts and values, yet at the same time I am neither here
        nor there. A visionary maybe, but no doctor.

        You shouldn't feel week because history isn't science, however I do
        think it is embarrassing that ethnology isn't a required course for
        such, or what should be a more reputable science (I have reputable
        notes from early 50's that somewhat defines loop holes in the
        scientific method). To me it isn't any wonder why archeology is so
        dependent on funds or rather lack of... scientific fields are now
        going through what religion already has for centuries... the almightly
        dollar problem still and an eleventh commendment (in which no other
        word exist for this cardinal number).

        To be honest I have noticed in pre-columbian lingo at times that it
        isn't so much different from my experience of aiding cult/occultic
        victims and warding off former misconceptions of those ideas
        (literally worldwide rednecks) basically a form of Gotic one-sided
        like notions that seem to be imbedded not only in westernized society
        but in philosophy of higher learning in nearly all the sciences &
        literal societies; not to mention Gotic art and ideas that is so
        relavent or irrelavent in a supposedly free society from it's very
        mornings.

        When it comes down to it, it's no different now as it was when Gibson
        wrote the rise and fall of the roman empire and the english view of
        how to deal with real ideas rather than unbelievable ones at the time
        when no concept of morality applied in a just manor but rather
        contrary in deeds and actions.

        9-11 was bad enough but I tend to view it as a secondary matter now
        just as then. The problem is still the same, no real efforts are made
        stuck in a fissure.

        Now when I can figure out how to penetrate the public library system
        and insist that Native books by Native authors be manditory for
        american history then maybe some folks would be interested in U.S.
        History.

        Only then would I be considered a visionary.

        be well,
        jamey


        --- In ancient_waterways_society@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"
        <beldingenglish@...> wrote:
        >
        > Stan, Jamey, Rick, Vince,and All,
        >
        > Jamey, I would agree with Stan referring to you as Dr. Clark.
        > In fact, the kind of intensive research all of you are doing in your
        > recent posts, you seem to be well representing the depth and breadth of
        > research I believe PhD's in ancient sociocultural and scientific
        > research did, more around the turn of the century into the 1930's
        > before they became more specialized and vested in university and
        > private foundations. Not meaning to be unfair, but generalizing. A
        > few courageous, open-minded PhD's are 'out there' and willing to work
        > with groups such as AAAPF and web sites as our own. Drs. John White and
        > William Conner who both wrote to me recently and will be actively
        > involved in the 2007 AAAPF/MES/Thor conference and tour of Ft. Ancient,
        > Ohio mounds. They work cordially with lay persona and professionals.
        > There need not be schisms and ill feelings among diverse people and
        > groups diligently seeking higher truths re: human pre-history.
        > _______
        > I was trying to find a photo of a large, grooved stone tool or
        > hammerstone such as the hundreds I have seen at the Ontonagon Co.
        > Historical Society used in the ancient copper mines aroudn Lake
        > Superior. Found this marvelous NW Wisconsin-Lake Supeior web site whch
        > includes Mississippi-St. Croix River area copper mining. Hope the
        > writer/author of the Harley site joins us. Good mention of Jonathon
        > Carver who is landed often at the Misery Bay Lake Superior campsite I
        > frequent on trips north of Ontonagon (Porcupine Mts.), Mi...
        >
        > Click here: Wisconsin's Ancient Copper Miners or
        > http://www.atthecreation.com/wis.anc/%20cu.mines.html
        >
        > I can't keep up with all of your Posts and fascinating responses here.
        > Thank you; I am pleased to be associated with each of you!
        >
        > Susan English
        >
      • james m. clark jr.
        I am sure many recall the epic documentation of the Ice Man or Oxey or whatever term was used for this man. If H.G. Wells were alive and well with burbon
        Message 3 of 3 , Mar 7, 2007
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          I am sure many recall the epic documentation of the "Ice Man" or
          "Oxey" or whatever term was used for this man.

          If H.G. Wells were alive and well with burbon in hand, he would
          immediately be amused by a comical script for his next movie and
          contemplating a lawsuit for wardrobe manipulations declaring that his
          sketch of a rare Greek Electrum vase (Outline Vol. I, p. 243) is in
          fact the Scythian costume he had in mind for his main character just
          before typing a message to Thor asking him if he would be his lawyer
          pleading for the body of K"nman and they would win the case if I was a
          part of the Jury and I'm sure they would have found that arrow with
          mere x-ray observation within the first weeks end.

          ok maybe not

          "Brenner was the son of Mader. He was an "Engl"nder" and king of
          the Schwaben. His wife was Th"m"rin (Tomyris), queen of the Getae,
          Dacians and Scythians. Brenner sent her troops to help in the war
          against Cyrus. He also defeated Darius who tried to invade the lower
          Danube region. Together Brenner and Th"m"rin conquered much of Asia
          Minor as far as Armenia. His nephew K"nman, son of Sigweis, was king
          of the Bavarians. Brenner expelled K"nman and 300,000 Bavarians from
          Bohemia and resettled that region with Schwaben, who then became known
          as Markmannen. Some of the expelled Bavarians settled in Bavaria
          proper, but by far the largest number of them crossed the Alps into
          Italy, from where they drove out some of the Etruscans. After the
          death of K"nman, the Bavarians of Italy were ruled by the kings Zeck,
          Ber (who built Bern or Verona) and Breitmar."

          could be Rice, T. Talbot, "The Scythians". London, 1959.

          or Herman L. Hoeh COMPENDIUM OF WORLD HISTORY Vol. I & II

          or a copy of Hoeh's work
          http://cgca.net/coglinks/wcglit/hoehcompendium/hhc1toc.htm

          ------------------

          Proceedings of the Royal Irish Academy Vol. 104C, 107-129 (2004)

          Archaeology, Celtic Studies, History, Linguistics, Literature

          A NEW APPROACH TO EARLY CELTIC ART
          By OTTO-HERMAN FREY, MRIA

          [Received 19 December 2002. Read 25 September 2003. Published 30
          December 2004.]

          ABSTRACT

          All modern studies of early Celtic art begin with the work of Paul
          Jacobsthal. In the sixty years since his magisterial study, however,
          there have been many new discoveries and there has been much
          discussion concerning the deeper meaning of Celtic art. Particularly
          significant in this regard are the two recently discovered Early La
          Tène burial mounds on the Glauberg in Hesse in Germany. Not only did
          these burials yield bronzes of major significance, a unique, almost
          life-sized human carving displaying weapons and personal ornaments
          was also found. The finds from the Glauberg shed much new light on
          the nature of early Celtic art. The influence of the ETSRUCANS of
          north Italy is especially evident.

          http://www.ria.ie/publications/journals/ProcCI/2004/PC04/PC04.html

          Full Text (pdf includes fine images)

          http://www.ria.ie/publications/journals/ProcCI/2004/PC04/PDF/104C05.pd
          f

          ----------------------

          Hoeh was a very gifted man used as a religous puppet.
          You can ignore the religious overtones, but then again
          the historical record of biblical mythology along with
          viable documentation as well as traditions and folklore
          in old world ethos are somewhat interesting with a number
          of references to ancient text, parchments, cuniform ect
          in a verity of languages and various culture records
          which is a very rare to find inasmuch as finding other
          online sources on-line translated into english yet peppered with
          american british israelite theories.

          It appears that Herodotus isn't considered to be a reference
          as far as i know otherwise I wouldn't have sent any of this,
          but I just happened to have another day off (sorry for so many posts)

          Herodotus: Queen Tomyris of the Massagetai and the Defeat of the
          Persians under Cyrus

          I.215: In their dress and mode of living the Massagetai resemble the
          Scythians. They fight both on horseback and on foot, neither method is
          strange to them: they use bows and lances, but their favorite weapon
          is the battle-axe. Their arms are all either of gold or brass. For
          their spear-points, and arrow-heads, and for their battle-axes, they
          make use of brass; for head-gear, belts, and girdles, of gold. So too
          with the caparison of their horses, they give them breastplates of
          brass, but employ gold about the reins, the bit, and the cheek-plates.
          They use neither iron nor silver, having none in their country; but
          they have brass and gold in abundance.

          I.216: The following are some of their customs: Each man has but one
          wife, yet all the wives are held in common; for this is a custom of
          the Massagetai and not of the Scythians, as the Hellenes wrongly say.


          rest @
          http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/tomyris.html

          be well,
          jamey
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