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What is extrapersonal communication?

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  • sumangal haldar
    What is Extrapersonal Communication? Hi all, Trying to explain this term to my students i got some very good questions from them, i answered them but now i
    Message 1 of 21 , Feb 28, 2010
      What is Extrapersonal Communication?
      Hi all,
       
      Trying to explain this term to my students i got some very good questions from them, i answered them but now i want to know the opinions of others too-
       
      I was explaining how extrapersonal communication is done between human and non-human entities... the questions that followed-
       
      Q1. How  about talking to a wall/ deity? Many people say and believe that they actually talk to inanimate objects (wall, mountains). Is it extrapersonal communication or intrapersonal communication?
       
      Q2. When one touches a touch-me-not plant it shrinks back, similarly carnivorous plants show some changes/ movements when touched, is it a communication, if yes of what type?
       
      Q3. Is praying (to the Divine) also communication? if yes then how to plot it on a communication model?
       
      Your answers would validate or contradict my points. Kindly comment.
       
      Sumangal Haldar
      Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
      SRM College of Engineering and Management.





      Your Mail works best with the New Yahoo Optimized IE8. Get it NOW!.
    • Jon Paulson
      In order to determine the type of communication, or if communication occurs at all, consider where the response comes from, and whether the response comes from
      Message 2 of 21 , Mar 1, 2010

        In order to determine the type of communication, or if communication occurs at all, consider where the response comes from, and whether the response comes from a source that has the full functionality to be a subject. 

        Also consider the difference between a “reaction” and a “response.”

        Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

         

        Jon Paulson

        Interim Program Director for General Education

        Center for Undergraduate Studies

        Walden University

        712-580-1658 (h/o)

        712-291-0144 (c)

         


        From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
        Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:58 PM
        To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [americancomm] What is extrapersonal communication?

         

         

        What is Extrapersonal Communication?

        Hi all,

         

        Trying to explain this term to my students i got some very good questions from them, i answered them but now i want to know the opinions of others too-

         

        I was explaining how extrapersonal communication is done between human and non-human entities... the questions that followed-

         

        Q1. How  about talking to a wall/ deity? Many people say and believe that they actually talk to inanimate objects (wall, mountains). Is it extrapersonal communication or intrapersonal communication?

         

        Q2. When one touches a touch-me-not plant it shrinks back, similarly carnivorous plants show some changes/ movements when touched, is it a communication, if yes of what type?

         

        Q3. Is praying (to the Divine) also communication? if yes then how to plot it on a communication model?

         

        Your answers would validate or contradict my points. Kindly comment.
         

        Sumangal Haldar

        Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

        SRM College of Engineering and Management.

         




        Your Mail works best with the New Yahoo Optimized IE8. Get it NOW!.

      • sumangal haldar
        Thank you Jon, for answer in appropriate words!!   Sumangal Haldar Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer SRM College of Engineering and Management.
        Message 3 of 21 , Mar 1, 2010
          Thank you Jon, for answer in appropriate words!!
           
          Sumangal Haldar
          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
          SRM College of Engineering and Management.



          From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@...>
          To: "americancomm@yahoogroups.com" <americancomm@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Mon, 1 March, 2010 6:51:28 PM
          Subject: RE: [americancomm] What is extrapersonal communication?

           

          In order to determine the type of communication, or if communication occurs at all, consider where the response comes from, and whether the response comes from a source that has the full functionality to be a subject. 

          Also consider the difference between a “reaction” and a “response.”

          Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

           

          Jon Paulson

          Interim Program Director for General Education

          Center for Undergraduate Studies

          Walden University

          712-580-1658 (h/o)

          712-291-0144 (c)

           


          From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
          Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:58 PM
          To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
          Subject: [americancomm] What is extrapersonal communication?

           

           

          What is Extrapersonal Communication?

          Hi all,

           

          Trying to explain this term to my students i got some very good questions from them, i answered them but now i want to know the opinions of others too-

           

          I was explaining how extrapersonal communication is done between human and non-human entities... the questions that followed-

           

          Q1. How  about talking to a wall/ deity? Many people say and believe that they actually talk to inanimate objects (wall, mountains). Is it extrapersonal communication or intrapersonal communication?

           

          Q2. When one touches a touch-me-not plant it shrinks back, similarly carnivorous plants show some changes/ movements when touched, is it a communication, if yes of what type?

           

          Q3. Is praying (to the Divine) also communication? if yes then how to plot it on a communication model?

           

          Your answers would validate or contradict my points. Kindly comment.
           

          Sumangal Haldar

          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

          SRM College of Engineering and Management.

           




          Your Mail works best with the New Yahoo Optimized IE8. Get it NOW!.



          Your Mail works best with the New Yahoo Optimized IE8. Get it NOW!.
        • sumangal haldar
          Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering
          Message 4 of 21 , Mar 3, 2010

            Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

            Dear Jon,

            Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

            Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India, has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication). God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

             

            What do you think ?

             

            Sumangal Haldar
            Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
            SRM College of Engineering and Management.


             


            The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.
          • Jon Paulson
            Sumangal: I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great. I know that for some
            Message 5 of 21 , Mar 3, 2010

              Sumangal:

               

              I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

               

              Jon

               


              From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
              Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
              To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

               

               

              Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

              Dear Jon,

              Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

              Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

               

              What do you think ?

               

              Sumangal Haldar

              Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

              SRM College of Engineering and Management.

               


               




              The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

            • Jon Ru
              Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via
              Message 6 of 21 , Mar 3, 2010
                Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                 
                A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation."
                 
                "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                48
                 
                In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@...> wrote:

                From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@...>
                Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                To: "americancomm@yahoogroups.com" <americancomm@yahoogroups.com>
                Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                 

                Sumangal:

                 

                I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                 

                Jon

                 


                From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                 

                 

                Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                Dear Jon,
                Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                 
                What do you think ?
                 

                Sumangal Haldar

                Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                 


                 




                The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.


              • Jon Paulson
                Jon: This is very interesting. I m not terribly up to date on Catholic Theology, so I have a question. I had understood that there was a point where the
                Message 7 of 21 , Mar 3, 2010

                  Jon:

                   

                  This is very interesting.  I’m not terribly up to date on Catholic Theology, so I have a question.  I had understood that there was a point where the laity was not supposed to pray directly to God, but were supposed to pray to Saints for intercession.  Was this ever the case, or am I the victim of a sort of  “urban legend”?   If this was the case, when did this change?

                   

                  Also, I have always wondered if the term Logos, commonly translated as “word” in John 1:1, referred not simply to language, but to the much broader sense of Logos as understood by Classical rhetoricians and philosophers (more along the lines of “ordering principles”).  Does that make any sense to you?  In any case, I’m going to have to look up “The Formal Structure…”.

                   

                  Has you recent research been published yet?  I would be interested in reading the full work.

                   

                  Also, Sumangal, with regard to prayer as an intrapersonal process from a Christian perspective, you may want to look into the beliefs about prayer used by the Religious Society of Friends (Quakers). 

                   

                  Jon

                   

                  Jon Paulson

                  Interim Program Director for General Education

                  Center for Undergraduate Studies

                  Walden University

                  712-580-1658 (h/o)

                  712-291-0144 (c)

                   


                  From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                  Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:26 PM
                  To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                   

                   

                  Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                   

                  A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                   

                  "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                  prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                  48

                   

                  In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                  Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                  --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                  From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                  Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                  To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                  Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                   

                  Sumangal:

                   

                  I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                   

                  Jon

                   


                  From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                  Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                  To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                  Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                   

                   

                  Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                  Dear Jon,

                  Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                  Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                   

                  What do you think ?

                   

                  Sumangal Haldar

                  Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                  SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                   


                   

                   


                  The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                   

                • crystal.coleman@murraystate.edu
                  Loved this post...Thanks Jon Very interesting...Thanks for the information! Crystal Rae Coel Coleman, M.A., J.D.(Esq.) Author of THE Presentation Guide Book
                  Message 8 of 21 , Mar 3, 2010
                    Loved this post...Thanks Jon
                    Very interesting...Thanks for the information!

                    Crystal Rae Coel Coleman, M.A., J.D.(Esq.)
                    Author of THE Presentation Guide Book
                    Head of Elizabeth College
                    101 Elizabeth Hall
                    (270) 809-5487
                    Director of Speech and Debate
                    Dept. of Organizational Communication
                    321B Wilson Hall
                    Murray State University
                    Murray, KY 42071
                    (270) 809-4467


                    ------- Original Message -------
                    From : Jon Ru[mailto:jru2797@...]
                    Sent : 3/3/2010 2:26:29 PM
                    To : americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                    Cc :
                    Subject : RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                     

                    Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                     
                    A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "
                     
                    "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                    prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                    48
                     
                    In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                    Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                    --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                    From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                    Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                    To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                    Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                     

                    Sumangal:

                     

                    I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                     

                    Jon


                    From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                    Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                    To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                    Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                     

                    Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                    Dear Jon,
                    Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                    Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                     
                    What do you think ?
                     

                    Sumangal Haldar

                    Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                    SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                     


                     




                    The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.



                  • Jon Ru
                    I m glad others are into this line of research!  No it s not published yet, it s under review with a journal now and is a proposal for NCA 2010.  If anyone
                    Message 9 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                      I'm glad others are into this line of research!  No it's not published yet, it's under review with a journal now and is a proposal for NCA 2010.  If anyone wants to review a draft I can send one off-list.  I'm not sure if there was a historical period where Catholics were only supposed to pray to saints for intercession (this is still my first Catholic research project and I'm not a historian), but I don't think so. Aquinas is clear that they should pray to both God and saints.  Invocation of saints and prayers for intercession are distinguished from Christ's mediation but both are encouraged.  This doctrine was a point of dispute for the Reformation, for instance Anglicans explicitly reject intercession as contrary to monotheism.  The best source for overviews of older Catholic doctrine is the Catholic Encyclopedia, check out this link for more on prayers to Saints http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08070a.htm
                      Happy Thursday!
                      Jon

                      --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@...> wrote:

                      From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@...>
                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                      To: "americancomm@yahoogroups.com" <americancomm@yahoogroups.com>
                      Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 4:30 PM

                       

                      Jon:

                       

                      This is very interesting.  I’m not terribly up to date on Catholic Theology, so I have a question.  I had understood that there was a point where the laity was not supposed to pray directly to God, but were supposed to pray to Saints for intercession.  Was this ever the case, or am I the victim of a sort of  “urban legend”?   If this was the case, when did this change?

                       

                      Also, I have always wondered if the term Logos, commonly translated as “word” in John 1:1, referred not simply to language, but to the much broader sense of Logos as understood by Classical rhetoricians and philosophers (more along the lines of “ordering principles”).  Does that make any sense to you?  In any case, I’m going to have to look up “The Formal Structure…”.

                       

                      Has you recent research been published yet?  I would be interested in reading the full work.

                       

                      Also, Sumangal, with regard to prayer as an intrapersonal process from a Christian perspective, you may want to look into the beliefs about prayer used by the Religious Society of Friends (Quakers). 

                       

                      Jon

                       

                      Jon Paulson

                      Interim Program Director for General Education

                      Center for Undergraduate Studies

                      Walden University

                      712-580-1658 (h/o)

                      712-291-0144 (c)

                       


                      From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                      Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:26 PM
                      To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                       

                       

                      Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                       

                      A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                       

                      "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                      prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                      48

                       

                      In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                      Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                      --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                      From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                      To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                      Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                       

                      Sumangal:

                       

                      I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                       

                      Jon

                       


                      From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                      Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                      To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                      Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                       

                       

                      Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                      Dear Jon,

                      Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                      Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                       

                      What do you think ?

                       

                      Sumangal Haldar

                      Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                      SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                       


                       

                       


                      The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                       


                    • sumangal haldar
                      Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance- In India
                      Message 10 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                        Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-
                         
                        In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  
                         
                        But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication). And the drilling continues...
                         
                        Sumangal Haldar
                        Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
                        SRM College of Engineering and Management.



                        From: Jon Ru <jru2797@...>
                        To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                        Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                         

                        Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                         
                        A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "
                         
                        "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                        prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                        48
                         
                        In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                        Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                        --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                        From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                        Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                        To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                        Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                         

                        Sumangal:

                         

                        I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                         

                        Jon

                         


                        From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                        Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                        To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                        Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                         

                         

                        Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                        Dear Jon,
                        Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                        Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                         
                        What do you think ?
                         

                        Sumangal Haldar

                        Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                        SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                         


                         




                        The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.




                        The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.
                      • Vernon Humphrey
                        From what I see it comes down to definition.  Do you define communication as the act of sending a message, does the message have to be received for
                        Message 11 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                          From what I see it comes down to definition. 
                           
                          Do you define communication as the act of sending a message, does the message have to be received for communication to be accomplished, or does the message have to be sent, received, and some form of  feedback given?  
                           
                          Vern
                           
                          “Each of us is in essence like a rubber band ball. Culture is developed as if adding one rubber band after another. Some rubber bands are wide and comforting; some are thin, tight and painful, with a variety of sizes in-between adding to the construction. Each new rubber band changes the mass, density and dimension of the ball and how it will react to outside stimuli, just as the layers of culture change how we as humans react to situations.”




                          Vernon F. Humphrey
                          706.329.7960
                          29 Park Place
                          Apt 304
                          Hattiesburg, MS. 39402
                          706.329.7960


                          From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...>
                          To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Thu, March 4, 2010 7:10:10 AM
                          Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                           

                          Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-
                           
                          In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  
                           
                          But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                           
                          Sumangal Haldar
                          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
                          SRM College of Engineering and Management.



                          From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                          To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                          Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                          Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                           

                          Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                           
                          A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "
                           
                          "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                          prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                          48
                           
                          In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                          Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                          --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                          From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                          Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                          To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                          Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                           

                          Sumangal:

                           

                          I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                           

                          Jon

                           


                          From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                          Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                          To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                          Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                           

                           

                          Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                          Dear Jon,
                          Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                          Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                           
                          What do you think ?
                           

                          Sumangal Haldar

                          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                          SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                           


                           




                          The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.




                          The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                        • Jon Ru
                          Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I m not an expert on Hindus, but I am
                          Message 12 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                            Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.
                             
                            Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?
                             
                            Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!
                             
                            Jon

                            --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...> wrote:

                            From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...>
                            Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                            To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                             
                            Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-
                             
                            In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  
                             
                            But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                             
                            Sumangal Haldar
                            Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
                            SRM College of Engineering and Management.



                            From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                            To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                            Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                            Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                             

                             

                            Jon

                             


                            From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                            Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                            To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                            Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                             

                             

                            Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                            Dear Jon,
                            Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                            Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                             
                            What do you think ?
                             

                            Sumangal Haldar

                            Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                            SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                             


                             




                            The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                            Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                             
                            A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "
                             
                            "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                            prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                            48
                             
                            In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                            Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                            --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                            From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                            Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                            To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                            Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                             

                            Sumangal:

                             

                            I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).




                            The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.
                          • Todd, Candace
                            As I was reading the conversation, and reflecting on my own religious direction, I realized I have been keeping these two areas of great personal commitment as
                            Message 13 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010

                              As I was reading the conversation, and reflecting on my own religious direction, I realized I have been keeping these two areas of great personal commitment as separate and different boxes.  

                               

                              In Buddhism, the aim of meditation is to quiet the chatter of communication on every level—one does this by emptying the mind or by filling it with harmonics that are not symbolic or communicative etc.  Communication is seen as a dynamic of attachment to surface, superficial and/or ephemeral aspects of human existence, what often gets termed as “appearances.” 

                               

                              Shifting modes of explanation here, insofar as communication makes us human, it is also what keeps us attached to our individualistic humanity and distracts us from our inherent connectedness--our oneness, if you will, with all that is.  In short, communication is a barrier to communing. 

                               

                              No wonder my life is always feeling complicated!  On the other hand, meditation is an alternative that more and more people are turning to as a technique for managing stress—research supports its efficacy.  Is it possible that there is such a thing as too MUCH communication? (perish the thought) 

                               

                              Perhaps it is because communication is interactive, and other focused.  Perhaps intrapersonal communication turns our interior landscape into a space for “otherness” to form—hence our sense of self is being splintered somewhat. Hmm.  And humano-divine communication could actually be separating the one who prays from his/her God at the same moment that connection is sought.  Sorry, now I’m entering a postmodern account, which is fine by me but makes many of us impatient I fear.

                               

                              Candace

                               

                              Candace E. Todd, Ph.D.

                              Assistant Professor of Communication Studies

                              Lynchburg College, VA  24501

                              434/544-8818

                               

                               

                              From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                              Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:32 AM
                              To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication

                               

                               

                              Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.

                               

                              Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?

                               

                              Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!

                               

                              Jon

                              --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...> wrote:


                              From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...>
                              Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                              To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                              Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                               

                              Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-

                               

                              In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  

                               

                              But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                               

                              Sumangal Haldar

                              Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                              SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                               

                               


                              From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                              To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                              Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                              Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                               

                              Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                               

                              A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                               

                              "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                              prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                              48

                               

                              In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                              Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                              --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                              From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                              Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                              To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                              Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                               

                              Sumangal:

                               

                              I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                               

                              Jon

                               


                              From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                              Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                              To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                              Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                               

                               

                              Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                              Dear Jon,

                              Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                              Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                               

                              What do you think ?

                               

                              Sumangal Haldar

                              Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                              SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                               


                               

                               


                              The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                               

                               


                              The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                               

                            • Tejinder Lamba
                              As for the Prayer, I remember: “When I was a kid, I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized that  the Lord, just didn t work that way.
                              Message 14 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                                As for the Prayer, I remember:
                                “When I was a kid, I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized that  the Lord, just didn't work that way. So I stole one and asked him to forgive"
                                As for Communication I am reminded of,
                                Jean Paul Sartere at a French cafe asked the waitress
                                "I like to have a cup of coffee with No Cream." The waitress:
                                "We have run out of cream, what about with No Milk"
                                H G Wells  rightly said :
                                "Buddha is the most Godly & the most Godless man in the whole History of Man"
                                Whenever asked about God, Buddha replied with 'Silence'

                                Tejinder Lamba




                                --- On Thu, 3/4/10, Jon Ru <jru2797@...> wrote:

                                From: Jon Ru <jru2797@...>
                                Subject: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication
                                To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                                Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:02 PM

                                 

                                Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.
                                 
                                Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?
                                 
                                Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!
                                 
                                Jon

                                --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@ yahoo.com> wrote:

                                From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@ yahoo.com>
                                Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                                To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                                 
                                Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-
                                 
                                In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  
                                 
                                But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                                 
                                Sumangal Haldar
                                Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer
                                SRM College of Engineering and Management.



                                From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                                To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                                Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                                 
                                Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!
                                 
                                A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "
                                 
                                "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for
                                prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."
                                48
                                 
                                In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in
                                Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.


                                --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                                From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                                To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                                 

                                Sumangal:

                                 

                                I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                                 

                                Jon

                                 


                                From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                                Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                                To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                                 

                                 

                                Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                                Dear Jon,
                                Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:
                                Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  
                                 
                                What do you think ?
                                 

                                Sumangal Haldar

                                Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                 


                                 




                                The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.




                                The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.


                              • Jon Ru
                                Does anybody here work in a School or College of Communication, as opposed to a department among other departments?  If so can I please ask you some questions
                                Message 15 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                                  Does anybody here work in a School or College of Communication, as opposed to a department among other departments?  If so can I please ask you some questions about how it is structured?  Please email me off-list at my school email address, jon.radwan@...
                                  Thanks!

                                • Jon Ru
                                  Great Candace!  I like this part of your post most   Shifting modes of explanation here, insofar as communication makes us human, it is also what keeps us
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                                    Great Candace!  I like this part of your post most
                                     
                                    "Shifting modes of explanation here, insofar as communication makes us human, it is also what keeps us attached to our individualistic humanity and distracts us from our inherent connectedness- -our oneness, if you will, with all that is.  In short, communication is a barrier to communing."
                                     
                                    This is an issue I've been pondering for awhile.  Overall I want to distinguish between mediated and immediate comm. and say that physical immediacy, as with direct contact, can create an other-oriented unity (communion).  All mediated (linguistic, visual, etc.) modes both create and attempt to bridge a gap, while touch is always both of us, right here and right now.  Even though I quoted Pope Benedict on prayer earlier, his description of charity and God in Deus Caritas Est is much more contact oriented than message oriented. 
                                     
                                    I love studying this stuff!  My new research project deals with Catholic and Anti-Christian perspectives on music.
                                    Still happy Thursday!
                                    Jon
                                     
                                    -- On Thu, 3/4/10, Todd, Candace <todd@...> wrote:

                                    From: Todd, Candace <todd@...>
                                    Subject: RE: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication
                                    To: "'americancomm@yahoogroups.com'" <americancomm@yahoogroups.com>
                                    Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 10:33 AM

                                     

                                    As I was reading the conversation, and reflecting on my own religious direction, I realized I have been keeping these two areas of great personal commitment as separate and different boxes.  

                                     

                                    In Buddhism, the aim of meditation is to quiet the chatter of communication on every level—one does this by emptying the mind or by filling it with harmonics that are not symbolic or communicative etc.  Communication is seen as a dynamic of attachment to surface, superficial and/or ephemeral aspects of human existence, what often gets termed as “appearances.” 

                                     

                                    Shifting modes of explanation here, insofar as communication makes us human, it is also what keeps us attached to our individualistic humanity and distracts us from our inherent connectedness- -our oneness, if you will, with all that is.  In short, communication is a barrier to communing. 

                                     

                                    No wonder my life is always feeling complicated!  On the other hand, meditation is an alternative that more and more people are turning to as a technique for managing stress—research supports its efficacy.  Is it possible that there is such a thing as too MUCH communication? (perish the thought) 

                                     

                                    Perhaps it is because communication is interactive, and other focused.  Perhaps intrapersonal communication turns our interior landscape into a space for “otherness” to form—hence our sense of self is being splintered somewhat. Hmm.  And humano-divine communication could actually be separating the one who prays from his/her God at the same moment that connection is sought.  Sorry, now I’m entering a postmodern account, which is fine by me but makes many of us impatient I fear.

                                     

                                    Candace

                                     

                                    Candace E. Todd, Ph.D.

                                    Assistant Professor of Communication Studies

                                    Lynchburg College, VA  24501

                                    434/544-8818

                                     

                                     

                                    From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                                    Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:32 AM
                                    To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                    Subject: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication

                                     

                                     

                                     

                                    Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?

                                     

                                    Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!

                                     

                                    Jon

                                    --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@ yahoo.com> wrote:


                                    From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@ yahoo.com>
                                    Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                                    To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                    Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                                     

                                    Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-

                                     

                                    In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  

                                     

                                    But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                                     

                                    Sumangal Haldar

                                    Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                    SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                     

                                     


                                    From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                                    To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                    Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                                    Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                                     

                                    Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.

                                    Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                                     

                                    A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                                     

                                    "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                                    prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                                    48

                                     

                                    In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                                    Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                                    --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                                    From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                    Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                                    To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                    Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                                     

                                    Sumangal:

                                     

                                    I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                                     

                                    Jon

                                     


                                    From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                                    Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                                    To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                    Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                                     

                                     

                                    Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                                    Dear Jon,

                                    Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                                    Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                                     

                                    What do you think ?

                                     

                                    Sumangal Haldar

                                    Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                    SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                     


                                     

                                     


                                    The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                     

                                     


                                    The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                     


                                  • Thomas Duncanson
                                    All who are following along about religion and communication This is wonderful! But I want to be a little bit stinky in this high minded and generous
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                                      All who are following along about religion and communication

                                      This is wonderful!  But I want to be a little bit stinky in this high minded and generous exchange.  If you have a handle on Catholicism, don't bother with this one, it will only patronize you.  But if you really don't have a sense for this and are genuinely curious, you might find this interesting and useful.

                                      It is vile, almost always protestant, slander that Catholics pray to saints, and this assertion, that they would ONLY pray to saints could only be the product of polemic.  I do NOT aim this at the person who asked the question, an innocent question, I assume.  But if you want to do an excellent communication study, track the transmission of such nonsense about Catholic prayer practices, the pope, purgatory, Mary, Jesus, the Bible, etc.  It wouldn't matter, except that so many actual people in our communities look down on or askance at their Catholic neighbors, and the Catholics peer back in hostility and suspicion.  It is almost a determination to deliberately misunderstand one-another.

                                      In the standard protestant view of Catholicism, it is a religion of imbeciles (and among the Jehovah's Witnesses and many evangelicals the spawn of hell itself).  I think any time you are tempted to believe ANY religion is the practice of idiots, you are off on the wrong foot.

                                      Catholicism is a 2000 year tradition.  There may be 1 billion Catholics alive in the world today.  Eons of official statements, theological interpretation, but most of all pious practices in myriad communities create startling variances in what Catholicism is.  Catholicism has accreted many contradictions, and the actual beliefs of members are diverse.  "Diverse" is too puny of a word for what Catholics believe.  In Catholicism there are monarchists and anarchists.  Priests and sisters hammer on nuclear submarines for peace, while other priests and sisters serve as military chaplains eagerly telling soldiers God is on their side.  Priests spend their days in voluntary poverty running soup kitchens; priests drive their Mercedes Benz to counsel the rich that they really can get that camel through the eye of a needle.  That Catholic lay minister who serves you as a "chaplain" at the hospital is probably one of the biggest feminists in town; her sister may be archly traditional.  Catholic lay people lead the opposition to abortion, and found organizations such as "Catholics for Choice."  The church is harshly authoritarian and wildly participatory.  It operates its own judicial system, but most Catholics will never have any knowing contact with Canon Law-- almost all problems are mediated locally, often mercifully, prudently.  It is antique and up-to-date.  It is in the forefront of the development of knowledge and in education, and its own members are aggravatingly ignorant of its history and doctrines.  Catholicism can be stunnignly formal, but has a charismatic side that authorizes speaking in tongues.  It often turns off its young people, and yet possesses both notable generational loyalty and an ability to attract committed new members.   As an institution it is spectacularly wealthy, but it has almost no way to make some of its greatest sources of wealth of much use, and so it is resource starved.  It is secretive, but its paper trail is miles wide-- there really is no excuse for the ignorant things said by and about Catholics.  I write all this-- as a gesture toward something much larger than anyone could get in an e-mail.

                                      Here in North America, the Catholic next door has probably never prayed to a saint in her or his life, though they have mumbled a line about "the intercession of the saints" many times-- a theological principle, an unrealized abstraction.  They probably do not know more than five prayers word-for-word.  What they consider to be "their" prayer is as spontaneous and extemporaneous, to God, perhaps "in Jesus' name," as almost any other identifiable religious group in Christendom.  They probably have a Bible and may or may not read it, a little or a lot.  They may have a prayer book; among older Catholics this may be a great comfort.  They may attend, but probably missed, that one mass a year when the "Litany of the Saints" is sung.  Most North America Catholics, I surmise, could not tell you her or his "Saint's Day" on the calendar and certainly do not celebrate a "feast" on that day, though most would know what you are taliking about if you asked them about this.  They may or may not have a rosary, and if they do they probably do not use it.  And when they do use it, they may do it wryly, with nostalgia for grandma, bored, semi-consciously setting aside the address to Mary, using the gruesome repetition to quiet their thoughts, thinking their actual petitions to-- God, however they understand her.  Yeah, there are Catholics who take every reference to God as the masculine in mass and translate it into the neutral or the feminine.  Because, if you haven't noticed, Catholics in every age, have insisted on being of their times.  Sure, it is a religion of solitary monks, but mostly it is a noisy religion of the ordinary people, of the street, of right now.

                                      Here in North America Catholics are almost as likely as the population at large to believe that abortion should remain legal.  Catholics have abortions at almost the same rate as the population at large.  The Catholic people have flat out rejected the official birth control ban-- notice if you tried to tell young people today all those old jokes premised on the large Catholic families, they wouldn't even get them, they would have no referent.  Catholics divorce almost as readily as the population at large, and chafe under the prohibition against remarriage and the awkward rules on annulment.  Catholics are supposed to attend mass weekly and confession annually, but very few fulfill these "obligations" scrupulously.  Catholics here are, by the millions, NOT much invested in the celibate male clergy.  They would accept women priests and married priests overnight-- because more than anything else they want the eucharist amply available every week and vibrant church communities.  Catholics have been genuinely stung and hurt by the clergy-pedophile scandals, and they are not happy with the bishops and Rome in their response to what has turned out to be a genuine crisis.     
                                      Aside from this Catholic pray to saints stuff, the other propaganda thing that drives me crazy is the idea that Catholics aren't biblical or don't have Jesus at the center.  Evey mass is based on a reading from the Hebrew Bible, singing a psalm, a reading from the gsopels, a reading from another of the books of the Greek Bible, and the eucharistic service is shot through with Biblical language / narrative.  There is a three year cycle of Bible quotation used as the basis for mass, so that over three years a large, some would say crucial, and representative sample of the Bible is systematically placed before Catholics.  As for Jesus, I would encourage anyone who thinks this figure is not the center, to attend mass for a month-- then write in and report what you heard.

                                      Catholicism is simply a huge phenomena, and a handful of points taken from a catechism will always get it wrong.  Catholics themselves often make embarrassing representations of the thing-- either what they happen to have on their minds at the moment, or something they think they are SUPPOSED to believe and do-- often something long since abandoned or never precisely so.  But then it IS what those billion practitioners say it is-- a web of pious practices complex enough to keep any scholar busy for a life time cataloguing, understanding-- often with amazement. 

                                      Tom

                                      Tom Duncanson
                                              

                                      >>> Jon Ru 03/04/10 5:54 AM >>>
                                       

                                      I'm glad others are into this line of research!  No it's not published yet, it's under review with a journal now and is a proposal for NCA 2010.  If anyone wants to review a draft I can send one off-list.  I'm not sure if there was a historical period where Catholics were only supposed to pray to saints for intercession (this is still my first Catholic research project and I'm not a historian), but I don't think so. Aquinas is clear that they should pray to both God and saints.  Invocation of saints and prayers for intercession are distinguished from Christ's mediation but both are encouraged.  This doctrine was a point of dispute for the Reformation, for instance Anglicans explicitly reject intercession as contrary to monotheism.  The best source for overviews of older Catholic doctrine is the Catholic Encyclopedia, check out this link for more on prayers to Saints http://www.newadven t.org/cathen/ 08070a.htm
                                      Happy Thursday!
                                      Jon

                                      --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:

                                      From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                                      To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                      Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 4:30 PM

                                       

                                      Jon:

                                       

                                      This is very interesting.  I’m not terribly up to date on Catholic Theology, so I have a question.  I had understood that there was a point where the laity was not supposed to pray directly to God, but were supposed to pray to Saints for intercession.  Was this ever the case, or am I the victim of a sort of  “urban legend”?   If this was the case, when did this change?

                                       

                                      Also, I have always wondered if the term Logos, commonly translated as “word” in John 1:1, referred not simply to language, but to the much broader sense of Logos as understood by Classical rhetoricians and philosophers (more along the lines of “ordering principles”).  Does that make any sense to you?  In any case, I’m going to have to look up “The Formal Structure…”.

                                       

                                      Has you recent research been published yet?  I would be interested in reading the full work.

                                       

                                      Also, Sumangal, with regard to prayer as an intrapersonal process from a Christian perspective, you may want to look into the beliefs about prayer used by the Religious Society of Friends (Quakers).. 

                                       

                                      Jon

                                       

                                      Jon Paulson

                                      Interim Program Director for General Education

                                      Center for Undergraduate Studies

                                      Walden University

                                      712-580-1658 (h/o)

                                      712-291-0144 (c)

                                       


                                      From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                                      Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:26 PM
                                      To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                                       

                                       

                                      Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                                       

                                      A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God.. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                                       

                                      "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                                      prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                                      48

                                       

                                      In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                                      Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                                      --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                                      From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                      Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                                      To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                      Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                                       

                                      Sumangal:

                                       

                                      I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                                       

                                      Jon

                                       


                                      From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                                      Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                                      To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                      Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                                       

                                       

                                      Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                                      Dear Jon,

                                      Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                                      Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                                       

                                      What do you think ?

                                       

                                      Sumangal Haldar

                                      Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                      SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                       


                                       

                                       


                                      The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                       





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                                    • Josh Davidson
                                      Hi Candace, Thank you for your reflections. I found them incredibly inspiring as a long-time, if part-time, Buddhist (haha), and a life studying or working in
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010
                                        Hi Candace,

                                        Thank you for your reflections. I found them incredibly inspiring as a long-time, if part-time, Buddhist (haha), and a life studying or working in communications in one role or another. I was recently applying to an MA program in Communication and was trying to explain in my own words what you just did perfectly - a whole life of tension between 1) working to recognize internal stillness, wholeness, interconnectedness, and 2) communication, which (I agree with Jon, this struck me the most, too);

                                        makes us human, it is also what keeps us attached to our individualistic humanity and distracts us from our inherent connectedness--our oneness, if you will, with all that is.  In short, communication is a barrier to communing


                                        And yet, we have to communicate. Or so it appears. Maybe communication is our training in working within the "appearance" that is life...because it's all we have!

                                        Thanks so much for helping me clarify!

                                        Josh


                                        De : "Todd, Candace" <todd@...>
                                        À : "americancomm@yahoogroups.com" <americancomm@yahoogroups.com>
                                        Envoyé le : Jeu 4 mars 2010, 10 h 33 min 29 s
                                        Objet : RE: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication



                                        As I was reading the conversation, and reflecting on my own religious direction, I realized I have been keeping these two areas of great personal commitment as separate and different boxes.  

                                         

                                        In Buddhism, the aim of meditation is to quiet the chatter of communication on every level—one does this by emptying the mind or by filling it with harmonics that are not symbolic or communicative etc.  Communication is seen as a dynamic of attachment to surface, superficial and/or ephemeral aspects of human existence, what often gets termed as “appearances.” 

                                         

                                        Shifting modes of explanation here, insofar as communication makes us human, it is also what keeps us attached to our individualistic humanity and distracts us from our inherent connectedness--our oneness, if you will, with all that is.  In short, communication is a barrier to communing. 

                                         

                                        No wonder my life is always feeling complicated!  On the other hand, meditation is an alternative that more and more people are turning to as a technique for managing stress—research supports its efficacy.  Is it possible that there is such a thing as too MUCH communication? (perish the thought) 

                                         

                                        Perhaps it is because communication is interactive, and other focused.  Perhaps intrapersonal communication turns our interior landscape into a space for “otherness” to form—hence our sense of self is being splintered somewhat. Hmm.  And humano-divine communication could actually be separating the one who prays from his/her God at the same moment that connection is sought.  Sorry, now I’m entering a postmodern account, which is fine by me but makes many of us impatient I fear.

                                         

                                        Candace

                                         

                                        Candace E. Todd, Ph.D.

                                        Assistant Professor of Communication Studies

                                        Lynchburg College, VA  24501

                                        434/544-8818

                                         

                                         

                                        From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                                        Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:32 AM
                                        To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication

                                         

                                         

                                        Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.

                                         

                                        Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?

                                         

                                        Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!

                                         

                                        Jon

                                        --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...> wrote:


                                        From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...>
                                        Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                                        To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                                        Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                                         

                                        Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-

                                         

                                        In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  

                                         

                                        But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                                         

                                        Sumangal Haldar

                                        Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                        SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                         

                                         


                                        From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                                        To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                        Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                                        Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                                         

                                        Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                                         

                                        A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                                         

                                        "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                                        prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                                        48

                                         

                                        In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                                        Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                                        --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                                        From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                        Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                                        To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                        Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                                         

                                        Sumangal:

                                         

                                        I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                                         

                                        Jon

                                         


                                        From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                                        Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                                        To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                        Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                                         

                                         

                                        Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                                        Dear Jon,

                                        Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                                        Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                                         

                                        What do you think ?

                                         

                                        Sumangal Haldar

                                        Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                        SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                         


                                         

                                         


                                        The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                         

                                         


                                        The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                         





                                        Offrez un compte Flickr Pro à vos amis et à votre famille. Allez-y!
                                      • Lori V. Roe
                                        Thank you, all! I am enjoying this thread. I don’t have much to contribute, but I keep reading. Lori Roe Assistant Professor of Communication Ivy Tech
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010

                                          Thank you, all! I am enjoying this thread. I don’t have much to contribute, but I keep reading.

                                           

                                          Lori Roe

                                          Assistant Professor of Communication

                                          Ivy Tech Community College

                                          2521 Industrial Parkway

                                          Elkhart, IN  46516

                                          574-293-4657 ext. 4210

                                          Pronto ID: lroe

                                          SQ: Ideation – Communication – Strategic – Relator - Learner

                                           

                                          From: americancomm@yahoogroups.com [mailto:americancomm@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Ru
                                          Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:32 AM
                                          To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: [americancomm] culture and Humano-Divine communication

                                           

                                           

                                          Yes Sumangal, there definitely is a contrast between Hindu and Christian approaches to Humano-Divine communication.  I'm not an expert on Hindus, but I am familiar with the Bhagavad Gita, and even though Krishna reveals himself to Arjuna in response to a plea (an almost Christian prayer dynamic) the book is really about self-realization through renouncing the fruits of action.  It's more about self-discipline and meditative enlightenment than it is about reaching out to others or God because God is seen as already present within us.  The challenge is to really know and believe and act in accord with your own divine nature.

                                           

                                          Can any other members with knowledge of other religio/cultural traditions tell us how Humano-Divine communication works for them?

                                           

                                          Again, great discussion thread, go ACA!

                                           

                                          Jon

                                          --- On Thu, 3/4/10, sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...> wrote:


                                          From: sumangal haldar <sumangal_haldar@...>
                                          Subject: Re: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication
                                          To: americancomm@yahoogroups.com
                                          Date: Thursday, March 4, 2010, 8:10 AM

                                           

                                          Jon your insight was really significant. But continuing on the same, this Humano-Divine Communication has huge cultural diversity. Take for instance-

                                           

                                          In India (a land of various religious belief) majority participate in deity worship to participate in communication with divine. They stand infront of an image and speak (pray) this is a kind of communication in which feedback (response of prayers/ worship) is mostly on the level of feelings. Now does this momentary feel-good factor  be catgorized as a feedback in communication. Who decides if it is communication or not other than the participator himself. The feel good can be illusion as well as reality.  

                                           

                                          But as a Christian if i refer to the other variant in this type of  humano- Divine communication in which we get ample proof of what you quoted - "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply,"  can be traced in the ministry of faith- healers, miracle doers. Biblical evidence for the same can be traced in New as well as the Old Testament. Jesus also said to his followers "ask and ye shall receive". Now in this type of communication also one has to be other oriented (like in other types of communication) . And the drilling continues...
                                           

                                          Sumangal Haldar

                                          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                          SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                           

                                           


                                          From: Jon Ru <jru2797@yahoo. com>
                                          To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                          Sent: Thu, 4 March, 2010 1:56:29 AM
                                          Subject: RE: [americancomm] Humano-Divine communication

                                           

                                          Thanks for continuing this thread Sumangal.  For many (most?) Christian groups God is considered a divine person that you reach out to and contact via prayer.  My last big research project looks at Pope Benedict's theology as it bears on communication, here's a brief passage with a direct quote to introduce the Catholic perspective, but it's just the tip of the iceberg, I find this branch of theology fascinating!

                                           

                                          A final sense of Pope Benedict’s dialogic style is his close attention to and prayerful response to the Word of God. This is far more than just one relationship among many; for Benedict Christianity’s triune God is the principle of relatability or communication itself. In "The Formal Structure of Christian Prayer" he reinterprets the divine Logos in terms of "communication" and "participation. "

                                           

                                          "The basic reason that man can speak with God is because God himself is speech, word. His nature is to speak, to hear, to reply, as we see particularly in Johannine theology, where Son and Spirit are described in terms of pure ‘hearing’; they speak in response to what they have first heard. Only because there is already speech, "Logos," in God can there be speech, "Logos," to God. Philosophically we could put it like this: the Logos in God is the ontological foundation for

                                          prayer. The prologue of John’s gospel speaks of this connection in its very first sentences: ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was in communication with God’ (1:1) – as a more precise translation of the Greek pors suggests, rather than the usual ‘with God.’ It expresses the act of turning to God, of relationship. Since there is a relationship within God himself, there can also be participation in this relationship. Thus we can relate to God in a way that does not contradict his nature."

                                          48

                                           

                                          In retranslating the passive preposition "with" via a term denoting a reciprocal and active process, "in communication with," Benedict shows how faith in the triune God is at the same time faith in contact and relating, belief in communion. God is The Word and in

                                          Deus Caritas Est he goes on to explain how that word is Love.



                                          --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu> wrote:


                                          From: Jon Paulson <jon.paulson@ waldenu.edu>
                                          Subject: RE: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere
                                          To: "americancomm@ yahoogroups. com" <americancomm@ yahoogroups. com>
                                          Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 11:16 AM

                                           

                                          Sumangal:

                                           

                                          I think that is a reasonable answer, and if it is acceptable within the cultural/religious community in which you teach, great.  I know that for some people in the U.S. , that answer might not go over so well, because there are very different conceptions of the godhead.  (I operate within a relatively small religious community: we are committed to diversity to the point where we embrace, and are led by, theists, atheists, and everyone in between).

                                           

                                          Jon

                                           


                                          From: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:americancom m@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of sumangal haldar
                                          Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:22 AM
                                          To: americancomm@ yahoogroups. com
                                          Subject: [americancomm] Communication : to do in the intrapersonal sphere

                                           

                                           

                                          Finally, consider how far you want to drill down into ontological issues such as the definition of life and the existence of god(s), always remembering Thud’s First Law of Opposition (“Push anything hard enough, and it will fall over”—Firesign Theatre, 197?)

                                          Dear Jon,

                                          Refering to what you wrote in response to my third question, i wanted some more inputs:

                                          Drilling an ontological issue related to GOD, here in India , has some importance of its own. As even students discuss such issues in classroom. "What kind of communication is praying to God ?" Well my response to them was that Praying to God, is a kind of intrapersonal process (communication) . God (for them who believe) talks or responds through one's self only. Like a person who is toubled gets solace in prayer, because he thinks that things would be better in future. Now this solace comes from within; a kind of communication with oneself.  

                                           

                                          What do you think ?

                                           

                                          Sumangal Haldar

                                          Senior Lecturer / Soft Skill Trainer

                                          SRM College of Engineering and Management.

                                           


                                           

                                           


                                          The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                           

                                           


                                          The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.

                                           

                                        • sumangal haldar
                                              Dear Candace,   Intrapersonal Communication is not the splintering of self rather, it is a realization in which self gets united into one whole. Now
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Mar 4, 2010

                                             
                                             

                                            Dear Candace,

                                             

                                            Intrapersonal Communication is not the splintering of self rather, it is a realization in which self gets united into one whole. Now this variety of self is the resutant of variety in percieving things from time to time. In intrapersonal communication this variety communicates to be one. This monoism is evident in all kinds of communication in the form of aggreement (aggree to fight, aggree to talk, aggree to be happy and so on...)

                                             

                                            Now when in meditation which itself is a kind of intrapersonal communication the mind gets filled with harmonics that are not symbolic or communicative, because of the very reason that human being has a limitation of five senses, silence takes over. That is why refer to Lamba's thread whenever Buddha was asked about God he replied with silence.

                                             

                                            True communication is not 'dynamic attachment to superficial aspects of human existence' rather it is the negation of the same. Because human existence craves for self and keeps self first, while communication teaches us to be other oriented.

                                             

                                            Sumangal



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